RootsChat.Com
Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland Resources => Topic started by: akanex2 on Sunday 24 May 09 14:13 BST (UK)
-
Civil Registration of non-catholic marriages started in Ireland, north and south, on 1 April 1845. The commencement date for registration of births, deaths and catholic marriages was 1 January 1864. A full NI birth, marriage or death certificate cost £12 from GRONI, but there are a number of cheaper options available.
The best option is to visit GRONI in Chichester Street, Belfast and pay £12 for a full day’s “index search” which must be booked several weeks in advance. This entitles you unrestricted access to computerised indexes and to 4 “look ups” of the actual registers. Any additional look ups are then charged at £3 each. These provide all the details recorded and included on the full price certificate. I would recommend doing your pre 1921 birth and death searches on the LDS website first and taking a list of references to check with you. At GRONI the marriage and post 1922 indexes are excellent and very easily searched, while the earlier birth and death entries – although computerised – are less convenient.
You can order a transcript of the details on a marriage certificate by phone from the Registrar’s Office at the relevant District Council for £3 or £4 plus postage if you know the names of the bride and groom and the exact date and place of marriage (Belfast City Council don't provide this service). These details are available from the Emeraldancestors.com online subscription database and look ups are often offered on this site by people with subscriptions.
You can search for all NI registration certificate references 1845-1921 online at the LDS Pilot Site
http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#p=collectionDetails;t=searchable;c=1408347
A search on this site will give you the name, registration district, year, quarter (if any), volume and page number taken from a microfilm of GRONI’s own index. This information is sufficient to allow you to order a certificate from GRONI for £6 (DO NOT TELL THEM you got the above details from the LDS website or they will charge you £12!!). Certificates normally arrive at UK addresses within 1-2 weeks.
http://www.groni.gov.uk/index/order_certificates.htm
County Antrim and Down certificate details (including Belfast) may be available online from AncestryIreland.com for £4 which is a slightly cheaper option, but doesn't provide the official document.
http://www.ancestryireland.com/database.php?filename=db_QUIS
Pre 1921 certificates for all parts of Ireland are also available from the Republic of Ireland GRO in Co Roscommon. They offer a cut price “research certificate” which is uncertified and is an actual photocopy of the original registration entry. This costs €6 plus postage (or €4 plus postage with the full reference from the LDS site) and can only be paid for in cash or by sending you credit card details in the post, which many people consider to be a security risk. Also the service can take around 4 weeks. GROI also provide a public search room in Lower Abbey Street, Dublin, but the indexes are quite antiquated and it’s a good idea to do your searching on the LDS site prior to visiting.
http://www.groireland.ie/apply_for_a_cert.htm
-
Superb summary. Thanks.
-
totally agree! if it was made a "stickied" topic then it would remain at the top of the board and stand out more. if the cost of certs change over time,they're bound to,then it would be a simple matter of popping back and editing the prices.
tony
-
Hi,
I'm afraid I've never been able to persuade GRONI to supply me with a certificate at the reduced rate when I provide them with name, year, district, volume and page numbers. They insist "we don't work that way" and charge me £12. No, I don't tell them that I get them from the LDS website because I don't. I get them from the LDS FHC either in Belfast, before it closed, or Edinburgh. I don't tell them my source nor do they ask.
Their website
http://www.groni.gov.uk/certificate-fees
makes their policy very clear. They insist on the entry number and date of registration.
mr-aitch
-
They do seem inconsistent, but I know of 2 other people who got GRONI certificates within the last 2 months for £6 using references I took from the pilot site. Must be luck of the draw!
-
Just out of interest, what's GRONI's beef with using info provided by LDS?
If the reduced rate is meant to reflect reduced labour on their part, then what difference does it make where the information came from?
-
akanex2,
Re your summary above. When talking about ordering by phone you make a comment about Belfast City Council. Does that mean that you need to go to some other agency or that you can't get this phone service at all for Belfast events?
I'm interested in a 1920 marriage in Belfast (Ardoyne).
Thanks.
-
I was told that Belfast City Council didn't provide the service several years ago (I think in GRONI - not sure), but never tried it as the same information is available online for £4 on the AncestryIreland.com site.
From speaking to staff at GRONI last time I was in, I was told they couldn't guarantee that the information had been transcribed correctly so was not as reliable as their own index. They told me if I ordered using LDS Pilot site references, I would have to pay whether they found the certificate or not - hardly a huge risk I would have thought ???
While there I asked if they offered the same service by phone which was available in the search room (i.e. getting the details from the register without buying a certificate, which costs £3 if you are there in person doing an index search). The guy on the desk told me that a caller quoting name, district, year, (quarter), volume and page number could have a "transcription" of the entry posted to them for £6. This is not a certified "Certificate" but contains all the same details - equivalent to the €4 "research copy" offered by GROI Roscommon, but payable by telephone.
