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Research in Other Countries => South Africa => Topic started by: Danchaslyn on Wednesday 01 April 09 12:48 BST (UK)
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Hi
Can someone please advise if the Baptist Church in South Africa keep archives, and if so, whom, and where, and how would I contact? Preferably by email? ???
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hi Bowes and All
Seem to remember that the Rev Thomas Aitken, ex-St Helena Island, formerly of West Linton, nr Edinburgh, Scotland, died in 1935, Kingswilliamstown, Eastern Cape, South Africa, used to be a Baptist Minister in Wynberg, Cape.
Could someone please tell me if Wynberg, Cape, is near Zonnebloem, Gardens, Cape? ???
Also, would someone have info of his being a Baptist Minister in Germiston, Wynberg and Kingswilliamstown, and elsewhere? ???
Any info much appreciated..........
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hello
For anyone needing to find relatives with connections to the Baptist Church in the United Kingdom, it has taken me six weeks to discover that you can contact the Baptist Church, in England, through their website, the Baptist Union of Great Britain.
www.baptist.org.uk
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hello
To help anyone trying to trace a relative who was a Baptist Missionary around the world try logging on to:
www.BMS World Mission.org uk
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hello
For anyone wishing to trace someone who was a Baptist Minister in Scotland, the following www details apply:
Baptist Union of Scotland
Neither the Baptist Union of Great Britain, nor the BMS World Mission will be able to help with details, if the Minister was based in Scotland.
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hello
As Rev Thomas Aitken emigrated from Scotland, to the Island of St Helena as a Baptist Minister, where he was the Prison Chaplain, from roughly 1898 - 1905?? ??? and then on to South Africa, where he again was a Baptist Minister and later, the General Secretary of the Baptist Union of SA, ................. the Baptist Union of Great Britain, the BMS World Mission claim they have no record of him.
The Baptist Union of Scotland claim they have no record of him, but have put me in touch with the Peebles Baptist Church, formed in 1889, which may have been Rev Thomas Aitken's local place of worship, prior to his emigration to the Island of St Helena.
I'm still trying to discover where, and how it was, that Thomas Aitken, became a Baptist Minister?
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hello
To help trace a relative, in South Africa, with connections to the Baptist Church, the following may help:
http://baptistunion.org.za/Department/tabid/ST/Default.aspc
I have contacted them seeking any information on Rev Thomas Aitken, and await their reply. ;)
Any other help and any other details on the Rev Thomas Aitken and family will be happily received. ;D
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hello
Can someone please help me with a lookup as to how and when, Rev Thomas Aitken, travelled, presumably, from Scotland, mid-1896? ???
I've traced him to St Vincent, one of the Cape Verde Islands, where he arrived September, 1896, departed for South Africa, March, 1897.
But have no passage details and would appreciate those and help with any info on him, as a missionary at St Vincent please? ??? ???
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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National Archives fo SA has this info
DEPOT KAB
SOURCE MOOC
TYPE
LEER
VOLUME_NO 6/9/4534
SYSTEM 01
REFERENCE 44284
PART 1
DESCRIPTION AITKEN, THOMAS. ESTATE PAPERS. STARTING 19350000
ENDING 19350000
I'm sure that Church LDS will have a copy of this death notice.
Let me know if this is the right person and I will try and go to LDS and get a copy of the death notice.
B
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Hello B
Wellllll........thank you so much for super flag, the best I've ever seen!!! ;D ;D
And for great help with Thomas Aitken's death, it is the right one. I've just discovered he died 1935, think possibly early in the year, in Kingswilliamstown, and buried, Kingswilliamstown.
Will email you with bare facts I have so far, to-morrow , when internet isn't so busy, this took half an hour to get into RC! >:(..........hoping you will be able to find out more.
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hello
The last record I have of Thomas Aitken in the UK, in Scotland, is:
1891 Census - Thomas Aitken, age 20, Boarder, Joiner
53 Caledonia Road
Cambusmethan
Wishaw
Scotland
Home of Janet Steele
Wishaw is about 15 miles South East of Glasgow. 8)
Some of his family are still at the family home, West Linton at this time. :o
So, I'm assuming he left working for his father, or with his father, John Aitken, also a Joiner? ???
Maybe he attended a Baptist Church in Cambusmethan, and there decided to be a missionary? ???
Have not details on Janet Steele, she may have been a relative, I don't know? ???
Five years later, he is on the Island of St Vincent, part of the Cape Verde Island Group, as a Baptist Missionary.
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hello
No response as yet from the Peebles Baptist Church (since 15 May) and seeing that I now know that Thomas Aitken was living in Cambusmethan, when he was 20, near Wishaw, I have now contacted the Wishaw Baptist Church.
Hoping they will be able to tell me if he was a member of their congregation and if they recruited/trained missionaries for around the world, in the latter part of last century? ???
