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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Yorkshire (West Riding) Lookup Requests => Yorkshire (West Riding) => England => Yorkshire (West Riding) Completed Requests => Topic started by: sandra bills on Sunday 06 September 09 14:49 BST (UK)
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My Cockroft family all hail from Ovenden/Halifax area. Most were baptised
in the New Connexion church, Ovenden, but there are no buriels for any of them in the Mount Zion church. Where is the next nearest likely church that they might have been buried.?
Sandra
COMPLETED.
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If you give me names, I'll have a look on my MI disc for Halifax churches. And I've got connections with a Cockroft family from Ovenden - Betty and Harriet Cockroft both married John Appleyard ::) They were all buried at Nursery Lane Methodists in Ovenden. Betty and Harriet were daughters of Andrew and Mary.
BumbleB
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Oh you a gem, hope you can findthem.
I have John Cockroft born Halifax,but could be Ovenden 1776. He died sometime between 1841 and 1851.He is not ont he 1861 census so assume he died then. His wife
Sally born around the same time.
Joseph Cockroft , born 1815 his son and joseph's wife
Betty born 1820.
Would be grateful if you can find them.
Sandra
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hey BumbleB
Where did you manage to get that MI inscriptions disc from.
I wouldn't mind one myself.
Sandra
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The MI disc is from Calderdale FHS, covers 15,000 gravestones in 38 graveyards. I've found it invaluable for my Appleyard clan.
Not sure about these, but:
Hebden Bridge Cross Lanes. John Cockroft of New Road Bottom, 24 April 1850 aged 80 and Sarah 6 February 1851 aged 73.
Sowerby Steep Lane. John Cockroft of Cob Castle, Sowerby 3 October 1860 aged 86 and Sally 17 May 1846 aged 65 plus John 20 April 1826 aged 10, George died in infancy, Henry of Nab End 23 August 1868 61, and Sarah his widow 4 January 1888 aged 71.
Of course if they didn't have a headstone then they wouldn't appear in this list, although some unmarked graves have been noted on the CD.
Best regards
BumbleB
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Many thanks,
Will have to mull over these a while to see if any dates fit.
thanks again,BumbleB
Sandra
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Hi BumbleB
Sorry forgot to ask did you notice , by any chance if King Cross methodist,
Halifax was on the MI cd. I ask because a lot of my rellies are there,and if they are not on the cd,where would I find out who is buried there.
Sandra
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Hi Sandra: sorry but KX methodists are not on there, and the churchyard is a mess!! My great grandparents are buried there and I had to be shown where the grave was. However, all is not lost :)
Although the records have not been passed to the Archives (as far as I remember), the KX Archivist is very helpful - I'll send you a PM with her details.
Sue
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Hi BumbleB,
Thank you very much, I know I have my North family buried there so there is just the chance that the Cockrofts are there as well.
Sandra.
Thanks fro phone etc.
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Hi Sandra
Have you checked the grave sales section on the Mount Zion website? Quite a lot of the earlier burials are only to be found there.
Anne
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Yep have done so. But for some reason could only get into 1833 section and not the others.
Do you have this problem as well.?
Sandra
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Just checked Sandra - all working for me.
Anne
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Ok Anne , thanks will try on a new window.
Sandra
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Hi Anne,
Just got in to the grave sales and its a great help. Have found two possible, but have got some clues to other members of the household I am looking for, so lots to chew on.
Thanks, again,
Sandra
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Dear Sandra,
just a note after reading what Bumblebee said about King cross Meths, i have looked at the Burial book, it is one huge volume with over 50,000 entries, it is in Halifax Library in the Archive section.
I have found a few of my relatives in there and some marriages.
The state of the graveyard it's self is disgraceful, it is badly overgrown, although someone seems to have been felling trees etc in the last few months.
If you cannot find any help with the gravebooks i will have a look myself for you but it may take me a week or so to get to the Library in Archive times, i believe it closes at 5:30 pm for original documents.
Regards,
Andy
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Thanks Andy for that information. I've noted it in my files. Wonder what will happen to it when they close the library? ::)
BumbleB
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Hi Bumblebee,
Yes all the valuable information will be spread to the four winds if they close Halifax Library, and with Wakefield archive being slated for the condition of the collections it makes you wonder where it will go.
Thats what you get with a council run by a child hating library hating lancastrian!!!
Regards,
Andy
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Hi
Think Huddersfield & Wakefield & Halifax for library & archive stuff but with Kirklees house in Calderdale or maybe just Kirklees Archives WYAS full stop-Inside info! ;D
Kirklees Archives and Library are as one in Huddersfield central library and there collection is awrsome, duplicate most of Halifax/Todmorden/Saddlworth /Mossley on film/fich and all west yorkshire with Wakefield & (Kirklees already)Dewsbury Archives.
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Many thanks BumbleB,
no luck with Marion at King Cross. She said they had closed down. Tlhis info will help us.
Sandra
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Hi Andy,
Sorry to but in . I have just informed BumbleB that I had no reply from Marion, the sec at King Cross, she said the same that they had closed down.
I would be very grateful if you could break this brick wall.My John Cockroft born either Halifax or Ovenden 1776. His death
certificate may lead us to his birth place and other info.
I had this brainwave to get his son, Joseph my great grandfather]s marriage cert to find occupation or address where they lived,but not able to read the occupation.Tried joseph brother marriage cert Samuel and had the same difficulty on both. Not normal occupation.
Will try to get back to GRO and ask them.
Only other avenue it seems is the death cert.
Thanks again,
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Hi BumbleB,
Not sure who Andy is that you were chatting to. But I think, he is from Huddersfield. If it is who I think, Hi Andy.
Sandra
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Hi Sandra: Sorry that Marion couldn't help. When I met her she did say that the church was about to be closed and that she didn't know what would happen to the burial register - no-one else seemed to care about it. And Andy came up with the answer, so at least we know where it is for the time being. Good luck in the search. Have you tried posting a picture of the elusive occupations - there are a lot of people on this site with a fantastic range of skills. Off on holiday now.
BumbleB
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Hi BumbleB,
Not computer literate I am afraid. I have a scanner but this one really has not got a good reputation for sending info. Well that's my excuse anyway.
I have figured out the one certificate, his g looked like e . So know it was
Ovenden and plain old ''weaver'' on the occupation. His father however on the Joseph marriage certificate is manufacturer, and cann't read the occupation of Joseph. Not too bothered by it as I have enough info off that one anyway.
thanks have a nice holiday,\
I went to Tenby for the day in the glorious sun and didn't want to come back.
Sandra
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Hi Sandra,
If you give me the death date i will look it up in King Cross Meths, the book is in date order so a year will do.
Dont know if Occupation is listed in burial book, it mat be listed in the other books that were filled in for the GRO, wich are also in Halifax Library Archive section.
PS for anyone who is looking for Marriage info there are also a few marriage books, and i think a few baptism books but i seem to remember not very many.
Regards,
Andy.
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Hi Andy,
Don't know if you remember me. (Norths). Hi cousin.
My John Cockroft is on the 1841 but can't find him with his wife on the 1851. So some time between then,Sorry can't be more definate. I have his occupation . I tis Joseph's I don't have. his son. John's occupation is manufacturer.born Ovenden, I think, but lived in Halifax for a while, went back to Ovenden. His wife Betty Fearnley. he was born 1776.
I have all his brothers and sister but can't distinguish who our John Cockroft is.
hope this help, ever so grateful for this.
Sandra
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Oh you a gem, hope you can findthem.
I have John Cockroft born Halifax,but could be Ovenden 1776. He died sometime between 1841 and 1851.He is not ont he 1861 census so assume he died then. His wife
Sally born around the same time.
Joseph Cockroft , born 1815 his son and joseph's wife
Betty born 1820.
Would be grateful if you can find them.
Sandra
Hello Sandra.
In answer to where they were buried
You seem to be scattered about a bit with your Cockcroft's!!! of Halifax.. As someone said there is a big Volume of Deaths?buriels at Halifax Archives. Tracking these is long without known dates? It will help others if you can circa (about dates) these names
As your first Post! here are the list of churches and denominations also Maps
http://www.genuki.org.uk/cgi-bin/churchmap?GR=SE074260
Free BMDs have a John Cockcroft death in Halfax district Deaths Jun 1859
COCKCROFT John Halifax 9a 260
This is the only one in 1851 to 1862 search
This should give where he died if its yours for £7 but only a £4 gamble if its not yours. Working on your Overden 1851 c to 1861 c above.
Hugh Wallis (Does not give deaths) list all the Chapels and churches. All religions
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~hughwallis/IGIBatchNumbers.htm
Deaths Jun 1859
~~~~~~~~
COCKCROFT John Halifax 9a 260
Regards Dobby
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Hi Sandra,
King Cross Meths was not built umtil 1874, before this it used the old Christ Church King Cross.
Think the graveyard begins arround 1874.
See Malcolm Bull's page relating to it.
http://freepages.history.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~calderdalecompanion/c109_k.html
Regards,
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Hi Sandra,
WYAS Ref Book. Calderdale
kings cross Non conformist register guide book 2 says
Halifax kingcross W (Wesleyan) ref point -MISC;538/1-2 Bapts 1841- 1884 Marriage none burial none. in registers
Dobby
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Hi Dobby,
Thanks info. That answers a lot of questons and a lot of hard work.
Looks as if my John Cockroft may have died by 1851 anyway so no luck there then. Ah well all the fun of the chase.
Sandra
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Hi Andy,
Make mistake with my dates john Cockroft died sometime between 1841 and
1851, I think. not 1861 so sorry.
oops.
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Hi Sandra don't give up
first this guys & Andy will help you!
Then there's Sue (Bumble) when see gets back off her holidays but in the mean time find Steve Whitwam and Lenny Beaumont in google or yahoo search their Email addresses a well put out on the web. Both are in to Ancestry round Halifax with 60 over years at it between them.
Email them with all your dates and names!. Steve founded the FHS 30 years ago.
Good Luck Dobby
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Hi Dobby,
thanks your encouragement and advice will doa search today for these e mails. thanks again,
Sandra
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There are 3 John Cockroft (Cockcroft?)
Queensbury Chapel graves 229 and grave 282
No dates
pauper graves by the way they are presented.?
Mount Zion 1876
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Hi Dobby,
Is Queensbury the same as Mt. Zion church?
Sandra
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Hi Sandra.
Mount Zion is Lower down is Methodist New connection
1775
Queensbury is Baptist And Methodist that is the Mother (Earlist) of Non conformist or non Orthodox meaning that is alternative to Anglican Church of England established 1747 (The first)
The vally out of Halifax has Overden/Wheatly/Illingworth half way up, at its head is Ogden/Denholm/and Queensbury.
There were 4 John Cockrofts in Gro deaths Two in 1846 -One in 1848 and one 1865 in Halifax.
As you know where round about where he lived at death only the Death certs will answer as to the exact place of death. (Expensive but that will answer. The 2 wrong death certs will be will be £4 and the right one £7 in total= £15 English money)
Dobby
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Hi Sandra PS
I'll carry on Sniffing around Halifax*** as I'm doing research for Bumble as she does my ancestry at Lichfield Warwickshire when I'm back home in Yorkshire.
If he was a Manufacturer there must be something on him that may differentiate the 3 John Cockroft's 1840's to the right John and things usualy turn up when one is looking for something else. At least a few of us know of him now in Yorkshire.
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Bingo
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/WRY/Halifax/Halifax37Dry.html
Whites Trade Directory 1837
http://mountzionhalifax.free.fr/Sales.php?FOC1
Mount Zion Halifax Methodist New Connection Chapel
John Cockroft Grave year 1847
John Cockroft
Tripping Green
Overlooker
Grave 243
This could be one of them
Calderdale GB 203
Catalogue reference number help HAS:110 (241)/409
Extent help 2 items
Title help Removal order
Date help 25 Jun 1842
Description help john cockroft, Mary Jane, his wife, and Wallace their child, Halifax to Ovenden
Also examination of said john cockroft, joiner and cabinet maker
Calderdale GB 203
Catalogue reference number help HAS:110 (241)/417
Extent help 3 items
Title help Removal order
Date help 8 Oct 1842
Description help john cockroft, an inmate of the Halifax Union Workhouse, Halifax to Ovenden
Also certificate of examination of said john
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Hi Dobby,
Thanks for the info. Firstly I have seen this tripping green one before but with out any dates n there can't be sure. Will see if anything matches the gro for that date or near.
