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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => East Lothian (Haddingtonshire) => Topic started by: Templar75 on Sunday 15 November 09 14:14 GMT (UK)

Title: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Sunday 15 November 09 14:14 GMT (UK)
Hi all,

I was wondering if anyone has done any research on Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston  who was killed in the Tranent Massacre in 1797, ancestors and descendants, I have tried the IGI for East Lothian but can't see anything.

Many thanks in advance.

Regards.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: KirstyG on Sunday 15 November 09 18:24 GMT (UK)
Hi Archie

Someone seems to have included her in their tree.

http://worldconnect.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=gilead07&id=I024170

There was a mention in someone else's blog that she was the sister of one their direct ancestors and she died young leaving 4 young children, and her husband later married a relative.

http://mittensmum.blogspot.com/2008/04/massacre-of-tranent-my-ancestor-joan.html

Kirsty
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Sunday 15 November 09 20:54 GMT (UK)
Hi Kirsty,

Thank you very much for the links they are most appreciated.

Best regards.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Joannie 7 on Monday 16 November 09 23:11 GMT (UK)
Archie

I have contacted you directly about Jackie Crookston.  Hope that this is OK!

Regards

Joanne
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Tuesday 17 November 09 00:13 GMT (UK)
Thanks a million Joanne.

Best.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: tidybooks on Monday 23 November 09 23:59 GMT (UK)
Hi Templar75,

Should this not be in East Lothian, Tranent is my birthplace and it is definitely East Lothian.

Tom

Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Tuesday 24 November 09 12:20 GMT (UK)
Hi Tom,

           I put down East lothian on the original post, what were you thinging about ?, we think that a Helen Wood an ancestor of ours may have been a decendant of Joan/Jackie Crookston.

Best.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: K44ENF on Tuesday 24 November 09 12:43 GMT (UK)
Hi Archie,

Although you clearly put East Lothian on your original post, this thread is in the Midlothian board. I think that was what Tom meant. I don't know whether it would be worth asking a moderator to move it? Just in case you miss out on an East Lothian specialist!

I had no idea there was a Tranent massacre. I have some people from Tranent in my tree - must do a bit of digging.

Karen
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Tuesday 24 November 09 13:17 GMT (UK)
Hi Karen,

               Thank you for keeping me right, I thought I had put it in the East Lothian one, must be old age!!.  (*)

Below takes you to all the various sites with information on The Tranent Massacre.

http://search.virginmedia.com/results/?channel=homepage&vml=telewest&vmt=t9&q=the+tranent+massacre&submit-frmGoogleWeb=Web+Search


Happy hunting.

Best regards.

Archie.



(*) Moderator Comment: now moved to East Lothian
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: K44ENF on Tuesday 24 November 09 14:19 GMT (UK)
Thank you Archie. I am more informed on the subject now. :)
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Woodsd on Sunday 07 March 10 19:58 GMT (UK)
Archie

Greetings again!

I have a wee bit of information about Jackie Crookston.  From looking through OPRs, my sister-in-law seems to be descended from Jackie Crookston's husband through his second marriage.  I guess from names that the husband's second wife was probably a relation of Jackie Crookston too.

I haven't looked at my notes on this for a long time, and they are hand-written scribbles.  I will dig the stuff out and drop you a note.

Meanwhile, obviously fascinated if Helen Wood (presumably the one that married James Young in 1846) is descended from Jackie Crookston.  That would make you a relation of my sister-in-law too, and my sister-in-law a relation of my ex-wife.  All too connected for comfort!

Best wishes

David
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Sunday 07 March 10 23:25 GMT (UK)
Hi David,

                 great to hear from you again and hope you are well, my cousin Anita in Canada whom I have met through this site has done a lot of digging, I think there are a couple of children not mentioned and she believes that one of them is a female and probably named Helen. She found one in Edinburgh down as in sevice but not shure if she is the one we are looking for.

Joanne who runs the midlothian family reasearch with her husband can't find her either, Joanne's husband is a direct decendant of Jackie Crookston.

Helen Wood who died at Loanhead died from " Overwork " she worked at the Kevock Mill in Lasswade, poor lassie and so young at 48 years.

If you can manage to crack it David it would be like finding the Holy Grail.

Take care.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Woodsd on Sunday 14 March 10 11:43 GMT (UK)
Archie

I’ve dug out the notes that I made a few years ago about my sister-in-law’s connection to Jackie Crookston.

What I’ve got has just skimmed the surface, and most of the information came off the internet.  I’ve not even fully checked the IGI or looked up the original OPRs.  So some obvious notes of caution, since I have not checked this information.  Also, I don’t think this is going to be of much use to you for Helen Wood, as yet anyway.  However, I’ve given a summary below just in case.

But please note again that I have not checked a lot of this information even to the IGI (and the website is down just now or I would have done some checks).

Regards

David.

