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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Buckinghamshire Lookup Requests => Buckinghamshire => England => Buckinghamshire Completed Look ups => Topic started by: Ceeoh on Friday 03 July 09 20:49 BST (UK)
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Sorry if this is a repeat request, PC gave me an error report.
Looking for the marriage of John Carr to Sophia (surname unknown)
Their first child was Martha baptised 24 February 1833 Lane End
1841 through to 1871 census John and Sophia are in Wycombe, Bucks.
1881 Sophia now a widow John having died 1880, she is at Lane End, Ditchfield
With those stats I would assume they married in the area.
Any help would be most appreciated.
Ceeoh
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Hi Ceeoh,
The church of Lane End Holy Trinity was opened in 1832 with the first marriage taking place on 23 December 1832 between John Cutler and Mary Keen. John did not marry here.
If you need more info then here is some:
Martha b. 24 Jan 1833
George b. 11 Nov 1835
William b. 2 Jul 1838
Helen b. 31 Jul 1841
John b. 16 Feb 1844
Charles b. 20 Jul 1847
Anne b. 14 Jan 1851
John's occupation was Labourer, his address Ditchfield Common
Sophia Carr was buried 20 Oct 1884 at Lane End, aged 79 of HWycombe
John carr was buried 2 Oct 1880 at Lane End, aged 77 of Ditchfield Common
This seems to be George (the son)'s marrige at Lane End:
George CARR, full age, bachelor, Labourer of Lane End, son of John Carr, Bricklayer married Ruth X TAYLOR, full age, spinster of Lane End, daughter of Charles Taylor, deceased, Labourer Witnesses: William Carr, John Harding Sharp
Notes: Banns not found
William X CARR, 24, bachelor, Chairmaker of Lane End, son of John Carr, Bricklayer married Elisabeth BLACKWELL, 19, spinster, Lacemaker of Lane End, daughter of Richard Blackwell, Wheelwright by Banns Witnesses: Thomas Fletcher, Sarah Blackwell
John X CARR, 22, bachelor, Chairmaker of Lane End, son of John Carr, Bricklayer married Hannah X OXLADE, 22, spinster, Lacemaker of Lane End, daughter of William Oxlade, Brickmaker by Banns Witnesses: Daniel X Oxlade, Jane X Oxlade
Charles BIRD, 22, bachelor, Chairmaker of Lane End, son of Joseph Bird, Tailor married Ann CARR, 20, spinster of Lane End, daughter of John Carr, Bricklayer by Banns Witnesses: Frederick Goodchild, Sarah Jane Gray
Matt
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Sorry I had to do this in two messages internet playing up.
Daniel X OXLADE, full age, bachelor, Brickmaker of Wheeler End, son of William Oxlade, Brickmaker married Ellen X CARR, full age, spinster, Lacemaker of Ditchfield, daughter of John Carr, Bricklayer by Banns Witnesses: John Carr, Hannah Oxlade
Oh and now i realise I forgot to put on the dates for the marriages:
11 Dec 1858
23 sep 1862
11 Mar 1866
24 Oct 1871
21 Mar 1863
And I can find these as their kids:
Baptism 15 Feb 1863 Elizabeth Ellen daughter of William & Elizabeth CARR of Ditchfields, Chairmaker
Baptism 15 Jul 1860 Jane daughter of George & Ruth CARR of Speen, Bucks, Labourer
Again internet playing up so will have to finish for tonight.
Hope this helps
Matt
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Many thanks for all the info most appreciated. 1881 shows Sophia as born West Wycombe, Bucks. If John and Sophia married prior to the opening of Lane End Holy Trinity can you suggest where they might have married please as it appears their children were baptised at Lane End and I see John and Sophia were buried there. Lane End seems to have played a major part in their lives and those of their children.
I don't know the area at all.
Someone sent me an IGI reference C109691 but I don't know what it refers to and John and Sophia don't appear to be on the IGI.
Would love to know Sophia's maiden name and the date they married!
