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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Northumberland => England => Northumberland Lookup Requests => Topic started by: jacqlineue on Saturday 25 April 09 12:59 BST (UK)
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25th June 1908 - 29 Nov 1971
I am looking for any information as I can't find out this persons mother. He does not appear to be on any census. If anyone can find a reference for him so i can get the right birth cert i would really be grateful. His father was George Henry Clark but only appears as Henry on the marraige cert.
Thanks for your time
Jac
Moderator Comment: I have now merged this post with another that was covering the same ground. I hope this will make it easier for all but they go in date order so some answers may seem out of sequence.
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Hi Jac
The only census he would appear on would be the 1911. Can you give more details from the certificate - address and father's occupation might help
Is this related to your other post about Simpson/Rothery in South Shields (which is Durham, not Northumberland) http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=377650.msg2508123#msg2508123
Barbara :)
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Hi Jac,
Have you looked on freebmd site to see if his parent's marriage is there?
charlotte
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W S Clark lived at 16 Joson Place (thats what it looks like). Both he and his father were miners. His dad was George Henry although it only has Henry on Williams marraige cert. I don't know his mothers name. He married Mary Garbutt July 26 1930.
This is not related to the other request it is the other side of the family.
I can't find him on any records that i have looked at.
I think his parents lived at 79 Sycamore Street Ashington
Regards
Jac
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sorry to be picky, but Joson Place, which town??
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Sorry thats Josson and i think it may be Ahington but i am not sure. The cert does not give the town.
Thanks for your help
Jac
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Does the cert give a District, and county Northumberland?
Have you looked for the family in the 1911 census?
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Marraige was at The Parish Church in Seaton Hirst in county of Northumberland. As i am new to this i am finding it hard to get any information.
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Hi Jac,
It's just that every scrap of information you can give will help, particularly as it is for later years. :)
I can see his birth date from the death registration, but the trouble is that doesn't tell us where he was born. So the next step is to find the family on the 1911 census, which should show both him and his parents, their ages and where they were born, then we can get further back.
We need this really to find his birth registration, I can't see a birth for any William Smith Clark, so it may be registered under just William, and could be any district, though probably in Durham/Northumberland, and because it was the end of June, could be either under the June or September Quarters for 1908
There are a couple of birth registrations for Gateshead, none for the Ashington area. You could contact Gateshead register office to see if either of them have a father called George Henry who was a miner.
Gateshead Register Office
Gateshead Civic Centre
Regent Street
Gateshead
NE8 1HH
email is registeroffice [at] gateshead.gov.uk
Best thing would be to find them in 1911 first
Barbara :)
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Thanks for that. I am looking at 1911 but so far have got nowhere but will keep up the quest till i find them.
I will let you know when i get any further.
Thanks again
Jac
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Do you know if he had any older or younger brothers and sisters? Births after 1911 gave the mother's maiden name, which is a big help
What were the witness names on the marriage cert, as that may help too
(also I've edited my last post to give Gateshead register office details)
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Thanks,
I will contact them. I know he had a half brother called Robert Mullen. Thats about all at the moment but i will crack it i know i will.
Jac
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Of course you will!
Just finding possibles in 1901 census to check against the 1911:
1901 census RG13 Piece 4835 Folio 37 Page 16
no.9, Eighth Row, Ashington, Northumberland
John Hudson head widr 59 Coal Miner Hewer Northumberland Haggerston
Mary Clark dau mar 22 " Cambois
George Clark son.in.law 26 Coal Miner Hewer " Seghill
1901 census RG13 Piece 4835 Folio 120 Page 52
222 Fourth Row, Ashington, Northumberland
William BARNFATHER head m 59 Timbering for Coal Cutting Miner Hebburn
Sarah " wife m 53 Morpeth
Sadie " dau s 22 Ashington
Willie " son 7 "
James " " 3 "
Henry CLARK nephew s 20 Coal Miner Hewer N'land Scotland Gate
Barbara :)
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That 1901 census with the William Barnfather. His wife is Sarah nee Clark. She was born abt 1848 ( I don't have her birth cert). Her father was Henry Clarke born abt 1825 Longhorsley and mother was Mary (Unknown) of Kielder Castle. I know there was another child Margaret Jane Clark. I don't know of any other children but I have not looked all that hard at this branch on my Barnfather limb.
