RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => Europe => Topic started by: Valigene on Sunday 29 March 09 02:33 BST (UK)
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Hi, my grandma was Sarah Sadaski, she is supposed to have been born in Leeds in 1888 but I cannot find her record.
her father
Michael Sadaski
Birth: 1866
Russia
Death: 09.10.1937
Birkenhead, England, United Kingdom
(I thought he was Polish)!!!
Mum was
Fanny Taylor
Birth: 1863
Russia
Death: 06.11.1929
Fannys dad was Morris Taylor
My grandad was Gershon ?Braun but became George Brown when he arrived in Uk.
Gershon Brown
Birth: 1879??
Russia
Death: 27.01.1964
I thought he was Russian!!!
His dad was Wolfe.
My parents separated when I was a baby and I never met any of these people.
The Sadaskis landed in Birkenhead and the Browns landed in Hull, they were alll Tailors by trade.
They were all Jews.
How do I find out more about them?? Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks Val
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Hi Val,
I've not had much luck finding them on the incoming passenger lists (so wondering if their names changed). I have found this, though, and wondered if you had seen it:
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/displaycataloguedetails.asp?CATLN=6&CATID=5091955
Just wondering where you found the information regarding Venezuela, Val?
I'll keep looking for you.
Kind regards,
Paulene :)
P.S. I did find a Michael Sadecki, born 1866, who came to Liverpool from NY, in 1920 (too late, anyway) - but, he was a cabinet maker.
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Val,
I think this might be Gershon:
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/displaycataloguedetails.asp?CATLN=6&CATID=5107835
Hope so.
Paulene :)
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Hi again,
One here for a gentleman named Wolfe Brown, but the date is late and place is different - in 1927, and London. So not sure about this one - let me know what you think, Val.
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/displaycataloguedetails.asp?CATLN=6&CATID=5112604
Cannot find anything for Sarah Sadaski, or Fanny Taylor.
Paulene :)
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In Polish:
Michał Sadowski. Notice the crossed L (Ł)
Sara Sadowska. Female christian names all end in 'a'. The surname follows suit.
more likely Sadowska/i not Sadaski.
Keep in mind that this is only how I see it, but it might help.
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Hi kaja,
I played about with the endings a bit - I knew the married names of women in Russia are different at the end, and the names (surnames) of the daughters, too. However, still couldn't find anything, though :(
It's good you pointed this out for anyone reading the thread :)
Thank you.
Paulene :)
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Just checked on the incoming passenger lists for Sadowska (just in case I didn't do that one) but nothing - can't find any info re them arriving on the lists :-\ There are some, but no Sara/h.
Any ideas, kaja?
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Sorry I got hooked on these sites.
Michael Sadaski is my man I am sure. The Russian sucre bit i got on ancestry.com and I don't think its right. dad told me before he died that the Sadaskis came from Poland and the Browns from russia but I think it was Prussia--Russia.
The spelling is Sadaski, and my family is the only one I have found in the Uk spelt this way.I will try to get the Nationalisation papers of my grandfather and great grandfather I have e mailed asking how to open Gershon.
You are amazing I am so stuck with this side of my family(the side that I am most interested) I have a picture of my grandmother sarah and I am her double, she died 16 years before I was born so could never have met her.
Not sure how you find these details but if you fancy another go.
Gershon had a brother Louie and a sister Selina(Civia/Sivia) Louies wife Malka Cruprik and sisters Rachel and Rebecca Cruprik.
Only if you want to look please don't feel obliged to.
Thanks Val
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Hi Val,
If they're the right ones it says Michael was 'from Russia'.
Once we have established whether they are the right ones, and where they came from, then we can find where the appropriate records/sources will be to do your family tree.
I'm not an expert on this, but I have a relative who is from Russia; and he told me his grandmother's line came from Lithuania (Jewish); so I've started looking at sites and information in case I look into one day.
I would think it's pretty amazing when you look at the old photographs and see such a resemblance. Lovely :D
I will see if I can find anything for you on the other names, but not sure how long it will take, as I'm helping someother people on other threads - I will do my best, Val.
Kind regards.