When I looked on the gro I matched about eitht possible
dates from 1841 to 1850 that is within the range be most probably died. Leaving his widow on the 1851. Her name Sally or Sarah for sure, so rules out the workhouse first one.
the second is a possibility.
Is there a website for the workhouse? and what does
removal order mean exactly.
John was definately a manufacturer and I know he had links with Isaac Ingham and also William Rushworth and
Joseph Woodhead.
He was living in Broad Street in 1841. And I know that his sons are Joseph , William, Charles, Samuel and two or three girls.
On the birth certificate for |Joseph it say s John Cockroft of the Shay. That is all we have except for the date 1776, as they were all christened in Mt. Zion.
Hope this helps.
Sandra
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Oh you a gem, hope you can findthem.
I have John Cockroft born Halifax,but could be Ovenden 1776. He died sometime between 1841 and 1851.He is not ont he 1861 census so assume he died then. His wife
Sally born around the same time. ???
Joseph Cockroft , born 1815 his son and joseph's wife
Betty born 1820.
Would be grateful if you can find them.
Sandra
Hi Sandra
From you last post!
Quote:-
He was living in Broad Street in 1841. And I know that his sons are Joseph , William, Charles, Samuel and two or three girls.
On the birth certificate for |Joseph it say s John Cockroft of the Shay. That is all we have except for the date 1776, as they were all christened in Mt. Zion. Unquote;-
If your right! John Cockroft was born 1776? and you have a birth certificate for his son Joseph the Joesph was born after September 1837!
Now its not impossible for John to be the father at 61 years old but Sally his wife would have to be at least 20 years younger to have had all those children
Have you got the right John Cockcroft (Referance to his birth year 1776) either on the census or Joseph birth certificate (First Gro Birth certificate started September 1837)
Bottom line It does not make sence or add up. ??? ::)
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Hi Dobby,
No Joseph was born 1815 we had his transcript and verified by them as to the father ie John Cockroft The Shay. the marriage certificate of Joseph says John cockroft, manufacturer. They were living in Halifax at the time of the marriage but returned to Ovenden later in or about 1841.
Sandra
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Hi Sandra,
Yes! I can see as I have just reread the other posts. now back on track! :-[
OK!
Working on John the manufacturer is your best hope meaning 'man of substance' and there maybe a Will at the Brothwick institute in York in Yorkshire! Also there maybe ownership of land in the Deeds Volume index at Wakefield Archives.
I'll check these at Wakefield & York when I return to Yorkshire
If you can or have? will help.
The younger or known youngest sibling ( A Joe's younger bro or sister) marriage certificate near to his death year may hold clues as to John's (Joe's Father) his last place of residence!
Well keep hacking!
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Hi dobby,
yes we have been looking into wills and found refer for
1880's for a William Cockroft but couldn't get ages t fit
in with our William.
All the sons on the census have taken their turn at
living or working on the farm known as Hal Farm. Nearest we can find to Hal Farm or Hal Farm House, is maybe
Haley, Illingworth. Slippy lane and Wrigley Hill are also
places they stayed in that area. all Joseph's brothers are known as either farmers or manufacturers. So seems
business in or around Ovenden, it seems.
Sandra
Will see if I can fit date of Joseph's siblings for a younger one.
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Hi Sandra
not read your last post yet!
Put John Cockroft Halifax in google books search engine
see corn grinder or millers
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=AuMuAAAAIAAJ&pg=RA1-PA473&dq=john+cockroft+halfax&lr=#v=onepage&q=&f=false
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=yrUHAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA135&dq=john+cockroft+halfax&lr=#v=onepage&q=&f=false
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Hal farm looks like Tipping green -Ogden area of abode.
Overden is place of Worship
Calderdale GB 203
Catalogue reference number help BIP/HX:6066
Extent help (1 file)
Title help E Rothera - water closet at Hal Farm, Ogden.
Date help 8 Jun 1956
Description help Scale: 4 feet:1 inch [1:48]
Subject FARMS
Access status help Open
Catalogue status Catalogued
Access conditions Original available for consultation by appointment
Calderdale GB 203
Catalogue reference number help BIP/HX:2738
Extent help (1 file)
Title help Ernest Rothera - block of garages on Hal Farm, Ogden. Date help 13 Aug 1951
Description help Scale: 4 feet:1 inch [1:48]
Access status help Open
Catalogue status Catalogued
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Hi Dobby,
I think we have just made a possible breakthrough. I noticed on those
polling votes. A John Cockroft dead and on the next page James Child from Idle. Joseph Cockroft was living with Grace Pickles Ind 65years and
James Child Ind 65 years.Also living with them are the Fearnleys who married Joseph Cockroft. Making him the same age as John Cockroft. To vertify this I need to know the date of the Polling pages have date of Oct 8 but that is all.What year would that be, please.
Hal Farm seems t obe the one ok. Much furtehr up that I at first thought, no wonder we haven't been getting anywhere. On the 1851 census Sally, John Cockroft's wife is down as farmer, 11 acres whilst William her son has 9 acres it seems.
Where is Idle by the way?
Sandra
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Hi Sandra,
Only Idle I know is in Leeds but there could be one in Halifax? this could be some remote place or lane end corner of a field as there are loads of places unknown in these 1800's censuses to modern folk. As polling year? I need to check that out! Its not always easy working on ancestry blind on other people's families as not in the know! Hence I put as much of what I find in the post within copyrights limits. You can see things I can't in the info found......
Some times ones lucky! as there are old pre 1841c polling in inhabitant and early census info 1801 or Overseers/Churchwarden accounts-yet like my own in Warwickshire Nothing!
Farming and Odgen! There must be direct link with the Cockroft Family. There is a John Cockroft in the WYAS online info owning a garage. (1987 ish off top of my head). Tipping green is 1/8 th of a mile from Ogden or 1/2 a field.
I'm hoping a grave headstone! With both Sally and John Cockroft on! being of business family? but pre 1837 is mostly epistemology. Words like verify or confirm are not in the formula! with only snippits of bits of info here and there! A problem modern folk have trouble coming to terms with after the lush census years! and being cut of 1837 to near nothing.........then Help!
Dobby
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Hi Dobby,
Yes understand your predicament.
Joseph is living with James Child at Jammy Green, is that Illingworth? I have aweful trouble trying to find these districts.
I remember my grandmother in Halifax at Grant Street, now pulled down, off Commercial street and we were right on the edge of the moors. I know she went to live finally at
Illingworth. I lived at Grant Street for the first four years
of my life, before coming back down to my parents in
Wales.
I remember her talking about Ogden a lot. I have a photo
of us all above Hebden Bridge outside a church with a signpost. 11 mile colne, Burnley, and something else I can't remeber offhand, but that is where the relatives are buried, up on the moors.
Joseph is on the 1841 as a weaver, and so is John, his father. So assume that his wife running the busiess
as a farmer, and he has some sort of textile business, I think in Ovenden or Halifax. Very difficult to sort it all out.
Another thing I need to know is Todmorden and Walden covering Ogden.
Sandra
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Hi Sandra,
I have the same problem with Wales place names.
Red Doles in Huddersfield I only heard of the other day and I live there! its local name today Cantor Lane where the fair used to be by the Football ground and be going there 60 years. So your not the only one.
The river Calder is a long steep valley that joins the River Air at Castleford and it source starts Rawtonstall (Stream) near Blackburn in Lancashire. Flowing down to Ba-cup then Todmorden where it becomes a river when it joins it other large stream from Burnley. From Todmorden to Halifax is a very long stretch of about Approx 15 miles with Hepenstall and Hebden bridge halfway (See google Maps)
Walsden is near Todmorden on the Rochdale road from.
Walden, Old Pool Bank, Pool In Wharfedale, Idle, West Yorkshire LS21, UK
Walden Dr, Queensbury, Bradford, West Yorkshire BD9, UK
Ogden is North-North west of Halifax on the Keigthley Road on the Moors above Hebden bridge, :D and a connecting trunk road the A 6033 and B6141 Oxenhope Hebden bridge to Denholme to Queensbury above Ogden moor (farms) and Village.
The Cockroft family may still own this garage and other ventures/businesses/farms. Thus maybe worth writing blind to them. Directories 192 or 118. websites or Yellow pages as business.
http://www.calmview.eu/WY/DServe.exe?dsqApp=Archive&dsqDb=Catalog&dsqCmd=Search.tcl
Enter John Cockroft in Search above link
Item
Click here to explore the full catalogue for this collection
Location help Calderdale GB 203
Catalogue reference number help BIP/HX:6492
Extent help (1 file)
Title help John Cockroft - garage at Dale Croft, Keighley Rd, Ogden.
Date help 5 Dec 1956
Description help Scale: 8 feet:1 inch [1:96]
Access status help Open
Catalogue status Catalogued
Access conditions Original available for consultation by appointment
Well Sandra! we have burned a lot of posts now in this and I'll check that polling year at Halifax library over the coming weeks and the Zion church yard. Also anything else. I be back in Yorkshire tomorrow.
I'll post any findings.
Regards for now!
Dobby
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Hi Sandra,
Have a chew on this (I'll let you do the finding Don't want to spoil your fun!!)----Allerton is Near Idle
John Cockcroft bapt 22-01-1775 Halifax Father Jon
http://www.calmview.eu/WY/DServe.exe?dsqApp=Archive&dsqDb=Catalog&dsqCmd=Search.tcl
enter John Cockcroft - Then enter separate John Cockroft
Father John Wool manufacturer maybe.
Look for these place names below round overden and Illingworth
Souterhouse, Wadsworth
Little Burlees, Wadsworth
Sand Hall
http://www.justice101us.com/turner/Abraham.htm
Benjamin Russell 1792
Parish, Halifax Shield. England Town History Halifax: In 1822 ... In 1847, the sappers and miners visited this district ... John Maude, jun. Richard Best, Thomas Shaw, John Cockroft ...
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/Misc/Transcriptions/WRY/IllingworthChurchHistoricalNotes.html
GENUKI: Historical notes on Illingworth Church.
The following extracts are from a book found in Halifax ... John Maude, jun. Richard Best, Thomas Shaw, John Cockroft ... conducted until the death of Mr Jonathan Akroyd, in 1847.
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Hi Dobby,
Well you have given me lots of info to sort out.
If we can find the date for the polling (I assume candidates) the John cockroft on that one may be the one that died in 1847 so would give us the lead we need and the dates. Whatever you can find I will be grateful for.
Thanks again,
Ooh you an an angel.
Sandra
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Hi San,
As I said I will look into Polling Year next week in Halifax Library.
******
The Wealth, Location and Poverty also history of Industry.
Poverty John Cockroft a Pauper in the Workhouse most likely pauper grave who married Ann Can Eliminated BUT! You still need him to eliminate death and bapt dates-their marriage by Bann but by License would give an age.
Manufacture in the late 1700's could mean Cottage (Farm) weaver or industrialist also trade manufacture like milliner (Hats) Or cobbler
My theory is Sally!
Find her grave John will be with here or near? She is in the 1851 c and her age, unless she remarred and then buried with her 2nd Hubby?
A long Job
Last you need to use IGI Hugh Wallis Bapts and marriage webpage.
Check all the John Cockroft marriages and Year of marriages
Then their first Siblings also Full lists of all them.
This will give their Religions & Church and if they had a sibling that march your Johns sibling bapt years
Example only
Ie Joe Bapts of John 1815 one say Halifax St John Anglican
And Yours is 1815 Overden/Ogden New connection Methodist
Find the siblings 1841 c if still alive and the exact Emuneration abodes and occupations also the 1868 Death in censuses.