James Crookston, born 9 January 1732, Gladsmuir, and married Agnes Hogg in 1753, Pencaitland.  Children included (certainly not sure about the accuracy of this list):
-   William Crookston, born 16 April 1754, Pencaitland, and married Elspeth Gray
-   Adam Crookston, born 22 April 1756, Pencaitland
-   George Crookston, born 31 January 1758, Gladsmuir
-   James Crookston, born 20 April 1760, Pencaitland, and married Jean Hogg
-   John Crookston, born 21 December 1762, Gladsmuir
-   Charles Crookston, born 25 November 1764, Gladsmuir
-   Joanna Crookston, born 12 June 1768, Gladsmuir (see below)
-   Margaret Crookston, born 3 August 1772, Gladsmuir
-   Agnes Crookston, born 10 June 1774, Gladsmuir, and married James Duncan
-   Thomas Crookston, born 6 May 1776, Gladsmuir
-   Robert Crookston, born 3 July 1780, Gladsmuir and married Joanna Redpath,

Joanna Crookston, born 12 June 1768, Gladsmuir, married William Ross (born 7 December 1764, Gladsmuir – some questions on date of birth) c 1789, Tranent.  Children included:
-   James Ross, born 30 March 1790, Tranent.

Joanna (Jackie) Crookston died during the Massacre of Tranent on 29 August 1797.

William Ross married secondly Janet Hogg on 20 December 1797, Pencaitland.  Children included:
-   Margaret Ross born 29 December 1798 Pencaitland, and married William McNeil (my sister-in-law is descended from this couple)

William Ross’s first wife Joanna Crookston was the daughter of Agnes Hogg.  Agnes Hogg was the daughter of William Hogg (born 11 April 1708, Gladsmuir) and Mary Braid, who married 3 October 1730, Gladsmuir.

William Ross’s second wife Janet Hogg had been born 21 October 1769, Gladsmuir, daughter of George Hogg and Margaret Atkins.  George Hogg was the son of William Hogg and Mary Braid.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Sunday 14 March 10 17:30 GMT (UK)
Hi David,

               thanks a lot for this and your time, I remember Anita saying that a child was missing and she believed it could have been a girl called Helen, Anita was going by earlier names hence her thinking this child was Helen, I can see her point as it was the norm then.

Thanks again David.

Cheers.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Woodsd on Sunday 14 March 10 19:00 GMT (UK)
Archie

I’ve been thinking about this today after posting the note above.

Helen Wood was born circa 1825 (died 1873, aged 48 years).  Therefore, to be descended from Jackie Crookston, Helen Wood’s mother would have to be one of Jackie Crookston’s daughters, ie surname Ross.

As you’ll know, the IGI does not report the birth of Helen Wood.  Also, only the father’s name of William Wood is given on Helen Wood’s death certificate.  The name of Helen Wood’s mother is not known.

I’ve previously looked up the census returns for Helen Wood (or Young as she was then) listed for 1861 and 1871.  I have never tried to look her up on the 1841 (or 1851) census, so that’s something still to be done.  Especially the 1841 census return could have Helen still living with her parents (probably either in Tranent where she was born, or Lasswade where she got married in 1846), and so provide her mother’s first name and age.

William Wood was dead by 1873 (recorded “deceased” on Helen Wood’s death certificate).  Again, I have never tried to find William Wood’s death certificate, but he may have one if he died after 1855.  His death certificate would provide details of his wife.  So that’s something else that could be searched for.

Also, William Wood might appear himself on the census returns (either Tranent or Lasswade), and his wife might be listed beside him.  That would at least give the wife’s first name.  So that’s a third aspect to investigate.

Meanwhile, the IGI has come back online, and I’ve tried a few searches.  And I reckon that I have got this.  However, Helen Wood would not be descended from Jackie Crookston, but instead descended from James Crookston who was Jackie Crookston’s brother.

James Crookston was born on 20 April 1760, either at Gladsmuir or Pencaitland (IGI lists both places, so need to check OPRs to confirm).  On 4 July 1783, James Crookston married Jean Hogg in Tranent.

James Crookston and Jean Hogg had a daughter Janet Crookston, born 27 September 1790 at Tranent.  On 16 July 1808, Janet Crookston married William Wood in Tranent.  This could well be William Wood who was the father of Helen Wood born 1825 in Tranent.

To prove the case, we really need the name of Helen Wood’s mother.  So maybe one of the suggestions above would help find that, ie William Wood’s death certificate or one of the census returns.

Meanwhile, the census returns list James Young and Helen Wood’s eldest daughter as Janet.  As you’ll know, the Scottish custom is to name the first-born daughter after the mother’s mother.  So, following that tradition, Helen Wood’s mother was probably named Janet, ie after Janet Crookston..

Although all this is quite probably the case, I’d like to prove the first name of Helen Wood’s mother to be more certain (just in case the William Wood who married in Tranent in 1808 was not your William Wood).  But I think the case is cracked.

Also of interest is that James Crookston (junior) married Jean Hogg.  The IGI indicates that Jean Hogg was born on 16 April 1762 the daughter of James Hogg and Helen Swann, who married on 25 August 1758 in Tranent.  James Crookston and Jackie Crookston’s mother was Agnes Hogg.  Meanwhile, the second wife of William Ross (Jackie Crookston’s husband) was Janet Hogg.  I’ve shown above that Janet Hogg was the niece of Agnes Hogg.  Chances are that Jean Hogg is part of the same family.  (Hogg is still a fairly common name in Tranent.)