AND, if they have any specific details of him????? ???
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hello
No response yet from either the Peebles Baptist Church, nor the Wishaw Baptist Church >:(
Would anyone know please, how to discover where and how, Baptist Missionaries were recruited and trained in Scotland, round about 1895? ???
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hello
My late mother's Journal of her trip to the Island of St Helena, October, 1985, accompanied by her elder sister, Dorothy Aitken, and their cousin, Winifred Bateman from the USA, has just been retrieved from storage in the barn.
;)
Pages and pages of photos, memorabilia and 40 A4 pages of handwritten notes to read and enjoy later! 8)
So, at last will have some more answers to never ending questions about the life of her parents, Rev Thomas and Edith Aitken on the Island, from 1897 - 1905! ::)
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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A series of photographs, taken by the Rev Thomas Aitken, 1898 - 1904, had previously been donated by Dorothy Aitken, to the Museum in Jamestown, St Helena, and the lady Curator on the 11 Oct, 1985, was busy showing them to a party of primary school children when Edith Constance Moe, nee Aitken, Dorothy Aitken and Winifred Bateman, his descendants visited the Museum.
Mention is made that in the main square of Jamestown, they walked past the church where the Rev Tom had been Minister and the Hospital where their mother had been a nurse.
On a visit to the Archives, they found records of their Grandparents 'Robert Galbraith (Ships Chandler) and Elizabeth Short.
I don't know where Robert Galbraith fits in the family tree? ???
Edith Mary Short, b St Helena, (married Rev Thomas Aitken), as far as I know, her parents were from Yorkshire, England, but I don't yet know her parents' names? ???
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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I've noticed from my late mother's Journal of the trip to St Helena that her elder sister Dorothy is actually,
'Elizabeth Dorothy Aitken'
also, their American cousin Winifred, age 86, at time of voyage in 1985, is..
'Winifred Grace Bateman'.
Family names again, as Dorothy and Constance's eldest sister was Winifred Grace Aitken.
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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From IGI:
Winifred Bateman, b 25 July, 1899
Death: 1 April, 1996 Social Security No: 131-12-1579
Obtained in New York State
Death Register ZIP Code 28601
North Carolina
Could this be cousin Winifred G Bateman?
Cheers
Danchslyn
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Came across a scrap of paper, in the hand of a long gone relative and it states that THOMAS AITKEN attended Spurgeons College in London for training for the Baptist Ministry.
http://en.wikipedia.org./wiki/Spurgeons_College (See Spurgeons in Wikipedia)
Noted that in Thomas Aitken's day (he may have attended the College between roughly 1887 - 1896), it was called The Pastors College
It opened in 1857 and was named after Charles Haddon Spurgeon and is run by the Baptist Union of Great Britain in association with the University of Wales.
I've emailed the Archivist at the College requesting further details of Thomas Aitken's time there as a student.
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hi Danchaslyn,
You may be able to get some record of your grandfather, Thomas Aitkin from the Baptist Theological College in Randburg, Transvaal. The president of the college was Rev Dr Rex Mathie.
When I lived in Durban and worked for the CESA in Pinetown, Dr Mathie often preached as a guest speaker. This was in 1980's, so not sure if Rex Mathie is still there, but the college would may have records of your grandfather, though he lived in the Cape.
Hope you manage to get a photo of him soon.
Lorand
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Hello Lorand
Well, well, your advice is certainly a new avenue to explore! thank you! ;D
As Thomas Aitken lived and preached in the Cape, Eastern Cape and Natal, and also, come to think of it, Germiston, in the Transvaal, the Baptist Theological College in Randburg, may well have some records on him. 8)
I'll google and see if I can get a contact email address for the College. ::)
Yes, a picture would make me so happy, also to know his history of his last years in Scotland, round about 1890 - 1895? ???
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Hello Lorand
Thank you so much for the info on the BTC Southern Africa, in Randburg, Gauteng. :D
I now have the mail address of their archivist to write to. ;D
Your Rev Dr Rex Mathie must have retired, as the Principal is now, Dr Martin Pohlmann. ::)
Again, thank you so much, I've waited since the beginning of April for someone to please post who to contact in SA to contact the BU Archives! ;D ;D
Cheers
Danchaslyn
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Dear Danchaslyn,
Here is some information about the Rev Thomas Aitken. The information I have about Rev Aitken, is what I can get from the book, “By Taking Heed – the History of Baptists in Southern Africa”, by Sydney Hudson-Reed.
