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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Worcestershire => England => Worcestershire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: howesd on Wednesday 17 June 09 16:26 BST (UK)
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I have a problem and wondered if anyone may be able to assist with a look up in PR's -
I have a George Anthony, son of Ezekiel and Sarah nee Johnson baptised 30 July 1843 Leigh with Bransford - this has been fine until a descendant has appeared with a birth certificate of George Anthony - son of Ezekiel and Sarah Johnson, stating birthdate of 6th March 1848, of which no baptism record can be found - did the first George 1843 die young? Ezekiel and Sarah had a child, Henry Richard Anthony baptised 27th March 1848 - any look ups would be a great help on this one - just until a visit to the Record office can be arranged - Thank you.
Confused !!
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1851
HO107 2043 46 34
Ezekiel 56
Sarah 46
Elizabeth 23
Ezekiel 12
Benjamin 11
George son 7
George grandson 8 mths
so the first George ddint die.
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Thanks for the reassurance, I've got in a right old *tiss* with this, can't think straight - so would it be a mistake on the birth certificate do you think? I don't know what to think?
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In Free BMD there is a birth for a George Anthony reg March quarter 1848 Upton upon Severn 18 [53]41 is this the other George? Perhaps a different family.
Playing devil's advocate if Ezekiel and Sarah had their son Henry Richard baptised on March 27th 1848 wouldn't they have had their new baby George (born 6th March 1848) done at the same time?
Jan
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Just to confuse you further Henry Richard Anthony isn't with the family in that 1851 census given by lizdb and I can't see a death for him!!!
Jan
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His death could be :
Ap/MAy/Jun 1849
Upton upon Severn
18 382
Henry Anthony
as I see his birth in 1848 was plain Henry with no middle name.
Though if they added the Richard at baptism then you'd have thought they would have used it when he died?
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There is another George in 1851 census in Birmingham where new descendant traces his line from, the son of John and Ann born 1848 - I wonder if Bmd/? have it wrong --- just can't get my head round it at all - the fact that new descendant has the actual birth cert with Ezekiel and Sarah as parents - sorry if I sound dim !!!
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Have you SEEN this birth cert?
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Yes, I've seen it -
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1851
HO107 2043 46 34
Ezekiel 56
Sarah 46
Elizabeth 23
Ezekiel 12
Benjamin 11
George son 7
George grandson 8 mths
so the first George ddint die.
It quite possible that George born 1848 was Elizabeths (was she married) son but registered as son of Ezekiel and Sarahs.
GEORGE ASPEY ANTONY.
Christening, 24 JUL 1850. Powick, Worcester.
Mother, ELIZA ANTONY.
But that don't explain why there is no birth reg for the other George.
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Mystery deepens! There was obviously a George born in 1843 ( as shown by 1851 census) and another in 1848. Have you got a certificate for the first George or found him in the BMD?
Lizdb - I was just going to suggest the same thing re grandson. But why register him as theirs and christen him with real mother's name - unless they were more worried about telling lies to the church than the authorities.
Jan
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there dosn't seem to be birth birth reg's for,
Ezekiel 12.
Benjamin 11.
George son 7.
perhaps the records were lost or destroyed.
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The only one I can see is.
Births Mar 1844.
ANTHONY George, Knighton. 26. 227.
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Elizabeth (Eliza) didnt marry until 1852 George Aspey -
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In 1871 RG10 Piece 3047 Folio 71 page 40
George Aspey 42 carpenter and joiner
Eliza Aspey 43
EZEDKAL ANTHONY 76 widower ( wife's father) Ag lab unemployed
Mary J Tompkins 7 niece
Jan
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Little George Aspey died in 1855
Still don't know what to make of it ?? Thanks all for trying to help -- Can I ask if anyone thinks birth certificate may be wrong - how likely etc.??
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George's death certificate - 22nd May 1878 gives his age as 34 years which puts his birth year 1843/44 which would place him correctly as the son of Ezekiel and Sarah but this does not answer the query regarding his birth certificate dob as 1848 - !! aghh
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I don't think it is his certificate, I think it is the grandson's certificate as it is definitely in BMD as George Anthony, March quarter 1848 Upton upon Severn 18 [53]41. So unless the mistake occurred twice - in the registration and on the certificate it seems there were two George Anthonys.
When did it become a legal matter to register children? As Jim1212 said the elder children don't seem to have been registered either.