The Family Search / IGI website has an Ancestral File recorded for James Crookston and Jean Hogg.  You might want to have a look at the extra information given there.

About 30 years ago, I went to the Brunton Theatre in Musselburgh to see a play called The Massacre of Tranent.  Little did I realise then that I’d become so interested in Jackie Crookston.  But it’s nice to have a statue in the family (yesterday morning when I went for my newspaper, I saw that Jackie Crookston was wearing a traffic cone on her head).

Anyway, in summary, I reckon that Jackie Crookston was your great-great-great-great-great-aunt.

I trust you find this of interest!

Regards

David
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Sunday 14 March 10 19:55 GMT (UK)
Thanks David boy is that some search, I remember Anita sending this to me it is William Wood's Death Cert.

Cheers.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Woodsd on Monday 15 March 10 17:54 GMT (UK)
Archie

That is not William Wood's death certificate (at least not the William Wood who was the father of Helen Wood).  Instead, this is the death certificate of Helen Wood's brother, named William Wood just like his father.  And, of course, this confirms that the mother was Janet Crookston.  So it adds more proof to what I've already written.

So I think the case is cracked.  You are descended from Jackie Crookston's brother.

Regards

David
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Tuesday 23 March 10 21:39 GMT (UK)
Hi David,

              sorry for not contacting you sooner but we have been hit with this cold bug or whatever it is, yes that looks like it is complete, we will never find Helen no matter what.

Anite has sent me loads of Certs on the Young and Wood family even the Tait family, will these be of any use to you ?.

Cheers.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Gow67 on Friday 13 August 10 20:24 BST (UK)
Hi folks,

I just discovered that, mainly due to this discussion thread, I am also related to Jackie Crookston through my mother's side.

She is my 6th great aunt, the sister of Robert Crookston b.1780 my fifth great grandfather.

Their father James Crookston is my 6th great grandfather.

Also, the statue in Tranent of Jackie looks a bit like my Mother......

 ;)

Let me know if anyone wants details to add to their own tree.

All the best,

Alan Gow

Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Friday 13 August 10 21:18 BST (UK)
Hi Alan,

            getting to be a small world now, that's great that you are related to her as well, could you please send the details you have please.

Where do you live Alan.

Cheers.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Gow67 on Saturday 14 August 10 21:11 BST (UK)
Most of the Crookston genealogy I obtained from "The Crookston Family of Australia Home Page" by Peter Crookston :

http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/c/r/o/Peter-Crookston/index.html  (http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/c/r/o/Peter-Crookston/index.html) 

http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/c/r/o/Peter-Crookston/PDFGENEO1.pdf

You will see Jackie's niece Rosa Crookston(b.1812) married a fellow named James Anderson and Peter's tree ends there.

Rosa or Rosie or Rose Crookston and James Anderson had a son called George Anderson (1835-1876) who was a coach hirer according to his death cert but I have good reason to believe he also had a pub in Linlithgow High Street.

George married Isabella Beveridge and they had a son also called George (1861-1918). He married Mary Jane Murray and they had a daughter Isabella Anderson.

Isabella Anderson married William Burness McMeeking (himself related to the famous Burness family of NE Scotland that spawned a certain Robert Burness a.k.a. Rabbie Burns) and they had a daughter Joan McMeeking (my Granny).

Joan married John Rooney and their daughter Bridget is my mother, married to John Gow.

I am in Bo'ness, West Lothian and in many ways things have come full circle as Jackie's father James Crookston was born 9th January 1731/32 in Carriden, now in Bo'ness.

I haven't had a chance to verify Peter Crookston's tree but it looks pretty spot on with dates, etc. and I have no reason to dispute his accuracy. I haven't even had a chance to contact him yet.

If anyone wants copies of certs let me know?

Hope this is of interest.

AG

Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: irene784 on Sunday 10 October 10 10:30 BST (UK)
Hi David

I found your posting quite by chance whilst trawling through the site.  I was intrigued to find my great great grandparents mentioned, James Young and Helen Wood.  Their daughter Janet married Thomas Clapperton in Loanhead in 1872 (my place of birth).

I am afraid I cannot shed any light on the connection with Joan Crookston, this is the first time I have ever heard of a massacre at Tranent!  I am now hooked on finding out more!

I do not have any hard evidence of Helen's mothers name as I haven't delved any further back yet.  I am pleased to learn she had a brother (William).  Where would I find information on him and other siblings? I have only found census details for Helen after she married James Young.

This possible Crookston connection has caused renewed interest in this line of my family tree.

Any little snippet anyone can give me on my family lines would be greatly appreciated.

Regards

Irene
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Oyama on Sunday 10 October 10 18:01 BST (UK)
Hi Irene

My grandmother was the daughter of Archibald Tait Young ( Janet's brother) as was Archie the originator of this post.   I have the genealogy re. James Young and Helen Wood and would be happy to share all the info. with you.

