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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Banffshire => Topic started by: rindercella on Sunday 24 January 10 20:23 GMT (UK)
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I have been trying to find my great great grandmother for some time. All I have is her marriage to Alexander Morrison farmer of Brambleburn Farm, Grange, on 16th December 1849. It does not say how old she was, where she was born or who her parents were. The other record i have is the birth of her son my great grandfather James Morrison in February 1849 at which time she died but cannot find any death record for her. Any help would be appreciated.
Any information on the death of her husband also would be appreciated who was Alexander Morrison born around 1807 in Grange. He is listed at Gledhilloch at the age of 65 in 1871 but been unable to find any record after that. Also can anyone tell me where Gledhilloch was in Grange and if its still there? I have tried "googling" but nothing....
Many thanks
Karen
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Hi Karen, Welcome to Rootschat :)
On a modern OS map Gled Hillock is marked as being 500m from Brambleburn Farm on the South East side of Lurg Hill.
It is marked on this map if you zoom right in to the black and white version. It looks as though Alexander Morrison only moved to the next farm building over.
http://geo.nls.uk/os6inch/google.html
Look for Edingight House and you should find it.
I see he is listed as Alexander Morison (with one R) at Bramble Burn in the 1841 census (FreeCen), but in 1851 it's Morrison again. ::)
There is a possible death for him on Scotland's People.
Using soundex on surname, and "Alex", with birth year 1807+/-5 years there are 2 deaths in Banffshire.
1 of them is in Grange in 1873 which would explain why you couldn't find him in later census records.
It might be worth viewing the image to see if it lists him as widower of Ann Lobban. His son James may have registered the death.
Hope this helps
Kirsty
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Thank you Kirsty for your help. I'm afraid the death of an Alexander Morrison in Grange in 1873 was another Alexander Morrison as I downloaded that from scotlandspeople but it wasn't him. I will look more into the other one. You also gave me an idea when you mentioned about his son registering the death as he had by then moved to Glasgow so perhaps he registered his father's death there. I will look into that as well.
Alexander's birth record I have been given says " in Sholstown"? Is there such a place or a similar sounding place? I did see a place on the map by the name of Aultown or something. Maybe transcribed wrong perhaps?
Thank you again
Karen
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Hello Karen,
I don't know how you could prove this one but it might be worth investigating.
FREECEN has 1841 and 1851 census records of Banff and Aberdeen.
In 1851 there is a Lobban family living at Grange - Alexander Lobban and family along with his brother Charles who were born at Glass, Aberdeen. They are at Glass with parents James Lobban and Elizabeth Simpson in 1841.
A parent search of the IGI shows James and Elizabeth had a daughter Anne born 1828 who appears to be working at Torrie Farm, Glass in 1841.
Could this be your Anne Lobban? Were there any witnesses on your great grandfather's birth record that would tie in with this family?
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There are lots of places in Banff called Something-town so it definately a possibility. I haven't seen anything yet that jumps out at me. Do you have any idea where the info came from, could it have been mistranscribed from handwriting or mis-heard?
Kirsty
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Hi Kirsty
It was from the Baptism record for Alexander from the Parish Register of Grange which my cousin got and the place was hard to read but it said: 22nd August 1807 John Morrison in Sholstown? had a child by his wife Margaret Donald. Baptised and Called Alexander. Witnesses Alexander Morrison and Alexander Mitchell. Three years later they were at Balamen? but that could have been misread also and it could mean Balnamoon. In 1824 they were at Brambleburn.
Thank you for your help in the search for Anne Lobban. I don't think that is her as I have been in touch with someone on Genes Reunited whose Anne Lobban was from Glass but she didn't marry an Alexander. Do you know if Glass is near Grange? I also found another Anne Lobban on the 1841 Census. She was 15 at the time so would be about the right age also. Her parents were James Lobban and Anne Eddie but its just finding the right Anne. I have looked at Libindx for buriels of Anne Morrison for Grange Cemetary but nothing came up but I am told that if she wasn't from Grange she would have been buried in her home town.
Karen
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If you want further confirmation of the name you could try posting that part of the image on the handwriting recognition board.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/board,425.0.html
There are lots of people there who are quite experienced at deciphering other people's scrawls!
Just don't forget to post a link back to this thread.
Kirsty
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Hi Kirsty
I have downloaded the original baptism record and I'm not any further forward with what the name of the place is so will try and post it as you suggested.
As regards Anne Lobban's death. Do you know if there is anywhere else I could look apart from where I have already searched?
Thanks again for all your help.
Karen
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Hi Kirsty
It was from the Baptism record for Alexander from the Parish Register of Grange which my cousin got and the place was hard to read but it said: 22nd August 1807 John Morrison in Sholstown? had a child by his wife Margaret Donald. Baptised and Called Alexander. Witnesses Alexander Morrison and Alexander Mitchell. Three years later they were at Balamen? but that could have been misread also and it could mean Balnamoon. In 1824 they were at Brambleburn.
