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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Armagh => Topic started by: MalcolmNZ on Friday 08 January 10 06:45 GMT (UK)
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Hi, I am new to this forum,
I am trying to find out more about my great grandfather Henry IRWIN (born 2nd June 1837 in Portadown, died 17th November 1915 in 3 York St, Opawa, Christchurch, NZ.
His parents were James IRWIN & Fanny RICHARDSON. Unfortunately I have no birth, death or marriage info on them or who their parents were.
Henry IRWIN & his elder brother Thomas (c1835 Co Armagh - 14 Feb 1898 Montreal St, Christchurch) arrived in New Zealand on the "Echunga" 16 December 1862, both settling in Christchurch.
Henry IRWIN married Elizabeth WHITFIELD (09 April 1848 London - 19 Dec 1933 at 54 York St, Opawa, Christchurch, NZ) 17 August 1877 in The Manse, Christchurch.
Thomas IRWIN married Grace JOHNSTON (c1836 Co Fermanagh - 16 April 1897 Sydenham, Christchurch) 22 May 1877 in The Manse, Christchurch
The IRWIN's were Presbyterians.
Also there is a reference in the family bible of a "Grandmother HENDERSON, died 20 October 1900" unfortunately her first name, age and where she died, was not mentioned (we are thinking Ireland, rather than New Zealand?). But our family's photograph collection includes an undated photo taken by a Portadown photographer, and she is included in the group, but we don't know how she is related to the IRWINs or RICHARDSONs.
Any help or suggestions would be very much appreciated,
Kind regards, Malcolm from New Zealand.
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MalcolmNZ,
I am researching for a descendant of Henry Irwin & Elizabeth Whitfield and wondered if you had a copy of their marriage certificate, as I am would like to ascertain the name of Elizabeth parents.
Your information re parents of Thomas and Henry was very much appreciated.
As an aside, was your Grace Johnston married to Unknown Gregg in 1858 before marrying Thomas in 1877?
kind regards,
Palmeri
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Hi palmeri,
on the death certificate of Grace Irwin (19 April 1897) her first marriage was to a James GREIG, but I don't have a time or place for their marriage, but I presume it was in Ireland, since Grace was born in County Fermanagh in 1836-37.
Grace's parents were Samuel & Margaret JOHNSTON.
Yes, I do have a copy of Henry IRWIN & Elizabeth WHITFIELD's marriage certificate.
Elizabeth WHITFIELD's parents were:
Thomas WHITFIELD (19 May 1816 Shoreditch, Middlesex - 21 February 1902 Balls Rd, Opawa, Christchurch, New Zealand)
Susannah MIDDLETON (17 June 1819 Harwich, Essex - 19 July 1890 St Albans or Waltham ?, Christchurch, New Zealand
they were married 17 August 1841 Bethnal Green Old Church, London
Thomas & Susannah had 7 children:
Ellen (01 October 1842 - 16 April 1852)
William (01 September 1845 - 19 March 1940)
Elizabeth (09 April 1848 - 19 December 1933)
Thomas Blizard (11 January 1851 - 08 December 1929)
Henry Edward (19 November 1853 - 03 April 1935)
George (11 December 1856 - ?)
Anne (26 August 1861 - 22 September 1927)
William departed from Liverpool, England 22 June 1864 from Liverpool, on the barque "Knight Bruce". Arrived Vancouver Island 24 December 1864. Settled in Snohomish, Washington (now an outer suburb of Seattle)
Thomas & Susannah and the other surviving children departed from London, on sailing ship "Light Brigade". Arrived Lyttelton, New Zealand 26 August 1868
Thomas WHITFIELD's (19 May 1816 - 21 February 1902) parents were:
Thomas WHITFIELD (05 December 1783 - ?)
Mary EDDES (I think?) (08 November 1783 - 09 January 1853)
Susannah MIDDLETON's parents were:
Thomas MIDDLETON (? - ?)
? PILBROW (? - ?)
Thomas WHITFIELD's (05 December 1783 - ?) parents were:
Thomas WHITFIELD
Mary ?
Does your friend have any more information about Henry IRWIN's ancestors?, as I am unable to find anyone beyond his parents James IRWIN & Fanny RICHARDSON.
Hope this will be of assistance,
kind regards, Malcolm (Christchurch, New Zealand)
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Hi Malcolm,
You are most generous sharing your info. My Irwin family member does not know I have managed to get this far, with your help. I will, of course, reference this info to you.
The BMD NZ, which is online, advises Grace Johnston married reg # 1858/522 and then Grace Gregg married reg# 1877/2643. Appears to fit in with her age.
If I discvoer anything new on Henry Irwin will let you know.
Once again, many, many thanks, Palmeri
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Hi Paleri,
Grace JOHNSTON married James GREIG in 1858
Thomas WHITFIELD (05 December 1783 Shoreditch, Middlesex, England - Dec Q 1861 East London, England)
Sorry, I haven't got much more to add to what I gave last year.