1897 -1905 - Pastor on St Helena Island. After moving to South Africa,
1905 -1910 - Pastor of the Walmer Road Baptist Church, Port Elizabeth
1910 -1913 - Pastor of the Lambert Road Baptist Church, Durban
1913 -1918 - Pastor of the Bulwer Road Baptist Church, Durban
1918 -1920 - Pastor of the Wynberg Baptist Church, Cape Town
1920 -1923 - Pastor of Germiston Baptist Church, Transvaal
1924 -1934 - Pastor of the Taylor Street Baptist Church in King Williams Town
He was elected President of the Baptist Union of South Africa in 1917 at the Bloemfontein Assembly
He was also Secretary of the Baptist Union of SA from April,1919 – January,1935 (obviously in a part-time capacity)
1935 – He passed away.
I spoke to my 96 year old father this evening because he lived in King Williams Town from his birth until 1934. He and my grandparents were members of the Taylor Street Baptist Church in KWT and so my father as a young person remembers him well. My grandparents were involved in a tragic level crossing accident in 1930 and Rev Aitken took my father into his home until the recovery of my grandfather. Unfortunately my grandmother died.
Hope this little bit of information helps you.
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Hi Pasdlm,
Just saw you post re Rev Thomas Aitken. I know that Danchaslyn will be thrilled to get it. You mentioned that your dad lived in King Williams Town and I wondered if he knew my mother's family who lived there at the time, though they would have attended the Presby. church.
The surname is McCall:
Archibald, a butcher.
Mary, his wife
Janet,
Chrissie
James
My mum, Janet McCall, would have gone to school in KWT in the early 1930's
Lorand
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Hi Lorand,
My father is very frail and his memory is far from what it should be. Not surprising for one who will be 97 in a few months. I was very surprised when he said he remembered Thomas Aitken.
My father lives in frail care in East London, South Africa. I live in Scotland and we speak over the phone periodically.
It is possible though that he might remember your family. Will ask him next time I phone.
My grandfather, William Munday, born in the UK, was a General Dealer in KWT (shop in Alexander Street, I think). My father left KWT in 1934 to start work in EL, where he has lived eversince.
Thank you for your response.
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Hi Pasdlm,
Thanks for your reply. Please don't worry your dad unnecessarily, especially as he is now frail and so far away from you.
My mum's family also went to EL where she attended high school and then on to J'burg. They were all fairly big places so he may not remember.
Kind regards
Lorand
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Hi,
I have just been searching for information about my grandfather and his father, this is a long shot! but I noticed that you had information on Baptist Churches in South Africa, I know your father was 97 last September so I know it may be difficult to ask this.
Do you know anything about a Baptist Church in Port Elizabeth? Queens Street? this is where my great grandfather Thomas James Councell (supposedly a pastor later in 1920's 1930's) & Magureta Harris were married in 1903, they had a son Sydney Councell in 1905, they then came back to Bournemouth and it seems that they seperated although never divorced.
Then in 1933 Thomas Councell was killed in an accident on the eve of coming back to South Africa on a missionary trip with a Rev Hutchinson Dennis, they were part of the apastolic faith church in Bournemouth.
I know this is a lot of vague information but it's all we have and just wondered if on the off chance you may know or have any information which would help us.
Many thanks
Louise
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Hi Lubbyloo
Try the link on the post number 6 to help you get info on the Baptist Church in Port Elizabeth at the time of your Grandfather's marriage.
Do you have any further details of the tragic accident of 1933, which killed Thomas James Councell? Such as in which area it occurred and the exact date?
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Eek, thank you I'm new to all this where is post no 6?
Yes I have all the information on the accident, my dad before computers were widely around wrote it all out from a library copy years ago!
It was in Bournemouth on March 20th 1933.
Louise
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Ah doh! I just thought about it and realised what you meant, thank you very much I'll have a look
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Hi Lubbloo
Perhaps I should have said "Reply No: 6"!
Anyway, I'll send you an email address of Baptist Archives in SA (in private messages), whom I'm sure will be able to help you.
I do have several reference books now on the Baptist Church in SA, but they are in storage!
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Hi Lubbyloo
Have sent a private message to you with a suitable email address for you to seek the info you need.
Had trouble sending it, so please let me know if you received it ok?
Good luck
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Hi Pasdlm
Some further info to your very full and welcome Reply 21:
Thomas Aitken's life between his leaving home, and working for his father, John Aitken, as a Joiner, in West Linton, near Edinburgh, Scotland, and the commencement of his missionary work, is of great interest to me.
Without success so far, I've contacted various churches, in and around Wishaw, South of Glasgow, to discover if he is listed as congregant. From early, to mid 1890's he left West Linton, and lived in Wishaw, as a Boarder, still working as a Joiner.
He then has his years of study at Spurgeon's College, London, before embarking on his missionary work. It would be great to know of where he lived, whilst he studied?
And, Pasdlm, he went from the UK (I don't yet know where he left from), straight to the CAPE VERDE ISLANDS, where he had his first missionary posting, on the Island of St Vincent.