I've only done this once as I've managed to get £6 certificates when required, but if you are having problems getting a cert, just ask for a "transcription" instead. They are probably inundated with cheap certificate requests as more people get to know about the pilot site, so may be tightening up on their rules in line with the online policy noted by mr-aitch below.
-
See this other thread for problems people have had with ordering from GRONI
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,383461.0.html
-
Thank you for all this information it has been very valued infor. I need 3 certificates one for Irene Carson b 1900 and the marriage certificate for William John Carson m Wilhelmina Bain/e who married in 1897 at Shankill Presbyterian Church.
-
Someone has PMed me asking about using the pilot site information on the online ordering service at GRONI's website as the forms contained no field for this information.
I checked with GRONI directly and they advised that the online service has been subcontracted and that, as "the subcontractors have no facility to confirm these details", they could NOT accept them for online orders. [I don't understand this, but it's the explanation I was given ???]
They did confirm that the index details could be used to order a cert by telephone or by post as these orders are still dealt with by GRONI staff themselves.
They also said that official policy was NOT to allow the 50% discount on certificates ordered using the pre 1922 index information (i.e. that provided by the pilot site) :'(. If you go to GRONI in person to do an index search, the post 1922 index references provide additional information which precisely identifies an individual certificate (incl. Enrty No. & subdistrict), whereas the old Volume/page reference is much less specific and involves further searches by GRONI staff (for example, one registration district (as identified on the pilot site) will contain a number of subdistricts, each with their own books).
While I have always found the staff there very helpful and accommodating, I suspect the huge increase in genealogical enquiries following the launch of the pilot site has resulted in a higher authority enforcing the letter of the law on discounts (still worth asking though if you phone in an order ;))
-
I cant believe this site ! Thank you so much, I am off to order my certificate now.
Karen
-
Check out this useful tip from Begclonrode on another thread:-
"Might (or might not) be of interest....but by using LDS Form 31768 you could order a photocopy from the LDS in Salt Lake City of (in this case) Volume 16, Page 827 of the 1868 Newtown Limavaddy civil register.
US$2.00 per photocopy including postage worldwide.
There is a minimum charge of US$4.00 so if you're only interested in the one entry it will cost US$4.00 But if you're interested in several entries (up to eight) it works out a lot cheaper than the GRONI.
I've used this service from New Zealand to order several Irish civil birth and death photocopies and it's delivered every time. Turnaround time is 4-6 weeks.
http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Search/rg/research/type/Form.asp
or google "lds 31768 pdf"
Scroll down to 31768 and click on the "pdf" link. Print out the form, fill in the details you got from LDS Pilot and post it off.
You will need to supply debit/credit card details. If, like me, you're concerned about giving out unsecured card details (which is the right attitude to have) I use a Visa Debit card and keep just enough money in it to cover the purchase.
Regards
Beg"
-
I got my 1849 Northern Ireland marriage record from the Irish GRO in the Republic of Ireland. I wanted to get hold of the original marriage entry that I had previously obtained in transcription form. GRO Ireland provided me with a photocopy of the marriage entry for only 4 Euro that is £3.61 in GB currency. It only took a week or so in the post to the UK.
You need to print out the application form and provide the specific details of the event to get the search discount. I would recommend the photocopy format as it's cheaper and you just get the original image. The Irish GRO have records for all events for the whole of Ireland in the 19th Century:-
http://www.groireland.ie/apply_for_a_cert.htm
C
-
The Irish GRO have records for all events for the whole of Ireland in the 19th Century:-
http://www.groireland.ie/apply_for_a_cert.htm
C
as stated in my original post... :)
Pre 1921 certificates for all parts of Ireland are also available from the Republic of Ireland GRO in Co Roscommon. They offer a cut price “research certificate” which is uncertified and is an actual photocopy of the original registration entry. This costs €6 plus postage (or €4 plus postage with the full reference from the LDS site) and can only be paid for in cash or by sending you credit card details in the post, which many people consider to be a security risk. Also the service can take around 4 weeks. GROI also provide a public search room in Lower Abbey Street, Dublin, but the indexes are quite antiquated and it’s a good idea to do your searching on the LDS site prior to visiting.
http://www.groireland.ie/apply_for_a_cert.htm
-
This is a great thread, thanks for all the helpful info.
GRONI are now trying to charge £14 for their online ordering service. This is really greedy... for only £1 more I can go off to New Register House in Edinburgh and get a whole day's searching...
-
Hopefully we will soon have the same service as Scotland as the GRONI are seeking tenders to run an online service on the same basis as ScotlandsPeople from no later than the end of 2013.
A full days search at GRONI in Belfast also costs just £14 and any certificates ordered on the day are half price - but still expensive enough!
-
New system up and running for some time now at:
https://geni.nidirect.gov.uk/
Searches are free while you have any credits on your account and search results give the exact date of an event as well as district and reference. £2 worth of credits gives you an onscreen view of the original certificate.
So far the system online only covers "historical events" i.e births over 100 years ago and marriages 75 years ago and deaths 50 years ago, but full access to all events is available in the GRONI seach room in Belfast.