Anita
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: irene784 on Sunday 10 October 10 21:30 BST (UK)
Hi Anita

I would greatly appreciate anything you can send me relating to the Wood and Young families.  This website is new to me so I am hoping I can find more information on my family history.
many thanks

Irene
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Woodsd on Tuesday 12 October 10 08:13 BST (UK)
Irene

I see that Anita is going to give you information on James Young and Helen Wood, so you're in good hands.

Meanwhile, you might like to look at Archie's posting entitled "Archibald Young" which you'll find on page 2 of the Midlothian page.

Regards

David
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Oyama on Tuesday 12 October 10 22:11 BST (UK)
Hi David

Thank You for the vote of confidence.

Have sent an Ahnentafel Chart to Irene outling her family tree from Janet Young ( her ancestor) back as far as as I was able to find them in the records

Anita
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: staceymaclennan on Monday 24 October 11 15:36 BST (UK)
hi guys,m im writing on behalf of my sister, we have been doing some research on the killings of the tranent massacre, my sister is in a new build in tranent on the battlefield of where this happened and is/has experienced some strange activity in her home, she heard a little girl speak to her saying "i cant hear, i cant see" and a few things lik toys and doors etc have moved and just wondered if anyone nos of a little girl who died and of any names, we cant find much on the internet.

thanks

stacey,
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Monday 24 October 11 19:47 BST (UK)
Hi stacey,

              I am related to Anita and Jackie or Joan Crookston was our 5th great aunt, as far as the story goes most of the people who were killed are supposed to be the ringleaders.

Jackie Crookston's body lay undetected for several weeks and she was found by Harvesters, men women and children were killed on that tragic day, Jackie Crookston's death was never officially recorded, she may have been fatally wounded on the outskirts of the Town and made her way to hide perhaps in a hedge and died there.

There does not seem to be any little girls killed on that day, however, a young boy of 13 years was hacked down in a field, the Dragoon Horseman hacked half his head off.

He and his brother William who was slightly older lived in Pencaitland, they had heard about what was going on in Tranent and decided to see the demonstration, they never reached Tranent the Soldiers saw them walking down the road and that is where he met his death his brother was wounded

Your sister states he hears the voice saying " I can't see and can't hear " it is probably the wee boy, remember having half of his head hacked off would mean his ear and one of his eyes were missing, perhaps a message.

If your sister hears the voice again tell her to say " William ", remember this was the brother of the dead boy who was not named, at 13 years old and in those days he was probably small and unbroken voice just a wee boy, if the toys are being moved around if it's him he is just being inquisitive, he probably never had toys.

If it persists tell your sister to get the help of the local Catholic Priest and ask if he could Bless the house, this usually works. Or she could look at it that he does not mean her or her family any harm, her house is probably on the spot where he fell.

John Caddell a local Mine owner was responsible for calling the Troops in, to incite the crowd he was seen throwing stones into them, Robert Dundas failed to see that the Troops actions related to murder.

The dead were, Peter Ness, William Lawson,Stephen Brotherstone, William Laidlaw, John Adam, James Moffatt, the young boy killed as mentioned his last name was Kemp.

Of course there were Jackie Crookston and some others not mentioned.

I have attached a map with the names of those who were shot and roughly where.

Cheers.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Oyama on Monday 24 October 11 23:48 BST (UK)
Hi Stacey

Excellent info from Archie.

Anita
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: staceymaclennan on Tuesday 25 October 11 09:40 BST (UK)
defo anita, thankyou so much archie, great help, my sister will be pleased.

stacey.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: staceymaclennan on Tuesday 25 October 11 09:49 BST (UK)
it seems that willaim laidlaw is the one thats closest to her, is this the one you are talking about as there are two williams.

stacey
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Hibee on Tuesday 25 October 11 14:04 BST (UK)
Hi

Is there any further information on John Adam, who was listed amongst those killed?

I have a 1st cousin (6 times removed) of that name, who was born 25. Jan 1764, married Janet Kinlay 25 Oct 1781 in Tranent, and had a daughter (Euphemia Elizabeth) there in 1786.

Hibee
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Tuesday 25 October 11 14:27 BST (UK)
Hi Stacey,

              I mean William Kemp he was the brother who escaped back to Pencaitland, as there are no actual ages except for the wee boy Kemp I assume the rest were all of adult age.

The wee boy that was killed could be the one that your sister is hearing and moving the toys, as his brother was called William she could say his name and see what reaction if any she gets if any.

What I will say is that he means her or the family no harm, depending on the age of her children she should ask them if they have ever seen a wee boy in the house, this happened to us when one of our sons many years ago saw something, he stood there smiling at something in the Hallway of our house, we asked him what he was smiling at and he answered a big man, we think it was his late granddad.

More on the Massacre :


Caddell took his anger out on a number of people on of them being Janet Hogg, he is alleged to have dashed her face against the door of the Inn. he is then supposed to have ordered the troops to ride in a five mile radius and kill everyone on site.

George Elder and Joan Crookston were shot in the street, Isobel Rodger 19 yrs old was chased by a soldier into a passageway of a house and shot dead, William Smith died on the staircase of a house opposite the Inn, Janet Forsyth 16 yrs old had left her job cutting the corn to see what was happening was shot by a soldier wounding her, she carried the bullet for the rest of her life.