Regards
Margaret (Ceeoh)
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Margaret,
Lane End was (it is now a parish from 1968) a village fromed out of the parishes of Great Marlow (about 4 Miles away from Lane end), Lewknor Uphill (a detatched part of Oxon), Fingest (2 miles away), West Wycombe (about 2-3 miles away) and Hambleden (about 4 miles away). Other nearby villages are Moor Common, Bolter; Cadmore; Wheeler; Moor; and Bourne Ends, Booker and Frieth.
I think this could be their marriage but it could be a bit early...
John Carr & Sophia Easden 07 Aug 1825 West Wycombe Bucks.
Also any children born before 1832 would be on the census returns, wouldn't they... unless Martha was the first and they just waited. There are no children of this couple baptised at West Wycombe.
I checked the Fingest Parish Registers and could not find the marriage. If they lived at Ditchfield (South Lane End) they could have married nearer Hambleden. But still it could have taken place at West Wycombe, Great Marlow or High Wycombe.
The Igi refrerence is for Lane End Baptisms... IF you google 'IGI batch' and there should be a link near the top saying 'Counties in England'. Follow Buckingham and then scroll down to whatever parish. If you see the batch number you are looking for then click on it and in the new window type in the surname you want.
Sophia Easdon was baptised at West Wycombe on 20 July 1806, Daughter of William and Charlotte Easden. That could correspond with the marriage at West Wycombe, but Sophia would be quite young.
Where was John born?
Matt
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Many thanks Matt.
Oh, if only I had realised!! I was in Milton Keynes March to May this year and now looking at the map realise the area was well within visiting distance. Did something like this on my last visit too - was within half a mile of Shoeburyness and only realised when we returned here that was where George Carr and family lived and Emma Carr (hubby's grandma) married.
Sophia Easden sounds like a good prospect - I usually only have access to census index (other than 1881 on CD) but they reflect her birth as 1806/1807.
Perhaps they had children died in infancy - (or were not baptised?). If this is the correct marriage Sophia would have been about 20 when they wed - seems rather a long time to 1833 before the family arrived (for those days anyway).
Sorry, don't know where John was born - however - I think I have four credits left on my 1911 voucher, I will have a look at 1851, hopefully it will give John's birthplace and any children remaining at home - but probably not those born 1825 - 1833!
Very many thanks,
Margaret
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Margaret,
1841 Census
Lane End, Great Marlow
CARR, John M 35 1806 Ag Lab Buckinghamshire
CARR, Sophia F 35 1806 Buckinghamshire
CARR, Emma F 15 1826 Buckinghamshire
CARR, James M 13 1828 Buckinghamshire
CARR, Eliza F 10 1831 Buckinghamshire
CARR, Martha F 8 1833 Buckinghamshire
CARR, George M 5 1836 Buckinghamshire
CARR, William M 2 1839 Buckinghamshire
Right so John Carr and Sophia Easdon is the correct one. They had Emma James and Eliza before Martha.
Emma baptised 1 Jan 1826 at Great Marlow. I cannot find James and Eliza's baptisms. The Great Marlow Registers on the IGI aren't complete enough.
1851 Census
Ditchfields, Gt Marlow
CARR, John Head Married M 45 1806 Bricklayer Gt. Hasley Oxfordshire
CARR, Sophia Wife Married F 44 1807 Lacemaker Wycombe Buckinghamshire
CARR, Eliza Daughter Unmarried F 20 1831 Lacemaker Gt Marlow Buckinghamshire
CARR, Ann Daughter F Gt. Marlow Buckinghamshire
CARR, George Son M 15 1836 Bricklayer Gt. Marlow Buckinghamshire
CARR, Ellen Daughter F 9 1842 Lacemaker Gt. Marlow Buckinghamshire
CARR, John Son M 7 1844 Scholar Gt. Marlow Buckinghamshire
CARR, Charles Son M 3 1848 Gt. Marlow Buckinghamshire
So there we are. Sophia was Easden and John was born in Oxfordshire.