Paulene :)
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Hi Val,
I think this must be Louie:
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/displaycataloguedetails.asp?CATLN=6&CATID=5118942
BFN,
Paulene :)
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Val,
I can't find anything for the others, but if you want to check yourself, here is the site:
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/searchthearchives/?source=searcharchives
Simply put 'naturalisation - brown' (or whatever name you want to search for).
Hope this helps - I'll see if I can find those names on the incoming passengers list.
Paulene :)
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Thank you so much for your help. I think Russia is the right destination.
If I can find the year Michael came to Uk, I will be able to work out who was born in Uk as I cannot find a birth record for Sarah in Uk but records say she was born in Leeds???
Thanks again
Val
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Hi Val & Paulene :)
Val, do you have the Sadaski family's 1911 Census entries? You will have to pay to view them, but the free search option shows:
Ormskirk, Lancashire
SADASKI
Michael 1867 44
Fanny 1865 46
Lily 1890 21
Jacob 1892 19
Samuel 1894 17
Leah 1897 14
Sculcoates, Yorkshire East Riding
SADASKI
Betsy 1896 15
Kind regards
Gaie
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Hi and thanks for that. I know polish ladies are ska but I have her marriage certificate and she called herself Sadaski. I also have Michaels death certificate he is Sadaski too so I know the spelling is correct.
I love all the imput this site is great, I only found it last night.
Val
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Have you checked: FreeBMD
There are a few Sadaski. Two in Leeds... your area of interest.
Then family or part of them seemed to have moved to Croydon, yes?
You might find links by checking those other people at freebmd.
Poland, Russia, Lithuania are all connected by 'Polish Partition'
If someone says he was Polish, but the documents say Russian. He was probably born in the old Polish territory.
There are posts about this problem in other threads.
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Hi Val
Sister Betsy may be this one:
Sep Qtr 1895 Leeds Vol 9b Page 471
Fanny Betsy SEDASKY
And Leah may be this one:
Dec Qtr 1897 Leeds Vol 9b Page 429
Leah SIDASKY
Samuel could be:
Dec Qtr 1893 Leeds Vol 9b Page 431
Samuel SATISKY
Lily could be:
Jun 1890 Leeds Vol 9b Page 473
Lily SITKY
Is Sarah this one?
Sep Qtr 1888 Leeds Vol 9b Page 452
Sarah SATKY
Kind regards
Gaie
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Sorry, missed off Jacob!! ::)
Could be:
Dec Qtr 1891 Leeds Vol 9b Page 461
Jacob SIDKEY
KR
Gaie
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Hi Gaie and kaja,
Have a look at this family I've just found on the 1891 census, and tell me what you think, please:
Head of Household Michael Rosenberg b. 1867
RG12 Piece 3714 Folio 115 page 9.
I wonder if that might explain why we can't find their entry into the UK :-\
TIA,
Paulene :)
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You are absolute stars, all who have helped here. Thank you so much.
xxxxx Val
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Ah, Val, but is it them? Do you have access to the census?
Tell me, is the avator pic new - or didn't I notice it before?
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Hi,
They are all the right names and all the right years so i guess yes we have them. I have got dates from other sources, marriages, deaths etc. I used to visit our local fhs but found it a bit much as I am not so well, so I left things for a while. I have now restarted and put it all on ancestry.com.
Yes I put the picture of grandma Sarah Sadaski on. I am a lot like her. Even as "cuddly" lol
Val
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She looks lovely :)
I'll just have alook at he passenger lists again for you , Val - now that I know we are looking for the name Rosenberg.
Back soon.
Take care,
Paulene :)
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I search through ancestry.com 1901 census shows them all as Sadoski and when they married they married as Sadaski.
Val
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When I did a name check at JewishGen I found some Sadoski.
And no Sadaski. But I only checked Poland, so there could be more elsewhere.
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I think its russia, dad said poland but i think he may have been wrong. What is this Michael Rosenburg, willow is looking for?
do you know. I think I saw a link to one on a census.