I am still puzzled about what became one of Elizabeth WHITFIELD's younger brothers: George (b. 11 December 1856 London, England - d. ?). He married Winifred BATES 17 March 1891 @ St John's Church, Christchurch, NZ. But I cannot find his death anywhere? (Winifred BATES was born abt 1870 in Christchurch, NZ; died 19 June 1935 Christchurch, NZ) and according to her will, he was still alive then.
Kind regards,
Malcolm Carr (PS, I survived the earthquakes OK).
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Hi Malcom
Thanks for all your help. I am pulling this document together now.
George WHITFIELD, born 11 Dec 1856 in Stepney, London, England; died 1947 in Christchurch, New Zealand; married Winifred BATES on 17 Mar 1891 in St. John's Church, Christchurch, New Zealand; born Abt. 1870; died 1935 in Christchurch, New Zealand.
Notes for George WHITFIELD:
source: Malcolm Carr (Christchurch, New Zealand) via www.rootschat.com
Other source: BMD NZ death reg # 1947/24585 for George aged 90
regards, Palmeri
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https://bdmhistoricalrecords.dia.govt.nz/search/Hi Palmeri,
thanks for your reply, but I am a puzzled on your info regarding the death of George WHITFIELD, because, a few years back I called in at the Dept of Internal Affairs office, where they looked him up for me and could only find the 1947 death, but it was registered in Wanganui!!, not Christchurch, and it had absolutely no details of next of kin or parents name or where he was born, so could not guarantee he was the right person. About all that appeared on the certificate was his name and his age of 90.
Also, I'm a little puzzled over the marriage of Grace JOHNSTON to James GREGG or GREIG? in 1858. You quoted registration no. for this marriage (1858/522). But when I typed this into the New Zealand Internal Affairs bmd website (https://bdmhistoricalrecords.dia.govt.nz/search/) nothing showed up? Or, was this off the microfiche, which I cannot get access to at present, because Christchurch Central Library is still closed after the February earthquake.
The only titbit I can add to what I sent earlier is: I recently purchased the death certificate for Thomas Whitfield (05 December 1783 @ Shoreditch, London - 11 October 1861 @ 3 Gresham House, Whitecross St, Cripplegate, London.
I do have information on Thomas WHITFIELD's (1783-1861) siblings, which I will include next time.
Regards, Malcolm.
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Hi mate,
Re George Whitfield. I am not very good on NZ place names. So probably assumed he died in Christchurch because of other family members but after looking at the NZ Electoral Rolls, he could have died anywhere.
1880-81 NZER records George at Colombo Street, Stanmore, Canterbury. He is a Letter Carrier. No other Whitfield family mentioned.
1885-1886 NZER records George, a letter carrier, and brother Henry, a tramway guard and father Thomas, out of business, at Colombo Street, Stanmore.
1890 NZ Electoral Roll records George, a postman living at Colombo Road, St. Albans Christchurch, with his father Thomas, occupation, our of business. Nearby is brother, Thomas Blizzard Whitfield, a Baker, in Victoria Street. Only males listed.
George married Winifred 17 March 1891, St. Johns Church, Christchurch. She is the daughter of William Bates.
1892 their son Arthur George Whitfield is born.
By 1896 NZER Thomas Blizzard, brother of George, Thomas now married to Helen Dow and living at 100 Victoria Street. Nearby is Winifred, wife of George, at 24 Lower High Street. George is not listed.
By 1919 NZER Arthur, son of George and Winifred, is a chair maker now residing at 626 Cashel Street, Linwood, Avon, Canterbury with his mother Winifred, married.
There are some big gapes but Winfired certainly died in Christchurch. George could have 'buggered off"
regards,
PS which child of Elizabeth and Henry are you descended through?
My brother's lady is comes down through James Thomas.
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Hi Palmeri,
thanks for you're prompt reply. Yes, what happened to George in later life is certainly a mystery.
I'm descended from their eldest child, Fanny Maud (14 July 1878 @ Opawa, Christchurch - 25 October 1955 @ Hillsborough, Christchurch), who married William Henry ARNOLD (12 July 1875 @ St Kilda, Dunedin - 14 February 1949 @ Christchurch Hospital, Christchurch) 29 May 1901 @ St Mark's Anglican Church, Opawa, Christchurch.
I can help you with place names:
Wanganui is a coastal city on the western side of the North Island.
Stanmore is a Christchurch suburb. just east of the CBD.
St Albans is a Christchurch suburb, just north of the CBD.
Victoria St is in the north-east part of Christchurch's CBD.
This particular St John's Church, is (or was before February's earthquake - sadly, it was so badly damaged it had to be demolished) opposite the southern edge of Latimer Square, not far east of Cathedral Square (I know it was this St John's from the parish record info on their wedding).