Just to add information incase someone in the future needs this: added 10-2010: Sarah Clark born 8 Feb 1848, Newgate Street, Morpeth d/o Henry Clark and Mary Ann Lovet.
Janis
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Aha!! ;D Great Janis. You see, Jac, I told you every scrap of info helps, and now look what I found
marriage registration: George's 2nd marriage if you want to get the cert:
That should give George/Henry's age, address, occupation and his father's name and occupation
Sep 1913 Morpeth 10b 815
Henry CLARK to Mary J MULLEN
Barbara :)
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Thanks I am going to do some more interogation of the older generation in family. They must know more.
Jac
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1891 census
RG12 Piece 4256 Folio 109 Page 30
Choppington Station, Northumberland
Henry CLARK head 63 Cartman Longhorsley
M A " wife 72 Greenhead
Henry " grandson 10 Scholar Choppington
Wm CARR lodger 35 Coal Miner Morpeth
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A bit off the subject but interesting ...
Mary J Mullen's husband was probably Anthony Mullin who died in 2Q 1909 Morpeth 10b 269, aged 38.
Mary is with 6 children in 1911 census. She was born circa 1872. One of the children is called Robert A Mullen born c.1901. This could be Robert Anthony Mullin 4Q 1900 Durham 10a 390 - the step brother you mentioned.
Mary Jane Maddison married Anthony Mullin in 4Q 1891 Durham 10a 574.
Laurina
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Sorry thats Josson and i think it may be Ahington but i am not sure. The cert does not give the town.
Thanks for your help
Jac
that will be Tosson Place, East Villas, Alexandra Road Ashington
pete
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that will be Tosson Place, East Villas, Alexandra Road Ashington
pete
Three cheers for local knowledge ;D
Tosson Place is here: http://www.rootschat.com/links/065n/
Jennifer
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thanks for the info everyone this is really helping
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I am quite new to this and i am having trouble tracing my gt grandparents. My grandfather was calle William Smith Clark born June 25th 1908 died 29 Nov 1971. He was married to Mary Garbutt in 1930. I have traced my grandmothers family but i am having trouble tracing Williams. Is ther anyone out there that can help with the names of his parents. It is thought that he was born in Byker.
Thank you for reading
Moderator Comment: I have now merged this post with an earlier one that was covering the same ground. I hope this will make it easier for all but they go in date order so some answers may seem out of sequence.
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Do you have thier marriage cert ???
Mary Garbutt - Clark Sep q. 1930 Morepeth 10b - 868
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yes i have his fathers name on cert is henry but he was george henry
regards
jac
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Hi jac
It does help if you give as much detail as possible. How do you know the father was George Henry? If you have that marriage certificate then it should have witnesses names and also occupations. Can you quote those? What age does it give for William then? I had a quick look for a birth in 1908 but could not see one.
Andrea
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William Smith Clark 22 Bachelor Father Henry Clark Miner
Mary Garbutt 19 Spinster George Garbutt Miner
Married July 26th 1930 Parish Church Seaton Hirst Northumberland
Witness George Garbutt and Dorothy Dawson
Hope this will help
Regards
Jac
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Not doing too well here! There is a possible marriage in 1906 for a George Clark on www.freebmd.org.uk where one of the brides is called Smith - just guessing that that might be her name.
You did not say why you think the father was George and not Henry. Where does the idea of Byker as a birth place come from?
Any idea whether your grandfather was the only child?
Have a look at free bmd and see if any names leap out at you.
