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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Yorkshire (East Riding & York) => England => Yorkshire (East Riding & York) Lookup Requests => Topic started by: sarahcat on Thursday 16 April 09 14:40 BST (UK)
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Hello,
I would be very grateful if anyone is able to give me some info, but it's a tall order, I know!
I am looking for the births for two people who married at the Holy Trinity in Jan 1815. They are John Arnett and Frances/Fanny Goodhand. Both were born in Hull in 1791, according to IGI records. As the IGI trail seems to stop there, I would like to find their parents either via their marriage or birth records....
I live in West Sussex and although many records from this area are available online,I am happy to help with any rogue parish record look-ups in the Southwick/Shoreham area, in return!
Many thanks!
Yours hopefully,
Sarahcat
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That record (Arnett/ Goodhand) is not in the extracted batch.
There is a submitted John Arnett / Fanny (unknown) stated as BEFORE 1815.
Marraiages at that era contain very little info.
Can you post the link for 'your' record?
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~hughwallis/IGIBatchNumbers/CountyYorkshire_(I-L).htm#K
Pauline
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Hello,
Just looked again at my notes and have exact date of marriage for John Arnett and Fanny Goodhand from LDS site, but of course no IGI number attached to it(or to their births,as cited on the marriage record) Date is 08 March 1811.
Not sure how to create link to it though, or if is allowed to do so?
Looked on the link you sent-thank you for that. Couldn't find anything there initially, but will double check...
Thanks again,
Sarahcat
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p.s the Jan 1815 date related to their daughter's birth, not the marriage.Doh! having one of those days!! Sarahcat
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I think the point Pauline is making is that the marriage entry that you've found on the IGI isn't one that's been extracted from the parish records, which is why there is no source information. The entry is one submitted by a member of the LDS church, and, therefore, not to be accepted without proper verification. The validity of such entries varies: some are pure invention, others are for real. There's no way to know which is which without checking the actual PRs.
It follows that the 1791 birthdate given for both Fanny and John(ny!) are probably just 'best guesses'.
You should also note that the submitted entry just says that the marriage took place in Kingston upon Hull. If this is correct, it may have been Holy Trinity, but it could also have been at St Mary's, Lowgate. Also, you shouldn't rule out Drypool, Marfleet, Sculcoates and Sutton which are now part of Hull. I know how difficult it is to identify possible parishes when you don't live in the area.
Have you managed to find either of them on the 1841 census? Or even, if you're lucky, they may have survived until 1851 when they would hopefully indicate their places of birth.
Jill
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Sorry can't help with the marriage, my records are 1792-1812
IGI has an extracted baptism at Holy Trinity
Elizabeth ARNETT 9 Jan 1815 Holy Trinity, Kingston Upon Hull, Yorkshire
parents John ARNETT and Frances
Don't know if you have these baptisms, they may fit in somewhere, all Holy Trinity Church, Hull:
11 Mar 1812 Saml, son of John & Frances Arnett
27 Sep 1803 Eliz. d R'd & Han'h Arnett
2 Aug 1808 Martha d Richard & Hannah Arnett
28 Jul 1812 James s Richard & Ann Arnett
2 Apr 1804 Mary d Jas & Eliz. Arnett
16 Sep 1805 Mary Ann d James & Eliz Arnet
20 May 1811 Elizabeth d James & Elizabeth Arnett
24 Nov 1800 Edward s Wm & Mary Ann Arnett
Barbara :)
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Barbara,
Your records might help - the submitted IGI has the marriage 8 March 1811.
If not, I'll see if I can pop into the Record Office next week and check it out.
Jill
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No sorry, only have transcripts for baptisms, just thought they might come in handy somewhere in Sarah's tree, as they don't seem to be on the IGI
Barbara
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I've just noticed that there seems to be a gap in IGI coverage of Holy Trinity marriages 1762-1812.
So, if the submitted IGI is correct and if the gap isn't due to the PR entries not surviving, I might actually find it at the RO!! ::)
Oh well, worth a try!
Jill
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Jill and Barbara,
Thanks so much for looking into this for me-is quite late in the evening so will look through your replies properly tomorrow.
I understand where you are coming from with the LDS records-there is clearly doubt when a record has not been extracted from a PR.
Have got John and Fanny on the 1841(living in London) and Fanny in the 1851....and actually their birth dates seem much earlier on the 1841....will look at that again.