Val
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Hi
I don't think the census that you've found is the right one! It's been strangely mis-transcribed. The image shows:
36 Lascelles Road
Michael Rosenberg Head 24 Tailor Grodney, Russia
Scilley Rosenberg Wife 25 Grodney, Russia
Separate household:
38 Lascelles Road
Morris Levi Father 21 Shoemaker Grodney, Russia
Katie Levi Mother 22 Malava, Poland
Sarah LEVI Daughter 11mths Leeds, England
The others are all Middletons in a separate household.
Sarah would have been about 2-3, and Lily would have been about 1 year.
But you're right about the Rosenxxxx link; in the 1901 census the Sadoskis (sic) are sharing a property with a brother-in-law Ben Rosenborn, sister-in-law Helen and their daughter Rebecca under 1 mth.
RG13 3533 107 29
Kind regards
Gaie
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Thanks, Gaie - I think I got too excited about the wife's name - just realised it was Gershon's wife who had a similar name :-[
I'll keep looking for another Michael born c 1866, with a daughter, Sarah.
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Here you are:
1891
RG12 3688 65 3
16 Templar Street, Leeds Central, Yorkshire
Transcribed as SUTKEY and it looks like SUTKEY on the image:
Michael Head 26 Tailor Russia
Fanny Wife 25 Russia
Sarah Dau 2 Yorkshire Leeds
Lilly Dau 6mths Yorkshire Leeds
Abraham RABENSTALL(?) Visitor 22 Tailor Germany
Hyman SUTKEY Visitor 17 Slipper Maker Russia
Kind regards
Gaie
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Wonderful stuff, Gaie :D
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Well, it fits quite well with the possible birth regs I found, and you can see how the surname seems to have progressed /evolved through the children's regs and the censuses ;D
Are we likely to find incoming passenger lists from Europe in the C19th?
Val, do you know when/where Michael and Fanny were married? If not, how do you know Fanny's father was called Morris Taiylor (from post #1)?
Gaie
Oops, cant' spell!! ::)
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Hi Gaie.
This is what it says about the database on ancestry.co.uk:
This database is an index to the Board of Trade’s passenger lists of ships arriving in the United Kingdom from foreign ports outside of Europe and the Mediterranean from 1878-1888 and 1890-1960. Information listed on the passenger lists may include: name of passenger, their birth date or age, port of departure, port of arrival, date of arrival, and vessel name.
Paulene :)
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Hi Gaie, I have my family tree on ancestry.com and found a lady with Fanny and Michael Sadaski on it. I didn't know fannys name. Well she is a direct descendant of Fanny sister--guess what her sisters name is !!!!!!!
Helen and she married Benjamin Roseburn, Rececca was oldest of 8 children.
If any of you want a look at my tree i will give you an invitation with pleasure. You are making it such fun.
I have got a bit despondant as I have Lupus and cannot get about like I did so progress has been slow lately but I am sure I will get links here.
Gaie I see you are searching in Leicester--who for?? coz I live just on the outskirts of leicester. I was a District Nurse before becoming ill and know the area well
Val
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Hi Val,
So sorry to hear you have lupus - I can understand that must be hard for you, especially when you have been so used to helping others. I'm so pleased we have brightened your day :)
Have you see the JewishGen webiste? Some of the information is free, I believe.
http://www.jewishgen.org/
I'm just looking around to see if I can find anything that might help you - I'll be back if I can.
Take care,
Paulene :)
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Val,
You might find this interesting reading while you're waiting:
http://www.saperia.com/Pages/history.htm
Hope so.
Paulene :)
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This is right. Both Sarah and Gershon were Tailors. As you know the Sadaskis settled in Leeds before moving up to Birkenhead, Liverpool. Gershon came into Hull where him and Sarah lived until she died in 1936.
Val
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Val,
Not having much luck in finding anything relating to passenger lists from Europe, but this is interesting regarding the social history of when your family lived and worked in Leeds in the nineteenth century:
http://www.rootschat.com/links/05yi/
It all helps to form a picture of their lives.
Paulene :)
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Well thanks for all your help tonight its been great, the funny thing is all my married life with 1st husband i spend most weekends in Leeds visiting his family not knowing thats where my roots were--I hated the place!!!