Andrea
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Dad says his name was george henry and ther is a little squiggle in front of the Henry on the cert. Dad says he thinks he was born in Byker. Will have to have another look at Free BMD as i must have missed that one
Thanks again
Jac
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As the marriage was in Seaton Hirst near Blyth......a search of the 1911 index Blyth district shows a William Clark aged 3, Christina Clark aged 5 and a Jacob Clark aged 10, and Sarah Ann Clarke aged 47 in the household, so it might be worth buying credits to see that census return
www.1911census.co.uk
I found this birth reg:
Dec 1901 Morpeth 10b 448
Jacob Smith CLARK
Barbara :)
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There is a possible marriage in 1906 for a George Clark on www.freebmd.org.uk where one of the brides is called Smith - just guessing that that might be her name.
Andrea, I can't see it in 1906, do you mean 1907? :-\
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Probably! Not quite with it tonight. It was Edith Smith I think?
Andrea
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Dad says he can remember an aunt Chrissie so this may be it. ;)I dohope so. I got credits so willhave another look.
Thanks
Jac
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If the children are that old in 1911 - assuming it is the right lot - then we need to look earlier for a marriage. Might find them in 1901 perhaps?
Andrea
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Will have a look tomorrow not got time tonight. Thanks for all your trouble. Will keep you posted.
Jac
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Nice to know one of the names rings a bell, but struggling to find a Sarah Ann Clark in 1901 - Jacob was born after the 1901 census.
Will leave it til Jac's got the 1911 details, may be a totally different family, hope not :-\
Barbara
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Thank you all for this information. Sorry it has taken some time to get back to you. I will delve deeper and the mullen link looks good as dad knew the mullens and one of his aunts married a mullen.
Regards
Jac
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Sorry it has taken me so long to get round to this but i really don't understand it . William was born 1908 so where does that fit in?
Does the marraige in 1913 refer to the nephew and is this his father as in 1911 he is only 20. Who would mother be. I am quite confused about this. The marraige to Mullen looks a possible. This Henry (nephew ) could be Margarets son.
Am i right
Thanks for your help
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Thank you for this information. I ahve been trying to find it but I am not having any luck. The family in the 1911 that you found is apossible but i think Williams dad remarried a Mullen as dad can remember his dad having a step brother called Robert Mullen.
Ther is a marraige for a Mullen and Henry Clark in 1913. She had a son called Robert.
This is totally confusing me as i can't find that marraige either on free bmd.
I am sorry it has taken me so long to reply but I have been on another search which was too good to leave.
Thanks for the help and i will keep trying as Dad would really love to know who his family are or where.
Thanks again
Jac
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Just a little geoegraphic and administrative angle ( for 1911 census etc)
Blyth lay within the administrative area of Tynemouth ( BMD registration, Censuses, Parliamentary, Sanitary etc)
North Seaton, Seaton, Seaton Hirst, Ashington etc lay within the admin area of Morpeth.
The dividing line was the River Blyth.
( But in modern times, 1937, these areas-for BMD reg anyway, all lie within Northumberland Central, based at Morpeth. )
Michael Dixon
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Thanks for that information it may help in this quest.
Regards
Jac
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Hello Jac
Sorry if you seem to be a bit confused with the information given to you so far, I think because you had two threads going about the Clarks it may have felt a little mixed up. The moderator has linked them now, so I'll try to summarise what we've found.
William Smith Clark married Mary Garbutt in 1930, you have that marriage cert.
His father you think was George Henry Clark tho on that marriage cert he's just Henry.
I found two possibles for William's father in the 1901 census for you, and asked you if you could check for them in the 1911 census:
1. George Clark 25 born Seghill married to a Mary (Hudson) - this could be George Henry and Mary who would be William Smith Clark's parents
or
2. Henry Clark single 20 nephew of Wm. Barnfather & Sarah (Clark) - if he was William Smith Clark's father, he wasn't married by the 1901 census
You haven't come back with that information so not sure which one he is.
Then we found a marriage for Henry Clark to Mary J Mullen in Sept 1913 Morpeth 10b 815 - we thought this would be George Henry's 2nd marriage as you said William had a half-brother Robert Mullen.