Dobs
By Elimination the other what is left will be your John and Sally
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Ps
We know already John the pauper (Wife Ann) was born in Overden as the overseers of their residence of removal always send them back to there place/parish of birth in removal orders & examination. Hence their marriage year to approx year of birth ie 25 years before +/- 5 years
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Polling year for 1848 and taken 1849
Go the Google book link page and use the right scroll slide to the first pages of the Yorkshire polling book LEEDS head Station
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Hi Again
You break through as below on Polling book and 1829 Pigots Directory of trade Horton street
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/WRY/Halifax/Halifax29Dry.html
Transcript of the entry of "professions and trades"
for HALIFAX in Pigot's Directory of 1829.
Woolstaplers,
Abbott Robert & Son, Union street
Baldrey Robert, 13 Square
Cockroft & Ramsden, Horton street
Cockcroft John, 13 Cheapside
This John Cockcroft Dead in 1848 if its him could be buried in Northowran (Horton)
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=yrUHAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA135&dq=john+cockroft+halfax&lr=#v=onepage&q=&f=false
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Hi Dobby,
Some of these sites look really good and I have plenty to keep me going.\
Thanks,
Sandra
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Hi Sandra
I'm back home now and been to Ogden/Overden/Illingworth
First Mount Zion is at Ogden but just in overden boundary but it Ogden Top well above the town ships of Illingworth and overden also Illingworth merthodist church is there as well- a good 2 miles from(Above on the moor) the townships. Halfarm seems a mastery to the locals and I called at Halifax Library and looked at the 1850's map -Nothing on hal farm?
John Cockcroft found at Queensbury baptist chapel grave owner no dates -I have now found his grave MI
John Cockroft died 29th May 1881 age 76 Wife Mary died 1844 age 39 (hence John the grave owner in the book)
So that one Eliminated
There were actually 23 John Cockroft and John Cockcrofts buried between 1837 and 1852 in the gro
and with so little info of lost grave yards Lost parish burial registers. Only the Gro's may give the answer but they give out very little info
So Sorry!
:'(
Dobby :)
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Hi Dobby,
yes it does seem to be a bit elusive this farm. It must have existed. Well At least you had all that lovely fresh air.
I have already found all, I believe of Joseph's siblings and Samuel, the youngest, I sent for marriage certificate and only gives John as father and weaver as occuptaiton for John. Just, what looks like Oven den something which I think is just the registrars fancy writing.
I have two brothers for John Cockroft 1776. one I believe is
Henry Cockroft born 1775, he was living at Shaking House, Rocks,I have him listeed in Mt. Zion for deaths.there was industry going on there by subsequent owners or renters later. I believe, the other is James around about the same time. Thanks for looking anyway.
I think Iwill send for death certificate anyway for John Cockroft death Zion 1847. He was at Tipping Green. It might give us more leads.
You have exceeded your post in your efforts and very grateful to you.
I still have lots of leads and info to go through so something, I am sure will show up sooner or later, and then it all , usually, clicks into place.
Sandra
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Hello Sandra,
I'll have a look at this from a new angle from your Joseph's Bapt 1815 and a full look at these census originals in the Halifax library also enumeration districts from the census recorders route around the streets of the district! We have concentrated on John b 1776 with tipping green looking as a good possibility!
Sally or Sarah is the one to work as burial place.
What is the connection of Hal farm to John & Sally.
I'll do this on when I'm doing my other archive business over the winter months.
Dobby
-
Hi Dobby,]
Sally down as farmer in 1851. In 1861 William wh is with her in 1841 and 1851 is in Hal Farm House. Samuel , if I remembrf rrightly, (Joseph's brother) is tere is 1841. In 1861 after Sally death Charles there in No 5 Hal House.
in 1861 William is back there with his sister Ellin who is also unmarried. Sometimes it is Hal Farm , Sometimes Hal House and No. 5 Hal.
I don't have the census for Ovenden and relying totally on a distant cousin who is working with me on this as her g grandmother and my g grandmother living in same house in 1871.
I have today ordered the death certificate for Sally Cockroft
death Halifax 1857. it seems the most likely and not many others for that date. Where did you get the date of 1851 from Dobby?
Sandra
-
Sorry Dobby,
I mean 1857. mistyped. rushing around this morning, got to go out and trying to cook some dinner as well.
Sandra
-
Hi again
Yes ! 1851 death of Sally??? Good question! I got Sarah! 1851 c - back from Australian post request (Night time) by me for Sally 1851c Hence I need orignal Census info to work from.
Sally or
Sarah Cockroft GRO's Death's
Sally or
Sarah Cock C roft (Cockcroft) Gro Deaths
Mount Zion website say there are many graves in one section not on their list! Only recording the best condition headstones
Illingworth Methodist grave yard is only 1/4 mile from Mount zion chapel all intact and bigger and unrecorded as MIs Yet!
-
John 1841c Broad St Halifax last known abode Qu! is he buried there and Sally went to live near or with William after John's death????
-
Hi Dobby,]
nearest church to broad street is in Lee Mount Area which is St. Georges. I think that they are a Catholic Church, but haven't persued that area yet.
Hope to have something from Sally Cockroft death cert. I don't know if they give maiden name. I have only six candidates of marriages for Halifax for Sally or Sarahs.
So hoping I can eliminate them as we go along.
Candidates are Midgely, Hanson, Culpan and three others
favourites as in order.
There is a child in the family within ten years with the name of Midgely Cockroft, so whether that is a clue we shall see.
I hope they put the maiden name on the certificate.
Sandra
-
Hi San
Been at my own library in Huddersfield today and they had Illingworth MIs Mid 1700's 1900's Two John Cockrofts one 1863 ans 1881
There's a Joseph Broad Lee or lane Illingworth.. and a few more of that street also a Lucy.
I got the original Census copies of 41c John and Sally 51c Sarah and William 61c William &1c William. Also Enumeration district Streets and next districts both sides so well find out the exact from these streets. (Hal Lane)
Dobby
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Hi Dobby,
Cant wait to hear what you find out locationwise.My you have been busy. So grateful to you.
I have spent the day putting a map of the whole of the area from Ovenden to Ogden. Trying to put street map together now, so I know where I am.
Sandra
-
removed as moderators advise
-
Hi, San,
I emailed to my self all these original census views from the free library edition! Got the first one then now all I'm getting is Tech problems page.
Any way theres 1851 is District 15 Halifax other street on the page Prospect place Overden & Beswis or Beswick or Beswish
Hal (Hall lane)Lane in Northowram 61c
Dobby
-
Hi Sandra
Maybe Your John and Sally want total RIP!
:-\
Berwisk and Hal Farm-house- lane in Overden -Illingworth -Ogden on the old maps 1850's map? (I've been up half the night looking at these old maps and modern) nothing? :(
http://yourarchives.nationalarchives.gov.uk/index.php?title=Place:Halifax_Registration_District%2C_1851_Census_Street_Index
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Hi Dobby,
yes I had Beswisk on the original from when I was on ancestry years ago, I kept the record.
Also William Cockroft, brother of Joseph, I think it was him was living in Prospect Row later moving to live with his brother Charles to Pharoah Street, which is also in Illingworth.
Anyway I have been putting my maps together and located
Wrigley Hill where William or Charles lived in between living in Hal House Farm. Now I found Wrigley Hill on the
Keighley road on , Wrigley Hill has a farm there right on the bend of the road on the edge of Keighley road opposite is
Raw Lane and Back Lane.
Not far away foff the Keighley Road is Cousin Lane.
I think we might not be too far away from Prospect Place and Prospect Row.
Just a thought that the farm that is still there are Wrigley Hill is the one we migth be looking for under perhaps another name now.
Sandra.
-
Hi Dobby,
Just been thinking that Samuel (Joseph brother) had a grocer shop in Broad Tree (terrace) number 133 for about thirty years. Sounds like he might have been selling produce from the farm. In 1851 he lived in Lower Hal. Not sure where Broad Tree is but think it might be in Lee Mount area. If you find where Broad Tree is let me know please. I am abit confused about this street.
Sandra
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Hi Sandra,
Thats great work! It will save me another trip to look at the said web site on census info. Always braking down like an old banger! (Reason I oversubscribed them)
If fact i will go back as I need to see the Route of the census recorders with these village being near as one.
Pin point the nearest church/chapel and Sally death location from her GRO cert. I saw Wrigley hill last night.
I'm sending a blind letter to this farm asking where it is? to the owner/occupier with a SAE and return to sender on the back if not found.
-
Hi Dobby,
If you go on Multimap , look along Keighley Road, you will see a bend in Keighley Road. That I believe is not there anymore, it is how it used to be.
There is on the bend, what looks like a farm, but reading now more about the area, it may also be a pub. A lot of history there going back to the war of the roses, that is if I have the right place.
I looked for Broad Tree and I have read that it might be in Boothtown, but can't find out much about that either.
I think that the farm might be split into two. Because on the 1851 where
Sally is left it says ''farmer of 11 acres'' and on the 1851 census for Charles,
(the brother of Joseph), it says ''farmer of 9 acres'', that was at Slippy Lane.
(wherever that might be).
Sandra
-
Hi
How stupid of me as General Rommil said when he found out Normandy was the invasion place.
Illingworth Hall Farm
Back Ln, Wrigley hill ST Marys Halifax, West Yorkshire HX2, UK
-
Its up for sale if you want to buy it
http://www.boococks.co.uk/residential_sales.asp?ID=4158
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Ernest Rothera
http://www.ckcricketheritage.org.uk/calderdale/illingworth/docs/illingworth_
thepeople.pdf
http://www.ckcricketheritage.org.uk/calderdale/illingworth/clubhome.
htm
Calderdale GB 203
Catalogue reference number help BIP/HX:2738
Extent help (1 file)
Title help Ernest Rothera - block of garages on Hal Farm, Ogden. Date help 13 Aug 1951
Description help Scale: 4 feet:1 inch [1:48]
Access status help Open
Catalogue status Catalogued
-
Hi Dobby,
I had thought of this place before but didn't know exactly where it was located. Now I will have to look up the history.
I have a feelling there is a connection with Cockroft anyway.
I found Broad Tree Road.
I went on multimap and followed Ovenden Road down until I came to juction off to Ovenden Way as you are lookinga the map (birds eye) there is a road off to the right called
Broad Tree Road leading to a cross roads mill lane, old lane,.If you carry on along mill lane, there is wood st and then into wood square. There is a largish farm and plenty of acreage of that to have been the farm as well. At Broad Tree there is a large mill athe start of the road. and if you follow the road on throuhg mill lane it comes to Boothtown Road.
How I would love to buy that Illingworth Hall. I can hardly afford my electric bills these days.
Going to have a look now at the multimap to see exactly were it is.
Sandra
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Hi Dobby,\
I also noticed that there is a largechurch up at
Wrigley Hill but couldn't see any graves. I wonder what that one is.
Sandra
-
Hi Sandra
Where are we going is my next Question! You have done remarkable well done job this far with your Maps.
Your objectives I assume are the age of John and Sally at their respected age for their Birth years and to find their marriage for Sally's maiden name. (Not easy)
Do the wittiness on Joe or other (If you have them) certs ring any bells? meaning Sally relations maybe and a matching Maiden name for a marriage of John and Sally/Sarah ? Someone.
Important ! can you give me the Known marriages if any? of Joe Bro's, sis's and DATES so I can check out their parish marriages for Wittinesses and if luck holds a License marriage by bond allegation maybe (Bonds man and beat man also the exact age unless they told porkies as not unusual) at Halifax Library
-
Hi Dobby,\
I also noticed that there is a largechurch up at
Wrigley Hill but couldn't see any graves. I wonder what that one is.
Sandra
Large Church is ST Marys Angican Church
-
Hi Dobby,
I should have the death certificate for Sally next weke sometime and that should confirm (if it is the right one) where she was living, perhaps her maiden name and who was with her when she died.
Samuel is the only cert for marrige I have. I have traced his
John Smith as a witness, to a Cockroft grave leading me to the Ogden area.
I know John Smith is so common but haven't foundany more int he area. He seemed to have been well known up there.