Another Tranent girl 17 yrs old Mary Allan was shot in a narrow passageway, the bullet missed her and hit the frame of the door, she passed out and the soldier thought he had killed her and left.

Soldiers saw women standing at the door of one of the houses a soldier went into the house, he saw the bed and started to hack and cut through the sheets, a child screamed with that a Mrs. Reid grabbed the soldier and threw him into the street, her young son David had lost one of his little fingers.

Stephen Brotherstone as mentioned earlier came from Pencaitland and the story is this, he and his wife with an old man called James Crichton were walking towards Tranent on the road from Pencaitland.

As they were walking they saw the Cavalry riding towards them, they took cover in a hedge but the soldiers opened fire a few times raking the hedge. A Trooper dismounted to see if they were dead but was amazed that they were still alive, he started to hack at James Crighton with his Sabre, he also attacked Brotherstone cutting his abdomen and legs, Mrs. Brotherstone screamed for mercy but none was given.

The Pembrokeshire Regiment never turned up for the hearing which seems that they were guilty of murder.

Sorry Hibee there is no other information on John Adam.

Cheers.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: staceymaclennan on Tuesday 25 October 11 17:46 BST (UK)
archie

thnakyou so much for all your time and information, you have been a great help!!

my sisters child is only one so not really old enough to speak even if he has saw something, whoever it is doesnt seem to be bothering them and never thought he/she would hurt the family, think they are just a little scared and finding out more information about who it may be has helped alot.

thanks

stacey.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Tuesday 25 October 11 23:38 BST (UK)
Hi Stacey,

                  you are most welcome and regards to your sister please.

Cheers.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crooston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Wednesday 26 October 11 00:40 BST (UK)
Hi Folks,

             to all who are interested this is the ruin of Gladsmuir Old Kirk where Joanna Crookston was baptized on the 12 June 1760.

Cheers.
 
Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Friday 28 October 11 11:42 BST (UK)
Hi Stacey,

                I spoke to my son this morning who is a Police Officer in Tranent, I told him your story about your sister hearing what sounds like a little girl and the toys being moved.

I told him she was in a new-build house, he said that some new-builds are an area called " Kemps End " hence the wee boy who was killed with half his head taken off, if your sister lives there then what she is probably hearing is the wee boy, there is still no name for him, as stated earlier he was 13 years old and it was his younger brother William aged 8 years that witnessed the killing.

Cheers.

Archie.

Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Hibee on Friday 28 October 11 12:00 BST (UK)
That must be almost as bad as living in Hob's Lane (Quatermass and the Pit, for the benefit of younger readers).

Hibee
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Tuesday 01 November 11 22:40 GMT (UK)
I wonder if an apology was ever made by the Government or the Regiment at some point.

Cheers.

Archie.
Title: Re: Tranent Massacre - Aftermath
Post by: Gerry_R on Friday 16 December 11 00:43 GMT (UK)
Hi all,

At Monica's suggestion, I am posting this here after posting it earlier as a new thread.

"I have been reading the London newspaper reports from the weeks following the Tranent massacre - or riots, as the papers have it. Lots of reports but many are simply repeating what they were fed by the Edinburgh press.
It was reported that about 8 "rioters" were taken away to Haddingon gaol and later to Edinburgh for trial. Somewhere I read that a number of these prisoners were convicted and transported - and in 1797-8 that must have been to New South Wales.
So far I have not been able to track down any records of the trials, nor the lists of those who were tried. Can anyone help me there? My family may yet have a convict connection or two.

Incidentally, the Manchester Times and Gazette of Oct 28 1843 reprinted an article from Tait's Magazine which mentioned the "riots at Tranent" in the same context as a discussion of a "mock rebellion in the west". It remains a mystery that the people of Tranent and surrounds were dealt with so harshly when similar protests and actions were being managed relatively cleanly at numerous towns all over Scotland. Perhaps the Battle of Prestonpans was still a sore spot for many of the people in power, even after the passage of 52 years."

The same report mentioned the "execution of Hardie and Baird at Stirling". I am interested in this tangent as both names are in my wife's family line, as was Jackie Crookston. I wonder if anyone can shed any light on the circumstances of this event, and exactly who "Hardie and Baird" were, and what dreadful crime they had committed to justify their execution.

Cheers,

Gerry

Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Friday 16 December 11 01:29 GMT (UK)
Hi Gerry,

              here are some links for you all good reading but what an end to their lives.

Cheers.

Archie.

http://www.theblendfestival.co.uk/index/stirling/historytimeline/bygone_days/execution-2.htm

http://digital.nls.uk/broadsides/broadside.cfm/id/15293

http://www.gcu.ac.uk/radicalglasgow/chapters/1820_insurrection.html

http://www.thesonsofscotland.co.uk/the1820rising.htm

http://www.memento-mori.co.uk/89.pdf

http://dcwilson.tripod.com/
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Gerry_R on Friday 16 December 11 03:22 GMT (UK)
Many thanks, Archie!

I have checked out all the references you gave me.  What a story!