Oh well life moves on. Its 1.29 here and time for bed. Hope you are around tomorrow. I will be. Thanks to you both for all your help
Val
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Goodnight, Val - I'll look out for your tomorrow.
Sleep well + God bless.
Paulene :)
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A present for you for the morning, Val:
http://www.jewishgen.org/jcr-uk/Leeds.htm
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Hi Ladies!
Thanks for the links, Paulene! Val, sorry to hear you've been unwell. Hopefully this has cheered you up a bit ;D
My mother was a District Nurse too, and I know what enjoyment she had from being out and about; she's retired now.
My Leicestershire lines are the names listed - Pollards, etc. And I'll certainly bear you in mind if I need any help, thanks for the offer :).
Paulene, yes that's why I thought we would have difficulty in finding these people on the passenger lists; unless they were on a boat that was going on to the USA/Canada, then usually you can't find the lists between European ports and Britain; I don't think they were kept - what a shame!
But the National Archive findings could prove fruitful, Val; and it might be worth getting that birth cert for Sarah SATKY, it's the most promising one I could find.
Val, by the looks of some of those trees on Ancestry, some people are just copying other people's trees without checking sources etc (the Russian, Sucre, Venezuela bit springs to mind ::) - where does that come from?). So do take them with a pinch of salt - unfortunately it's very common on the net ::) !!! But I'm glad you've linked up with Fanny's sister's descendant. Is it Janet's tree?
Kind regards
Gaie
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Yes it is Janets tree. Her husbands mum is a sort of second cousin to me, I think it was a slip of the hand as when I checked the drop down window is Russia, then Russian sucre. I kept an open mind but I knew sarahs sisters hubby etc came from raigrod russia. I am sure its Russia/poland. Sadaski is certainly a polish name. I am still trawling through all these links
Where do your Clarkes come from?? Its the only name I recognise.
Val
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Raigrod should now read as Rajgród, which is in Poland.
It's north-east Poland. You should be able to locate it on a map.
Do a place name check at JewishGen.
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I have printed off these census, have Sadaski address in Leeds and Gershon was living with his sister selina and hubby Sam Goldstein. I found that address in Hull, unfortunately original house had been knocked down. I don't know whether the Sadaskis came from Rajgród, how can I find out ?? but Sarahs sister Lily married Isidore Finklestein. I met their son once before he died and told me his family came from there but mum was born in Leeds, o whether he met dad or grand parents Michael nad Fanny?
He also cried when he saw me, he said I looked just like his mum!!
Val
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Hi Val, Gaie and kaja.
Just got home and read your posts. I think the birth certificate forr Sarah might be interesting, too.
Just found this jolly site about Rajgrod - it mentions Lithuania!
I'm going to have a read through it now.
Hope you've all had a good day.
Paulene :)
Whoops:
The site would help, wouldn't it!: :-[ ;D
http://www.angelfire.com/il3/fam/Rajgrod.htm
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I am soooo excited. I have sent for Sarahs birth certificate. I have also sent for Michael Sadaski's naturalisation papers and I have asked them to open Gershons naturalisation papers as they are closed so hopefully they should be sorted soon. Will get Michaels tomorrow, will keep you posted.
Val
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That's wonderful, Val - look forward to hearing your news.
Hope you get some response to your other thread, too.
Take care,
Paulene :)
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I got it today!
Michael Sadaski was born in Zaga in the Provence of Kovna.Russia. Kovna became Kaunas I have discovered.Lipmana & Chaiu were his parents.
Val
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I just wonder if there is any way we can search Russian records. I have found the place of birth Zaga is spelt Zhager and the province of Kovno is now Kaunas.
Great great grand parents are Lipmano and Chiau Sadaski I assume Limano is the man.
Any suggestions where I start?
Val
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Hi Val ;D
Well done with your searching so far!!
Have you tried this site before? It's part of the LDS collection and is a worldwide place-name search for all the places for which they hold films. If you find what you're searching for you can order the film to your local biggish LDS centre and view the records.
http://www.familysearch.org/eng/library/fhlcatalog/supermainframeset.asp?display=localitysearch&columns=*,0,0
If you put "Kovno" in the Place box and click Search, and then keep going, you will come to a Topic list that includes Jewish records.
