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Family History Documents and Artefacts => FH Documents and Artefacts => Topic started by: Alan Ryan on Friday 24 April 09 17:13 BST (UK)
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As a last desperate effort to hopefully find clues on the whereabouts of my granddad (William Ryan 1893-1961. Bradford) in his childhood & during WW1, I'd like to access his medical records. Where do I start please ? ;D
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Hello Alan
I have checked ancestry and have come across the following: all living bradford
1901 census image not on screen
Thomas Ryan 40
Harriet 42
Elizabeth 14
William 10
Ella 3
1901 Census 93 Park Road Childrens Home Bradford
John J Ryan 12 born Oakworth
William Ryan 9 born Bradford
1901 Census 79 Granby Street Bradford
Robert Ryan 32 House Painter
Mary 29
William 6 at school born Bradford
Hope this helps
Summersage
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Thanks Summersage, but my granddad was actually abandoned and ended up in Hemsworth sometime before 1901, he was still there in 1911 and again in 1916 when he got married, just 4 dates to show for 23 years. He moved back to Bradford to get away from the coal mines after the birth of my dad and and 2 uncles. I've tried everywhere (inc Kew) to find records of absolutely everything else without success, which has now left me considering the possibility of his medical records which hopefully would include military service. I wrote to the "patients association" for advice but after 2 weeks they wrote back without answering my question. So that's the situation at the moment, hence the request for info on accessing GP's medical records. Alan
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To access the records of someone who has died you need to apply under the Access to Medical Records Act, 1990. You will only be able to access the records if:
* you are the next of kin or legal executor
* you have the permission of the next of kin
* you have written permission from the deceased person given before they died
You will need to state which records you want to access and if you are taking or intend to take legal action. The same charges apply as under the Data Protection Act.
http://www.patients-association.com/FAQ-Category/8
Stan
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Thanks Stan, as the eldest son of my granddad's eldest son I'm not sure if I out rank my dad's brothers but the main question is; who do I actually contact for applying for access to the medical records ? and would they still be held by the NHS or the (Wakefield) National Archives or somewhere else ? Thanks also to Summersage but I already had the 1911 information, there was also a British Legion Social Club on Bush St that my granddad was the steward of for several years after he left the pit and after he was married he lived about 100 yds away on King Edward St. If you could find something on his military service, that would be a bonus but it looks like the records were among those that were lost in the blitz. He was in the Army Veterinary Corps but NOT pte. SE/11669. Alan
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Alan
I work with medical records, and to the best of my knowledge the records of deceased patients are not kept in the long term. There is some leeway nationally about the length of time they are retained, but in my area it is six years after the death of an adult, and twenty-five years in the case of a minor. Before 1948 and the start of the NHS, the patient records of general practitioners were their own property, and very few found their way into the new records post-1948, so even where other records survive, early records are unlikely to be included. As far as hospital records go, there are many surviving, particularly admission and discharge registers, and the location and scope of such records can be traced via the Hospital Records Database.
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/hospitalrecords/?WT.lp=sa-33620
But after so many years, I think the assumption must be that your grandfather's local medical records (GP record) would have been destroyed many years ago. Computerised records will change the way that information is held in the future of course.
Sue
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Thanks a lot Sue, I'll have a look at the National Archives site but I'd better not hold my breath. I have read somewhere in the past week though, that military medical records were supposedly retained but It wasn't clear if the records were attached to the GP records or not. If they wern't then I suspect they may have gone up in smoke at the same time as the service records.
