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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Lancashire => England => Lancashire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Sylviaann on Monday 14 September 09 15:58 BST (UK)
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My mother-in-law would be mortified to find that her gggrandparents were both illegitimate
1855 Marriage cert says
George Illingworth living Chatburn father John Holgate both farmers
Ann Lawson living Sawley father Gabriel Carter Shopkeeper.
Can anyone find these peple in 1841. I have the bride and groom in 1851 living in Downham
George was born c1822 Grindleton, mother probably Sarah
Ann Lawson born c1824 Sawley
MaryA found me a lot of Holgates in the area but there doesn't seem to be a John who was a farmer. It could be made up but a John Holgate was a witness.
Thank you for your help
Sylviaann
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Hiya Sylviaann
1841 Laneside House Chatburn Lancs
John Holgate 40 farmer
Sarah Holgate 40
George Holgate 19
Thomas Holgate 11
Richard Holgate 8
Mary Holgate 4
Only Richard and Mary born in county
HO107/Piece 507 Book 1
Also a Christopher Holgate and family a few doors down
Willow x
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there is a gabriel carter marriage to a mary lawson
date; 27th mar 1830
place; downham,lancs
looks like gabriel done the decent thing 6 years late.
ext.rec. igi
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1841 Sawley Yorkshire all born in county
Gabriel Carter 45 grocer
Mary Carter 45
Ann Carter 18
Sarah Carter 13
John Carter 11
William Carter 9
Margaret Carter 6
Alice Carter 4
Robert Carter 2
Elizabeth Carter 1m
HO107/Piece 1322 Book 1
There is also in 1841 Salford Lancs place of birth all listed N K
Gabriel Carter 24 labourer
Mary Carter 30 winder of cotton
Alice Carter 2
HO107/Piece 585 Book 17
her brother maybe?
Willow x
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Ignore the other Gabriel his father was William
Willow x
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Though saying that I suspect that they are related because the name Gabriel seems to get passed down the family
Willow x
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Does that look as if George Illingworth is down as George Proctor on the census and Ann Lawson is down as Ann Carter. ??
Wonder why they didn't use those names on the marriage cert. Their daughter Selina married a Proctor and their grandson is called George Illingworth Proctor. What a mix up.
Thank you
Sylviaann
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Hiya Silviaann
Yes they are under their fathers name I dont think the enumerators were too bothered about being correct
Willow x
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Sorry for the delay my computer has been down.
This family is very messy. The trees will not look right. Also I cannot be sure that those fathers are really the fathers. Will have to find some parish registers.
Can I be very cheeky and ask if you can find George Illingworth, John and Sarah Holgate and Gabriel Carter in the 1851 census. I was told George was in Chatburn but that is all I have. I really need the parents places of birth as there are a few on the IGI who could qualify.
Thank you for your help
Sylviaann
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Hi,
1851 census for John and Sarah Holgate
Lane Side, Chatburn
HO107/2256 folio 116 page 30
John Holgate, Head, Mar, 53, Farmer of 30 and a half acres, Yorkshire Sawley
Sarah, Wife, Mar, 52, Yorkshire Grindleton
Thomas, Son, U, 20, Employed on farm, Yorkshire Grindleton
Richard, Son, 17, Employed on farm, Lancashire Chatburn
Mary, Daur, 14, Scholar, Lancashire Chatburn.
Mo
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Hi,
This looks like the same Gabriel Carter and family despite his sudden change of occupation ::)
Sawley, Yorkshire
HO107/2255 folio 126 page 10
Gabriel Carter, Head, Mar, 55, Manufacturer (Cotton). Sawley
Mary, Wife, Mar, 55, Sawley
William, Son, U, 18, Joiners, Ap, Sawley
Margaret, Daur, 16, Weaver Cotton, Sawley
Alice, Daur, 14, Weaver Cotton, Sawley
Robert, Son, 12, Post Boy, Sawley
Mary, Gran Daur, 8, Scholar, Sawley
Elizabeth, Gran Daur, 9, Scholar, Sawley
Regards,
Mo
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Thank you very much. That might solve a puzzle especially with the Holgates. There are lots of them.
Thank you again
Sylviaann
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Hiya Sylviaann
1841 Laneside House Chatburn Lancs
John Holgate 40 farmer
Sarah Holgate 40
George Holgate 19
Thomas Holgate 11
Richard Holgate 8
Mary Holgate 4
Only Richard and Mary born in county
HO107/Piece 507 Book 1
Also a Christopher Holgate and family a few doors down
Willow x
Hi
Sarah and John are my 3rd Great Grand parents.
Sarah's maiden name is Illingworth (but cannot find her parents). Sarah had Thomas b1830 before she married John Holgate, Thomas became a Holgate when Sarah and John married. But when Thomas married a "Ann Holgate" he reverted back to Illingworth.
According to my sources John also had a son George b abt 23 Feb 1822 before marrying Sarah. But on further investigation I have come across a Christening date of 9 Mar 1822, for George, with the mother being named as Sarah Illingworth.
John and Sarah were married on 26 May 1831. So I am wondering if George Illingworth may also be Sarah's son.
Jeff Illingworth
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Hi
I have just started researching my family tree. George Illingworth, born in Grindleton in 1821/22 is my great-great-grandfather with Ann Lawson/Carter as my great-great-grandmother. I came across this thread which is probably a few years old now - sorry if this is now past history to all of you. I am trying to push back beyond George and so am intrigued by the notion that George was the illegitimate son of John Holgate and Sarah Illingworth.
Kind regards
Martin Illingworth
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Hello
Martin, could you please email me at jeff.mymail@gmail.com.