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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Dorset => Topic started by: MortenofPoole on Thursday 12 March 09 15:07 GMT (UK)
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Hello. I'm researching WW1 servicemen who were either born in or had connections with the Poole/ Bournemouth area . I would very much like to hear from any descendants. Thanks. Morten
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Hi Morten,
Are you aware that at the time of WW1 Bournemouth was in Hampshire?
You could contact the Dorset Family History Society (www.dorsetfhs.org.uk) and ask for your request to be printed in their next journal.
Nanny Jan
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Hello & thanks for your reply. Yes, I am aware that Bournemouth used to be in Hampshire. I started out researching men connected to Poole first of all but this has now spread to Bmth as the two towns are so closely linked. Thanks for the tip about the DFHS.
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Hi Morten,
My grandfather was from Bournemouth and was in the army in WW1, but he spent the whole of the war in India. Would he be any use to you?
Best wishes,
Linda
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Hi Morten,
My grandad enlisted in Parkstone, although he was from Durham he may have moved down there before the war, I am not sure yet. He married a Parkstone girl after he was invalided out and lived in Parkstone for the rest of his life.
Paul
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Thank you LindaJ1959 & Paul Caswell. I will be in touch direct.
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Hi Morten
My gr grandfather was from Poole, served with the Somerset Light Infantry and died in Karachi in1918.
Louise
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Thanks Louisef. I will be in touch direct.
Morten
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Morten, my great-grandfather served, as did one of his sons, in WW1. Am having trouble finding any records due to a lot of the records being destroyed in WW2.
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Hello Wallace. If you would like to tell me their names then I will see if I can help. Regards. Morten
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Morten, the surname is Samways. Harry and son William. It is my information that Harry died in Weymouth military hospital from wounds received. The hospital, of course, is not longer standing.
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Hello again Wallace
Do you know any information eg. their regiments, where born/ where they were living etc? There are 8 Medal Index Cards for Harry Samways & 26 for William Samways. I also noticed that there is a service record for a Wm George Albert Samways who resided at Upton, Poole.
Also, do you know when Harry died as I couldn't find his entry on the CWGC website? A Harry Lionel Samways, however, died 28/3/18 and is buried in Belgium.
I will have a look through my notes, in case they were mentioned in the local paper. Regards. Morten
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Thanks Morten. They were both from Oakdale. William would have been around 17 at the time the war broke out, Harry, between 35 and 37, i think. I was always told they joined 'The Dorset Regiment'. However, some ink stamps on the back of a birth certificate for my grandmother says 'infantry office, Exeter'. I guess the certificate was used to validate something.
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Hello again Wallace
I had a look through my notes and found the following -
Sgt A E Samways (Dorsets), from Poole & (possibly three brothers) Pte Victor (Dorsets), Lance Corp. Herbert (ASC) and Pte Frederick ( regiment ?) from Upper Parkstone.
Also a Corporal W G Samways from Bournemouth who was in the Military Police.
Looking again at the Medal Index Cards for Wm or Harry in the Dorsets, I can see a Wm G J Samways (3521, Dorsets) & found a Henry (947, Dorsets).
This is a good example of how difficult it can be to track down the correct information with limited knowledge to go on. However do let me know if you can think of any other information that might help us track them down. If they served abroad then there should be at least a Medal Index Card.
By the way - I think that you assumptions about the birth certificate are correct. Best Wishes. Morten
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Thanks Morten. Are all medical index cards surviving from WW1 as i have often been told that a lot was lost to bombing in WW2. It seems strange that there appears to be no record of either - could they have joined another regiment? I was also told that Harry was a recruiter before he actually went himself.
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Hello Wallace
Do you know the date when Harry died in Weymouth? The Medal Index Cards survive for (almost) every man who served overseas. Many Service Records were lost during the blitz. Some Pension Records also survive but it would not be suprising to find that both Harry's & William's records are missing.
There are MIC's for - Wm (5 Dorsets), Wm A J (Dorsets), Wm J (Dorsets), Wm G J (Dorsets) - did he have a middle name? Also for a George H. (Dorsets). However he may have continued in the army after WW1 so his record could still be with the MOD, when did he die??
Interestingly, there is a Pte. H. Samways (Dorsets) listed on the memorial inside Longfleet St. Mary (Poole) Church so it does seem probable that he was in that regiment.
Regards Morten
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Hi Morten,
I think the name on the memorial (H Samways) is almost certainly his, as there is strong anecdotal evidence that he is buried there also, but i have yet to determine this for sure. If you are up there again, i would appreciate a photo, but otherwise, i can try to send my sister up there. But where does this leave us? I assume this means that his MIC is missing. Can we go anywhere else with this now? By the way, can you tell me where to look to know more about where and what the Dorsets did in WW1?
As for William, i don't know of a middle name, but let me do some more poking around.
Thanks again for all your assistance.
