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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Lanarkshire => Topic started by: mcghee67 on Saturday 28 November 09 12:02 GMT (UK)
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Looking to find imformation on St Marys Industrial School, Bishopbrigs,
Why would a child be admitted to it ? Who ran the school, etc
Kind regards Jane
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Hi Jane,
Google
Scotland in 19th century 16.4
Should be first hit - Reformatories and Industrial schools
Paints a rather grim picture but later I think the nature of Industrial Schools changed. It gives details of origins and set up of schools.
St. Mary`s Abercromby Street, Glasgow served as an Orphanage and educational facility for the less fortunate. Gave them a chance in life.
I will PM some of the info I found in case it is of use.
Cheers
Ogleway
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My relative was sent to the school to live there, after his family hit hard times
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Hope the info I PM`d was useful as was the site I suggested.
O
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Does anybody know if there are any records kept for St Marys industrial school in Bishopbrigs
kind regards Jane
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Guys, as far as I know it was more or less, the Borstal.....Skoosh.
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If any survived the Mitchell, Catholic Archives (now searchable online) will have them. Or they should be able to tell you who has them/or if they survived.
Did you get the info I researched and PM`d to you?
Was it and site I gave of any use to you?
O
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Found this on another forum, it seems the Bishopbriggs school was for boys
Information extracted from the “Fifty-Fourth Report, for the Year 1910, of the Inspector Appointed, under the Provisions of the Act 5 & 6 Will. IV. C. 38, to Visit the Certified Reformatory and Industrial Schools of Great Britain."
The categories are Certified Reformatory Schools, Certified Industrial Schools, Certified Short-term Industrial Schools and Certified Day Industrial Schools.
There are four R.C. Certified Industrial Schools listed under Lanark. Two of these have St. Mary’s in the name. The other two are Slatefield Industrial School for R.C. Boys, Gallowgate, Glasgow, and Dalbeth Industrial School for R.C. Girls, Dalbeth House, Parkhead, Glasgow.)
The only R.C. Certified Reformatory School listed for Lanark is Parkhead R.C. Reformatory for Boys at West Thorn, Tollcross, Glasgow.
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St. Mary's Roman Catholic Orphanage and Industrial School for Boys, Kenmure, Bishopbriggs, Glasgow. Certified for 200 boys, July 18, 1905. Original certificate November 25, 1862, C.M., Very Rev. Canon Dyer, 68, Abereromby Street, Glasgow.
(Detailed report p.155)
St. Mary's Roman Catholic Industrial School for Girls, Abercromby Street, Glasgow. Certified for 190 girls, November 25, 1862. C.M., The Sister Superior.
(Detailed report p218)
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(p.155)
Glasgow R.C. Orphanage.
Visited.—9th and 10th March, and 4th October, 1910.
Inmates.—Total number in school, 200; voluntary cases, 0; on licence, 14; absconders, 1.
Staff.—Superintendent, Mr. A. Mathieson. Matron and nurse, Miss Fraser, M.D. Head schoolmistress, Miss E. L. Hopegood (t. and c.), left 14th July, 1910, and was succeeded temporarily by Mrs. T. Sullivan (c.) on the same day. Miss S. A. Bradley (c.) was appointed on 14th September, 1910. First assistant schoolmistress, Mrs. W. Cadahy (t. and c.), left on 29th April, 1910, and Miss B. McLoughlin (t. and c.) was appointed on 1st May, left on 15th September, and was succeeded by Miss Dooley on 8th October. Second assistant school-mistress, Mrs. Malone (ex-p.t). Joiner and manual instructor, tailor, shoemaker, baker, engineer, and bandmaster. Change of yardmaster, assistant yardmaster, handyman, labourer, outdoor officer. Changes of kitchen-maid and laundress.
Premises.—The premises were clean and in good order through-out. A partition was being put up at one end of the dining-room to make a small recreation-room.
Standards with awards.—Standard VI, 12, good (just); Standard V, 30, very fair; Standard IV, 47, very fair; Standard III, 38, very fair; Standard II, 32,.good; Standard I. 31, good; Preparatory, 8, newcomers. The general award is very fair.
Class subjects.—Singing (sol-fa), good. Composition, very fair. Recitation, very fair generally, good in I and II. Mental arithmetic, good in I, II, and VI, fair in V and III, poor in IV. Geography, very fair in V and VI, good, elsewhere. History readers have been used. Object lessons in the juniors have been started.
Industrial training.—Drawing is good generally—geometrical drawing needs further attention in the upper standards. Manual instruction is good, and good technical lessons are given in the tailoring, shoemaking, and banking departments; the work in the tailor's shop being particularly noteworthy. The garden boys get a practical training, and the technical lessons by the superintendent, which have been in abeyance owing to illness, are to be resumed. The upper standards are also given a weekly lesson by the engineer on machinery. Of 87 boys in the school of the age of 13 and over, 71 are regularly employed in skilled occupations. Of 25 boys disposed of during 1909, 19 went to skilled occupations. The band is very fair.
Physical training, &c.—All go through a course of Swedish drill, and exercises with clubs and dumb-bells. The display will be improved when the new instructor has infused more smartness into the work. A squad gave a creditable display over the horse. Foot-ball is played and the school have won several matches.