Thank you for your help in the search for Anne Lobban. I don't think that is her as I have been in touch with someone on Genes Reunited whose Anne Lobban was from Glass but she didn't marry an Alexander. Do you know if Glass is near Grange? I also found another Anne Lobban on the 1841 Census. She was 15 at the time so would be about the right age also. Her parents were James Lobban and Anne Eddie but its just finding the right Anne. I have looked at Libindx for buriels of Anne Morrison for Grange Cemetary but nothing came up but I am told that if she wasn't from Grange she would have been buried in her home town.
Karen
Hello again Karen,
This appears to be your Alexander at Bramble Burn in 1841 with his father John.
MORISON John age 55 Farmer
MORISON Alexander age 30
MORISON Margret
MORISON Jane
MORISON Elspet
There is another Alexander Morison around the same age living at 'Balamoon'.
You can view the transcriptions at FREECEN.
Regards,
Nel
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Hi Kirsty
It was from the Baptism record for Alexander from the Parish Register of Grange which my cousin got and the place was hard to read but it said: 22nd August 1807 John Morrison in Sholstown? had a child by his wife Margaret Donald. Baptised and Called Alexander. Witnesses Alexander Morrison and Alexander Mitchell. Three years later they were at Balamen? but that could have been misread also and it could mean Balnamoon. In 1824 they were at Brambleburn.
Thank you for your help in the search for Anne Lobban. I don't think that is her as I have been in touch with someone on Genes Reunited whose Anne Lobban was from Glass but she didn't marry an Alexander. Do you know if Glass is near Grange? I also found another Anne Lobban on the 1841 Census. She was 15 at the time so would be about the right age also. Her parents were James Lobban and Anne Eddie but its just finding the right Anne. I have looked at Libindx for buriels of Anne Morrison for Grange Cemetary but nothing came up but I am told that if she wasn't from Grange she would have been buried in her home town.
Karen
Hello again Karen,
This appears to be your Alexander at Bramble Burn in 1841 with his father John.
MORISON John age 55 Farmer
MORISON Alexander age 30
MORISON Margret
MORISON Jane
MORISON Elspet
There is another Alexander Morison around the same age living at 'Balamoon' so 2 different families.
You can view the transcriptions at FREECEN.
Regards,
Nel
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Hi Kirsty
It was from the Baptism record for Alexander from the Parish Register of Grange which my cousin got and the place was hard to read but it said: 22nd August 1807 John Morrison in Sholstown? had a child by his wife Margaret Donald. Baptised and Called Alexander. Witnesses Alexander Morrison and Alexander Mitchell. Three years later they were at Balamen? but that could have been misread also and it could mean Balnamoon. In 1824 they were at Brambleburn.
Thank you for your help in the search for Anne Lobban. I don't think that is her as I have been in touch with someone on Genes Reunited whose Anne Lobban was from Glass but she didn't marry an Alexander. Do you know if Glass is near Grange? I also found another Anne Lobban on the 1841 Census. She was 15 at the time so would be about the right age also. Her parents were James Lobban and Anne Eddie but its just finding the right Anne. I have looked at Libindx for buriels of Anne Morrison for Grange Cemetary but nothing came up but I am told that if she wasn't from Grange she would have been buried in her home town.
Karen
Hello again Karen,
This appears to be your Alexander at Bramble Burn in 1841 with his father John.
MORISON John age 55 Farmer
MORISON Alexander age 30
MORISON Margret
MORISON Jane
MORISON Elspet
There is another Alexander Morison around the same age living at 'Balamoon' (and varients) till at least 1861 so 2 different families.
You can view the transcriptions at FREECEN.
Regards,
Nel
If somebody can delete my last 2 posts I'd be very grateful! :-[
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Apologies for (almost) duplicate posts.
Something to mull over.....................
1841 census at FREECEN shows 4 Ann Lobbans and 1 Anne Lobban born 1824 + or - 10 years.
A marriage search 1851 + or - 10 years at FamilySearch .org shows 4 Ann Lobbans and 1 Anne Lobban.
Not 100% foolproof but...... 3 of the marriages take place at the same parish where 3 of the Anns were in 1841 - Cullen(the 15 year old) and Abernethy and Marnoch.
The one born at Knockando is easy to find in later census records.
That leaves the Anne who was born at Glass and the 1848 marriage of an Anne Lobban and Alexander Morrison.
Unfortunately the one born at Cullen (who may have married Alexander Paterson) is proving hard to find in 1851.
Regards,
Nel
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Remember, the 1851 coverage in freecen is not complete yet!