We need to know where George Henry and his first wife, with son William were in the 1911 census
Hope this clears things a little, did you check for any of them in 1911??
This was the family I suggested you might like to check in 1911
Blyth district shows a William Clark aged 3, Christina Clark aged 5 and a Jacob Clark aged 10, and Sarah Ann Clarke aged 47 in the household, so it might be worth buying credits to see that census return
The other thing you maybe could do would be to get the 1913 marriage cert for William's father to Mary J. Mullen
I found a Mary Jane Mullen in the 1911 census index along with children Mary, Elizabeth, Dorothy, Robert Kate and Joseph. Does your Dad remember if William had any other half-brothers and sisters besides Robert Mullen?
Barbara :)
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Thanks Barbara for that information. You have made it a lot clearer for me now. I did look at the census but it says William is the grandson on it. I will have another look with the information you have clarified and will get back to you.
Once again thanks
Jac
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I only looked at the 1911 index, if you have looked at the full thing would you like to give all the people in the household, names ages birthplaces and relationships and perhaps we can work from there to see if it is your William.
The only other William in the index, right age, in Northumberland 1911 had a father called William
Barbara
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Hi barbara,
The others in the household are
Jane Scott Head 57 Durham
Sarah Ann Clark Daughter 47 Bedlington
Benjamin Weight G Son 18 Morpeth
James Wright G Son 14 Bedlington
Jacob Clark G Son 10 Bedlington
Jane Wright G Daughter 17 Murton Colliery
John Pringle Boarder 63 Sheepwash Nothumberland
Elizabeth Richardson Boarder 70 Edlington Lane Durham
Henry Cotchley Son 15 Bedlington
Christina Clark G Daughter 5 Blythe
Robert Hagens Boarder 29 Edinburgh
Hope this is usefull because it means nothing to me except the Chrissie
Regards
Jac
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Sorry Jac, but please can you modify your post and put the birthplaces? (just click on 'modify' button on your last post, alter it and then click 'save')
Then I'll hopefully be able to find them in earlier census and sort out who is who. William is Jane's grandson, Sarah her daughter, but it's not certain if Sarah is William's mother. I'll look for Sarah & Jane earlier, but their birthplaces will really help
Barbara :)
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Hiya, I know this thread was last used a year ago, but i too have a family member in the 1911 census talked about here. The Jacob Clark is my husbands great grandad, and like you i found it confusing and had a hard time finding sarah ann clark and who she was married to.
So, just wondering if you ever found out and if the william or christine clark on the 1911 census was a relative of yours that you were searching for? :)
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Thanks for your input on this. I have not done much on this lately as I have been doing a lot on another line of my tree and got bogged down with it. I have looked at Jacob's born in 1901 and have found one with the name Jacob Smith Clark. This may be the same one but not sure. What was the name of your Jacobs father as that may hold a clue for me.
Thanks for getting in touch. I am going to re-open my file on this and start afresh on it. My dad would love some answers as would the rest of his family.
Jac
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After three years of searching I have eventually (thanks to the people of roots) traced the baptism for William Smith Clark.
I would just like to say a big thanks to everyone who has tried to help me especially Barb, Scot, Cris, Angela, MattR, Matt9, SarahA and Pckl who found the information. There are too many who have helped to name everyone.
I now need to find a birth reg. for him but it does not seem so important now.
Thanks again to all of you for your time and patience with this one.
Jac
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Thanks,
I will contact them. I know he had a half brother called Robert Mullen. Thats about all at the moment but i will crack it i know i will.
Jac
you may have sorted this bit out but Robert Mullen married Minnie Garbutt they had two sons, Robert and Ken Mullen W S Clark lived at 16 Joson Place (thats what it looks like). Both he and his father were miners. His dad was George Henry although it only has Henry on Williams marraige cert. I don't know his mothers name. He married Mary Garbutt July 26 1930.
This is not related to the other request it is the other side of the family.
I can't find him on any records that i have looked at.
I think his parents lived at 79 Sycamore Street Ashington
Regards
Jac