Now, if only I can find some link between the collier Baird families of Tranent and that of John Baird, weaver, from North Lanarkshire. . .
Pretty tenuous, I would think, but I will have a look.

Gerry

Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Friday 16 December 11 23:09 GMT (UK)
Hi Gerry,

              what a difference from Weaver to a Miner, anyway happy hunting I am sure you will find a link if I can be of any help give me a shout.

Cheers.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Gerry_R on Friday 16 December 11 23:40 GMT (UK)
Thanks, Archie,

I will keep your kind offer in mind. Researching Tranent from Brisbane, Queensland is sometimes difficult!

By the way, I really like your 1799 map.  I note your Copyright on it. May I use it in my (private) notes of all this history to share with my family?

Cheers,

Gerry
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Saturday 17 December 11 02:18 GMT (UK)
G'Day Gerry,

                 thank you for asking, if it is for private use there is no problem, so you are from sunny Brisbane, we were there 3 years ago visiting Relatives, one lives in Elimbah and the other in Ferny Hills, a beautiful country and the people match it as well.

I was standing on a bit of waste ground in Bribie Island but next houses, my cousin said don't move so I froze, after a few minutes he yanked me on to the road, it turned out a King Brown Snake was over my two feet and I never felt it, same with the Red Backs there was a nest near his pool I never changed underwear so fast !!.

We had a lovely walk along the beach at Wooram pure white sand I wish we were back again.

Cheers.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Lois_Moon on Sunday 29 January 12 00:14 GMT (UK)
A very horrific read, all of this about the massacre.  It was news to me until I found this tread a couple of days ago.

Stephen BROTHERSTONE was my 4x grandfather.  I was in looking for his death information when I found your postings.  He was born is 1743 and his wife was Margaret THOMSON and his childen were born in 1778, 1780 & 1787.

Lois
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Sunday 29 January 12 10:08 GMT (UK)
Hi Lois,

                       I am glad that you now know what happened to Stephen, have you managed to find a death registration for him or not I would be interested to find out please.

Regards.

Archie.

Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Lois_Moon on Sunday 29 January 12 20:15 GMT (UK)
Hi Archie and all

My cousin will have a look on Scotlands People for that, now that we have a date.  I'll let you know when I hear from her.

Lois
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: JHC on Friday 03 February 12 12:34 GMT (UK)
I have read through this Crookston thread and would like to ask about James Crookston who married Janet Wood 1822 Tranent. There were children Jemima 1826 and Jean / Jane 1824.
James died and Janet Wood married Andrew Archibald, which is where I fit in (also Coalminers).

Is that James Crookston related to the Crookston of the massacre?

Thanks.
Jean (from cold, wet, Sydney, Australia)
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Woodsd on Saturday 04 February 12 11:35 GMT (UK)
Jean

James Crookston who married Janet Wood was the nephew of Jackie Crookston of the Massacre.

If you use the links posted here by Gow67 on 14 August 2010 and the summary from my first post of 14 March 2010, you find that this James Crookston was the son of Robert Crookston by his first wife Rosina Redpath (I've got Joanna as his wife, but reckon that's a handwriting thing).  Anyway, the links from Gow67 will give you dates and lots more.

As for Wood, more research would be needed to link your Janet Wood to the William Wood and Janet Wood mentioned in my posts in March 2010.  The dates indicate that your Janet Wood is not one of the ladies of that name already mentioned.  But they could easily be related and give you a double connection.

So you too are a member of this big family and related to a statue in the centre of this lovely (!) town.  You will find plenty photographs of the statue by using Google

Regards

David (from cold wet Tranent)
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: JHC on Saturday 04 February 12 13:51 GMT (UK)
David
Thankyou for the previous links, which I'll read with interest.

My Janet Wood was born 1803, daughter of Archibald Wood and Janet Brown. (She had a son named Archibald Wood Archibald in 1832, to her second husband.)

I drove through Tranent in 2007 and saw the statue, but didn't know the connection at the time.

Regards
Jean


Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: lindeyblonde on Wednesday 14 March 12 22:09 GMT (UK)
Hi I am new on here. I have been researching  my family tree for a few years now. My grandmother was Jean Crookston Armour b 1905. Jackie crookston features in my tree but haven't quite worked out relationships. there is load of info here and I would like to use it, and cross check with my tree. I hope this is ok.
I have been to see the statue too and feel very proud to say she is an ancestor!!
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: richard watson on Saturday 17 March 12 22:40 GMT (UK)
Hello, I was born in Tranent and I'm a direct descendant of Euphemia Adam and James Smith. Euphemia was a brother of John Adam who was one of the casualties of the massacre. Their son James my direct ancestor married Catherine Hogg who was a descendant of William Hogg and Mary Braid who in turn were grandparents to Jackie Crookston. The Smith family were from Newton and members of their family were the Bennetts and the Moffats. There was a William Smith who was also killed during the massacre. I'm not sure if he was a distant relative but James Smith senior did have a brother William. There is also a book about the history of Tranent(McNeill). I read it many years ago and there is a mention of some of the casualties.
                                                                                                                     Richard.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: MonicaL on Sunday 18 March 12 09:02 GMT (UK)
Hi Lindeyblonde and Richard

Templar has not been online for a few weeks. He will have got notifcation of your posts and hopefully will post back soon.