Isaac Ingham was th eother witness and I believe his wife was the witness on Joseph marriage certififacat.e
There is only other witness on Joseph marriage 1841
was William Rushworth whom I cannot find.
I don't have a real clue to who Sally maiden name was before she married but Hanson and Midgeley the faovurties.
there is a Midgeley Cockroft later on the family, but also
|Samuel Hanson from Hebden Bridge visited my North relations in 1881 20 years later. So who knows.
Charles must have married Hannah in about 1835 first child 1836.\
William never married.
There is a John Cockroft born 1808 wife susannah or sarah, but I wouldn't go there if I were you we think he is a bigamist and we have neough problems as it is.
Hope that there is enough for you to go on with.
Sandra
-
Hi
Glegg, Culpan, Midgley and Hanson of Halfax marriages
Midgley and Hanson had Bapts at Mount zion 1805 plus years.
Midgey has buckets of info on the net
If john Jr was the Bigamist more the better as more Wittinesses He could have been anything as long as there's info. ie murder - vicar- mayor of Halifax.
John Smith Is Too common.
Newpapers go back to the late 1700's in Halifax.
-
Sandra Your Smith connection
found this below;-
Seeking information on the ancestors (and confirmation of the immediate descendents) of William Cockroft and Abigail Smith Cockroft, married 1/24/1811. I believe Abigail's father was James Smith, and Abigail and William had a son whom they named James Smith Cockroft (my 5th ggrandfather).
Anyhow, two of James Smith Cockroft's sons (Charles and David - I don't know whether there were any other children) were born in Halifax, Yorkshire,in the 1840's and emigrated to the US @1860. Their father, James Smith Cockroft was both baptised and buried at Illingworth Chapel, Yorkshire.
If it's any help, Abigail, J.S. Cockroft's wife, may have been christened in 1787 at South Parade, Wesleyan, Halifax, Yorkshire.
-
Cockroft Abigail Bradford Y 9b 112
-
Cockroft Abigail Bradford Y 9b 112 Deaths Jun 1853
-
In Brief or High points of!Deed
Township of Ovenden and Illingwoth
In 1814 -Act of parliament-Lands of Lord Henry Saville Lord of Overden his Heirs by decree
of Illingworth Chapelry of Overden/Ogden Common Lands to be farmed.
The Village gave name an old Family which remains no pedigree some of the descentants on the
spot are in a humble situation of life and there are some remains of the old family Hall now
converted into cottages,
Henry Saville Lord of Overden by Deed dated 27th Jan Granted and confirmed to James Brawnforth,
William Doughty, William Illingworth Jun.John Maude Jun, Richard Best, Thomas Shaw. John Cockroft,
Henry Cockroft........
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=qGCvAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA376&dq=cockroft+illingworth#v=onepage&q=cockroft%20illingworth&f=false
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Hi dobby,
That's interesting about South Parade, will have to do try to find out more.
I remember being in touch with this woman on the net some years ago. She asked then if there was a connection.
Some other woman, I don't know if it was her said that some of the Cockrofts went out to Russia to teach weaving and then cam eback again.
I am more than interested i nthe land situation for the Cockrofts re Saville.
Someone in our family, may be the Partington- North line is called Saville.
But that may be coincidence. Oh I wish I could rmemebr all my grandmother ever told me about the family, but I was so young.
I still feel that there is something with the land down at Broad Tree. Also the fact that there is a large mill on the river bank where I feel that there might be a connection with the Cockroft family industry or soemthing. All the Cockrofts lived there at some time in Broad Tree Terrace, which could be on the main
Ovenden Road. There is a terrace of houses there. I couldn't see anything
aroudn that area other than those. But Wood Square looks interesting as a smal holding. Wonder if that land is what was left them?
I had a look for anyhting on Illingworth Hall Farm and couldn[t find much other than Malcolm Bull site and that didn[t say much either.] Would like to find out the past owners.
Sandra
RE John Cockroft born 1808 bigamist there is, if I remember right an article on him on the Malcolm Bull site. I don't have time to persue this line as I have the decorators all in at the moment and you can image the mess. I have another week of this yet. So will have to fit in when I can on the ancestry.
-
Yes Sandra and I'm plastering my walls alike you messy! so I know what you mean but thats been going on two month or more! and like!! I get fed up and go out. 3am to Warwick (Last Week!)
Though this bit of info may help you we have found. (Sunday search as library is closed) I was after their nearest burial ground with this location of residence in censuses! search. As your topic request.
I'll dig as I said before with my other quests over the coming months.
Post any info from Sally's death cert in view of her grave search
All for now
Best regards Dobby
-
Ok Will do Dobby,
thanks again,
Sandra
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Double wedding 21-04-1806 CULPAN
John Culpan X Betty Firth both Sowerby parish by Bunns
Witt Frances Nicholle
William Bundworth or Birdworth Res pro witness
John Cockroft Weaver X Sally Culpan Sinster both of Sowerby parish
sub parish of St John by banns Both put X mark
Wit Frances Nicholle
William birdworth (As Above)
***********************************************************
3-03-1807
John Cockroft Weaver X Sarah Hanson Spinster both of Sowerby Parish
By Banns Both Put X mark
John Cockroft X Sally Clegg Both of Hepenstall by License
Wit John Hellewell
James Michell
************************************************************
21-12-1802
John Cockcroft Weaver X Sally Clegg of Heptenstall< (As Written)
By Licence
Both signed
Wit Nick Clegg
William Ridsworth
****************************************************************
Page 108/9 entery 322 date 31-08-1806
John Cockroft Labour X Sarah Midgley Both of Overden of this parish
Marrie by Banns William Willmot
In the presence of George Child
And William Burhworth Regular Church Wittiness
Have copy of this event if you PM me your Email Address I will
send a copy Used for this purpose only.
Cannot Post Parish register>Copy rights
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Based on the original markerstones, The grave sales John Cockroft Tippingreen and the grouping of Cockroft graves also the numerical order of dates of burials on these stones by the entrances gate and dates on the headstone in year by year order. This could be the Grave 273 large family grave. Every thing seems to fit! next grave is Thomas Cockroft Grave owner
Photo gone to B?W uploading for some reason but you'll get the drift.
-
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=407836.new
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Hi Dobby,
I think we have found our man and I haven't had the certificate yet. you are off the ball aren't you? That means (Wales)) you are really on target.
It has to be Sarah Migeley (the cert I sent for). She has George Child as witness and Joseph (his son was livng with James Child), too much coincidence here.
I have been looking for the other witness to Joseph marriage cert for William
Rushworth and think now that William Burdworth might be the same person,
what do you think?
By the way how do I PM.
Sandra
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Hi Sandra
Take your copy of the Midgley parish reg copy image as soon as poss then I will remove it from the decipher board. (C?rights)put your curtsur on the reg image and right click your mouse.'Save to Picture's
William Rushworth is on a lot of St John marriages as church stand witness. (No Family connection)
In answer to your original question. 1837 to 1867 ish mount zion register bapt/burial book taken to Kew and not on micro film/fic-Supposed to be in BMD non comformist website but not all are on yet.
There is one last chance! The Halifax local weekly rag (newspaper) pre dates 1837.has birth,death & marriages. but only the better to doo's/off's will be in it I would think.
Study the Mount zion SALES of grave (Address/Occupations shown) and grave yard Mi's with your maps and build a picture of the Cockrofts /Midgley/Child etc. and family search for the birth/bapts.
The manufacture was cottage industry weaving! not business empire.
I'll look at the news paper but may be a long Job (Months)
I WILL REMOVE THE PARISH REG IN TWO DAYS From THE DECIPHER BOARD as completed.
RDS Dobby
-
Hi again
The only Overden marriage of this St John parish (Sub) confirm
Also both signed Mark X -This alone makes me certain the other Business John Cockfort are not the 1806 marriage and 1841 c Broad st John. Labourer was a loose term for general manual worker put by Judgment of clerk. Farming and farm cottage weaving on the moors was common. (ODGEN/Overden Jed Clampet 'Beveley Hillbillies' and grannies snooker fancy eating table ;D)
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Hi Dobby,
Now I am confused. If you say that this Broad Street John is not the one and that the John we are looking for is still elusive, where can he be.?
Already been building picture with the rellies, but now
where do we go.
Yes, I agree it was more cottage industry but where did
the money come from that was handed down from the Cockrofts to the next two or three generations.
Really puzzling me now.
Sandra
-
Hi Sandra.
You may have miss read
My first thoughts on manufacture! as being Mill owner and trade directories IE John Cockroft of Northowram also this Rochdale partners John Cockroft!.
Yours is to the highest degree the 1806 marriage to Sarah Midgley, and the one on the 1841 census Broad street census.
Cottage industry was the first wool manufacture of cloths until these industrial mills took over!and even Mill workers who had small holdings also carrying on their small family cottage weaving & farming.
This was the time of the late Luddites and charties riots round Halifax
These terms on church registers/ GRO certs(Early GRO;s copies of parish registers) and census are very loose covering a wide range. ie Mason could be a quarry worker or a high skilled stone carver.
-
Hi Dobby,
Yes understand your predicament.
Joseph is living with James Child at Jammy Green, is that Illingworth? I have aweful trouble trying to find these districts.
I remember my grandmother in Halifax at Grant Street, now pulled down, off Commercial street and we were right on the edge of the moors. I know she went to live finally at
Illingworth. I lived at Grant Street for the first four years
of my life, before coming back down to my parents in
Wales.
I remember her talking about Ogden a lot. I have a photo
of us all above Hebden Bridge outside a church with a signpost. 11 mile colne, Burnley, and something else I can't remeber offhand, but that is where the relatives are buried, up on the moors.
Joseph is on the 1841 as a weaver, and so is John, his father. So assume that his wife running the busiess
as a farmer, and he has some sort of textile business, I think in Ovenden or Halifax. Very difficult to sort it all out.
Another thing I need to know is Todmorden and Walden covering Ogden.
Sandra
Sandra,
I've pick this up on the assumption you have the right John and Sally 1841c Broad st from your Joe bapt 1815, the surname Child is the strongest link and Overden location of abode. As for prior knowledge of events of wealth of the Cockcrofts I cannot comment on without your full knowledge of events.
My object is to work around John unknown exact age or year of birth and death year of the 1841 c John Cockcoft & wife Sally to find his parentage and Sally's also her maiden name.
Dobby
-
Hi Dobby,]
You are quite right, we must sort out who my John Cockroft is. Firstly I would like to find out for definate the location of Broad Street and Broad Tree Terrace. Joseph lived Broad Tree Terrace and so did Samuel for thirty years with the grocer shop. Broad Street seems to be very vague to my recconing. Also I have only found on the map Broad Tree
off Ovenden road.
I notice that Broad Tree off oVENDEN ROAD is in fact in the area of Lee Mount where all my latter family, ie Miranda cockroft who married my g grandfather James North.
James was, as I have been told, by relatives in South Africa, whom James lpaid for them to go there,was manager in the mill at Lee Mount. Which is anybody's gues which one. I know that they lived in a large house either called Lee Mount House, or Spring Lee.
That is bye the bye because we also have the other
Cockrofts living up at Hal Farm wherever that may be,
ie. Charles, William and possibly John.
However on Samuels Census for 1851` it says he is living at Lower Hal,so mystery deepens until we ge tthe certificate rfor Sally,perhaps.
I am going to have another look at the grave sales because I think I saw two other people who lived at Hall or Hal
something number.
Sandra
-
Sandra,
I fully understand!
As 1841 c I'll re look at that enumeration census recorder route and exact! district again as where!
If your main council Public (Not LDS) book reference library is within reasonable bus range? then they have Anc**try .c*.uk free library edition. Search out John original 1841 c original view of this event! at the top of the page you will see a line flow finishing district 14(Click on District)
Next page click on District 14 next page click in emuneration (Middle to right!*** ignore left events- you'll see) This will brink up the route the census recorder took that day 1841. Street by street.
Joseph Cockroft born/bapt 1815 there is only one (Ive checked all parish's and none conformists and quakers)of John and Sarah Cockroft Mount zion chapel Overden area sub Illingworth just in the Ogden border.