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Hello Alan
I have checked ancestry and have come across the following: all living bradford
1901 census image not on screen
Thomas Ryan 40
Harriet 42
Elizabeth 14
William 10
Ella 3
1901 Census 93 Park Road Childrens Home Bradford
John J Ryan 12 born Oakworth
William Ryan 9 born Bradford
1901 Census 79 Granby Street Bradford
Robert Ryan 32 House Painter
Mary 29
William 6 at school born Bradford
Hope this helps
Summersage
Robert Ryan and Mary (maiden name O'Brien) are my gr grandparents and William aged 6 is my grandfather. They were married at St Anne's Church in 1891. Witnesses were Thomas Lawler and Catherine Lawler. Their father's were William Ryan and John O'Brien (deceased).
regards
Quigs
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Thanks Quigs, obviously not the same granddad but my granddad William's father was called Patrick and his father was also called William. Just a very long shot but did your Robert have a brother (or cousin) called Patrick ? ;D
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I don't know if Robert had brothers and sisters, but his father was William and his mother was Margaret Bourke. Patrick is a name that runs through each generation of my mother's family. Robert and his wife had one son, my grandfather William. The Ryans mentioned above are my mother's paternal family, her mother's family were also called Ryan and lived in Lancashire, Leeds and Bradford.
My other Ryan gr grandfather, Timothy, definitely had a brother called Patrick. Family stories say that Timothy born about 1862 in the Tipperary area went to America with his brother Patrick as young men. In 1891 Timothy was in England and living in Bury in Lancashire with his wife and first child Katie, as he is in the 1891 census with them. In 1901 he was married at Leeds Register Office, living at Harper Street, he is in Bradford by 1904 when my grandmother's youngest sister Johanna was born. As far as I know Patrick also came back from America and lived in Bradford, I would imagine if he had sons he would have called one of them Patrick. There were other brothers of Timothy and Patrick who also lived near to my mother when she was a child, I know there was a Thomas, a Joseph and James, as far as I know they were a large family.
Have you any addresses where your Ryans lived in Bradford and surrounding areas, also what other surnames are you looking for?
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My gt granddad Patrick appeared fom nowhere in 1891 and married Mary Davis, he was 44 and she was 23. In 1893 Granddad William was born and not long after he was dumped in an orphanage, Pat & Mary disappeared again. I found Mary back in Kendal in 1895, getting married again and using her maiden name. There's no sign of either of them on the 1891 census and addresses include; 268 Ripon St, 28 King Charles St and 24 Captain St. There were also several other Patrick Ryan's living in the same area which I've researched and discounted, maybe your Patrick is one of them or possibly the same person ? ? ? :-\ . Alan
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Alan
Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. Armed with questions I have just been talking to my aunt who lives in Bradford but unfortunately she couldn't tell me anything, she just says that there are a lot of Ryans in Bradford and people didn't talk about things in those days, also she is old so perhaps can't remember things the same. Patrick is certainly the right age to have been a brother or cousin to my great grandfather. Have you still got information on the Patrick Ryans you have discounted? if so I would appreciate seeing it.
Sorry I couldn't be more help but if I learn anything else I will let you know.
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Alan
Further to my answer below, when I was talking to my aunt this morning, I thought her ears pricked up when I said the name Davis, although it's not the person you are looking for, I have had a look on Free BDM and it looks as if my grandmother's brother, Timothy Ryan was married to Gertrude Davis. It must be my grandmother's brother because I know he was married to a woman called Gertie. Children of Timothy and Gertrude were Timothy, Terence, Joseph and Mary.
This might be worth looking at further.
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Send me your email quigs so I can return you copies of all my certificates, if any of them interest you, let me know and I'll see if I have any old scraps of paper in my files with more details. * ;D Alan
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Good luck with the search for medical records, Alan.
I used the site which Sue (Scarletwoman) suggested to track down my Great Grandfather's hospital records from 1908. It wasn't easy, and there were several false leads, but well worth it in the end when I actually got to look at the notes detailing his last days. :o :'(
Maybe because it was over 100 years ago - there weren't any restrictions on reading them - even though, as the eldest daughter of the only son of the only son, I'd have put up a good argument!! 8)
Hope you find the information you are sekeing. :)
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Morning Gataki, the medical records search came to nothing about 2 years ago, as does most searches on my male line, Too many secrets and no existing records. The good thing about Roots chat is that all the advice and information is retained and can be revisited in the future when possibly new records have been added. Alan :)