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W.Luffman Pte 5901 of the 1st Dorset Regiment was killed in action 3.12.1914, and appears to have been killed by a sniper or unaimed bullet at night. I know little more about him other than that his name appears on the War Memorial at Poole, and that he was married to a lady from Wales. Luffman is a rare surname but less uncommon in Dorset, so he may have been associated with Poole.What first drew attention to this is that no one seems to know the poor man's first name. This is one thing I would like to establish for certain. From marriage records in Wales I believe it was either Walter or William.
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Hi Morten,
I think the name on the memorial (H Samways) is almost certainly his, as there is strong anecdotal evidence that he is buried there also, but i have yet to determine this for sure. If you are up there again, i would appreciate a photo, but otherwise, i can try to send my sister up there. But where does this leave us? I assume this means that his MIC is missing. Can we go anywhere else with this now? By the way, can you tell me where to look to know more about where and what the Dorsets did in WW1?
As for William, i don't know of a middle name, but let me do some more poking around.
Thanks again for all your assistance.
Hello again Wallace
I will go and see if I can locate Harry's grave next week & get a picture for you. Do you have an address where Harry lived? I don't know if you are living locally but Bmth/ Poole & Dorchester have reference copies of the Dorsets WW1 campaign. It has been reprinted but costs over £50!!! Also have a look at this site http://www.keepmilitarymuseum.org/ There is so much info available over the internet now that any search e.g. dorset regiment ww1 will throw up lots of results.
Let me know if any other info. re - Harry or William comes to mind so we can keep looking for their MIC's. Regards. Morten
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W.Luffman Pte 5901 of the 1st Dorset Regiment was killed in action 3.12.1914, and appears to have been killed by a sniper or unaimed bullet at night. I know little more about him other than that his name appears on the War Memorial at Poole, and that he was married to a lady from Wales. Luffman is a rare surname but less uncommon in Dorset, so he may have been associated with Poole.What first drew attention to this is that no one seems to know the poor man's first name. This is one thing I would like to establish for certain. From marriage records in Wales I believe it was either Walter or William.
Hello Redroger. I have come across this family. I'm also working on a project about the history of Green Road, Poole and I know that the family lived there for a short time before moving to South Road/Lagland Street. There is a Medal Index Card - 5901 William Luffman, died 13/12/1914, entered theatre of war 12/9/1914 and was entitled to the 1914 Star, Victory & War Medals. The card also states that he was in the 1 Dorsets. The poor soul didn't survive at the front very long did he? I too would like to know more about him. Regards. Morten
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So far I have tried via the 1911 census to find him, on the address given on the CWWG record, but to no avail, part of the problem with his in laws is the usual one with the frequency of Welsh surnames. Thanks for the info on his address in Poole, I am interested as I am reliably informed that all bearers of the Luffman surname are related to a common ancestor.
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Redroger
I had a look through Kelly's directory - 1911 edition has a Charles Luffman at 32, Priory Road, Southbourne. The 1912-13 Edition lists him again at same address & also Alfred Luffman at 9, Windham Road, Bmth. (none in Poole residents section). Regards. Morten
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Wallace
I'm afraid that I could not find H. Samway's gravestone at St. Mary's. It appears that the he probably isn't buried there. I also asked in the church office but they couldn't help either. Regards. Morten
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Thanks for that Morten, More research required, at least this time it's local!
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Hi Wallace....I suppose you may have already have this info already by now but will post anyway....may show on death certificate little snippets of info that could help in some way....
Harry Samways Reg of Death 1916 Age 38 Poole Dorset 5a 345
Regards Cheryle
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Hi again Wallace....Harry being shown as a Foreman Brickmaker in 1911 just as he had been in 1901, so only Morten will know if he is likely to have been a 'recruiter' in his spare time.....William of course lived to the ripe old age of 75 so there has to be some paperwork somewhere to show for his efforts during WW1 surely :'( hopefully Morten can strike lucky for you!!.... and i would think now that as Harrys death is registered in Poole he would be buried very close to Creekmoor/Upton/Waterloo area even though he was a Wareham Boy.....he was a married man with 6 children after all so i would imagine his wife Henrietta would have wanted him to be somewhere close by....
Best wishes Cheryle
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Hi All...I was just having a little scout around the Poole Area for the Luffman post and came upon this little gem....