Welcome to RootsChat, Lindeyblonde!

Monica  :)
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Hibee on Sunday 18 March 12 09:55 GMT (UK)
Hi Richard

Euphemia Adam was the second of John Adam's four children.  Three of them married Smiths from the village of Penston.

You might be interested in my website, if you've not already seen it (link on the left of this post).

Alistair Adams
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: richard watson on Sunday 18 March 12 21:14 GMT (UK)
Hello,

Sorry I should have said Euphemia was John's daughter. I have a number of ancestors that lived in Newton, Tranent, Musselburgh, Old Craighall or the surrounding area.The main families that I am looking for are : Gordon, Wilson, Gray, Muirhead, Ross, Halley, Love, Smith, Adam and Watson. Good site Alistair.

Richard
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: richard watson on Wednesday 21 March 12 14:36 GMT (UK)
Hello,

       there was motion put forward on debates day in the House of Commons on the 7th Nov 1797 regarding the Tranent Militia incident. The mover of the question was by the right Honourable Mr Tierney. I searched for the MP's of that era and the only one I could find was George Tierney from the constituancy of Southwark. He asked for an enquiry into the actions of the Militia. Pitt wasn't to keen for an enquiry and other MP's actually praised the soldiers for a job well done. The motion was defeated by 139 votes to 8.

Richard.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Monday 26 March 12 00:18 BST (UK)
Hi Friends,

                 Monica I am sorry but I have not received any notifications on this subject for ages.

Ok I have attached the birth for Joanna Crookston for you all in case you do not have it, as far as I know she married William Ross in 1789,  I have been on to Scotland's People and it does not come up, if they married then perhaps they never had the money to pay for registration, or did they have an Irregular marriage like many others.

Her death has never been registered again perhaps William never had the cash at the time, this is a real shame as she was one of the Heroine's of Tranent and noted in history.

Cheers.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: MonicaL on Monday 26 March 12 08:14 BST (UK)
Hi Archie

Great to see you back  :) Sometimes gremlins appear on the notifications, so worth double checking in case something has been unticked for this topic.

Monica
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: belter on Wednesday 18 July 12 16:54 BST (UK)
Recently discovered I am descended from Jackie Crookston's brother, James.  He has a daughter Janet who goes on to marry a William Wood.  Their son James Wood who marries Mary Morton is my 3x great grandfather.  Any more info on these family tree branches would be appreciated. 
     Very proud to know I am descended from such a strong and determined woman. :)
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Wednesday 18 July 12 19:01 BST (UK)
Hi Belter,

              welcome to the family cousin here is a site I came across, just click on the names.

http://www.geni.com/people/Jackie-Joan-Crookston/6000000009608060911

Cheers.

Archie.

Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Woodsd on Friday 20 July 12 21:38 BST (UK)
Belter

I presume you have read the posts on this thread from 14 and 15 March 2010 which mention William Wood and Janet Crookston.  You'll see too the death certificate of their son William Wood.

David
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: fnqjen on Friday 24 August 12 06:26 BST (UK)
Recently discovered I am descended from Jackie Crookston's brother, James.  He has a daughter Janet who goes on to marry a William Wood. 

I too am descended from Janet Crookston and William Wood, via their son William Wood who married Elizabeth Grant. 

Quote
Their son James Wood who marries Mary Morton is my 3x great grandfather.  Any more info on these family tree branches would be appreciated. 
Quote

It seems that the families of these two brothers were close, because William and Elizabeth called one of their daughters Mary Morton Wood, obviously after their sister-in-law.  (One of their 11 children)

 
Quote
Very proud to know I am descended from such a strong and determined woman. :)
Quote

Me too, I was able to obtain details of the Tranent Massacre set out in a small booklet from Scotland some years ago, I think it was from the Midlothian or East Lothian local authority.  In it I found details of how another woman, I think Janet Hog, stood up to the authorities and even gave evidence at a subsequent trial.  James Crookston's wife Jean Hog had a sister Janet Hog, so maybe they both had a sister in the thick of it - probably they were too. 

I was very interested to read on another post that Jackie Crookston's husband subsequently married a Janet Hog, but the details given are for a Janet Hog with different parents.  I'm hoping that they made a mistake and our Jean's sister Janet, the Janet who also resisted and the Janet who married William Ross were all the same person.  But both Janet and Hog are common names in that area, so could be 2 or even 3 different people.  Other family members have the booklet at the moment, so can't check the name for sure.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: mamad on Sunday 03 February 13 18:56 GMT (UK)
Hello All,

tidybooks suggested I add to your posts, I, too, have been looking at the Tranent Massacre.
Sketches of Tranent  in Olden Time(1881) was republished by Kessinger Publishing and I bought a copy as I have been trying to find out more about George Elder who was killed in the street in the Tranent Massacre. Unfortunately all sources I have looked at don't give any more information other than he was "of Tranent". My 3xggf on my paternal side was George Elder Montgomery born 10 Nov 1797. His parents were David Montgomery and Christian Elder daughter of George Elder and Jean Steele. Christian also had a brother George(born 1777, died 1836 aged 59). Unfortunately I am unable to find a death for Christian's father and to add to the mix, there are 2 x George Elder born 1762 in Prestonpans and 1769 in Haddington. It may be that 1762 George moved to Tranent or that it was Christian's father who was killed.

