RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => Canada => Topic started by: Ken aspinall on Friday 10 April 09 20:56 BST (UK)
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Hi all newbie here,
I'm looking for help locating a relative who was one of the Barnados boys in 1893.
Christmas Aspinall was born in Liverpool, England June 18 1878. The son of Robert and Elizabeth.
He was one of 5 children. In 1893 after the death of his father (Mother died earlier) he and brother Peter were shipped over to Canada on the SS Labrador arriving in spring 1893. I have traced Peter Aspinall and have located lots of new relatives living in British Columbia. CHristmas is a bit more of a mystery, I have found the record of Christmas who has now changed his name to Christopher. He married Lillian A Mackenzie in York on 15 October 1900. I can't find any other traces of him through Census from Canada and would be interested if anybody could help.
Also his younger sister Mary is understood to have gone to Canada around the same time but I have no information on her after the 1891 England Census when she was aged 7.
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Hi Ken,
just welcoming you :)
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http://automatedgenealogy.com/census/View.jsp?id=73255&highlight=7&desc=1901+Census+of+Canada+page+containing+Christopher+Aspinall 1901 Canadian census,do you have him on this one.
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Or maybe not,you say he married in 1900...
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Actually, Hepburn, you found him. The entry was mistranscribed as the image indicates that Chris was married. A couple of lines before him is the listing for Lillian A. Mackmin. Her birth date matches the entry from the 1911 census and the census indicates that she was married. As well, on the marriage registration for Chris and Lillian, Lillian's father is named Alfred and the head of household for that entry was named Alfred.
Here is a link to the 1911 Canada census image at Library and Archives Canada that has a Chris and Lillie Aspenell living in Toronto:
http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1911/pdf/e002028600.pdf
They have no children with them. As well, I couldn't find any Aspinall birth or death registrations connected to Chris in the Ontario databases at Ancestry.
There is a passenger list entry for a Mary Aspinall who arrived on the Canada in Halifax on 15 Apr 1910 and then in Portland, Maine on 16 Apr 1910. Her destination is listed as being Alberta. Here's a link to the passenger list at LAC (line 11):
http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/e/e145/e003621929.jpg
I found her on the 1911 census in Raymond, Alberta. Here's a link to the census image at LAC (line 40):
http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1911/pdf/e001930106.pdf
There is a 1901 census entry in Everton, Lancashire that has the following family:
Robert Aspinall, head, in army, born Wales - written after that is NK (presumably "not known")
Mary Aspinall, sister, 16, born Liverpool
Elizabeth Aspinall, wife, 20, born Liverpool
(Piece: 3480; Folio: 170; Page: 43)
This is the order that it is on the census however there is a mark indicating that Elizabeth and Mary's orders should be reversed. It is possible that the birth place of Robert is incorrect on the census. I see from the 1891 census that there was a brother named Robert who is the right age to be this Robert.
Jacquie
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http://www.rootschat.com/links/061m/ BHC
The other with that surname on the1893 ship's list transcription was a Lucas, could that have been Christmas/Christopher?
Keep us posted, as I have added them onto the Homechildren resource board...
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Oh yes,the Lucas entry they weren't sure of the name.
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Thanks to all that helped me graet support here.
Ok Hepburn that is indeed Christmas on the 1901 Census, and I had seen that one before but for some reason I must have not saved it, I'll add that to him in my GED now.
Jacqui in Canada. Thanks for that link I didn't think of looking foe misspellings of the name that is indeed Chris and Lilian, I'll have to wait until the next census to see if they had any children.
The Mary that you offered I am a bit dubious about, if she sailed over in 1910 where was she for the 1901 Census. The age is out by 2 years that ships record makes her 2 years older than she was but this could be an error on the 1891 Census, unfortunately the 1901 census you found Mary and Robert on is not the correct one I too saw that but I have Robert on the 1901 Census still in Liverpool and with his wife and children one of whom was my grandad. So I need a little more clarification on the Mary you provided before I add her but thanks so much for your input.
J.J I know the it looks like lucas but if you look closley it is actually Cmas abbreviation of Christmas, the ages are correct
Thanks for all your help
Ken
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thanks for clearing that up, as I didn't look at the image... ;D
Mackmen/Mackmin may be the right surname, births for Alfred James & Jane Elizabeth Setter are transcribed as MacKmin, MacKnin...Jane Elizabeth Setter's marriage (1870 Lambeth) has 2 missing on page....Don't the daughter Eliz. either...(egads)
Unless she's Mashman.....orMcMann, McMann, MacMain, McMinn, McMahon well, you get the idea...
Anyway, here's the name for the family in 1881... St John's Ward, Toronto, York, Ont.
Alfred Mackmen age 32 born England & wife Jane Eliz. age 31 born England / C of E
Eliz. -10 born England..rest b. Ontario ...Frances-8 ...Alice N.- 6....Alfred -4.... Lilly- 1
However Birth Dec quarter of 1848 has an Alfred James Mackmin...( St Leonard vol.2 p.281 )
( added: ahh..IGI also has him christened Finsbury, London as Mackmin...)
Young Alfred is Mackmin in 1891 toronto....mother Jane died as Mackmin ..1903 directory, Toronto Mackmin A. J.
so this spelling looks to have pole positon....
added: IGI has an Ontario birth entry...seems to not be just a submission for Lillie Anne Mackmin
Aug 1st 1880 Whitby, Ont - parents Alfred F Mackmin & Jane Setter
and also the birth 1890 of NELLIE not of another Lillie...