-
Hi Dobby,
Just found Edward Cockroft living at 5 Broad Tree Terrace, on the 1881 census with wife Hannah. he was christined
1817 at zion father James mother Sally. He was a carpet weaver. He could be cousin to Joseph. he died 1889
grave number dm 30. Looks like Broad Tree and Broad Tree Terrace are the same place. On the graves it said Broad Tree on the Cenus 1881 Broad Tree Terrace.
james could be brother to my John Cockroft 1776.
Will look further.
Sandra
-
Sandra
As you said this is a hobby. You got a good knowledge of these maps. As I said the enumeration districts in A .co.uk is your wishing well source for at the time info.
Another way is to go a few pages either side and pickup the streets round these locations. For the time being use the 1881 in family search LDS census. Find one in overden then click the next few (10)pages either side and streets. Better still find Hal farm/cottages or houses.
Allow a little time to have a natter with your neighbors and friends though!
-
Hi Dobby
I have already done what you suggest previously, but I have already ordered the 1851 census books ovenden and I have 1861 census Halifax area which I haven't had time to look at yet, so plenty to keep me occupied. Out all day tomorrow so won't have a lot of time again,
Keep digging,
]Sandra
-
Bumble will be back next week she know Halifax more than I in ref to the odd ball places. You want to try Holmfirth 'Love Bum names ! High Bottoms- Mark Bottoms -Pok Bottoms and some I darn't put! as may upset the -'Shut that door' community!
-
Hi Dobby,
I can image all the wierd sounding place names.Best keep them to yourself. I'll find them when I come across them.
Didn't tell you I am a Minister of the church did I.
Sandra
-
Yes Well I. ER!.
'Rambo' and 'The sound of Music' are not an exact match! ER!
Mind you I get on with the Rev'nd Mother on this site.
**********
Sandra try
http://www.GenesReunited.co.uk/static/signout.aspx
You'll have to register.
go to census free part
go to the 1851c
Enter William Cockcroft
Birth year 1809
Click on Overden (Not Overeden Birth place)Census area
The map takes you exactly to the census Street location
Waindale close Mount Tobar
Dobby
********
Yes I can see Last of the summer wine country! Yes Well.
Compo was a bit out spoken. Hee By gum!
-
Hi Dobby,
Like the wellies, will give it a go.
Sandra
-
GENUKI: Moor End United Reformed Church, Mt Tabor, Halifax, Yorkshire
John Cockroft of High Field, Ovenden, shalloon maker. John Foster of Bankhouse, yeoman. Matthew Patchet of Cold Edge, yeoman. Samuel Garforth of Wainstalls, ...
www.genuki.org.uk/.../HalifaxMoorEndURC_TWJpagemill.html - Cached - Similar
-
19th century (1800's)halifax newspapers online
http://www.calderdale.gov.uk/leisure/libraries/services/online-reference/19century-newspapers.html
You will have to join the library to gain access
contact the Library! (Phone)
I'll still use the library to look up as well
-
Hi Dobby,
Just received booklets for 1851 census and looke up Sally Cockroft and she is described as living at Berwick.
the ED 15 area is described as follows re Hal.
Typed as seen
One other part of Ovenden township comprising one other parcel of the Ecclesiastical District of Illingworth from White Gate go East down Tewitt Hall Road take down South Side thereof which is the Bradhsaw Boundry from Tewitt Hall road bottom go WEst to Parsonage House South to Threapcroft and Ovenden Grange then keep East of Farrar House End then go up the Turnpike road take all the Houses on the right hand and left to Mr. Isles Mill End then go to Whit
Hill both Hals New Chapel to Tewit Lane top.
Somewhere there is our Hal.]
Will spend tomorrowing looking at the area and maps.
Not sure of this area at all.
Sandra
-
Hi Sandra
This is the next district :o 13- 1841 census
John was in Broad ST district 14
the only one I got sent from An*stry was the next district 13
Overden/Mixenden rest got the Tech problem pages on 14 and 15 districts.
Halifax Broads st is not this one_ therefore your on the right track with your theory
of Broad tree terr Overden
States
"one the part of the township of Overden being the the district
of St Mary's Illingworth,begin at stod fold and take goose cough,
binn hole, then go to hunter hill,(S or F)> Furloft (or Coft)age (furcottage?),
then turn south the boundary of Overden & Warley to upper hunter hill (S,F,or L)
> Solomons Temple, Norh's ark, then go to(S,F or L)> leaning Hill, East height old chapel
fields, then go to Upper Heights, then to White Hall ,then go to Hamilton Hall,
Then down footpath to Brow Bottom from thence to West to Mr (S,F,or)> Fosters shed
to Mixenden lane,turn past down mixenden lane? take in all houses north west of
said lane to you get below the old smithy, then turn forth east onto Overden brook opposite Mixenden
brook stone, then turn up the west side of said brook called (S,F.orL)>slodford.
Rambo Dobby (Under attack form Nora Batty's ghost)
-
old maps
ToP of Wrigley hill -Turn Left Passing Jammy Green (Now White Hill find) > Holmfield
Census recorders route
From (Left of on map)Holmfield at an angle of 35 deg's or 10 oclock- go towards causeway foot & tipping green - passing through Tewit lane
That the route. Where Hal is ? or Berwick.?
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Hi Dobby,
They should have given you your Duke Of Edinburgh award for this.
Oh my I am glad I don't have to go looking up there for this one, you would need a search party to find me.
Sandra
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Hi,Sandra.
There are short cuts to find your way round the maze!: As for John's death thats even with death certificates will be hard with all the Sally/Sarah wives (Migdley name of 'person with at death' would help! or a sisters married name but at her age >doubt it- if you find the Midgley family pod!), only the place of death if its Berwick or Hal would prove and it is not known where it is!- as seen on a map. There were two Sally/Sarah on the 41c born 1780 ish. The1806 Overden parish abode marriage was living in Overden that year and her Midgley bro & sis maybe also finding her brothers on the census with a Cockroft visiting maybe or Child surname. (Search Illingworth Midgley location. (Sisters stuck together!)
You need to recap you sums for errors!:-Common practice! also if you missed anything vital in your search!
As for family wealth? that could have been made down stream of John & Sally in the hay day of the Victorian Boom years 1840 -1901 Intustrial Modern period
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Sandra,
Know doubt!! you have an answers!*****!! to is??? but recheck your facts before I push deeper or waste my time*******!! >:(
Thorton Queensbury?
1861c
Hannah Bradley 29 Yorkshire, England Wife Ovenden Yorkshire
Jacob Bradley 30 Yorkshire, England Head Ovenden Yorkshire
Joseph Bradley 2 Yorkshire, England Son Ovenden Yorkshire
Mary H Bradley 1 Yorkshire, England Daughter Ovenden Yorkshire
Ralph Bradley 7 Yorkshire, England Son Ovenden Yorkshire
Emma Cockroft 15 Yorkshire, England Sister Ovenden Yorkshire
George Cockroft 18 Yorkshire, England Brother Ovenden Yorkshire
Grace Cockroft 8 Yorkshire, England Sister Ovenden Yorkshire
Miranda Cockroft 11 Yorkshire, England Sister Ovenden Yorkshire
Miranda born Where Cock Roft not in Gro
Only Cock Croft
Births Mar 1838
Cockcroft Miranda Bradford 23 98
Births Jun 1846
Cockcroft Miranda Bradford Yk 23
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Hi Dobby,
Yes you have right Miranda. Queensbury is in Ovenden. Miranda just missed the 1851 census but Joseph her father is on there in Jammy Green.Ryecroft Moseley Row.
In 1841 census he is with Grace Pickles head 55 and James Child.
in JMosely Row , Jammy Green.
Not sure where William his son is in 1851. Can you ltell me if there is a Willliam on the 1841, as I don't have the census here.
On the 1851 I have the book form and ther eis a William aged 4 at Rocks.Different ED district. Not sure what is happening here.
Sandra
Also is Broad Street the same as Broad Tree . Iam confused over this.
I also need to know if the image yo sent of the grave is John Cockroft tipping green.
Sandra
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Sandra,
Can't see wood for trees situation in the real!- so many John Cockfoft and over lapping areas.
The Northowram John's or burial and business.
*******
I'll order this E Rothera 1951 &56 house planning and garages at Hal farm out at the archives to see if any info as to where it is and last hope as if maps don't show it. Youll have to go by the nearest street on the 1851c. on a map (Next few pages either way to Sally widow of John page).
I'll relook Broad st this Broad Tree in Overden again nearest streets.
Tipping Green and Broad street 1841c being the same area as Broad tree! I'll check area district 14 out.as what they sent by Email was the next to it District 13. But Itwas Overden not Halifax area for John.
May be both dead ducks if maps don't show it.
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Hi Dobby,
Well been looking on the Multimap and found threapcroft so I take it not far from there. Went back towards to Whitehill but got lost from there.
Let me know if I am in the right area for Hals this is important.
Sandra
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Hi Sandra,
Left map _Left bottom corner top of WRIGLEY HILL
The Word Berwick is Barrack lane See maps
The 1851 cencus is start -White Hill -Berwich- Upperhall -Yewtree - Yewtree farm - Smith house- Turner house-Twit hall farm-................. Ainley Hill-last
See 1892 MAPS COPY TO PICTURE'S AND TAPE TOGETHER (2 A4 IN TO A 3) See left side and rigt side on to of map
-
See Occupation Road :D in above Map
My working out based on Epistemology only!
John Cockroft Born 27th April 1778 Overden Halifax
Sally/Sarah Midgley bapt 27 MAR 1781 Square chapel Halifax
Marriage 31 Aug 1806 Overden sub parish of St John Halifax
John's Death Unknown To many in GRO Sally's death most likely GRO Deaths 1857 Halifax
1836 burgas Rolls Hailey Hill
1838 " Hailey hill
1842 " Overden
1846 " Overden
1841 census District 20 Overden Morley Halifax
Beard Street John age Weaver of worsted
Family Sally Wife
Ellen Dau 20 Worsted weaver
William son 30 Worsted weaver
Sally Dau 20(?) Worsted weaver
Nanny Dau 15 Worsted Weaver
Route:- All of that part of Overden comprising
(first two letter unreadable **misby. Snowden houses,
Woodhead House, Needle row, Somersales charity, lower fold,
on to Popples road, as far as :D Occupation road :D at Nag Nab and Nabs lane
Street in order
Lower fold Biddian
Beard Steet
Delf Hole
Up School croft
Stanton house
Sunnybank
Spring hall
uppercroft
Twine medh
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Well Sandra thats about best I can do! far more than most on this website. As for John death year its seems there is no answer other than buy all the Death certs. Only hope is Mount zion website to put location to the graves sales. With is 41 res and sibling bapt at Mount zion its most likely they are buried there.
The 1841 c is adult round off age to the nearest 5 years.
Who was their the Milkman and dustbin men were-
As Mavis in Corrie St "I don't really know? Rita"
RDS Dobby
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Hi Dobby,
Ooh you little beauty. Smack on the nail.
I have managed to print off the left side Methodist chapel and top part of occupation lane and top ofJammy Green. but for some reason my computer doesn't like printing from fax.
The are of Hal Farm and Threap Croft I haven't been able to print. Please do not ask me to save to computer, I am not computer literate and not much good at that sort of thin.g
I will ask Wendy, the girl I correspond with , if she can get it from there and sent to me the image.
Good news with this one, if we can prove that William and Charles are brothers of Joseph then I know that in 1881 they were livng together at Pharoah Lane,.
Joseph lived at Ryecroft no. 81, Moseley.
As I was saying when my grandmother had to leave her home in Halifax they gave her a flat in Illingworth.
I visited her there 30 years ago and she took us all around the streets and up the moors she was then 88 years, as strong as a bull.
When I looked on the map yesterday for Jammy Green I found the exact location for where she was living in Illingworth Road, (ie Jammy Green). I have walked those streets without knowing and it was really wierd. My grandmother must have requested going there to live to be with the ancestors.
Dobby you have more than excelled in your line of duty.