Then he went to South Africa, then to the Island of St Helena, then back to South Africa.
Hope all is going well with your Grandfather and that the above will interest him?
Any other help on Thomas Aitken's life in Wishaw, London and St Vincent will be greatly appreciated.
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Hi Danchaslyn,
Have you tried to find him in the census records pre-1911?
If he was a Baptist, then the most likely church in Wishaw where he would have worshipped would be Wishaw Baptist Church (see http://www.wishawbaptist.org/)
You might like to contact Spurgeons College (http://www.spurgeons.ac.uk), or else when in London he might have worshipped at Metropolitan Tabernacle (the Baptist Church made famous by C H Spurgeon in the 19th century) at http://www.metropolitantabernacle.org/. These might still have the old records that may provide some info. If he was in London in 1901, then the census would provide the place where he stayed.
The findmypast website (findmy past.co.uk), I think, provides ships passengers - date, ship name and place they left from in the UK to other countries around the world.
Sadly my father died about 2 months ago aged 97 years. In any case he was very frail and for him to tell me he had remembered Thomas Aitken was quite an achievement.
If you have already tried all the suggestions above without any sucess, then apologies. I hope you will have some further success.
Regards,
pasdlm
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Hello Padslm
My sincere condolences to you and your family upon the recent death of your dear father. What a grand age he reached and I'm so touched that he did indeed, remember my grandfather.
Thank you again, for all your help. I've found Thomas Aitken, in the past on Censuses pre 1911, staying in Wishaw, as a Boarder and still working as a Joiner, and yes, I did contact the Wishaw Baptist Church, but was told they 'don't have an archivist, so therefore would be unable to look up any records'.
I do have Thomas' record from Spurgeon's, but hadn't heard of the Metropolitan Tabernacle, until you mentioned it, this afternoon, so I will give them a try.
Regrettably Thomas had already left for "the Atlantic, St Vincent, South Africa, and St Helena, by 1901. The previous Census has him in Wishaw.
Do you think it possible that Spurgeons had their own accommodation attached to the College?
Thank you
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Hi Danchaslyn,
Sorry, if I had read through the previous postings of this topic I would have realised that you would have pursued the avenues that I suggested in my previous reply!
I did a quick free search on findmypast.co.uk under the Migration tab, and I notice that there are several possibilties. The name Aitken, Thomas or Thos., or T or no initial at all on board a ship going to SA during the 1890's corresponding to a birthdate of about 1871-ish crops up quite a lot. The problem is which one is he? I am not sure whether it will be possible to know with any degree of certainty which one is the correct entry. Maybe he would have gone to SA quite soon after he finished at Spurgeons? - this might at least pinpoint a date of departure and eliminate some possibilities.
This is a tough one!
pasdlm
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Hello Pasdlm
Again, thank you so much for your suggestions and help.
So that we don't go off on a tangent, I know definitely, that Thomas Aitken, left the UK (don't know where from) directly for the Cape Verde Islands, specifically the Island of St Vincent, after he studied at Spurgeon's. There he remained on his first posting.
So many ships travelled, as we all know, from the UK, to the Cape, South Africa, and on to India, Australia etc. I've also found a few Thomas es on some of these different voyages, but none, thus far, to St Vincent.
Were the Cape Verde Islands a regular stopping off point for ships in the late 1890's, early 20C? Or, would this have been an unusual sea voyage?
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Hello Pasdlm
Findmypast.com doesn't appear to have any specific sea voyages by a T Aitken to the Cape Verde Islands, (listed on their site as 'Cape Verde').
To help us pinpoint "our" Thomas Aitken exactly, he was born 4 April, 1871 and died, 7 January, 1935.
He was at his birth home, in West Linton, on the Census of 1881, and a Boarder in a home, in Wishaw on the Census of 1891.
He went to London to study at Spurgeon's.
From September, 1896 (age 25 yrs, 5 mths), until March, 1897 he ministered in his first post as a missionary, on the Island of St Vincent, Cape Verde Islands.
I don't know if he returned to the UK, after his posting on ST Vincent, before his next posting, in South Africa?
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Dear Danchaslyn,
It is true that there is no T Aitken to the Cape Verde Islands specifically. However, Cape Verde is off the west coast of Africa and there are several ships that route in that direction. There is one African destination country nearby - Nigeria - could he have got off in Nigeria and got another boat to Cape Verde? Also ships going to SA, Australia and even the far east would have gone down the west coast of Africa. It is very possible that they might have stopped off at e.g. Cape Verde before going on to their final destination. As I see it, there are several possibilities on findmypast.co.uk. that would fit into this possibility using the surname Aitken and T, Thomas, Thos or without initial between the dates of 1894-1897.
He might not have returned to UK before going on to SA - just joined a ship calling at Cape Verde, if they called in at that port - who knows?