I couldn't see Zaga or Zhager listed, but it may have come under a bigger village.
Even if you don't find a film for this particular place, it is a useful site; I've found records of my Polish ancestors using this site.
Kind regards
Gaie
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Hi Gaie,
Thanks but I cannot get it to work.
Val
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Hmm, :-\, the site seems to be having problems at the moment, sometimes it displays a page, sometimes it doesn't ???. But the link does work!
Try this: http://www.rootschat.com/links/0600/
That should take you to the film notes pages (there are 375 film notes listed for Kaunas metrical books).
Kind regards
Gaie
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Hi Val and Gaie,
Sorry for ignoring you over the weekend - it was my son's eighteenth birthday, and we had visitors.
Val, that is wonderful news - so now you can move on to the next step :)
I couldn't get the LDS link to work either, but I know there have been problems recently.
However, I've just found this link with regard to the Jewish cmeteries (Old and New), and this might be of interest to you, Val:
http://www.jewishgen.org/cemetery/e-europe/lith-S-Z.html
Still looking for other sites.
Hope you both have a good day.
Paulene :)
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Hello Val,
I thought the others might be interested, so here's the text of my PM to you.
I've done some further investigating for you.
The ancestral town is today called Zagare, and is located on Lithuania's northern border to Latvia.
Zhagare (as it was called in Russian) was on the northern border of the Kovno gubernia (in the Shavli district).
This link shows you where it is:
http://data.jewishgen.org/wconnect/wc.dll?jg~jgsys~shtetm~-2620841
Nowadays, the Jews of Zagare are referred to as Lithuanian Jews (Litvaks) as a genealogical distinction. In the 19th century, they were simply Jews living in the Russian Pale of Settlement.
Unfortunately, our friends the Mormons have not microfilmed any of the Jewish records from Zagare, which was quite a sizeable town with a few factories. Records may be held in the Lithuanian State Historical Archives, but they would be in Russian and Hebrew/Yiddish - a bit of a challenge.
To really find out the status and availability of vital records you should join the Litvak Special Interest Group (SIG) on jewishgen.
http://www.jewishgen.org/Litvak/
I'm guessing that the surname was originally Sadoksky or Shadovsky, but I could be wrong. The name Sadaski does not appear anywhere.
Michael's father's name was Lipman, without the 'o'. Can you post a snippet to rootschat showing both his parent's names; you may have misread his mother's name.
Regards,
Justin
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Hi Val,
Hope this works:
http://data.jewishgen.org/wconnect/wc.dll?jg~jgsys~allcountry2
Paulene :)
ADDED:
Sorry - it doesn't work - so try this, and put 'sadaski' in the surname box, and then select kovno gubernia as the region.
Hopefully a good list of search results will come up.
Fingers crossed!
http://www.jewishgen.org/databases/Lithuania/
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Thanks, Justin - it is very interesting :)
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Hi,
I have had a go at adding the information as attachment. If not i will try to repost.
George Brown was Gershon Brown but we think they were Braun or Brawn before arriving in Uk. I am awaiting his nauralisation papers but he was closed so having to wait for them to re open. Gershons dad was Wolfe Brown/Brawn/Braun
On looking at the Sadaski's I think mum is Chaia, which my research says is giving to a child which wasn't expected to live, and dad could be Lipman. Anyway if document attachment works its from original so you can have a look.
Thanks so much for all your help, I am really enjoying this new search. i thought I would not be able to go any further back.
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I will try once more to add attachment, think it was too big last time
Val
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That's fine, Val :)
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Val,
You're right, it's Chaia more often transliterated as Chaya.
It is a so-called amuletic name (something new for me), and as you say it was given to a child for good luck and to ward off the Angel of Death.
My ggf was called Chayim (the masculine equivalent = life in Hebrew).
I'll check some of my notes, but Chaya was probably also simply a very popular name (as was Chayim).