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JJ Once again thankyou, the surname was indeed Mackmin so many misspellings throughout the transcriptions. This has helped unearth a wealth of information. many thanks.
Ken Aspinall
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Hello Ken,
You could try the following website;
freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~britishhomechildren
for $20.00 Canadian you can request a search of the British Home Registry.,which seems to be quite thorough.
I checked the list of home children on the site and found 12 children/young adults with the surname Aspinall.
The is a Lucas, Maria(which could be Mary) and a Peter listed.
I hope this will be useful to you.
Regards from sunny Alberta
Lilybell
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maria was age 22 when she came in 1913 ( see reply # 5 above for spellings of aspinall from the LAC BHC lists
Ken...Want to welcome you to rootschat by the way...remiss in not having done so...J.J.
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Good morning ken,
Found this little bit of info on the following website
freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~tweetybirdgenealogy/sept1895.html
Christmas Aspinall- Mr. J.M. Shier Leaskdale March 1893
Peter Aspinall- Mr. D. Walker Leaskdale March 1893
This is where they were both placed for how long I do not know.
This quite a interesting website its worth a read just to get a feel for what these children endured.
Leaskdale is in Uxbridge Township Ontario I think it is fairly close to Toronto.
Christmas is proving to be rather elusive.
Lilybell
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Found this marriage for Christopher although you may already have it.
#802342-00
Christopher Aspinall 23,tinsmith,England s/o Robert Aspinall and Elizabeth Williams married Lillian A. Mackenzie 20
Whitby, Toronto d/o James MacKenzie and Jane E. Setter
Witn Alfred J. MacKenzie and Helen Deveroux of Toronto 15 Oct. 1900
Available on Ontario Vital Stats Registration(OVSR) Project
Lilybell
Lilybell
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Ken,
Have found a obit for Christopher's wife Lillian if you PM me I will send it on to you. Am also working on another lead will let you know what I find.
Regards
Lilybell
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So a big thankyou to everyone that helped and especially thanks to Lillybells tenacity the mystery of Christmas is solved.
Christmas Aspinall Born Liverpool June 18 1878. Brothers Robert, John, and Peter and sister Mary. Orphaned 1893 age 14 after fathers death and with brother Peter shipped to Canada arriving spring 1893 on the SS Labrador as part of a group of boys from Dr Barnados. went to Mr. J.M. Shier Leaskdale March 1893. 1900 Married Lilian Ann Mackmin and lived with them in York Toronto, address unknown Occupation as Tin worker. 1911 owns own store at 777 Queen St West, Toronto living with Lilian and brother in law Alfred J Mackmin and his wife Helene. Died Nov 17th 1965 and buried at Prospect Cemetary with wife Lilian who died March 14th same year. They lived at 153 Strachen Ave Toronto, just around the corner from where the store was. Looks like no children.
Does anyone know where I can get a trade listing of stores between the periods of 1911 and 1950's I would be interested to find out a little about what type of store and when he sold it and retired etc..
Many thanks to all those that assisted me.
Ken
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Regarding the Mary Aspinall that Jacquie found as a passenger to Canada through Portland, Maine.....
If anyone has full A***Y access, there should be an immigration to the USA record (even though she was passing through) under 'Atlantic Port Passenger Lists'. There is a Mary Aspinall indexed but I don't have access to the details.
The USA started keeping these records in 1907 and they can provide a great deal of information. Assuming this is the same Mary that Jacquie found, there s/b (hopefully) enough info to decide if she is the sibling.
Polarbear
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It would appear that the Mary who arrived in 1910 is a different Mary. On the passenger list entry in the database Polarbear referred to that Mary indicates that her mother is the nearest relative she had in England.
Jacquie
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Good morning Ken,
I have sent in a request to the Toronto Reference Library( they allow you to submit 3 a day) looking for what
business was located at 777 Queen St. W, Toronto . I will post them here but I am not sure it will help.
1911-1912 International Light Co.
1913 Stanley Smith
1915 Esau Muscovite Plumber
1935 David Taback dry goods also Bert King & T A Cuff
1945 Louis Swartz dry goods Allen Myers August Kaikaren
I can request other years if you wish. It does not look like he owned a business unless he was perhaps in a partnership.
Seems like a variety of stores were located there over the years but have not found anything that states he owned a business.
Getting back to Mary I could not find a death for Robert but did find on Rootsweb FreeBMD a death for a Elizabeth
Aspinall who died Sept 1883 Liverpool also found a birth for Mary Aspinall born Sept 1883 could this be your Mary?
Do you think Elizabeth died in childbirth? Not having a lot of luck finding a passenger record for Mary coming to
Canada. Have checked on Ancestorsonboard but nothing with birthdate of 1883 or 1884 coming to Canada.
I do not believe the Mary someone found in Taber ,Alberta is the correct one. Maybe she went to the USA.
Lilybell
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Not that it matters entirely, But the J.M. Shier may have been this farmer in Scott 1891..., James M
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/census-1891/001081-119.02-e.php?person_id_nbr=2249978
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Attachments: from the September 1 1895 Barnardo magazine Ups and Downs - mentions Christmas`s placement at that time.
I have a large article written by Peter Aspinall as well - contact me if you`d like a copy of that as well.
I had helped a member of our Facebook Group - British Home Children Advocacy & Research Association do some research on this family and found these articles. She would likely be related...
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does not look like it attached so, trying it again.