Jan
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Jan,
This baby is recorded as being 8 months old in 1851 on the census -
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If he was 8 months old, there is not a birth record for him.
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Think I'm going to have to give up on this - run out of ideas! There don't seem to be any more George Anthony's born about that time in Worcestershire apart from one in 1854 also registered Upton upon Severn. He, according to the 1861 census, is the son of an Eliza and James Anthony and his p.o.b is given as Leigh.
Good luck. It would be nice to hear if you ever solve it. I hope he isn't a direct ancestor.
Jan
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GORDON BENNETT !!!!! hahahah
Thank you for helping - I will let you know -- is it meant to be so stressful I ask myself - I used to love finding my ancestors - hahah!! ummm !!
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I am wondering if the1848 certificate actually says (or should say) 1843, but badly enterred in the returns to the GRO by the vicar or registrar or whoever, so it got indexed as 1848......
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Okay everyone, think I can finally shed some light on this ;D
After 4 hours sat looking at every possible microfilm record -again, for the family. I can confirm that George Anthony's baptism was actually registered twice! Once at Leigh parish Worcestershire, and again at Bransford parish (the parish is known as Leigh with Bransford)
At Leigh it states :
George Anthony, son of Ezekiel and Sarah of Twig Bed, Bransford was baptised by G. Munn on 30 July 1843 (Ezekiel's occupation, Labourer)
At Bransford it states:
George Anthony, son of Ezekiel and Sarah of Twig Bed, Powick (this is just the name of their cottage) was baptised by G.S. Munn on 30 July 1843 (Ezekiel's occupation, Labourer)
I've also double checked George's siblings again, and although most are correct, I've found a bit of a discrepancy with IGI records for one or two.
I also checked the baptism record of George Aspey, as well as every possible death record for Powick, Leigh with Bransford, St Clements Worcester and St John Bedwardine, and nowhere could I find a death of any George Anthony or Aspey/Asprey.
George Aspey Anthony to give him his correct name from the baptism record, was baptised at St Peter Powick, son of Eliza Anthony, single woman, on 24 July 1850.
A personal theory as to why I couldn't find records of his death in 1855 is that he may have possibly been buried in the original Anthony family church at Cotheridge, alas I didn't have time to check those!
As for the birth certificate, I personally feel, now I've seen the double entry baptism for George Anthony 1843, is that because his death certificate, and census records point to him being born in or around 1843, is that the birth certificate is actually wrong. My guess is a printing error or blotched ink, after all it's very easy to accidently convert a 3 into an 8!
So hopefully problem now solved ;) phew!!
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Where are the living in 1851, and where doe's it say they where born.
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Ezekiel, his wife Sarah, and most importantly their son, and grandson, both called George, are living at 'Twig Bed' Powick, Worcestershire. So it all fits in. Their daughter Eliza, the mother of George Aspey Anthony is also there along with a few other of her siblings. Their places of birth also fit in with the baptism records.
I still stand by my theory that the actual Birth certificate is wrongly dated, especially as it is so easy for wet ink, whether printed or out of a pot, to turn a simple number 3 into an 8.
The next step of course is to look at Cotheridge burial records again, and also look at the original birth registrations just to be doubly sure, but as a fair few of George's (1843) siblings don't appear on BMD either, I can only guess that they are one of the many records yet to be transcribed.
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I notice this one,
RICHARD ANTHONY.
Christening, 28 DEC 1845, Leigh With Bransford, Worcester.
Parents:
EZEKIEL ANTHONY.
SARAH.
And this is the closest birth reg I can see,
Births Mar 1845.
ANTHONY Richard, Knighton, 26, 248.
The same place as,
Births Mar 1844.
ANTHONY George. Knighton. 26. 227.
The years are right.
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Hi
Think I agree with Genenut and that the 3 has become an 8, very easy to see how this could happen. As we've searched everywhere and can't find a registration for George Anthony in 1843 and yet we know he was born there from the 1851 census, this must be the explanation.
What a puzzle!
Jan
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ok good, So I will check Knighton parish for these, thank you.
Just to confirm though, the records found from today's microfilm records:
Parishes checked for births and deaths :- St Clements, St John Bedwardine, St Peter Powick, Leigh with Bransford
Children of Ezekiel Anthony and Sarah Johnson:
Eliza Anthony daughter of the above, abode: Hinton Lane, Worcester, father's occupation: labourer, was baptised by rector John Danks on 6 Nov 1827 St Clements ( the IGI record for 27 Apr 1828 is wrong, as no baptisms on that date took place in any of the parishes!)