Thanks for all your hard work,
Sandra.
ps. If I can't get the images I will draw them from what I have on the computer.
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Hi Dobby,
Forgot to tell you also that the family of Child, accoridng to the 1851 census living at Threap Croft. So tying in nicely at the moment. Lots more research yet.
Sandra
-
Tell Wendy ,
1892 large map
Map 17___ Top of Wrigley hill ----Right side of 200 yards on.White Hill road.
2 nd draw down in the large map drawers at the Halfax library! (Ask Librarian)
-
Sandra
If you have a Digital camera, put best view on your computer screen -the part you want. Wait to night time. Switch off all the light in the room. Switch off your flash on the camera and photo your computer screen (Map)
Futher back from John will always be Guessing though! as so little info.! in early 1700's and the before 1600's
My dads side are all at Almondbury Huddersfield with gravestones back to 1600's. Halifax St John the same 1600 gravestones. :o
Best of Luck with it.
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Hi Dobby,
Never thought of taking image by camera.
If want to get a copy can I order online at the library in Halifax do you know. I would like a copy anyway.
Snap for Almondbury my Norths are all from there , I managed to get back to 1460 with the help of Andy....
thanks again,
Sandra
-
you beat me by 20 years
mine Adam b 1481
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Hi Dobby
Have sent personal reply.
Sandra
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Oh you a gem, hope you can findthem.
I have John Cockroft born Halifax,but could be Ovenden 1776. He died sometime between 1841 and 1851. He is not ont he 1861 census so assume he died then. His wife
Sally born around the same time.
Joseph Cockroft , born 1815 his son and joseph's wife
Betty born 1820.
Would be grateful if you can find them.
Sandra
Hi Sandra.
Standing in for Bumble B while on holiday
Got to thinking !you know' (Painful! bats in yond church bellfry) as one does'! where be the nearest churchyard to yond Hal farm! ;D
Anyway first! I found the original 1951 & 1956 Hal farm in the WYAS archives and its Lower Hal farm from the garages survey map! copy right would not let me copy. Barrack farm and Hal farm are as one!
...................
Illingworth church yard! St Marys Angilcan church! 400 yards from Hal farm.
West Yorkshire archives Wakefield-TS/SMI Inscriptions in the graveyard of St Mary's church of Illingworth, Ogden & Overden
Grave no 48
Epitaph Mi.
"Ann wife of John Cockroft of Overden died 1800 aged 24 years
John son of the above John Cockroft died 20 May 1826 age 17 years
Grace Cockroft of the above John died 1840 aged 28 years
Above John Cockroft died 7 Oct 1850 age 76 years
Sarah relick (Widow) of John Cockroft died 30th march 1852 age 74 years
-
HAL FARM as 1951-1956 Planning Survey
-
Resent as requested
Click "Resent" tag in blue below photo map and copy from that
-
hard to photo flat stones but more readable in black & white
-
Sanda
Think this post Completed now!.
Dobby
Over and Out
Going
Gone!
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Hi Dobby,
Love that scripture on the headstone.
My thanks to you and everyone. You have more than exceeded in your line of duty. God Bless you and everyone on Rootschat.
Will keep in touch on e mail.
Sandra
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Sandra put the word in capitals COMPLETED on your no 1 or first post in modify on page 1Catching up :'( on house work! ;D ;D ;D off to Warwick tomorrow :D.
Will sort out Photos and other stuff when your computer and printer are fixed. DECLUTTER all unwanted doc's on it.
Will post you the important ones now. :D
Photos Later.
I can still use Roots and my email down in Warwick!
Dobby :)
-
San
Now back home in Yorkshire
Going to sort these Cockroft's out once and for all
will send results/update by land post in Feb 2010.
Dobby (Dave)
-
Looking forward to that Dave. You sound like a man with a mission.
Thanks,
Sandra
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Hi San
Own ancestry!
No! fed up of looking at ag labs! in Warwick! Snore!ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzz! at archives down there!
MOO!
Dobby
-
:-[
I am trying to find the whereabouts of my friends grandfather Joe and his brother, the family name is Midgley and I believe they were buried in the garveyard at King Cross Methodist church Halifax, but as others have found the graveyard is so overgrown a general search is impossible, however if I have a specific area I will find it
Thanks
Pete B
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Hi peter,
If you give me a date of death i will look on saturday for the burial
and the rough location ( i have a plot photograph )
and let you know where abouts in the graveyard it is, providing it is not in the oldest part which i have not yet decided how the numbering system worked.
Regards,
Andy
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Hello Peter,
Welcome to roots chat! I'll Let Andy deal with this! but as he says! Post as much info as you can for Andy.
Really it best to start your own post tread on from the forum Board- England-West Yorkshire-Look up reguest- New topic!
This way more people will see your request.
Regards Dobby
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Hi Sandra.
Your Cockrofts date back to
John Cockecrofte
Birth: About 1515 Of, Ovenden Halifax, Yorkshire, England
Marriage
Spouse Agnes Jackson
18 JAN 1539 Halifax, Yorkshire, England
John Cockecrofte
Birth: 16 JUN 1549 Ovenden, Halifax, Yorkshire, England
Parents
Father John Cockecrofte
Mother Agnes Jackson
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Thanks Dave,
Sandra
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Another Gravestone image
Think its one of yours
-
We Try
-
We Try
Very hard :) ;)
Nice photo Dob's :)
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Hi Libby
12 people in an* est*y dot thing-ie have trees with Joe & Betty and are going bonkers over this photo. I just asked some teenages if they ever had seen Joe and Betty's grave - ' Yer! follow me' a lad said.
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Well, Dob's, talk about being in the right place at the right time :) Good for the lad - if only he knew how happy he's made a lot of people ;D
Fantastic outcome, and a lovely photo of a very well preserved headstone, well done :)
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yes
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Halfax Library building WYAS
St Mary church yard Illingworth Ovenden Halifax West Yorkhire Memorial inscriptions
John Cock(C)roft B 1746/7 (son of Jonathan Cockroft b 1726 son of Joseph born 1707/8 of Joshua) Illingworth Married Frances (Phanny as MI below) Sutcliffe 27 March 1769 Halifax
Graves numbers 250 and 251 Graves of Jonathan Cockroft.(Owner)
Grave 250
John Cockroft of Ovenden died 17-01-1717 AGE 58 (Brother of Joshua Gt Grandad of John Cockroft b 1746/7 of Jonathan)
Mar his wife died 14-09-1743 age 68
Isaac son of Joshua their grandson died 14-09-1760 age 1 year
Patty his daughter died20-03-1760
age 3
Elizabeth daughter of Joshua Cockroft died 31-03-1783 age 15
Thomas his son died 17-04-1763 age (no age)
Joshua their father died 29-12-1801 age 70
grave 251
Mary wife of Michael Sheard of Mixenden died 25-04-1736 age 57
John son of Jonathan Cockroft died 21-12-1743 age 3 weeks
Sarah wife of John Cockroft died 23-04 1765 age 69
Phanny wife of John Cockroft 29-05 1810 age 70
Above John Cockroft died 17-05-1832 age 85 he was the pew opener for 57 years
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Halfax Library building WYAS
St Mary church yard Illingworth Ovenden Halifax West Yorkhire Memorial inscriptions
John Cock(C)roft B 1746/7 (son of Jonathan Cockroft b 1726 son of Joseph born 1707/8 of Joshua) Illingworth Married Frances (Phanny as MI below) Sutcliffe 27 March 1769 Halifax
Graves numbers 250 and 251 Graves of Jonathan Cockroft.(Owner)
Grave 250
John Cockroft of Ovenden died 17-01-1717 AGE 58 (Brother of Joshus Gt Grandad of John Cockroft b 1746/7 of Jonathan)
Mar his wife died 14-09-1743 age 68
Isaac son of Joshua their grandson died 14-09-1760 age 1 yearPatty his daughter died20-03-1760
age 3
Elizabeth daughter of Joshua Cockroft died 31-03-1783 age 15
Thomas his son died 17-04-1763 age (no age)
Joshua their father died 29-12-1801 age 70
grave 251
Mary wife of Michael Sheard of Mixenden died 25-04-1736 age 57
John son of Jonathan Cockroft died 21-12-1743 age 3 weeks
Sarah wife of John Cockroft died 23-04 1765 age 69
Phanny wife of John Cockroft 29-05 1810 age 70
Above John Cockroft died 17-05-1832 age 85 he was the pew opener for 57 years
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Hi Sandra bit more info
Your Grandparents Joseph Cockroft North and wife Amy.
Gave number 118 section B in Kings Cross Wesleyan Methodist Chapel graveyard Halifax West Yorkshire
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Hi Sandra and everyone,
if you dont know where the grave is i can point you in the right direction, it is fairly easy to find.
Will photograph it if you wish.
Regards,
Andy
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Hi Drew,
It would be a massive help!! for Sandra! as it's very unlikely she'll ever come to Yorkshire (Heath wise) I have never visited Kings Cross graveyard and it will take me a month of Sundays to find it! so If you can find the grave. I think we all would be very appreciated but more by Sandra,
Dave from Huddersfield (West)
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Hi Dave,
You've made my day with these finds. Thanks again,
Andy, I would dearly love photos, and I was told that the graveyard at KingCross very overgrown. You will need to take a machette with you methinks.
Sandra
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Hi sandra,
I have looked for the grave and although i found the site there is sadly no stone.
They have been felling trees lateley and a pile of logs is actually on the gravesite!!
I have checked the records for burials and there were only 2 people buried in this particular grave, 118 Sedction B i have photos of the records.
If you P M me i will attach them as they are too big to put on here if you want the photo of the grave as well let me know.
regards,
Andy
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Hi Andy,
How do I PM you please. Sandra
-
andra,
I have sent you one.
Andy
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Hi Andy,
Hope you got it ok.]
Sandra
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Hi Sandra
As there is no headstone -I've done an image Memorial
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Dobby,
Loveley memorial, pity they left the logs there.
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Hi Andy.
Its a another type of grave natural something and better than a flat nothing. If a poster board said "by Moore" by it (Bettan Hall) it would be inundate with visitors. I am in contact with Sandra by email most days but posted on roots our basic views for other researchers of this family. Grave was found easy by your posts and grave 122
May see you on the ancestry track! around Halifax.
Dave (Dobby)
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Hi, I was reading your posts regarding the search for John Cockcroft and I think he may be related to my family. I'm descended from Matthew Cockcroft, who was the son of Joshua Cockcroft and Mary Pickles from Illingworth. He was born in the early 1760s. I have to look up which church he was baptized in. I believe he had two brothers...Isaac and Joshua... and a sister named Betty. Matthew and his wife Hannah have five kids....John, Jacob, Betty, Sarah, and Sally. I think the children were baptized in the New Connection church in Ovenden.
I believe that Joshua might have been the son of a John or Jonathan and I'm wondering if there might be a connection between my family and your John. Do you think this could be possible? Matthew joined the military and left in 1794 or 1796 to fight in the Irish Rebellion in 1798. He remarried a local girl sometime in the early 1800s and settled down in Newtownards, county down.
I'd appreciate any help you could provide! Thanks....Cindy
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Hi Cindy
Off hand I think Joshua Cockroft b 1724 died as an infant of John and Joshua Cockroft b 1732 John's next child called Joshua was the 1757 Joshua Marriage.
He will be connected futher back to Sandra's lot
Hope it Helps
Dave
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Dave,
Thank you so much for your feedback. I'm really hoping that I can link into Sandra's family....you and she have done a super job researching the family in the Illingworth area!
I was wondering if you might be able to answer one more question for me. Matthew's children (born in the 1780s and early 1790s) are listed as being baptized in both the Zion Methodist New Connexion church in Ovenden and the South Parade Wesleyan church in Halifax. The dates in both churches are identical. Was there a connection between the two?
Thank you again for your thoughts!
Cindy
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Hi Cindy,
Sandra is in the middle of extencive building work on her house- hence I have anwsered. It was more her incredable good luck with Gravestone finds! as she repeated this with her North Family that took her tree back finding one with 3 generations on. She'll be back online next week and maybe she will be able to help you more as I only path find back on the main line. She has loads of info! so fingers crossed.