Regards,
flst :)
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Thank you Nel,
As regards Alexander Morrison yes that's him on the 1841 census, he married Anne Lobban in 1848 in Grange, their son James was born in 1849 then Alexander appears on the 1851 census again at Brambleburn and he is 40 and the child is 2 but there is no mention of his wife which is what makes me think she died giving birth to James in 1849 or shortly afterwards. I have tried everything to find her death record in Grange and elsewhere in Banffshire without any luck.
I contacted someone on Genes Reunited who had the Anne from Glass on their tree and was told that they thought she had married an Alexander and would check up and get back to me if she had but heard nothing more so I gather it was the wrong Anne. Shame about the one in Cullen, especially her being difficult to find on the 1851 census, I was pinning my hopes on her but if she married someone by the name of Alexander Paterson it couldn't be.
I will try and contact others on Genes Reunited with Anne Lobbans on their trees around the time I think she was born and see what I can find out.
Any other thoughts would be greatly appreciated.
Many thanks
Karen
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Do you know if Glass is near Grange?
It depends a bit what you mean by near. Glass is a parish west of Huntly and east of Mortlach, so it's not a huge distance, maybe about 15-20 miles, depending which way you go. Quite near enough to meet a future spouse.
I'm afraid the death of an Alexander Morrison in Grange in 1873 was another Alexander Morrison as I downloaded that from scotlandspeople but it wasn't him.
Who was that Alexander Morrison then?
4 Ann Lobbans and 1 Anne Lobban
I see he is listed as Alexander Morison (with one R) at Bramble Burn in the 1841 census (FreeCen), but in 1851 it's Morrison again.
Don't attempt to draw any conclusions from spelling. It was a very variable feast. A missing 'e' or extra 'r' is of no significance at all.
Alexander's birth record I have been given says " in Sholstown"?
Could it be Scotsto(w)n? That's quite a common place name.
Unfortunately the one born at Cullen (who may have married Alexander Paterson) is proving hard to find in 1851.
The IGI lists two children of Alexander Paterson and Ann Lobban, one born in Cullen on 13 July 1841 and one in 1857 in Seafield. A gap like this always suggests to me that they belonged to the Free Kirk, and did not have their children's baptisms recorded in the Parish Kirk. In 1851 they were at Bauds in Rathven; Ann was aged 34 and listed as born in Rathven. So birth date 1816/7. Their children were Isabella, aged 9 (the one born in Cullen in 1841) and three more aged 7, 3 and 1. There could have been a child who died young and would have been 5 years old in 1841. I reckon the likelihood is that this is the daughter of William Lobban and Iosbel Donaldson, born in Cullen on 8 January 1817.
There's a listing of an Ann Lobban, born 1819 in Fordyce (listed several times, some with the place name a bit mangled) and marrying William Harper in 1838. All three references to her are submitted to the IGI and therefore to be regarded with suspicion until checked against the original document. The IGI also lists three daughters, all born in Fordyce. In 1851 she is listed at Drums in Fordyce, a widow, aged 52, born in Rathven. I have no idea where the 1819 came from.
I don't see any children listed for John Thomson and Ann Lobban, who were married in Boharm on 25 December 1838, and I can't find them in the 1841 census there.
Nor can I find any children of William Pirie and Ann Lobban, who were married in Marnoch in 1848. Nor can I find them in the 1851 census.
There's a 12-year-old Ann Lobban, Ag Lab, born Aberdeenshire, in a rather curious household headed (apparently) by John Simon, farmer, aged 9 (yes, nine!) at Torrie in Glass in 1841.
So I speculate that either your Ann Lobban is the one born in Glass, or that she is a totally different Ann Lobban whose baptism does not appear in the parish registers.
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Karen, my hobby is Lobban Genealogy, hope I can help with the following info on Lobban & Morrison, some I'm sure you already have:-
1. OPR Marriage entry of 16 Dec 1848 at Grange of Alexr Morrison & Anne Lobban
2. 1851 census at Brambleburn re Alexr Morrison, Head, Wdr, 42, from Grange (abt 1809)
son-James Morrison,aged 2 b Grange abt 1849; Sister Isabella(Morrison) McEwan aged 36, Wid of John McEwan & her son James McEwan aged 10, scholar from Boyndie, Banff.
3. 1851 census at other Brambleburn;- Geo Morrison Head Mar 54 Farmer Grange c 1797;
Wife Elspet Morrison 40 Mortlach abt 1811; plus scholar sons William 11; George 7 & Alexr aged 5, plus daur Isabella aged 2;
I also have a potential Anne Lobban born 1823, who I believe is the G G G/mother you are looking for, my email address is > * < if you want to make contact direct;
Lsyd(*)
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Karen
I've just skim read the chain of postings about Alexander Morrison and Anne Lobban.
