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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Staffordshire => Topic started by: FlutterBye on Sunday 15 November 09 02:13 GMT (UK)

Title: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: FlutterBye on Sunday 15 November 09 02:13 GMT (UK): Hi

Would anyone know where I could access an inquest held 29th December 1893 by the Coroner for Staffordshire. James Probert aged 73, was accidentally killed in the No 12 Pit Buffery Colliery on the 21st December 1893.

any help appreciated.

Thanks
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: alyson123 on Sunday 13 December 09 14:32 GMT (UK): I have read the newspaper report in the Birmingham Daily Post which reports on the actual inquest held at the Hare and Hounds Inn stating that James lived at Birmingham Street then going on to give circumstances and findings relating to his death.
Not sure if you have already read this???
Regards
Alyson
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: Redroger on Sunday 13 December 09 17:11 GMT (UK): First Flutterbye, read the nespaper report referred to, but be aware inquest reports at this period were extremely detailed and graphic. The report should give the name of the Coroner involved and where he was based. Then go to the archives for that area and ask whether that Coroner's papers have survived. They will be on unrestricted acces for that time (75 year closure), but not many have survived as some years ago I believe they were "weeded"
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: FlutterBye on Monday 14 December 09 07:29 GMT (UK): Hi Alyson and Redroger

Yes thank you I have now seen the newspaper article, one of the rootschat members sent it to me, I was hoping the article would mention James's wife or children unfortunately it didn't, I was happy all the same. I didn't realise there maybe a coroners report/papers I will email and see whether they have a copy, this may mention any family left behind.

Thanks again for your replies
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: Redroger on Monday 14 December 09 15:19 GMT (UK): In my experience any family members are unlikely to be mentioned unless they witnessed the accident, which unless he had a relative working with him is unlikely. Also the survival of coroners' records is patchy at best. Good luck anyway.
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: jacquelineve on Monday 14 December 09 17:59 GMT (UK): Flutterbye

Is this your James in 1891 census?

Birmingham Street,Dudley
PROBERT
James 60 coal miner
Mary A 52
George 17 ..... ......
John 15 ...... .......
All born Dudley Worcs

Jackie
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: FlutterBye on Monday 14 December 09 18:47 GMT (UK): Thanks Redroger and Jacquelineve

The reason I wondered about relatives was the discrepancy in his age, James death in 1893 it says he was 73, yet on that particular census he was 60, but the fact both states he was living Birmingham Street it must be him.

Thanks
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: Redroger on Friday 18 December 09 15:47 GMT (UK): You seem to have proved the identity satisfactorially, ages may often particularly in Victorian times show fairly heavy discrepencies between sources. The main reason is that particularly 1837 when civil registration began people often had no accurate knowledge of their age within 5 years or so. There were then, as now, people altering their age so that they appeared more reasonable as marriage partners in public records. A case in point my grandparents' marriage certificate (1895) shows him aged 55, and my grandmother aged 35. She was born in June 1859, so her age was correct, he was baptized in 1828, making his age at least 67, and probably from the baptismal dates of his siblings a year or two older.
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: jacwin on Monday 15 February 10 17:41 GMT (UK): Hi! Flutterbye.
I have just joined Roots Web, and come accross your question you asked about the accident to James Probert. well I have been reserching him as he is my great grandfather He married a Mary Ann Allport I have his marriage cert. his children were Sarah Ann Probert George, John and Samuel who was my grandfather I hope that has helped.
Yours Jacwin
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: FlutterBye on Tuesday 16 February 10 05:00 GMT (UK): Hi Jacwin
Thx for your reply.
They also had Alice Levina and John.
I descend from their son James Probert b 1864 he married Eliza Nicholls.
I also have their marriage cert, I had no joy on the Probert side, the earlist I have this James is his marriage cert, hit a brick wall there. Had more luck on the Allport side.
Did you get any further back with the Proberts?

Thanks
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: jacquelineve on Wednesday 17 February 10 10:55 GMT (UK): Hello Flutterbye (you may already have this info, but if not..)