Matt
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Wonderful! Very many thanks Matt your help really is appreciated and we now have a much more complete picture of my husband's g-g-grandparents the Carr family - where they lived, where they came from, what they did for a living. Thank you.
Regards
Margaret
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Margaret,
Marriage 16 May 1853 by Banns
James CARR, aged fa, Bachelor of Lane End, Labourer son of John Carr, Bricklayer
Mary Ann X DAFTER, aged 19, Spinster of Lane End daughter of Thomas Dafter, Labourer
Witnesses John Bird Eliza Bird
Baptism 12 Feb 1854 Richard born 18 Jan son of James & Mary Ann CARR of Ditchfield, Labourer
Baptism 22 Jun 1873 Annie Alice daughter of James & Mary Ann CARR of Bermondsey, SE, Publican
I can't be sure it's the same couple but the names fit?
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John BIRD, full age, bachelor, Chairmaker of Lane End, son of James Bird, Baker married Eliza CARR, full age, spinster of Lane End, daughter of John Carr, Bricklayer by Banns Witnesses: Caroline Gill, James Gill
also I think John and Sophia might have had an older
Josiah CARR, full age, bachelor, Shoemaker of Lane End, son of John Carr, Labourer married Charlotte X HAMBLEDEN, full age, widow of Lane End, daughter of Elijah Willis, Labourer by Banns Witnesses: Josiah Carr, John H Sharp
Matt
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Hi
James Carr marrying Mary Ann Dafter certainly fits as Eliza Carr marries John Bird and they are witnesses at James's marriage.
Josiah Carr is more difficult - who would the Josiah Carr be who was a witness at the marriage? Bridegroom Josiah Carr, witness Josiah Carr.
Perhaps Josiah came between James 1828 and Eliza 1831, or Martha 1833 and George 1836
Do you have the marriage dates of Eliza Carr/ John Bird and Josiah Carr/Charlotte Hambleden
Thanks
Margaret
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No I don't know who Josiah is but the father and father's occupation match. My guess he was baptised at Great Marlow. I'll put out a request for his baptism.
the dates are:
Eliza 11 Apr 1852
Josiah 24 May 1858
Matt
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Hi Matt,
Have picked up the replies to your query on my behalf, many thanks.
Did a little digging last night and also came up with Josiah (b1822) 1851 on the census index, but did not know his mother was Ann.
1861 he reflects as born 1817. There is a Josiah aged 10 Wycombe 1871.
This is an odd one because his marriage says son of John, and one of the witnesses was John H Sharp. A witness at George Carr and Ruth Taylor's marriage was John Harding Sharp. There's a connection somewhere.
I did wonder if he was a natural child born perhpaps when Sophia was very young (about 16), but no way could she be the mother if he was born 1817!
I wonder if Josiah's father is shown on the 1851? Could he be a natural son of John (1806)? Then again he could be John's (1806) brother. This is getting very involved.
I had a look for Charlotte Ellis's first marriage to Hambleden but didn't find it.
Thanks again
Margaret
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Hello Margaret
I've also done a little digging and discovered that there were three Josiah CARRs in the 1861 census:
The first was born in Bucks circa 1821, is resident in Oxfordshire and has a wife named Charlotte. This must be the Josiah, son of John, who married Charlotte HAMBLEDEN at Lane End on 24 May 1858. He is shown in the 1851 census in Dean Street, Great Marlow, aged 29 years, unmarried, a journeyman shoemaker living with his widowed mother, Ann CARR.
The second Josiah was born in Bucks circa 1840, is resident in Bucks and has a wife named Louisa. This must be the Josiah who married Louisa FORD at Bisham, Berks, on 23 June 1860. The IGI record gives this person's father as Richard CARR, and the baptism of Josia, son of Richard and Hannah CARR is recorded at Great Marlow on 31 Dec 1839. Richard's occupation is given as shoemaker. From his age given in the 1851 census I assume that Richard is the person baptised at Great Marlow on 9 June 1811, the son of John and Ann CARR.