Another source I read will be of interest to Hibee:
"John Adam had not left his work at St Germain's Colliery that day until twelve noon and could not therefore have taken part in the riot......................................................... From his hiding place Tait heard John Adam plead for mercy saying he had not been near Tranent that day and that he would go with them wherever they pleased. A soldier was heard to say, "There's your mercy." and a shot rang out. John Adam groaned in pain at which another soldier taunted him, "Damn you... what are you groaning at there". John Adam was found dead in a ditch and covered in blood .................... There were two bullet holes in Adam's chest as well as several sword wounds on his chest, arms, hands and stomach." (Taken from the Declarations of Adam Blair, William Tait and James Hood)  Information is given about two men who visited the relatives as they wanted to take action against those responsible. "They visited Janet Kindly, widow of John Adam" "Petitions were presented .................... in the name of Janet Kindly" Unfortunately the petition was dismissed.  By the way, Scott Adam/s from Newton is my 4Xggm om my maternal side. She married Andrew Wilson 1782 at Newton. Perhaps she is related to John Adam.
I also found the list of Prestonpans folks who signed the letter to be presented to the "honourable gentlemen at Tranent". The names were written in a circle so no name was first. If folks are interested, I can list the names in another post.


Here is the link for Sketches of Tranent in Olden Time, it's now online
www.archive.org/stream/sketchestranent01sandgoog/sketchestranent01sandgoog_djvu.txt
Happy reading!

Mags
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Hibee on Sunday 03 February 13 18:59 GMT (UK)
Hi Mags

Than you very much for this.  I have Scot Adam as the first cousin of John Adam.

Details in here...

http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?db=adamsmidlothian

Regards

Hibee
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Sunday 17 February 13 21:18 GMT (UK)
Hi Mags,

          would it be possible please to see the list of name that were on the petition.

Regards.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: mamad on Monday 18 February 13 06:51 GMT (UK)
Hello Archie,

Names of those who signed the Prestonpans letter:

William Alpin, George Thomson Jnr., William Greig, Andrew Darling, John Genlan, George Thomson, David Ballent, Peter Thomson, James Welsh, Robert Allen, Hew Dougal, George Swan, Matthew McVey, Thomas Haig, James Thomson, James Inglis, Peter Bell, John McTosh, John Young, Richard Wright, Thomas Hill, Thomas Johnston, James Brown, George Kerr, Matthew Smith, Robert Russell, George Swan, Matthew Mint, Nicolas Outerside, John Gow

Nicolas Outerside was able to get into the meeting and hand over the letter. Needless to say, it was rejected!

The men of Prestonpans were against the Militia Act and decided to protest in a letter. They declared that they unanimously disapproved of the Act, would assist each other to try to repeal the Act, were peaceable and if trouble happened the aggressors would be the Deputies and, as they disagreed with the Act, what would that infer about the trust that could be placed upon them to carry out duties.

Although the men were trying to be reasonable by putting pen to paper, the last statement shows  a subtle threat! There are four Thomsons who signed the letter - wonder if they were all related?

Mags

Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: mamad on Monday 18 February 13 07:17 GMT (UK)
Hello again Archie,

Thought you may also be interested in the names of the six people who were charged with mobbing and rioting outside John Glen's public house:

David Duncan, Elizabeth or Elly Duncan, John Nicolson, Francis Wilson, Robert Mitchell, Neil Reidpath

Trial took place on 10 October at Edinburgh. D Duncan, Nicolson and Wilson all failed to appear and were outlawed. E Duncan brought proof that her name was Alison Duncan and her case was dismissed. There was conflicting evidence for Mitchell and Reidpath and a verdict of Not Proven was given. Shortly after the trial ended, Wilson did appear. He said he had been ill and eventually it was decided not to pursue the case further.

Mags
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: Templar75 on Monday 18 February 13 11:13 GMT (UK)
Hello Mags,

               thank you very much for taking the time in sending in the names it is really appreciated, I wonder if John Young was a relative of mine apart from Jackie Crookston, poor soul she was never recorded as having died and yet the rest seem to have been.

It shows how people were treated in those days here we have a group of men who handed in a well written document, unfortunately the powers to be said they were simple yet most of them seemed to have worked in the Potteries so were craftsmen.

Sir Walter Scott was at the court and detailed some of what had happened and it just came down to plain brutality, the government has still not apologised for what happened, what is really drastic is the kids and old people who were cut down.

Have you looked at the map I made out showing roughly where the people were killed or injured ? if not I can post it again for you.

Best regards and thanks again.

Archie.
Title: Re: Joan ( Jackie ) Crookston of the Tranent Massacre
Post by: mamad on Monday 18 February 13 11:33 GMT (UK)
Hello Archie,

Have got a map but thanks for the offer.

Mags