Lower High St runs south-east from just south of the Cathedral Square.
Linwood is Christchurch suburb, further east from Stanmore.
Winifred WHITFIELD (nee BATES) died 19 July 1935 @ 97 Ferry Rd, Christchurch (this part of Ferry Rd is in the south-eastern part of the CBD.
Hope this is of some help.
Regards, Malcolm.
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Hi again Malcolm,
I only have Fanny and William with 2 children. Ruby who married Frederick Church and Iris who married Charles Finernan.
The FT I have been working on now encompasses members of the Whitfield family but, I am sure, with many errors. On my brother's side, been a work-in-progress since 2005, he dates back 28 generations to Robert, the Bruce. His fiancee's side is nearly as impressive. Hope they will be pleased with it as it starts with their daughter and it is their Christmas gift, right or wrong!!! Best effort but always ready for assistance and correction. They are off to NZ in December to catch up with family and show off their beautiful daughter Eloise, who will be 6 months old when they arrive in Auckland.
You, and she Eloise or her mum must be 2nd, 3rd or 4th cousins.
Thanks for your help have entered the details you gave me. Although had the info about Winifred, died 19 buried 21. I have the4 New Zealand burial locator and marriage disc. They help a little.
kindest regards,
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Hi Palmeri,
Fanny Maud IRWIN & William Henry ARNOLD had 4 children:
(1) Ruby Doreen Elizabeth ARNOLD (31 Oct 1902 @ 53 Barbour St, Linwood, Chch - 11 Oct 1969 @ 252 Opawa Rd, Hillsborough,
Christchurch)
married: Frederick CHURCH (23 Dec 1884 @ Lauriston, Ashburton, Mid-Canterbury, NZ - 28 Jul 1953 @ 252 Opawa Rd,
Hillsborough, Christchurch) on 24 Apr 1935 @ St Mark's Anglican Church, Opawa, Christchurch
(2) Iris Alice Pearl ARNOLD (23 Sep 1907 @ 15 Opawa Rd, Opawa, Christchurch - 19 Aug 1972 @ 31 Marama Cres, St Andrews Hill,
Christchurch)
married: Charles John FINERAN (22 Jun 1906 @ Darfield, Canterbury, NZ - 19 Jan 1977 @ Christchurch) on 15 May 1929
@ St Mark's Anglican Church, Opawa, Christchurch
(3) Olive Thelma Caroline Fanny ARNOLD (11 Mar 1911 @ 15 Opawa Rd, Opawa, Christchurch - 31 Mar 2003 @ Springview Rest
Home, 74 Chrystal St, Richmond, Christchurch)
married: James Edwin CARR (21 Jan 1906 @ Ashburton, Canterbury, NZ - 10 Mar 1976 @ Christchurch Public Hospital,
Christchurch) on 06 Jul 1940 @ St Mark's Anglican Church, Opawa, Christchurch
(4) William Henry Irwin ARNOLD (20 Jul 1914 @ 15 Opawa Rd, Opawa, Christchurch - 20 Jul 1914 @ Christchurch)
Olive was my mother.
William was either stillborn or lived only a few hours, I'm not sure which (I cannot find any entry for a birth or death in the bmd indexes).
Unfortunately, I'm still stuck going back any further with the Irwins. The furthest back I've got to is:
Thomas IRWIN (1835-36 @ County Armagh, Ireland - 14 Feb 1898 @ Montreal St, Christchurch)
Henry IRWIN (02 Jun 1837 @ County Armagh, Ireland - 17 Nov 1915 @ 3 York St, Opawa, Christchurch)
Their parents were:
James IRWIN & Fanny RICHARDSON (unfortunately, I have no bmd info on either of them)
(My mother told me they all came from Portadown in Armagh)
28 generations is pretty impressive. I've only managed 9 generations so far, and that's only in one line.
My apologies for a mistake I made in my last message - Victoria St is in the north-west part of Christchurch's CBD, NOT north-east.
Regards, Malcolm.
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Hi Malcolm,
I have added that info into FT. Hope that ok. You and my brother's lady are 2nd cousin's once removed. She uses the surname Irwin.
Have you looked at http://rootsireland.ie
I have but I find response very slow. Think my laptop nearly had its day.
You may have more info in your head than you think.
regards,
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Hi Palmeri,
hope you are OK. Sorry its been a while. I have recently found out quite a lot more through an Essex genealogist who found some records in parish registers held at the Essex Record Office.
I have attached updated information for you.
Kind regards, Malcolm.
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Hi Palmeri,
I have recently received additional information on the Irwins & Whitfields through an Essex genealogist, and Alan & Trisha Thatcher's Family History (http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=REG&db=fireballxl5&id=I437)
The following attachments have been corrected & updated.
Kind regards, Malcolm.