This is all just speculation because in actual fact ship travel in those days was quite sophisticated and they may not have needed to call somewhere before the final destination. My grandfather emigrated to SA in 1901 and the journey was only 3-4 weeks. This is not easy...................
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Dear Pasdlm
Again, thank you, and, well, a new twist to the tale, is that very recent family discussion has resulted in a memory that Thomas Aitken, en route to the Cape, South Africa, to take up his first posting as a Baptist Missionary, departing the UK, possibly August, 1896, was actually, 'shipwrecked' onto the Island of St Vincent, Cape Verde Islands!
Therefore St Vincent, Cape Verde Islands, might never have been his intended destination.
I wonder if and where, there might be records on Cape Verde, of mid-19C Christian Missionaries?
If indeed, Thomas Aitken, was 'shipwrecked', it could explain his quite short period, on St Vincent, as a Missionary, i.e. from September, 1896 - March, 1897?!
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Dear Pasdlm
Once again thank you for your suggestion that I contact the Metropolitan Tabernacle, London, for possible information on Thomas Aitken, as a congregant
I've received a very speedy reply to my enquiry. Most unfortunately, the Metropolitan Tabernacle do not have an Archivist and are not in a position, nor have the resources necessary, to assist me with my enquiry.
Of course, they are predominantly a place of worship and not a museum, nor archive.
Upon researching further, the Met Tab was actually burned to the ground, twice, once in 1898, and a second time, during bombing May, 1941, WWII! On both occasions only the front portico, and the basements were left standing, so, let's hope all records were stored in the basements!
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Hi Danchaslyn,
I did a free search on findmypast for ship passengers from UK ports to any part of the world. I did not include first name, initials nor any definite gender and several possibilities were given. In my limited experience of genealogy research, I have found transcriptions errors to be a big problem, especially because of my own surname. I have become suspicious of any transcribed record and must see the original. Could the initial T be erroneously transcribed as J? There is a J Aitken fitting the birthdate and year of travel going to East London, South Africa, in the year 1896. The first stopping point in SA would be Cape Town where he might have disembarked. Again this is pure speculation. I don't have a subscription to findmypast to verify or see the original. The prospect of a 'shipwreck' had never entered my mind! The ships then were steam driven so maybe they had serious engine problems, or maybe they ran aground!
Well I hope that the records at Met Tab were kept in the basement or else they would be gone forever!
Finally, did Thomas ever come back to the UK? Maybe before leaving for SA after being on Cape Verde. Ancestry.co.uk have passengers lists for incoming passengers. I am not a subscriber to this either.
Hope this helps.
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Dear Pasdlm
Absolutely concur, have found on previous records of all sorts, that the "scribes" don't always necessarily transcribe folk's details, accurately.
Your suggestion of the "J" Aitken, travelling in 1896 to East London, South Africa, sounds to me like a stroke of pure genius!
Once I have a little more time, I'm also going to investigate how one finds out about maritime disasters? Shipwrecks, especially in such an unusual and notable part of the world, such as Cape Verde Islands, must surely have been noteworthy?
And, yes, Thomas and his wife Edith Mary did travel from at least South Africa, back to the UK, and maybe even from their posting on the Island of St Helena, to the UK. They spent one long furlough back in the UK, I'll have to try to find my dates for this, or perhaps, "baitken" and "weech" may well have them instantly to hand?
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From "Missions Time Line" (Christian Mission History);
1876 - 'In September, a rusty ocean steamer arrives at a port on the
Calabar River, in what is now known as Nigeria.
That part of Africa was then known as the "White Man's Grave"!
The only woman on board that ship is 29 year old Mary Slessor, a
Missionary.'
Could there have been other missionaries on board? Would this be one of the regular shipping routes, used to transport missionaries, all over Africa, and beyond?
To date have not been able to discover the name of the ship, or it's intended destination etc?
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No further details on Thomas Aitken's voyage from the UK - Cape Verde Islands, as a bachelor missionary, as yet.......but;
After several years, on the Island of St Helena, by now a married Baptist Pastor, on 2 August, 1901 Pastor & Mrs Aitken and baby sailed on the SS "Corn Exchange", from Jamestown, St Helena, to Cape Town, on three months leave.
On 21 November, 1901, Pastor & Mrs Aitken and baby arrived at Jamestown, from Cape Town, in the "Donolly Castle", only to find they had to observe four days quarantine on the hulk "Howden", before they could go ashore, on Monday, 25 November, 1901.
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Hi Danchaslyn,
Good for you finding details about the dates and ships that the Aitken family travelled between St Helena and Cape Town!!!
Mary Slessor did sail for Nigeria in 1876 as you say. However, I understood that Thomas Aitken would have sailed for South Africa, or St Helena, in 1896?