The location of Alexanders birth is "Mosstown" in 1807, the 'M' is quite elongated and makes it look like an "Sh" and the double "s" has the old style long "f" shape to it. Its located about half a mile to the south west of Brambleburn and Gledshillock.
I too am descended from the Morrison's of Brambleburn. Alexander's parents, John Morrison and Margaret Donald are my 4 x gr grandparents.
I'm descended from their third son, George Morrison (who married Elspet Bain and also lived at Brambleburn). Their son Alexander had an illegitimate daughter, Mary, in 1869. She is my gr-grandmother. These are the George and Elspet listed at item 3. in lsyd's posting.
I have a file of information on the Morrison family - but not sure if I have more information on Anne Lobban or not. I seem to remember coming to the same conclusion, (that she died in childbirth) about 20 years ago. Alexander is clearly a widower in the 1851 census. I'll look through it to see if I have anything more about her.
I have Alexander's death as 13 Sep 1879 at 21 Warwick Street, Glasgow (Gorbals District) . He is a farmer, and widower of Ann Lobban. James Morrison his son, registers the death. See Gorbals District deaths 1879 entry 623.
I was born and brought up beside Grange, though now live in London, but return there regularly. Very happy to share information. Look forward to hearing from you.
Alan.
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Alan
I am so glad you read my posting. I've been searching for Alexander's death for a while but couldn't seem to find it so thank you for that. I have never been to Grange but plan to go in the summer for a visit. Anything you could tell me on the area would be much appreciated.
Karen
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So glad you found someone who can help you further! Please remove your email address from your post. Alan can contact you via private message.
Regards,
flst
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Hi Flst
Sorry, I am new to this, can you tell me how to remove e mail address?
Thanks
Karen
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If you view your previous post you should see two small buttons, I think at the top right hand side: Quote and Modify. Click modify and it will let you reopen your post to edit what you have put. Then you just erase the email address.
Kirsty
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Thanks for your help Kirsty I have done that now.
Kind regards
Karen
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Hi there,
I am descended from James Lobban & Elizabeth Simpson. I think their daughter Ann married Alexander Morrison. I have come across a person on ancestry who is confident that this Ann actually married a McDonald and died in Aberdeen, and I am waiting to hear back on how they came by this info.
Ann Lobban's brothers certainly had close ties with Grange, having farmed at places such as Sillyearn, Crylet and Coldwells within the parish. They were all as you know born in Glass. Also sister Isabella had two children over in Grange - one of whom was fathered by an Alexander Morrison - perhaps the other Alexander referred to in some of the reply-posts you have had to your own posting.
Anyway, would love to discuss further.
Kindest regards,
Ana
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Sorry I am new to this - If you have the Fordyce MI's I would be really grateful if you could help me out. Looking for Pierries and Rhoderick Davidson. Hope to hear from you.
:)
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Hi Lilberti
It would be best to start a new topic with a title of "Fordyce" MI's and the names of the people you are researching, that way it will be seen by far more people. Good luck.
Karen
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Hello Karen,
By chance I came upon Roots.com and your message about the Morrisons and Lobbans. They too are my great great grandparents. My great grandfather was James Morrison who married Mary Paton. Alexander Morrison died on 14th Sept 1879 aged 74 and I am sure he was living with his son in Warwick St Glasgow at that time. James and Mary had 8 children and 2 adopted sons. My grandfather was James Brown Paton Morrison.
Regards, Evie
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Hi Evie
It is really lovely to hear from you. You and I must be second cousins! I've been trying to find out more about your grandfather for a while. I traced his death to Killearn, Stirlingshire and have been meaning to order the certificate from ScotlandsPeople. My grandfather was his younger brother, Alexander Morrison. I have lots to share with you and any info you have for me would be great. Yes you're right about Alexander Morrison and him dying at the home of our great grandparents James Morrison and Mary Paton at Warwick Street, Glasgow.
I look forward to hearing from you again.
Warm regards
Karen
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I am decended from George Morrison and Elspet Bain too! From their son John Morrison b.1838 (married Ann Innes in 1860, had George in 1861 who had my g grandpa William Grant Morrison who had my gran Cathy Morrison). INteresting that his brother had an illegitimate child as I think John may have left his wife too. PLease could you let me have any info you have pre- George and Elspet? Or anything really!
Thanks in advance!
Ruth
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Hi Ruth, thanks for your post - your George Morrison was the brother of my gg grandfather Alexander Morrison born 1807. When his wife Ann Lobban died George Morrison and Elspet Bain took care of my great grandad for a while when he was a baby. Can you pm me as have quite a bit of info on them? Will be great to be able to share. Unable to post my email address on here or I would. Look forward to hearing from you.
Karen