Ezekiel Anthony son of the above, abode:Cripplegate, Worcester ( few minutes walk from the previous abode -I'm a local lass which helps with this!),father's occupation, labourer, was baptised 13 Dec 1829 St Clements, Worcester
Burial took place 22 Mar 1830 at St Leonards, Cotheridge, performed by Rev. Edward Green (from the original parish records held at the church itself.)
James Anthony born 21 Mar 1831 (from his daughter's birthday book) son of the above, abode: Cripplegate, Worcester) father's occupation: labourer, was baptised 30 Mar 1831 St Clements, Worcester
Thomas Anthony, son of the above, abode: Powick, father's occupation: labourer, was baptised at St Peter, Powick on 18 Aug 1833 (not at Leigh with Bransford as it states on IGI and I did check all the other parishes just to make sure)
John Anthony, his record was the only one I couldn't find, as his IGI stated baptism is 15 Dec 1835 St Clements -- The microfilm ended at Dec 7th 1835, continued on the next microfilm at 21 Dec 1835 -however we hold plenty of records for him, and are 99.9% confident that he is the son of Ezekiel and Sarah, also he is on census records with them. I hope to find his baptism on either Powick or St Clements BT's as I did check the other parishes for 6 years either side of his IGI given date just to be sure
Ezekiel Anthony, son of the above, abode: Powick, father's occupation: labourer, was baptised 27 Mar 1838 by W. Woodward at Bransford parish
Benjamin Anthony, son of the above, abode: Powick, father's occupation: labourer, was baptised 3 Sept 1840 by N. Cocks at Bransford
George Anthony, son of the above, double entry for both Leigh and Bransford parish 1843 as I stated earlier
Richard Anthony, son of the above, abode: Powick, father's occupation: labourer, was baptised at Bransford by Thomas Robinson on 28 Dec 1845 -this is also a double entry as it appears again in Leigh parish records
Burial of Richard Anthony, abode: Powick, age 2 took place on 1 Feb 1848 at St Peter Powick, vicar was J.H. Turbitt.
Henry Richard Anthony, son of the above, abode: Twig Bed Powick, father's occupation: labourer, was baptised 27 Mar 1848, by N.S. Cocks at Bransford.
Burial of Henry Anthony, abode: Powick, aged 11 months took place on 16 Feb 1849 at St Peter Powick, vicar J.H. Turbitt.
Phew, I'm pooped now!
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I notice this one,
RICHARD ANTHONY.
Christening, 28 DEC 1845, Leigh With Bransford, Worcester.
Parents:
EZEKIEL ANTHONY.
SARAH.
And this is the closest birth reg I can see,
Births Mar 1845.
ANTHONY Richard, Knighton, 26, 248.
The same place as,
Births Mar 1844.
ANTHONY George. Knighton. 26. 227.
The years are right.
Just re- read your post again Jim, apologies, I've had such an intensive day with the research! Knighton is on the Shropshire borders -I was thinking you meant Knightwick which does have our Anthony relations!
We are aware of the Knighton/Shropshire/Tenbury Anthony's and so far sadly we haven't been able to link back to them, but we live in hope! ;)
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Hi genenut,
It was just a thought as they were registered about the same time.
Jim.
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and a good thought that's stirred the old brain cells again regarding the Anthony's from this area, although we've found no link with them as yet, there is certainly something there - a brick wall that needs a bit of knocking down, so with a bit of luck and hope, we might one day get to link the 2 families together ;)
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Going to add a final post to this, as we've been staring at this birth certificate for so long it's a wonder it hasn't faded!
First thought, as said before, when the registrar originally wrote the certificate out, the ink was smudged making a 3 look like an 8, the document gets filed away and put on the list of registrations, it goes to the printer and comes out as 1848 instead of 1843.
Second thought, similar to the first, the document is so badly damaged -and the original printed registration still showing 1848 that it has to be rewritten when it was ordered last year.
Final thought, after reading something very interesting, and I'm now going to back track slightly on what I've said before ,is this:
When the first system of registering births was first set up in 1837, many people didn't bother to register, for example, some people who had already had children did not realise the system had changed, and others were confused.
It was only after 1874 that people were fined for not registering a birth, so before that date there's no guarantee on find a birth certificate, (or even a correct one!) for your ancestors. Not everyone complied with the law!!