As regards to furlough of Thomas and Edith - it seems as if dates are very important because many people with the name of Aitken travelled by ship during the early part of the last century. I hope that you will be able to identify the dates more accurately.
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Dear Pasdlm
Well, twas from a St Helenian personal source!
And, yes, whoops, in my fervour I did confuse Mary Slessor's very much earlier voyage with a possibility for Thomas'. Thank you for keeping me on the straight and narrow.
Good news, with regard to Thomas and Edith Aitken's furlough, from the Island of St Helena, to the UK; 'The Transport "Staffordshire" took Pastor Aitken, Mrs Aitken and their three children to England for six months leave on April, 15, 1903.
They returned to Jamestown, St Helena, by the SS "Avondale Castle", arriving on October, 13, 1903.'
As both of Thomas' parents, John and Grace Aitken were still alive during 1903, I feel certain, they would have for some of the furlough, stayed with them, at West Linton, Scotland, and with Thomas' elder sister, Elizabeth Aitken.
At the Aitken household in West Linton at the time, would also have been the children of Thomas' eldest brother, Sir Robert & his wife, Lady Caroline Aitken (of Bombay, India) who were being raised by their paternal grandparents.
i.e.; nephew, John Ellis Aitken, niece Marjorie Grace Aitken and nephew, Robert Gordon Aitken.
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Hi Danchaslyn,
So it seems as if all the furlough details are now known. It just remains for the outgoing ship and exact dates from UK to Nigeria/St Helena?
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Dear Pasdlm
Ah, but there's more........
On July 5, 1905, Mrs T Aitken left Jamestown, Island of St Helena, for Port Elizabeth, South Africa.
Don't have details of the ship, or her return journey, but am guessing this might have been a trip 'on family business'?
cheers
Danchaslyn
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On December, 5th, 1905, Rev Thomas and Mrs Edith Aitken, and their three children, departed Jamestown, Island of St Helena, as passengers on ship ?, bound for Port Elizabeth, South Africa.
Don't yet know their arrival date in Port Elizabeth?
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http://baptistunionhistoricalsociety.blogspot.com/2011/12/rev-thomas-aitken.html
Stumbled upon this thread by chance - hope the link above is of some assistance
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Thank you casman69. The Baptist Union Historical Society makes interesting reading. I hope that Danchaslyn
has had time to read it. I knew some of the people down the right side of the webpage - in fact one was my daughter-in-law's grandfather!
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Greetings!
As a new meber of this group, I would be interested to hear from anyone who can add any fiurther information to that which I've been able to glean about my ancestors living in St Helena.
My grandmother, Emma Minnnie Short, was born on the Island on 27th March 1871, one seven siblings . Her parents were Robert Galbraith Short and Elizabeth Short, nee Denton. She is believed to have been a nurse and met my grandfather, a soldier by the name of William Porter Firth while he was stationed on the Island in 1898/9.
Her father was born in Scotland as Robert Galbraith and settled in St Helena. According to verbal family tradition his father was a sea captain, who died at sea. Young Robert moved to St Helena to be cared for by an uncle, surnamed "SHORT" and his two unmarried sisters. Apparently Robert was subsequently known as Robert Galbraith Short. He married Elizabth Denton in St Pauls Church, Jamestown on 23rd June 1863 and his occupation as shown on the marriage certificate is "Farmer" and his address is "Rose Bower". There is a record of him trading under the name of Messrs R. Galbraith & Co, in partnership with Elizabeth Galbraith and William Ackley (Deed dated 1868 between these three named and Nathanliem Solomon, George Mop and James Magnus Gideon). I am advised by a friend who visited St Helena that there is still a shop in Jamestown, though now trading by another name, is known by the locals as "Galbraiths".
Elizabeth Denton came from Hull, England and trained as a teacher in Lincoln. She sailed to St Helena, probably in 1862 to take up the post of the first schoolmistress in Jamestown.
Robert died in March 1911 having survived his wife by a few years. Their children were
Eleanor, b. Circa 1865. teacher
Amy, b. 9 September 1866, m. Frank Bateman
William, b. 11 April 1869
Emma Minnie, b 27 March 1871,m William Porter Firth, d. 4 June 1935
Edith Mary, b. 4 February 1874, m. Tom Aitken
Robert Galbraith, b. 13 July 1875. m.
Mabel, b 21 March 1879, d. 5th April 1879
Thanks, in anticipation of help.
Peter
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Hi Peter,
Hopefully Danchaslyn will be able to assist you in this. It seems part of Danchaslyn's family line.
Best wishes
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Family folklore had it that Galbraiths was a ships chandlers? also that Emma Minnie was always known as "Minnie". Amy and Frank Bateman left St Helena for America. Mabel and one other sister were the Head of and a Teacher at the Lace School on St Helena.