Have also got the IGI for their daughter Elizabeth's christening and think I did originally try finding the marriage under the corresponding number....
Thanks again-your help is very much appreciated!
(As I said, am having one of those days, so hope to be more on the ball tomorrow!!)
Sarahcat :)
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Have got John and Fanny on the 1841(living in London) and Fanny in the 1851....and actually their birth dates seem much earlier on the 1841....will look at that again.
Sarah, don't forget that in the 1841 census, adult ages were usually rounded down to the nearest 5 years, so not accurate for dating births
Barbara :)
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Hi, There are no entries for either Holy Trinity, Hull 1761-1791. Best wishes clive
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Sarahcat,
Presumably, on the 1841 census, they were both recorded as being born out of county? On the 1851, does Fanny give her birthplace as Hull?
Jill
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Yes Jill, in the 1851 Fanny/Frances is recorded as born in Hull and is living with both her daughters: Elizabeth,her husband/children and Frances, single.
In the 1841 the whole family are recorded as born in Middlesex, but it is definitely them.The problem is that John and Frances are both recorded as born 1771 and 1776 respectively!!Know there can be errors on the census,but maybe they were actually born quite a bit earlier than LDS non IGI record says...so thanks for prompting me to look at that again!
Elizabeth was definitely born in Hull but her younger sister Frances was born in Middlesex. However, knew nothing about Samuel(thank you, Barbara)...perhaps he did not survive or was off doing his own thing by 1841. Will look into that.
Lots of food for thought then and also need to have a good look through the other Arnett info that you gave, Barbara....
Got to dash, but will be back later!
Sarahcat
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I checked the marriage at the Beverley RO this morning - and this particular submitted IGI is to be trusted!!
The marriage was there at Holy Trinity 8 March 1811
John Arnett otp, mariner & Fanny Goodhand of the same, widow. Witnesses were Samuel Arnett and --- Fisher (the first name was very hard to decipher - could have been Mary, Mark something like that).
Did you know Fanny was a widow? if not, that could help find her maiden name - if you can find her first marriage, of course. ??? Also, I hope the witness Samuel Arnett might point you in the right direction to find John's birth/baptism.
Good luck.
Jill
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Hello Jill,
Thank you so much-you have been really helpful and it was extremely kind of you to do this look up ;D.
That is all so useful and will keep me busy for a while I should think!!(along with all the other info that has come up with this posting). I didn't know Fanny was a widow, so that's brilliant....
Many thanks again, and if I can help with any local look-ups please let me know...I don't live near Chichester(W.Sussex RO) but occasionally get to Lewes(E. Sussex RO) or could visit churches in Shoreham area of W.Sussex...
Best wishes,
Sarahcat
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You're very welcome, Sarahcat. I don't have any ancestors in Sussex - yet! but I'll keep your kind offer in mind should I come across any in the future.
I enjoy the 'hunt' for lost ancestors - a bit like puzzle solving I suppose. Just to prove it - I looked on the IGI for the baptism of a Samuel Arnett and there is one in 1780 in North Ferriby (then about 7 miles from Hull, now virtually part of 'greater' Hull). He was the son of John Arnett and had a brother John, baptised N Ferriby 1771. So the witness could have been John's brother, although that would have made John 40 years old when he married Fanny. ???
I didn't have any luck at all looking for Fanny's earlier marriage to a Mr Goodhand! :(
Jill
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Wow, thanks once again! John Arnett's dob on the 1840 census is 1771! So North Ferriby could well be the place - brilliant! Perhaps John was 'married to the sea' before he met Fanny! He ended up as a 'Surgical Instrument Maker'!
It really is an irresistible challenge, isn't it, tracking down these ancestors?(Especially the ones that don't want to be found too easily) And it's the best feeling when you do bust a brick wall!
Will keep hunting for Fanny's Mr. Goodhand....
Thanks, Jill.
Sarahcat
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p.s. Yes, please do let me know if any of your ancestors pop up in Sussex! :)
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how do you look up births marriage and deaths etc for Holy Trinity, Hull. some of my ancestors (Fosters) lived in Holy Trinity early 1800's (George b 1816) and I wonder where you go to look things up. I am in Hull this week so could go along if you could tell me. thank you.
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This link should tell you everything you need to know:
http://www.hullhistorycentre.org.uk
Jill
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thank you, I actually went and signed up there last week. Are you saying that they should have all the records I can possibly find there?