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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Nottinghamshire => Topic started by: Lindoo on Thursday 19 February 09 17:24 GMT (UK)

Title: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: Lindoo on Thursday 19 February 09 17:24 GMT (UK)
Looking for a family of BURTON who lived in Normanton-on-Trent in late 1880's.  Is this in Notts, Lincs or Yorks?  Would they be registered in Gainsborough perhaps?  Can anyone advise?
Regards... Lindoo
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Thursday 19 February 09 18:14 GMT (UK)
Burton on Trent is Notts so you are on the right board

Can you post details of what you already have and what you need help with
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: Lindoo on Thursday 19 February 09 19:38 GMT (UK)
All the info I have is:

William BURTON was born in 1880 approx and his parents lived in Normanton-on-Trent.  I don't know their names but they seem to have been market gardeners.  In 1904 William married Bertha Emma HOTCHIN (Glanford B 7a993).

I did look at 1881 Census to find Joseph BURTON and Emma living at Brott Lane with son William (28) amongst others and grandson William (age?).  Not sure if grandson is son of William aged 28.

Haven't checked other census info.

Lindoo.
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Thursday 19 February 09 23:07 GMT (UK)
Do you have a copy of William and Bertha's marriage cert showing the name of William's father and his occupation
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Thursday 19 February 09 23:19 GMT (UK)
The 1881 census you mention could suggest that William was the son of William and Ellen

Joseph Burton 60
Emma 50
William 28 married - son
Ellen 24 daughter in law b Lincoln
the following were all shown as sons or daughters and were unmarried
Mary 27
Joseph 25
Nathaniel 21
Emma 20
Richard 16
Frank 15
Arthur 9
Then
Frank Burton grandson aged 2 b Lincoln
William Burton grandson aged 7mths b Morton


Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Thursday 19 February 09 23:27 GMT (UK)
1891 for Village St Normanton on Trent.  All children below William b Normanton on Trent

William Burton 38  b Newark on Trent - grocer
Ellen   35  b Lincoln Astby?
Frank   12  b Lincoln - Hemswell
William   10  b Lincoln - Morton/arton
John   8 
Arthur   6 
Joseph  4 
Agnes M   2 
Frederick 4 months
RG12 Piece 2642 Folio 48 Page 4
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Thursday 19 February 09 23:29 GMT (UK)
Possible birth

Births December qtr 1880 
 
William  BURTON      Gainsborough  7a 721

Gainsborough covered Marton
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: Lindoo on Saturday 21 February 09 18:14 GMT (UK)
Thank you very much.  All looks very promising.
I don't have a copy of William and Bertha's marriage certificate.  How can I go about getting this?

Lindoo.
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: Lindoo on Saturday 21 February 09 18:58 GMT (UK)
Also looked for marriage of Joseph BURTON and Emma.  A very likely one is Dec 1851 Newark (15 1141) with her maiden name as EGGLESTON.

Regards....
Lindoo
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Sunday 22 February 09 17:11 GMT (UK)
Hi Lindoo

Quote
I don't have a copy of William and Bertha's marriage certificate.  How can I go about getting this?

Using the reference you quoted above  In 1904 William married Bertha Emma HOTCHIN (Glanford B 7a993). you can order a copy marriage cert online at www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/

That will give you his fathers name which will help to confirm if the census entries I found are the correct family
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: Lindoo on Sunday 22 February 09 19:13 GMT (UK)
Thanks CaroleW,

Have ordered marriage cert for William and Bertha.  Also taking a chance with ordering cert for  William and Ellen (1876).  Ditto for Joseph and Emma (1851).

Does earlier census than 1881 show Joseph BURTON and Emma in Notts?

Regards....
Lindoo
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Sunday 22 February 09 19:25 GMT (UK)
Quote
Does earlier census than 1881 show Joseph BURTON and Emma in Notts?

Yes - 1871 in Normanton and the added bonus of confirming you have the right marriage for Joseph & Emma.  Everybody b Normanton unless shown otherwise

Joseph Burton 52  market gardener
Emma 42  b Newark
Joseph   16 
John  14 
Nathaniel  12 
Emma  10 
Fredrick   8 
Richard   6 
Frank   4 
Mary Eggleston 76  mother - widow - annuitant b Newark
RG10; Piece: 3456; Folio: 63; Page: 13

Per IGI

EMMA EGGLESTONE   Christening:  03 JUN 1829   Newark Upon Trent, Notts

Father:  WILLIAM EGGLESTONE    Mother:  MARY 
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: Lindoo on Sunday 22 February 09 22:15 GMT (UK)
Hi CaroleW,
That's excellent!