20 Green Road....1901...
James F ?????? Head Married 40 Labourer Sewage Works Isle of Man
Elizabeth ???? Wife '' 40 Sutton Dorset
Harry Samways Son 19 Preston
Tom '' Son 14 Poole
Annie '' Dau 12 Poole
Could this possibly be a candidate the elusive H Samways ::) from the Roll of Honourfor Poole??? Sorry to be adding to the mix...... ;)
regards Cheryle
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Yes, that could well be Harry. I'm suffering a bit from information overload. All my records are on paper and when I had another look at the Green Road section, I saw a James KENNON living at 20 Green Road with this family. Thanks for getting in touch. Regards Morten
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Dear Morten and Cheryl,
Apologies - i don't get on Rootschat that often. Thanks for your further efforts regarding Harry Samways. As you correctly point out, he was a brickmaker and worked at the brickworks in Oakdale before WW1. I have obtained his death certificate which indicates, contrary to what my grandmother told me, that he died at home "of Pleurisy with effusion; Syncope;", and not at the old hospital in Weymouth. Given that he died in December 1916, he likley still died of the effects of wounds recieved. I recently wondered if his uniform would tell us anything - i have a photo...???
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W.Luffman Pte 5901 of the 1st Dorset Regiment was killed in action 3.12.1914, and appears to have been killed by a sniper or unaimed bullet at night. I know little more about him other than that his name appears on the War Memorial at Poole, and that he was married to a lady from Wales. Luffman is a rare surname but less uncommon in Dorset, so he may have been associated with Poole.What first drew attention to this is that no one seems to know the poor man's first name. This is one thing I would like to establish for certain. From marriage records in Wales I believe it was either Walter or William.
william luffman private of the first battalion dorset regiment enlisted at poole dorset born redledge salisbury wiltshire killed in action 3rd dec 1914 france and flanders
regards
alli
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W.Luffman Pte 5901 of the 1st Dorset Regiment was killed in action 3.12.1914, and appears to have been killed by a sniper or unaimed bullet at night. I know little more about him other than that his name appears on the War Memorial at Poole, and that he was married to a lady from Wales. Luffman is a rare surname but less uncommon in Dorset, so he may have been associated with Poole.What first drew attention to this is that no one seems to know the poor man's first name. This is one thing I would like to establish for certain. From marriage records in Wales I believe it was either Walter or William.
apologies if iam repeating something you already know redroger
william luffman married mabel.e davies dec qtr 1911 newportm vol 11a page 484
the cwgc sie says he was son in law of mr a davies
regards
alli
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Thanks Alli, But he wasn't there in the 1911 census, and neither was she, and I can't find them. Imagine looking for a Davies in South Wales!
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Ref. Harry Samways.
Was Harry invalided out of the army, do you know?
If so, I believe that he would have been awarded a 'Silver Star'. This may help you to sort out which one of the 8 is yours.
As he died of pleurisy it is possible that he was 'gassed'. The damage caused could result in death some years later.
Can you find a record of a burial service? The fact that you couldn't find a gravestone could be because the family couldn't afford to buy one. If you find a record of the service the church may have a plan of the graves so that you can identify the plot.
With some home deaths the names were not always recorded by CWGC as war casualties. This can be changed but you do need to gather as much information as possible before you start.
I can give you a contact, if you want to go ahead, who will be able to help you with the application. (We had a name on our WW1 war memorial who was one of the 'missing' and he has now been added by CWGC.)
Good luck
Regards
Lee
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Dear Morten and Cheryl,
Apologies - i don't get on Rootschat that often. Thanks for your further efforts regarding Harry Samways. As you correctly point out, he was a brickmaker and worked at the brickworks in Oakdale before WW1. I have obtained his death certificate which indicates, contrary to what my grandmother told me, that he died at home "of Pleurisy with effusion; Syncope;", and not at the old hospital in Weymouth. Given that he died in December 1916, he likley still died of the effects of wounds recieved. I recently wondered if his uniform would tell us anything - i have a photo...???
Hello Wallace
At least we now know that he died at home and not at Weymouth. It could well be due to being gassed. I would very much like to see the photo if you would like to share it with me? I will let you know if I come across any more info.
Regards Morten
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Hi Morten
I’m not a descendant of the family but I have done some research on Pte. Tom Harold Watmore who is shown on the plaque at St Clements Church and wondered if this would be of interest to you.
John.
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Hi Morten
I’m not a descendant of the family but I have done some research on Pte. Tom Harold Watmore who is shown on the plaque at St Clements Church and wondered if this would be of interest to you.
John.
Hello John
Thanks for your message. I also have come across this man so I would be very interested. Perhaps you can send me a PM and let me know what you have discovered? Have you been researching the names on that plaque specifically?
Many thanks
Morten
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Hi Morten,
My GrGrandad serviced as a Private in the Dorsetshire Army Regiment. He did not talk about the war often & nor do my family, but the little info I have gleaned from them has been that he did serve at the Battle of the Somme & at some time became a prisioner of war.
I have found his medal roll index card but nothing else at the moment.
Regards
jen
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Hi Morten
No I've not been researching the names on that plaque but have been helping a friend who is connected to the Watmore family that married into the Arnolds and were in Hamworthy by 1851.
Have sent you PM with details of what I know about Tom Harold.
Spiderboy.
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Thanks Spiderboy. PM received & good to see the Dorset Cross alongside the Wessex Wyvern.