Regards Dave
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Hi Dave and Cindy,
Just on for today and tomorrow and builders back on
Tuesday and finishing up by Friday . patio doors in so major work completed just plasterboarding to finish.
Of course clean up anothr week or so after, but at least I will have my house back. If I survive that long.
Cindy will have to let you know info when I can get to files. After 60 you can forget anything by memory. Dave an you give Cindy my address please.
Hope you enjoying your hols Dave.
Thanks for holding the fort for me.
Sandra
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Hi Dave and Sandra,
Thank you both for responding so quickly. I look forward to working with you to possibly add another branch to the Cockcroft family tree in Illingsworth! My branch of the family ends up leaving England around 1796 to fight in the Irish rebellion in County Down in 1798. We spent 4 or 5 generations in Ireland and then emigrated to the U.S....mostly settling in the New York/New Jersey area.
There is a mystery surrounding our family's origin in England. According to the story Matthew shared with his relatives, he was from the Flamborough or Bridlington area. However, there is no trace of a Matthew being born in East Riding. We feel that there is a strong possibility that our Matthew is the one born in the Illingsworth/Ovenden area and that for some reason the story was not told accurately. There are birth records for five children born to Matthew and Hannah Cockcroft in the late 1780 and early 1790s in the Ovenden area. We suspect that Matthew's marriage in Ireland could have been his second and that he could possibly have still been married to Hannah. If this was the case, maybe he purposely misrepresented his birthplace. Of course this is still all guesswork at this point!
Anyway, I look forward to hearing from you once the dust settles!!!
Cindy
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Sandra
I have sent Cindy your Email address
Dave
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Hi Dave,
Thanks for that. will have to look all this up when I can get to the files.
Sandra
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Hello Cindy.
I don't wont to get to involed with this as it not my family! only helping Sandra! but your research seems to be ? either you are or your roots are from the USA back though Ireland to England. One of the common assumptions made by people from the USA is the distance in the US being large country and our small country in England! but though to you Bridlington is not far from Halifax in USA terms -too us or more them days was quite distance. Halifax people were hill land farmers of Cattle /sheep & Weavers of Wool or Silk and most Coast people were flat land farmers of Grain/Veg/fodder and fishermen. Thus if your Mathew Cockroft was from Bridlington Hull area I would try and contact the Family History societies in Hull to check the parish registers for another Mathew Cockroft.
Dave
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Hi Dave and Sandra,
Thanks for the comparison between East and West Riding...it gives me a lot to consider. I went ahead and posted a lookup request for the Flamborough area. Will see what happens. I'm not too hopeful since I believe a relative might have commissioned some research in that area a few years back and it did not reveal any Matthews. To tell you the truth, I can only find one documented birth of a Matthew Cockcroft for that time frame and it's the one in Illingworth.
Matthew just does not seem to be a family name for the Cockcrofts or the Pickles. The Matthew Cockcroft born in 1776 in York, that's listed on the Family Search database, is not sourced. It was placed on the database by another one of my relatives but it is based on an assumption of his approximate age at enlistment and the family legend that he was born in the York area.
The name of Matthew's first son in England is Jacob, which also does not seem to be a family name. His children in Ireland were named Robert, Matilda, and Jane.
I understand that Matthew and his children were involved in the lead mining industry. Is that more prevalent in the West Riding area? I believe he was considered a laborer but his daughter in Ireland supposedly married a miner, so he may have been working in the lead mines. Unfortunately, the daughter moved to the U.S. or Canada and was never heard from again.
Thanks again for your help...your perspectives on the Halifax area are extremely helpful!
Cindy
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Hi Cindy
What year was Robert Cockroft born in Ireland if Sally was baptised in 1793, so if Robert was born after? about 1796 ish in Irland it would seem it is the Halfax Mathew but if he was born before 1793 then he's not yours
There is Mathew born in Illingworth in 1762 who married in Halifax St John in 1785 (in find my past website) so not him. and this Matthew (doulbe tt) was an Apprentice weaver in Ovenden
http://www.calmview.eu/WY/dserve.exe?&dsqIni=dserve.ini&dsqApp=Archive&dsqCmd=show.tcl&dsqDb=Catalog&dsqPos=0&dsqSearch=((text)='matthew%20cockroft')
If the link does not come up
use the link and enter Matthew Cockroft (double TT in Matthew)) in search
Also enter Cawcroft and click the Calderdale entries on the page list that comes up and see Cawcroft taken as Cockroft
http://www.calmview.eu/WY/DServe.exe?dsqApp=Archive&dsqDb=Catalog&dsqCmd=Search.tcl
As Jesse was born in 1779 and Mathew Cock(Caw)roft married 1776 in Kirkheaton and Mathew b 1747 Kirkheaton
Kirkheaton (West Heaton [Westheton]) is in the Colnebridge and Brighouse area and Ovenden moor is above Brighouse at Northowram/ Queensbury of Halifax area
and did have Coal and Iron ore mining
http://kirkheatonnetwork.co.uk/history.html
Last the b 1762 Mathew Illingworth would be too young for the 1779 birth/bapt of Jesse and if he was! his marriage would be by Licence by bond allegation
Dave
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Hi Dave and Sandra,
Dave, thank you for your replies. I hope I'm not infringing on your time and generosity. If it's more convenient, I can wait until Sandra is back online. It seems like every answer brings about more questions and it is very exciting to speak with two people who are so knowledgeable about the area/history. Nevertheless, I don't want to put you or Sandra on the spot. Let me know when enough is enough!!!!
I must say that it still is not clear if the Illingworth Matthew is the one. According to his attestation papers, Matthew volunteered for the military in January 1795, so he could be the father of Sally and the other four children. On one of the children's birth records, I think it's John's, it's noted in the margin that he is the son of a pauper. Would a weaver's apprentice be considered a pauper or is it possible that he did not succeed in weaving?
The birth date for Matthew's first son in Ireland is not clear due to the destruction of all of the early County Down records in the Dublin fire of 1922. The first Robert that we can document died in 1878 at the age of 51, which means he would have been born in 1827. Some family members feel that the age on the death certificate is not correct and he may have been ten years older, meaning he would have been born in 1817. I'm of the opinion that there is an earlier generation, an earlier child born in the early 1800s. Since the records no longer exist, we'll probably never be able to answer that question.
Interestingly, one of Sandra's gravestones has created another mystery. We know that two weeks after Matthew enlisted, an Isaac signed up for the same regiment. We always assumed it was Matthew's brother, the one born in 1759. However, according to the gravestone, that Isaac died in 1760 at the age of 1. So now we have two mysteries, who is Matthew and is he related to Isaac!
I guess what I need to do is find out whether or not there is a death certificate for the Illingworth Matthew. I've done a lot of research using the BMDs for the non-conformist churches held by the National Archives. Unfortunately, the death records do not seem to be complete. Is there an archive somewhere for the Mt. Zion New Connexion and the South Parade churches? I've checked the purchasing records for the burial ground at Mt Zion but do not see anything there.
Thanks again for all your help. Please let me know if I can do any research for either of you. I'm in the U.S.
Cindy
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HI Cindy,
Just been reading what you said about Isaac .
Dave this is your post dobfarm on Friday 26th march 10 19.20 gmt .
It reads St. mARY Church yard illingworth Ovenden Halifax.
Memorial isncriptions.
John Cockroft B 1746/7 (son of Jonathan Cockroft b 1726 son of Joseph bornf 1707/8 of Joshua)
Marired Frances Sutlciffe 27.mar 1769. Hal.
Grave numbers 250 and 251 graves of Jonathan Cockroft owner.
Grave 250
John cockroft of Ovenden died 17.01.1717 aged 58 Brother of Joshua gt grandad of John Cockroft b 1746/7 of Jonathan.
Mar his wife died 14.9.1743 age 68
Isaac son of Joshua thier grandson died 14.9.1760 age 1 year Patty his daughter died 20.3 1760.aged 3.
Elizabeth dau of Joshua Cockroft died 31.3.1783 age 15
Thomas hsi son died 17.4. 1763 ag (no age)
Joshua thier father died 29.12.01 age 70.
grave 251
is my John Cockroft pew opener died 17.05.1832.
Dave I think that this is the connection with Isaac.
I can't get at my records, do you recall this
Where would Jacob, son of Matthew fit into this please?
Sandra
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Hi Cindy,
To be blunt! I think its a case of the fitting a square peg in a round hole or visa versa.
Your not sure where Mathew came from! you are saying Robert born 1817 to 1827 from his death age and the Dublin records are missing or incomplete. If it was the Mathew father of Jesse b 1779 then- Robert would have been born 38 to 48 years later so either Mathews wife was about 20 years old Jesse's birth when she had Jesse in 1779 and 59 in 1817-69 years old in 1827 when she had Robert and by the time she Jane she would be in her 70's.
You seem a nice person and we would have liked to have helped you but the is nothing positive your saying that we can work from and thus have to say we can not help you!
All too vague! unless Mathew married a 2nd wife a lot younger in Ireland post 1793 (Sally's Bap)
I guessing Mathew was born 1790 to 1800 East Yorkshire thus again contact Hull FHS
Regards Dave
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PS Try This Cindy.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,358572.msg2355293.html#msg2355293
Dave
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Halfax Library building WYAS
St Mary church yard Illingworth Ovenden Halifax West Yorkhire Memorial inscriptions
John Cock(C)roft B 1746/7 (son of Jonathan Cockroft b 1726 son of Joseph born 1707/8 of Joshua) Illingworth Married Frances (Phanny as MI below) Sutcliffe 27 March 1769 Halifax
Graves numbers 250 and 251 Graves of Jonathan Cockroft.(Owner)
Grave 250
John Cockroft of Ovenden died 17-01-1717 AGE 58 (Brother of Joshua Gt Grandad of John Cockroft b 1746/7 of Jonathan)
Mar his wife died 14-09-1743 age 68
Isaac son of Joshua their grandson died 14-09-1760 age 1 year
Patty his daughter died20-03-1760
age 3
Elizabeth daughter of Joshua Cockroft died 31-03-1783 age 15
Thomas his son died 17-04-1763 age (no age)
Joshua their father died 29-12-1801 age 70
grave 251
Mary wife of Michael Sheard of Mixenden died 25-04-1736 age 57
John son of Jonathan Cockroft died 21-12-1743 age 3 weeks
Sarah wife of John Cockroft died 23-04 1765 age 69
Phanny wife of John Cockroft 29-05 1810 age 70
Above John Cockroft died 17-05-1832 age 85 he was the pew opener for 57 years
Hi Sandra This what I put
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Hi Cindy,
Managed to get to files and no Matthew connected to my John Cockroft 1773 Illingworth.
Sorry not able to help further.
Sandra
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Sandra and Dave,
Thank you for all your help and insight. I appreciate all the info you've shared. Currently traveling, but will try the scavenger hunt when I return. Hopefully, we'll someday solve the mystery!
Thanks again,
Cindy
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Hi Cindy,
No problem,
Sandra
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Hi. Cindy
Been nice corresponding with you ! I'll keep you in mind on my next visit to Halifax and any other venues like York Uni Borthwick archives etc.
Good Hunting
from England and Wales (Sandra)
Dave
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ST Mary Graveyard Illingworth
GRAVE STONE 251
IN MEMORY
Mary wife of Michael Sheard of Mixenden died 25-04-1736 age 57
John son of Jonathan Cockroft died 21-12-1743 age 3 weeks
Sarah wife of John Cockroft died 23-04 1765 age 69
Phanny wife of John Cockroft 29-05 1810 age 70
Above John Cockroft died 17-05-1832 age 85 (B 1746/7)
he was the pew opener for 57 years
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St Mary Church graveyard Illingworth Halifax
Grave 250
IN MEMORY
John Cockroft of Ovenden died 17-01-1717 AGE 58
Mary his wife died 14-09-1743 age 68
Isaac son of Joshua their grandson died 14-09-1760 age 1 year Patty his
daugher died 20-03-1760 aged 3
Elizabeth daughter of Joshua Cockroft died 31-03-1783 age 15
Thomas his son died 17-04-1763 age (no age)
Joshua their father died 29-12-1801 age 70
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Thanks Dave,
]Sandra
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Sandra
Just Post simple proved findings now on this link.
