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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Antrim => Topic started by: alocin66 on Friday 09 October 09 14:46 BST (UK)
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A quick question...
If a child was illegitimate (1880s), and no father's surname was on the birth certificate, how common was it for the parents to marry at a later date?
Or for the mother to use the father's surname as her surname and the baby's on the birth certificate?
???
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Hard to say whether or not was common for parents of illegitimate child to marry after the birth but it certainly did happen.
Haven't come across mother using father's surname (instead of her own) on the child's birth certificate. However, have seen a widow registering several children with deceased husband as child's father (after he was quite dead several years) and also know of several cases where illegitimate children were known locally by father's surname but births registered under mother's surname (registrar was local doctor and would have known the family circumstances).
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Not sure how common it was, but my gg grandmother had no father on her birth certificate and was given her mother maiden name on the certificate, however, her older brother had their father's surname on his certificate, and in 1901 census the mother had the fathers surname even though they didnt actually marry until 1905, with 3 children out of wedlock. :o
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Hi,
Also not sure but my Ggrandmother's brother, a life long bachelor, had two illigitimate children who had his surname and whom he took in when their mother died. They were then 15 and 9 years old.
He left all to them in his will. However we do not know if the lady had the same surname.
Regards
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Thanks for all your information - extremely interesting.
I think I need to make a few notes... ;)
Kind regards,
alocin66
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Hi
My gg-grandmother had 2 illegitimate children.
The first my g-grandmother was registered with the fathers surname.
The second was also registered with the fathers surname (not the same father!!), but she went on to marry the second gentleman and had further children.
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Birth certificates for England and Wales, until 1969 did not have a space to enter a surname for the child. This example from 1913 for Northern Ireland shows a similar format:
http://www.claires-rosleaancestry.co.uk/dads%20birth%20certificate%20full.jpg
As you can see, only the child's forename/s go in the place marked 'Name, if any'.
The registration appears on the birth index under the parent's surname, or the mother's if there is no father recorded.
This means that for a birth registration of an illegitimate child to appear in the index under the father's surname, either the mother has to present herself falsely as if married - giving her name as eg Mary 'Father's surname' formerly 'Mother's surname' - or the father has to be present at the registration and agree to have his name recorded.
In the second case, the child's name appears in the index twice, once with each parent's surname.
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Hi Galium
That is interesting as I know the name of my g-grandmothers father - it appeared on both her marriage certificates - although I do know at the time some information could have been given falsely!! (she was born in Northern Ireland).
On the Civil Registration her name is registered as Mary Jane Tweed, there is a mark at the bottom which indicates that she was illigitimate, mothers name is given but no fathers name. She is not entered twice onto the index though when I searched for her at the GRO.
Kind Regards
Carolann
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When you say she was registered as Mary Jane Tweed - do you mean that this is how she appears in the index? Or is 'Mary Jane Tweed' entered in the space for the child's name, so that she appears in the index as Mary Jane Tweed Mother's surname ?
If Tweed is entered as one of her forenames, this is a not uncommon way of the father's name being acknowledged legally on the birth certificate of an illegitimate child. The father may not consent to being named on the certificate, but he cannot prevent the child being given his name this way.
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Hi Galium
Yes the space that says 'name of child' is recorded as Mary Jane Tweed, name of mother Rosey McShane, no fathers name entered, on the index it is recorded as Mary Jane Tweed.
I find this interesting as the next child is entered as 'name of child' Margaret McGrady who was also illigitimate. No fathers name was entered either, but Rosey McShane went on to marry James McGrady later he is named as the father on Margarets marriage certificate.
Family members always assumed McGrady was Mary Janes father (no-one ever knew the circumstances of her birth until after death!), after she died her daughters went to register her death, the GRO could not find her birth as either McGrady or McShane it was indexed as Tweed. This is how I also found it when I looked for a copy of her birth certificate while searching the index. Her mothers surname is not entered after Tweed on the index.
Maybe this one is a fluke!!!
Kind Regards
Carolann
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Have you ever managed to find Mary Jane's baptism record?? This is how I found my granny's father's name. She was baptised in C of I in Aghalee and the father's name was given at her baptism. She was registered under her mother's maiden name. I don'e think she ever knew her father's name as at each of her marriages she gave a different name for her father!! RosemaryJoan