Justin
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Val,
Had you seen the reference to Jacob Sidkey aka Sadaski, a tailor of Liverpool, changing his name to Taylor in 1918?
It's recorded in the London Gazette of 30 Jul 1918.
He must be Sarah's brother surely.
Justin
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I haven't seen it but I know both Jacob and Samuel changed their name to Taylor. I thought at first it was because of their trade but mums maiden name was Taylor. where do I find the article? You folk amaze me with findings.
Val
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Justin,
Do you think the names that are coming up on the Jewishgen database could be the original names that Sadaski was before it changed when they arrived in the UK?
I see there are Sadaski names coming up ont eh Ellis Island passenger lists + a Valeria Sadaski coming up on one of the 1930s ancestry.com lists.
Paulene :)
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Val,
Here's the LG link:
http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/30821/pages/9052
Paulene - Something definitely happened to the name between Zagare and England, but I'm not sure what. I'm about to browse through some more records for clues.
Justin
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Thanks I found a few bits. Not had any success in kovno looking at records.
Val
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Val,
The thought occurs to that Fanny's original surname was probably Shneyder (cf. Scheider = tailor in German). Shneyder is how the name is transliterated from Yiddish into English.
Zagare was in the Šiauliai district (and rabbinate) of Kaunas gubernia. As far as I can make out, nonew of the BMD records for that district were microfilmed.
I have justed looked through the 2,000 odd voter's records for Zagare - nothing there.
The problem is that our Jewish ancestors moved around a lot. A good relevant example is the family of the famous singer, Al Jolson. Born as Eisa Yaelson in Serdzius (west of Kovno) in 1886, he was son of parents who had married outside Seredzius, and had both come from separate towns even further afield.
Did you ever see the episode of WDYTYA on David Suchet? Similar story.
Justin
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I just appreciate all you have done so far. My dad insisted that the Sadaskis were Polish, I know the borders were very close. From what I have read the jews were herded to these areas so i guess Michaels parents could have come from further afield??
Val
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Sarahs birth certificate came today and its the right one. Her birthday is 16.08.1888. So not only do we look alike but we are both Leos too !!!!
val
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Hi Val & All :)
Phew, glad it's the right one ;D And I'm glad to hear that you feel so connected to an ancestor.
I'm really enjoying this thread......
Kind regards
Gaie
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Ok but I found a discrepency!!
Sarah Satky born 16.08.1888. The year is right for my Sarah. dad is Michael and he is a Tailor thats correct. She was born in Leeds thats correct. Mum is Fanny thats right but we knew Fanny as Taylor==not a russian name but on Sarahs birth certificate it says Fannys name was formerly CRAVITZ !!!!! that sounds more russian
Val
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Val, going back to your 1st post, where did you get the information that Fanny's father's name was Maurice Taylor?
Kind regards
Gaie
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on ancestry.com I found a distant relative who was a desendant of Fanny's sister Helen. She gave me the information
Val
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Well, I've had a Google of Cravitz/Kravitz, to see if I could find anything of interest, and according to this website, it is of Jewish eastern Ashkenazic origin and it means "TAILOR" ;D ;D ;D ;D
http://baby-names.familyeducation.com/celebrities/k/288
The same definition is given on Ancestry:
http://www.ancestry.com/facts/Kravitz-family-history.ashx
So I guess I've answered my own question (and yours!) ..... ;D :P ;D :P ;D
Kind regards
Gaie
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Its like a puzzle and we are slowly getting the pieces together. I am so glad I found you here, I had no idea how to go further back. I have been looking at the Kovno records and Cravitz is also spelt Kravitz/Krelitz.
I did find a Moshe and Lebe in Jurbarkas Kovno but have no dates. I know Moshe is Morris.
Not sure where else to search
Val
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Well done, Gaie. I should have thought of that.
Kravitz is derived from the Polish word for tailor = krawiec.
The Yiddish word is shneyder, and that is the more common surname, spellt Sznajder in Polish.
Do you know where and when Michael and Fanny married?
My thinking is that Fanny come from Poland, i.e. not Kovno, where Shneyder is the more common name, although I have also seen Kravets and Kravitsky.