It will makes it easier for other posters to understand
Dave
For other readers
We all use IGI and free bmd GRO website
If you have any GRO cert info please put in on the free postems on the free GRO website
Its not always a easy decision to make after paying £9 out but if someone had posted their GRO cert info it may have saved you £9 so its swings and roundabouts
Also similar Parish register or Newspaper BMD records of GRO events
can be posted on these GRO postems.
Grave Memoriel Inscriptions or if you see an odd grave dated after 1837 post in free bmd's website
This is an example only
http://www2.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/CreatePostem.pl?d=bmd_1283811321&r=29913916
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Hi Sandra,
Latest update of probable route back from John Cockroft b 1773
John Cockroft 1773 father John
John above m Sarah Midgley 1806
John Cockroft 1747/8 father Jonathan
John Cockroft above m Frances sutcliffe. (sexton) 1769
Jonathan b 1726 father Joseph
Jonathan Cockroft above m Phebe Webster 1742
Joseph Cockroft b 1708 father Joshua
Joseph Cockroft above married Martha Priestley 1724
Joshua birth unknown? aprox 1685 ish unlce of Joshua b 1731 below in grave 250 from Grave 250 and 251 and Joshua family name suspect Father John Cockroft b 1659 died 1717
Joshua Cockroft above married Matha Firth 1706 Elland/Bighouse> Woodhouse
problable sister
Margerat Cockroft b 1787 Father John in Elland parish adode Woodhouse Brighouse
probale brother
John Cockroft b 1659 d 1717 had a son John Cockroft a bother of Margerat above! (Birth Year Unknown) who married Sarah who died 1765 aged 69 b 1796
Spotland & Ovenden, co.York - settlement John Cockcroft, Sarah his wife and Mary,Joshua (b 1731 died 1801 age 70 Grandson of John b1659-d 1717) , Sarah, John and James their children ( from Lancashire Archives)
John and Ann moved to Warley post 1787 no more sibling born in Elland post 1787
John Cockroft b 1759 -d 1717 age 58 father Christopher Cockroft
John Cockroft above m Ann Taylor 1785 by Licence Allegation Elland/Bighouse Woodhouse Ann died 1708 Warley in child birth
John Cocktroft above 2nd marriage to Mary year unknown-Mary died 1743 aged 68
Christopher Cockroft b 1639 Heptonstall father Henry
No Marriage known as yet for Christopher
There are too many Henry's bapt 1600 +/- 20 year to say which one was Christopher's father
.........................................................................................................................
Other Possible route back is the Joshua b 1670 in Ance*try.co but seems a bit too old to father Joseph b 1708 but can't be ruled out.
............................................................................................................................
I'll see if there are any other possible Joshua Cock(C)roft b 1685ish possible routes back or Baptisms.
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Hi Dave,
Have noted your comments.
thanks again,
Sandra
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This is speculation only
Cromwell Times
Christopher Cockcroft bapt 1639 Heptonstall
Union of Xpofer Hernici Cowrofte X Elzia Hays or Haws 1657
Liz's father John of Popples
Deciphered from
Source Yorkshire Wills
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Hi Dave,
Looks like I have replied ok. Don't know if you know or not but there are two Popples, one in Ovenden and one in
Heptonstall.
Sandra
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Hi Dave,
Looks like I have replied ok. Don't know if you know or not but there are two Popples, one in Ovenden and one in
Heptonstall.
Sandra
Think Popples is by Henry -father of Christopher b 1639 (Xpoher) Heptonstall abode Woodhouse Warley John father Christopher 1659 Elland abode Woodhouse Warley !his son Joshua b 1685 was bapized in Halifax St John abode Warley! it could be either but suspect Illingworth is nearer at Treapcroft, Barrack and Hal -farms in Popples Illingworth also Hey (Hay) family are from Illingworth
Heptonstall and Elland seem to be the churchs used by the Cock(C)roft families depending on time of year and weather for BMD's but also Halifax st John before St Mary Illingworth Church started
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Hi Dave,
Got that ok. Think everything is running smoothly now.
thanks,
Sandra
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Woodhouse Lane and Farm, Scares bottom Ovenden
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hI Dave,
Haven't heard of Farm Scares Bottom, Ovenden.
Sandra
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hI Dave,
Haven't heard of Farm Scares Bottom, Ovenden.
Sandra
Put this in google maps 'woodhouse lane skircoat halifax'
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ok Dave,thanks,
Sa ndra
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Hello Sandra
Your Welcome !
Dave
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Hi Dave,
Getting you loud and clear now. Marvellous. thanks
Sandra
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For other readers Sandra was having tech problems with getting 'Alerts' of posts.
Now resolved
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Hi Dave,
All working well now thanks again.
Sandra
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If you give me names, I'll have a look on my MI disc for Halifax churches. And I've got connections with a Cockroft family from Ovenden - Betty and Harriet Cockroft both married John Appleyard ::) They were all buried at Nursery Lane Methodists in Ovenden. Betty and Harriet were daughters of Andrew and Mary.
BumbleB
Your MI disc looks to have some interesting information. Can you tell me if this covers the whole country or just Halifax and where could I get one?
Many thanks
Ginger
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Hi Gingernut,
This is an old thread on bumble b tread reply and many emails have past between us offline being Bumble b, Sandra and myself since .
I have done alot of work in Halifax for Sandra and Bumble b family history
Bumble b has done most of my family ancestry in Warwick also Sandra is working on the Derbyshire side of my family.
Also Bumble b and Sandra communicate on their own families off line.
All 'tit for tat stuff!'
We only put info on Rootschat for other people who maybe doing these families or researching them -now or lose email contact by computer technical communication problems
But thanks for bringing this to our attention.
Dave
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If you give me names, I'll have a look on my MI disc for Halifax churches. And I've got connections with a Cockroft family from Ovenden - Betty and Harriet Cockroft both married John Appleyard ::) They were all buried at Nursery Lane Methodists in Ovenden. Betty and Harriet were daughters of Andrew and Mary.
BumbleB
Your MI disc looks to have some interesting information. Can you tell me if this covers the whole country or just Halifax and where could I get one?
Many thanks
Ginger
Bumble B is in Australia at the moment but I will email her on her return to the UK to remind her to answer your query at the end of November.
Dave
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Hi all,
Calderdale family history society publish the MI's for about 40 graveyards in the Halifax area, they are available through
http://www.genfair.co.uk/
the calderdale website is here http://www.cfhsweb.com/
Andy
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Thanks Dobfarm - hope BumbleB is having a nice time ! wish I was there..
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Hi Gin
Your best! way ;) is to PM Bumble b yourself as she has Email access in Australia and is ancestry mad like the rest of us! :-[ so won't mind you contacting her with your query. She has a lot of Halifax knowledge & can tell you her resources of her own stock also be able to tell when she will be back.
:)
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hi Sandra, (and Dobby)
I'm not sure if you resolved your original question or not ? I have re-read the first half dozen pages of this thread and it seemed that you were chasing about over most of West Yorkshire and that was the main reason that I stopped following the thread ages ago.
Let me explain my interest My 3x great uncle Joseph Lightowler married Hannah Cockroft in Halifax 27 Jun 1814 both OTP. Joseph lived in Northowram - next to Ovenden. As far as I can make out Hannah was born 1793 and was baptised at Pellon Lane baptist, dau of Thomas and Hannah, she had a sister Harriet b 1787.
In 1841 the Lightowler family lived at Crow Point Northowram and next door was a Betty Cockroft age 30 (rounded down ?)
The burials of my family were very elusive but in Bradford Library I found reference to them being buried at Ambler Thorne Methodist Chapel Queensbury, in a book of burials and MI's that an historian had hand written. (Some of the MI's had been copied from Arthur Blackburn's records).
If you have come across any of my Cockroft family in your search I would welcome any new info.
Dave
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Hi Dave,
I'll leave you with Sandra!
We have have taken Sandra's family deep rooted tree back to the 15th century with the her North and Cockroft surnames with Wills-MI's PR's-Deeds -leases, abodes and many more. Sandra is fully conversant now and maybe able too help you.
For myself I'm doing my own family research! also one off selected (No blanked [unknown date outside 3 month peramiter limits] searches) PR lookups for rootschat posters off the boards only and Sandra's other Surnames in between and cannot take any more personal family overhaul research cases.
Dobby
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Hi there Dave the Tyke,
Both Dobby and myself have traced my Cockrofts of Ovenden and see I see no conection to your tree. I do hope that others will be able to link in and help you with your quest.
Happy hunting,]Sandra
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OK thanks Sandra and Dobby
I'll leave that line for the moment - plenty of other avenues to explore
Dave
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Hi Sandra,
,
You and Dobby helped me a while back when I was researching my ancestor Matthew Cockcroft, who left England as a soldier and eventually settled in Ireland. I have finally found a document that I think links the Matthew born in Illingworth in 1762 to my ancestor who ended up in County Down. I also believe that my branch of the Cockcroft family from Ovenden is connected to yours in the following manner:
Matthew -- born 1762- father is Joshua according to the birth record (siblings are Betty born 1757, Isaac born 1760, Joshua born 1766)
Joshua - The only Joshua I can find born in the Ovenden area during the right time is the one born in 1731 to a John. I believe this Joshua is the one who is buried in the grave #250 or 251, that you mentioned earlier in this thread. That Joshua mentioned on the gravestone (who is said to be the grandson of John born in 1659) died at age 70 in 1801, which matches perfectly with the Joshua born in 1731. Furthermore, I think that Matthew's sister Betty is really the Patty buried in the same grave in 1760 (age 3) and his brother Isaac is also buried there in 1760 at the age of 1)
John - I can't find the birth record for a John around 1690-1710 in the right area, however, you reference a John who marries a Sarah (born 1696) and is relocated with his family....including Joshua....from Spotland to Ovenden. I think this John could be the brother of your Joshua born in 1685. They would both be the offspring of the John born 1659 and died 1717.
I'm still trying to figure out why my Matthew mentioned that his family originated in the Flamborough/Bridlington area but I have a hunch. If our Cockcroft family originated in the Wadsworth area could it be possible that they are linked to the famous Caleb Cockcroft who married Elizabeth Oxenbridge and died in London in around 1645? In his will, that Caleb left money to the poor men in Heptonstall and Wadsworth, so he may have been born in that area. I've seen mention of a Caleb born to a Caleb in London in 1636. I'm wondering what became of this second Caleb. Perhaps he went to the Flamborough area at some point. Since the elder Caleb (who married Elizabeth Oxenbridge) was a Merchant Adventurer, he would have been connected with shipping, so his son could have gone to a coastal town like Flamborough. Plus there is at least one Caleb born in Flamborough in the 1700s. It's a long shot, but one that I'm now trying to research!
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Hi Cindy
Sandra has put her records to bed on the Cockroft's and I cleared mine out in a declutter otherwise I'd be inundated.
From records on here its seems you maybe on to something! also that far back anything is possible so keep researching.
Since your last visit on here West Yorkshire archives have put all their parish registers online in Ancestry.com/com aug/co.uk.(Many not in the IGI index) You can see them in most libraries worldwide and that have free public computers free use, Ancestry library edition or Join Ancestry as a paying member at home.
My immediate Granddad always said is family came from Leek in Staffordshire but found out his dad came from Temple Balsall Warwickshire but later found his brother went to live in Staffordshire. This maybe the case with you! ??? a side shoot going to the east Yorkshire coast.
Graveyards are full of ancestors with statements like 'of this town but formally of another town'
Its a question of what is proved to you and accept. :) and what others can't disprove different :-[ back in pre 1750 days with so little info or census.
So keep up what you are doing and have faith! ;)
Dobby
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Dobby,
Thank you so very much for your help! You and Sandra have given me so many great ideas and I've really enjoyed corresponding with you! Please let me know if I can be of assistance with your research.
Cindy