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Just come across Peter's post about the Galbraiths on St Helena. I've been working on the Ackelys on St Helena with a lady in Australia. A will arrived today from England in which Robert Galbraith was one of the executors:
dated 15 Sep 1867 of Alfred Ackely, whose brother William Ackely and Alfred's wife Katherine Rose Ackely were the other executors. Alfred refers to Robert Galbraith as "my beloved uncle" which would make Robert and William uncle/nephew as well.
There was a Mary Ann Ackely on the island as well, and it's her I'm trying to trace. She was born c1839 and married John Statham Stewart in 1858. They had two children, Mary Galbraith Stewart and Robert Galbraith Stewart so presumably she was also connected to William and Alfred, possibly a sister or a cousin.
The will was proved on St Helena on 13 Nov 1868 where William Ackely and Katherine Rose Ackely were described as the surviving executors, implying that Robert Galbraith had died between Sep 1867 and Nov 1868, although your findings contradict this.
One interpretation of events is that one of Robert's two sisters that you mention married William and Alfred Ackely's father.
Any light that you can shed on this aspect would be appreciated.
David
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I've been working with Peter offboard and thought it might be helpful if I recorded for posterity what we found.
Family tradition says that "Galbraith - living in Berwick area. Father - Sea Captain. several children, Robert eldest. Father died at sea while children young. widow relatively poor. Bachelor uncle offered to adopt Robert and take him to St Helena provided his surname changed to "Short". Uncle Short was owner of a typical Island import & export business. Robert (Galbraith) Short settled in St Helena as assistant to uncle. Two maiden Galbraith sisters kept house."
As with most family legends there seems to be a lot of truth in the story, but it's got mangled.
His age in St Helena implies a birth in 1839.
In 1841 living in Newham, Bamburgh, Northumberland was
Richard Short 35 Schoolmaster; Eleanor Short 40 b Scotland; William Short12; Thomas Short 10; Elijah Short 8; Mary Short 6; Jane Short 4; Robert Galbreath 2. All ex Eleanor b Northumberland.
In the same place in 1851 the family consisted of
Richard Short head marr 47 Schoolmaster b Egglingham; Eleanor Short wife 51 b Scotland; Mary A G Short 16 b Bamburgh; Jane Short 14 b B'gh; Philip G Short son 9 b B'gh; Richard J Short son 6 b B'gh; Robert G Short 12 nephew (adopted son deleted) b Berwick on Tweed; Jane Galbreath mother in law 76 b Scotland
Richard Short had married Eleanor Galbreath at Bamburgh on 18 May 1828.
So the deleted “Adopted son” replaced by “nephew” in 1851 seems to confirm that Richard and Eleanor Short had adopted Robert Galbreath, and that he was the son of a sibling of Eleanor. So that part of the family story stacks up, as does the part about living in the Berwick area. Additional evidence is provided by a descendant of Eleanor Short who possesses a poem printed on silk, inscribed "R Noble, St Helena 6 Nov 1860" ‘Lines written on the death of Mrs Robert Galbraith’ who d Nov 4, which links the Bamburgh family to St Helena.
Also living on St Helena was a Robert Galbraith who was an uncle of William Ackely. In 1868 Robert Galbraith Short, along with an Elizabeth Galbraith was in partnership with William Ackely as R Galbraith & Co. It seems as though Robert junior went to St Helena to work for an uncle Galbraith, rather than an uncle Short. So the family story is half right on this score. It's the bit about Robert being the son of a sea captain who died at sea when Robert and several younger siblings were still young that concerns me. There was a sea captain who was buried on St Helena:
a plaque in St James Garden, Lower Jamestown in St Helena, reads: “ GALBREATH, William McKellar (Capt)*; d. 9 Nov 1843, aged 30 years. A native of Greenock in North Britain and late Commander of the barque “Alchema” who in January 1843 was shipwrecked on a coral reef in the China Seas and fell a victim to disease induced by the privations which he suffered on his passage home. He was landed at St Helena and died in the 31st year of his age. His sorrowing relatives far separated from his cold remains can but lament his early and hapless fate and destiny to the affection which they bore him by erecting this tablet to his much cherished memory”
A William McKellar Galbreath was born in Greenock on 28 Oct 1812 to parents Matthew Galbreath and Agnes McKellar. A newspaper article reads as follows: “ Captain William McKellar Galbreath died at St. Helena on 9th November 1843 age 31”. (Greenock Advertiser 29.12.1843)
If Robert was born in 1839 and his father was shipwrecked in Jan 1843 there isn't time for Robert to have had several younger siblings. And we know from the 1851 that Eleanor (Galbreath) Short's mother was Jane Galbreath not Agnes. In 1841 living in Berwick on Tweed were Thos? Galbraith 70 pensioner & Jane Galbraith 65, both b Scotland. In the next house was ?? Carr 65, Geo Carr 10 and Jane Galbraith 30 . Subsequent censuses show Jane Galbraith was unmarried and born in Berwick on Tweed in 1807-8. I think there's every chance that she was the mother of an illegitimate Robert Galbraith, and the sea captain story has got embellished so that he turned into the father of Robert.