The third Josiah was born in Bucks circa 1817, is resident in Bucks and has a wife named Ruth. This is, in fact, an error as this person is really named Joshua. Joshua CARR married Ruth JIMMOTT at Lane End on 17 Mar 1844.
Although there is no baptism to be found for Josiah circa 1821 at Great Marlow the evidence suggests that he is the son of John and Ann CARR and therefore a brother of the Richard CARR who had a son named Josiah. He does not belong in the family of John and Sophia CARR.
Orpheus
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Many thanks Orpheus
I rather think there is a connection somewhere between the two familes - based only on the marriage witness John H Sharp (Josiah and Charlotte) and John Harding Sharp (George and Ruth).
Perhaps John b1806 (wife Sophia), Richard b1811 (wife Hannah) and Josiah bc1821 (wife Charlotte) were brothers, however, not sure as John was born in Oxfordshire as per the 1851.
Thanks again, it certainly rules Josiah out as issue of John and Sophia.
Regards
Margaret
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Just had another thought on the brother theory. John and Sophia had ten children, five of them sons. Going by the patterns of the times wouldn't they have named at least one of them Richard or Josiah?
They have James, George, William (Sophia's father's name), John (father's name), and Charles.
Perhaps the witness was just a coincidence after all!
Margaret
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Hello Margaret
Yes, I think the witness was a coincidence. Both marriages took place at Lane End and John H. SHARP may well have been the parish clerk.
However, it is possible that John, Richard and Josiah were brothers. It would be a good idea to post a request for John's baptism in Great Haseley on the Oxfordshire Lookup requests.
Orpheus
PS. I forgot to mention that there is a baptism for James, son of John and Sophia CARR, at Great Marlow on 29 June 1828
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Many thanks again Orpheus - never thought about the parish clerk!
Will post a request for John, Great Haseley, but think I need to check the 1861 and 71 to see where he says he was born. 41 Says Buckinghamshire. 51 says Great Haseley Oxfordshire.
Just to confuse the issue! There was a John Carr, son of John and Ann, baptised St Sepulchre London in 1806.
Regards
Margaret
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If anyone is still following this thread I think we can now rule Josiah (son of Ann) out of the picture. As suggested I placed a request on the Oxfordshire list and received a wonderful response giving me John's data from the 1861 and 1871 census, his baptism, a sibling, and data on his son William.
John is the son of Richard Carr and Elizabeth Parsler and was born in Great Haseley Oxfordshire 1804
Margaret
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Diana Easden was my great-great-great-great-grandmother and a younger sister of Sophia Easden.
I'm sketching up the entire Easden family and its branches! I've included the information on this thread and am using Ancestry.co.uk to branch it out as much as possible.
Descendents of Sophia Easden are cousins of mine!
My tree is located at:
www.jordan53.tribalpages.com
If anyone would like the Security Code to view private data, let me know!
IT WOULD BE BETTER TO E-MAIL ME DIRECT THAN REPLY TO THIS, BUT PASTE IT ONTO THREAD ALSO SO PEOPLE CAN FOLLOW :]
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Margaret,
also I think John and Sophia might have had an older
Josiah CARR, full age, bachelor, Shoemaker of Lane End, son of John Carr, Labourer married Charlotte X HAMBLEDEN, full age, widow of Lane End, daughter of Elijah Willis, Labourer by Banns Witnesses: Josiah Carr, John H Sharp
Matt
I know this is an old thread but I'm interested in Charlotte X daughter of Elijah Willis
I have Charlotte as being baptised on 12/2/1825 in Hambleden dau of Elijah Willis and Susanna
From what I can see Elijah married Susanna on the 12/02/1825 - the day before Charlotte's baptism.
Would Charlotte have already been born
I then have a record of a burial for Susanna Willice on the 16 Feb 1825
Could Susanna have married, given birth and died all on the same day???
Susanna was my great x 4 grandmother. When she married Elijah she already had an illegitimate son, James Plummer Collins who was my great x3 grandfather.