Justin
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Incidentally, Fanny's Yiddish name was probably Fayga / Feiga / Feige which is derived from the word for 'bird' (cf. Vogel in German, pronounced Fogel).
The Yiddish name is in turn a translation of the Hebrew name Tsipporah/Ziporah = bird.
Justin
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Thanks both for everything. So I will put what information I have.
Michael Sadaski was naturalized in 1914, having been in the country for 27 years. That means he came to Uk in 1887. Sarah was born in 1888, so I would imagine they were married when they came to England. I have checked the ancestry records and cannot find a marriage. Sarah wasn't born until August.
Val
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Today I received Gershons naturalisation papers, it looks like I am not Polish but half Russian.Gershon Brown was born in Pickelyn in the Province of Kovno, Russia 30.07.1878. His dad was Woolff and mum Sarah(nee Kirsovitz).
Gershon came to England in 1897.
In 1922 dad was dead but mum still lives in Pickelyn.
I now want to try to find records in Zaga and Pickelyn, do I have any chance of finding anything?
Any help would be great,
Val
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Hello Val,
The province of Kovno corresponds to much of Lithuania. Kaunas being the Lithuanian name for Kovno.
I'll have a look through some databases over the weekend, I would rate the chances as quite high of finding out more.
Justin
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Thanks I will look forward to hearing from you
Val
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Hello Val,
Gershon was born in what is now called Pikeliai on the northern Lithuanian border.
As far as I can see no birth records prior to 1918 have survived (or ever existed). That could mean that BMDs were ecorded in t he registers of a larger nearby town, e.g. Telsiai seat of the local rabbinate.
Not good news, but I'll see what else I can find.
Are you certain about his mother's surname? Could the K be an H?
Bernstein (Bernshteyn or Berenshteyn) only occurred in the towns around Raseiniai in 1816.
Justin
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Val,
In genealogical terms, Jews fom this part of the Russian Empire are described as Lithuanian Jews or Litvaks.
Jewishgen has a special interest group (SIG) called LitvakSIG which provides invaluable information for genealogists.
For each district (uyezd) there is a research group. I would urge you to contact the coordinators for the Telsiai and Šiauliai districts.
http://www.jewishgen.org/litvak/research.htm
You would probably have to join the research group and contribute financially to the voluntary work of the group - but it would be fascinating.
Let me know if you are unable to access the page.
Justin
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Hello to all who have posted in regards to Val's search.
I know this is an old posting but thought I would try and see if anyone is still looking at it.
I have been impressed with the help that was given to Val.
Val and I made contact some time back (off site) regarding the Sadaski name as I was trying to find a connection between our BROWN families who I was led to believe were related.
Val's uncle Woolf , (son of Gershon /George and Sarah moved to Glasgow where my Brown family also lived.
Both these families came from HULL to GLASGOW and were originally from RUSSIA as far as I was aware .
According to my father ,Woolf was his cousin.I don't know if this was just a courtsey cousin or factual as I have not been able to make any true connection between GERSHON and my grandfather ISRAEL.
Our original name was evidently BROHM changed to Brown and I have recently discovered that my grandfather came from PIKALIEI hence I feel there is possibly some truth to this connection which I have not been able to establish.
Hopefully this is of some use to Val.
Cheers,
Maureen.
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Hi Maureen,
How lovely to hear from you. Nearly three years have gone by but I still keep nibbling at bits of history. I haven't done so much with the Poles/Russians but have been working on the english side but have today taken a new look at this lot.
I haven't any information about Woollf my uncle except he married an Anita Chitkin and had a son Kenneth. I have a photo of Wolfe and Anita. I will message you my email address as I have changed it. Please be in touch and i will invite you to my ancestry tree so you can look when I have your e mail address.
Val
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Hello Val,
I could not find you from our previous conversation and as you say your email has changed.
I have some data on Woolf , Anita & Kenneth.
Anita remarried and lived beside me in NEW ZEALAND.
I can fill in some missing dates for you but I will send you an email with this .
I will be in UK later this year and hopefully will find some more data amongst my family.
Cheers,
Maureen.