Health.—A boy died suddenly in July from meningitis. A boy suffering from hernia was operated on in the infirmary. There was a case of fractured elbow and some boys have suffered with their eyes, but the health during the year has been generally good. There is no regular inspection of the teeth, but boys are sent to a dentist for extraction when considered necessary.
Conduct.—There were four cases of absconding (three boys getting away together), but all were promptly recovered. A few cases of disobedience and boyish offences, and a fair number of schoolroom punishments complete the list. The general conduct is good. There is no mark system, but well-behaved boys are allowed home on Sundays.
General remarks.—The frequent changes in the teaching staff have necessarily impared the schoolroom results. An improvement may be expected next year. In other respects the school appears to be doing very well.
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http://www.talkingscot.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=12391
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Sancti, you've omitted the salient point of how ones forebears ended up in an Industrial School (Catholic or otherwise) the reports you mention could equally pass for Eton or Harrow! whilst some kids were unfortunate enough to end up there due to family circumstances, the bulk were sent there by the courts and shocking places they were!......Skoosh.
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mcgee67
I checked St Mary`s for you in Mitchell today.
Records you seek are not held there.
Ogleway
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Many many thanks Ogleway for having a look and thanks to everyone who answered my query I appreciate it very much.
Kind regards Jane ;)
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Hi I just found your posting on this forum while browsing .
I was a resident of st marys for one year in 1963 to1964 .
At that time it was classed as an approved school for boys.
It wanst such a bad place then as you were treated reasonably well as long as you behaved.
Interestingly I was passing one day when it was a derilect building a few years ago and decided to venture inside as there was a door open .
To my amazement I found all the old records and reports covering the time that I was in there.
Needles to say i still have them to this day
Hope this info helps a litle bit with your searching
john
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Sancti, you've omitted the salient point of how ones forebears ended up in an Industrial School (Catholic or otherwise) the reports you mention could equally pass for Eton or Harrow! whilst some kids were unfortunate enough to end up there due to family circumstances, the bulk were sent there by the courts and shocking places they were!......Skoosh.
Skoosh, the reports relate to the early 1900's and way before my time. Can you confirm if you are talking from experience ;D
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Sancti, ah take the fifth on this matter!......Skoosh.
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The records are with the Roman Catholic Dioscese in Glasgow but while they admitted having them they ingnored my requests for answers. I think you perhaps have to go there and do the research.
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I was thirteen year a boy, I was sent to 'Housie' ~ Approved School... St. Marys in 1963 to 1965...ish, I spent 28 days in remand at Larchgrove, then on to St. Marys I can tell so many tales about the place, the Catholic priests who ran it, then it was civilian-ran, a big burly man called Ford was headmaster, a tough but fair man he was, he gave the belt hard on the arse in his office to bad boys... me included, it was not all bad, far from it lots of great outings tattie picking, the baths at Kirkintulloch, the trips to Loch Lomond, the food, the films the clean beds and so on. Got oot and went to work for the Times paper in Glasgow..... then on with life. Yeah!
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Hi I just found your posting on this forum while browsing .
I was a resident of st marys for one year in 1963 to1964 .
At that time it was classed as an approved school for boys.
It wanst such a bad place then as you were treated reasonably well as long as you behaved.
Interestingly I was passing one day when it was a derilect building a few years ago and decided to venture inside as there was a door open .
To my amazement I found all the old records and reports covering the time that I was in there.
Needles to say i still have them to this day
Hope this info helps a litle bit with your searching
john
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Wow! found yer auld files eh!! It was not too bad in Housie, some bullying and so on, the men in charge were ok, mostly.... Auld Goch the cobbler, remember him? Wee Chesty? Scony Weir? Br. Ford......the bonnie Irish lassies who served the grub and worked in the kitchens. Our sang~~~ The Boys of St Mary will never say no.....sing high-sing-low tr la la. I never got in trouble ever again, well not bad stuff! some went on the Bar-EL some died, some lived. Best of luck . R Moffat.
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I'm really interested to see this post. My late father was apparently sent to a "borstal" for "bad boys" called St Mary's in Glasgow. I know this place wasn't a borstal but perhaps that's how my disgruntled dad would describe it. He was from Perth and was a young offender, charged of borrowing/stealing another little boys' bike. He was baptised as a RC so perhaps, if this is the correct place, that is also a connection.
My dads name was Danny Mann, born 1953, so I'm assuming his time out would have been early to mid 60's.
I suppose what I am interested in really is finding his file and where to start looking for that. Ive really enjoyed the above posts!
thanks
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does anyone know if there are any photos of St. Marys 'approved school' Bishopbriggs?? or can someone tell me where to start looking..my dad was in there in the 60's and i believe one or two of his brothers were as well..(surname Boyle)..he often talks about his time in there, dad lives here in England now but he would love to know if any info/photos etc exists ...any help in this would be greatly appreciated..
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Hello Caroline,
There are some photos and a description of the school's history here:
http://www.childrenshomes.org.uk/GlasgowStMaryBoysIS/
Best wishes
Rockford
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thanks for the info link Rockford, i have actually already read that info but i was hoping for photos/info on the school around the 60's when my dad was there. The only photos i can find are of 1908..he also said the football team from the Marys did well so i was hoping that someone somewhere had photos of the teams through the years. Maybe along shot i know but worth a try. Thanks again..Caroline
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I lived in the area during the 1950-60s, and all we cihldren were told was "That's where all the bad boys live" and that if we didn't do as we were told, then you'd end up there as well!