Re.James snr. According to 1871 census at Dudley-James states was born Worcester City.

Jackie

ps Do you have his fathers name from marriage to M.A.Fleck
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: FlutterBye on Wednesday 17 February 10 18:03 GMT (UK): Hi jacquelineve

I don't see him before his marriage in 1864 I searched and searched.
Yes his father's name was also James.
Mary ann was a widow when James and her married.

Thanks
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: Bilge on Wednesday 17 February 10 18:15 GMT (UK): Mining Accidents - James Probert
Name: PROBERT James
Age: 73
Date: 21/12/1893
Year: 1893
Occupation: Dataller.
Colliery: Buffery.
Owner: Dudley Colliery Co.
Town: Dudley.
County: Worcestershire
Notes: Run over by tub at foot of incline.

Dateler/Dataller/Day Man/ Daytaleman/Day Labourer Casual worker, employed on a daily basis.
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: jacwin on Friday 19 February 10 11:58 GMT (UK): Hello Flutterbye.
Thanks for your reply, much appreciated. I have traced James Probert down to 1831 his father was also named James and I think he might have been born in Gloucester but as yet I haven't confirmed it. His wife Mary Ann Allport died in 1922 and her age on on her death cert. puts her down as 90 years old which makes her 8 years older than she was according to the censuses. Would it be possible to get a report of James Probert's death on line from the Birmingham evening post or if you know anybody that could send it to me.
I have traced Samuel Allport and Esther Homer and I have just discovered that Esther Homer remarried after Samuel Allport died..
Regards Jacwin.
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: Bilge on Friday 19 February 10 18:58 GMT (UK): If you log onto and register onto this web site there are a number of James Proberts that may well be your link, bearing in mind that the Forest of Dean Gloucestershire had a large mining community.
http://www.forest-of-dean.net/
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: FlutterBye on Friday 19 February 10 22:41 GMT (UK): Hi Jacwin
Yes I have a copy of the newspaper report, pm me your email and I'll flick it thru, also have an article on a Samuel Probert living in Birmingham Street, poss your Samuel.

It would be great to compare notes.

Thanks
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: FlutterBye on Friday 19 February 10 22:43 GMT (UK): Hi Bilge

Thanks for the info on James and that's a very interesting site, I will have a good look around.

Thanks
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: jacwin on Sunday 21 February 10 13:07 GMT (UK): Hi! Flutterbye.
Thanks for that my e.mail address is haydn.probert@yahoo.ca. it would be very interesting to compare notes. Once again thanks a lot.
Regards Jacwin.
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: Redroger on Sunday 21 February 10 17:10 GMT (UK): Jacwin, Respectfully suggest you remove your email address by modifying your post before the moderator does it for you. For scamming and privacy reasons the moderators don't like email addresses to be shown publically.
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: jacwin on Monday 22 February 10 12:53 GMT (UK): Hello Redrodger.
Thanks for that but Flutterbye asked me to pm her with my e.mail address but I don't know her e.mail address so how do I do it.If you could let me know it would be much appreciated. I am new to all this.
Regards Jacwin.
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: Bilge on Monday 22 February 10 15:20 GMT (UK): Click on there name when you get a new screen up you'll see a line Send This Rootschatter a personal message..........Click on it and it's sorted.
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: Redroger on Monday 22 February 10 18:20 GMT (UK): Bilge seems to have answered your question Jacwin.
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: jacwin on Monday 22 February 10 21:15 GMT (UK): Bilge.
Thank you very much for that it is all sorted now I have sent a message once again Thank You. much appreciated.
Regards Jacwin.
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: FlutterBye on Tuesday 23 February 10 07:50 GMT (UK): Hi Jacwin
Sent you an email

Thanks Bilge & Redroger got Jacwin's pm..

:)
Title: Re: Inquest - Mining death in the Buffery Colliery
Post by: jacwin on Wednesday 24 February 10 15:21 GMT (UK): Jacqueliveve
James's father was also named James.

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