Berwick on Tweed baptism register needs to be checked for the baptism of Robert Galbraith c1839.
Having helped sort out Robert Galbraith Short, I'm no further forward with my Ackely problem, but my understanding of the Galbraiths on St Helena has improved! And I still think that the mother of the Ackelys was a sister of Robert and Eleanor Galbraith! Just can't prove it. Yet!!!
David
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Hi Peter
This is strangly the same as my family tree, we also have a robert galbraith who we thought was an orphan that was adopted by the family short. He also went on to st helena and married an elizabeth denton or patton. It all seems almost identicle to mine, also with the scots background. The dates just seem funny. Robert i have as being born in 1869 and dying in 1959. He was my moms grandfather and she remembers him dying when she was six. Things that are similar are:
Scotland link
St Helena link
Robert Galbraith Short (Either adopted or looked after, we know it as adopted)
Married Elizabeth (some in my family say that the nee was denton others say patton)
Dates although they dont match are around the same timeframe.
One of Roberts sons was Leslie William Short which was my grandfather and i am trying to trace my family tree and stumbled across this post.
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I don't like to leave loose ends dangling, so here's an update on the Galbraith family. A visitor to St Helena recently sent me photographs of the wills of Robert Galbraith who died in 1868,and Robert Galbraith Short, his nephew born 1838, who died in 1911.
In the earlier will Robert Galbraith consistently referred to his nephew as Robert Galbraith Roper, then ruled through Roper and added Short above and initialled the alteration. There's a birth registration in Berwick-upon-Tweed in the Dec quarter 1838 of Robert Galbraith Roper (don't ask; no idea how I failed to spot this three years ago!). The birth cert arrived last week and his parents are shown as John Roper, shoemaker, and Jane Roper formerly Galbraith. The informant was Jane Roper. One problem: I can't see a marriage between John Roper and Jane Galbraith. I can find John Roper shoemaker and Jane Galbraith in subsequent censuses, but are unmarried and not living together. But no John and Jane Roper. Cynical old codger that I am, I suspect that Jane Galbraith registered the birth as Roper to hide the illegitimacy.
Jane Galbraith was the sister of Robert Galbraith on St Helena, and of Eleanor Short née Galbraith who adopted Robert Galbraith Roper.
bantumi69 - Robert Galbraith Short married Elizabeth Denton in 1863 in St Helena, and had a son Robert Galbraith Short in 1875. Did this Robert Galbraith Short move to South Africa at some time after 1896 (when he was initiated into the Freemasons in St Helena)?
David
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Hi
There is a Robert Galbraith Short born 1876 listed as a student on the 1891 Census on Family Search
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QN5W-F2M
Then there are 7 births to a Robert Galbraith Short taking place in South Africa with spouse Sarah Short also on Family Search. Childrens names Grace, Leslie, Thelma, Edith, Gordon Victor, Stanley and Sidney first birth in 1916 there are images to acompany the birth entries here
https://familysearch.org/search/record/results?count=20&query=%2Bgivenname%3A%22robert%20galbraith%22%20%2Bsurname%3Ashort
and then in our Archives
DEPOT TAB
SOURCE MHG
TYPE LEER
VOLUME_NO 0
SYSTEM 01
REFERENCE 4311/59
PART 1
DESCRIPTION SHORT, ROBERT GALBRAITH.
STARTING 19590000
ENDING 19590000
REMARKS SURVIVING SPOUSE SARAH SHORT (BORN WOODWARD).
and then her Estate File
DEPOT TAB
SOURCE MHG
TYPE LEER
SYSTEM 01
REFERENCE 2726/66
PART 1
DESCRIPTION SHORT, SARAH. (BORN WOODWARD).
STARTING 19660000
ENDING 19660000
REMARKS PREDECEASED SPOUSE ROBERT GALBRAITH SHORT.
Perhaps this is the son of Robert and Elizabeth with his wife.
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Thanks very much 3sillydogs. I think that just about completes the Shorts/Galbraiths from St Helena. It's been an interesting bit of research
David
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Hi Guys
Wow i had actually given up my search because of funds really, but this information is amazing i need to find all my stuff i did get and try figure this all out. All i know is of my grandfather Leslie William Short in south africa posted during the war i think. The family dropped the Galbraith Short and just kept the Short so thats all i know.
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I think Galbraith was just used as a middle name, rather than a double barreled surname. The brother of Robert Galbraith Short, born 1875, who went to South Africa from St Helena, was plain William Robert Short.
David