Trying to go back to find Joseph's father.  The marriage cert I've ordered will give his parents.  Free BMD does not go back before 1837.  Are there other options?

Regards...Lindoo
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Sunday 22 February 09 22:32 GMT (UK)
Hi

The marriage cert will only give his fathers name and occupation.  The IGI has a lot of pre-1837 births and is free at www.familysearch.org

This is one to bear in mind given that he named one of his sons Nathaniel but you can't be sure until you get the marriage cert

JOSEPH BURTON Christening:  04 AUG 1818   Marnham, Nottingham  Father:  NATHANIEL BURTON    Mother:  SUSANNA 


Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Sunday 22 February 09 22:45 GMT (UK)
Slight change of birthplace on the 1861 census which makes the IGI christening above more likely

1861 for Normanton.  All children b Normanton

Joseph Burton 43 b Marnham master gardener
Emma 35 b Newark
William 9
Ann 7
John 5
Nathaniel 3
Emma 1
Elizabeth 47 sister b Marnham
RG9 Piece 2417 Folio 65 Page 15

In 1851 - Joseph (32) gardener and his sister Elizabeth (37)  were in lodgings in Marnham.  Birthplace for both was Marnham
HO107 Piece 2121 Folio 678 Page 3

ELIZABETH BURTON  Christening:  09 JUL 1813   Marnham, Notts
Father:  NATHANIEL BURTON   Mother:  SUSANNAH

1841 for Marnham - all born in county.  The 1841 census does not show relationships or actual birthplaces - just whether they were born in the county in which they were living.   

Nathaniel Burton 65 farmer
Elizabeth  27 
John   25 
Joseph  23 
HO107 Piece 866/6  Folio 5 Page 13

NATHANIEL BURTON Christening:  27 NOV 1774   Marnham
Father:  JOSEPH BURTON    Mother:  ELIZ  (Eliza/Elizabeth??)

Deaths December qtr 1844 
 
Nathaniel BURTON   East Retford  15 349

East Retford covered Marnham

 

Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: Lindoo on Monday 23 February 09 14:45 GMT (UK)
CaroleW,

That's great and curious too! 

From 1881 Census Joseph and Emma had children: William (28), Mary (27), Joseph (25), Nathaniel (21), Emma, Richard, Frank and Arthur.

20 yrs earlier the 1861 census gives Joseph and Emma with children William, Ann (7),  John (5), Nathaniel (3).  This gives a discrepancy in ages (eg. Nathaniel either 21 or 20+3=23) and two children Ann and John who conflict with Mary and Joseph but their ages are spot on! 

Would you have a child Ann and in 20yrs time call her Mary instead?

Regards...
Lindoo

PS. I'll start a new string, this one is getting a bit long.
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 23 February 09 17:42 GMT (UK)
Don't start a new topic - it will confuse things.  You need to keep on here for continuity

Never pay too much attention to ages - many people only aged 5 years between a 10 year census
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 23 February 09 17:49 GMT (UK)
New post  http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=363238.new

Posted by Lindoo

Quote
Nathaniel BURTON was born in 1774 in Marnham and died in Dec 1844.  He married Susannah  and they had children named Elizabeth (b. 1813), John (b. 1816), and Joseph (b. 1821).  1841 census H0107 Piece 866/6 Folio 5 Page 13.  Thanks to CaroleW.

Nathaniel BURTON's father was Joseph and his mother Eliz (Eliza or Elizaeth).

Is it possible to go even further back?

Reply posted by Sunflower today

Quote
Hi Lindoo

Nathanael Burton married Susanna Parker at Marnham 31.12.1812

2 more children born to Joseph & Elizabeth

John Burton bapt 28 Feb 1768
Joseph Burton bapt 24 Nov 1772

Carol
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: Lindoo on Thursday 26 February 09 16:09 GMT (UK)
Copy of marriage certificates received:

In 1904, William BURTON (23) to Bertha Emma HOTCHIN (19),  fathers William BURTON (gardener) and John HOTCHIN (foreman) respectively.

In 1857, Joseph BURTON (farmer) to Emma EGGLESTON (dressmaker), fathers Nathanial BURTON (deceased, farmer) and William EGGLESTON (deceased, gardener) respectively.

Regards...
Lindoo
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Thursday 26 February 09 16:24 GMT (UK)
Hi

Thanks for letting me know - thank goodness we got the right Burton family
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: Lindoo on Friday 27 February 09 19:03 GMT (UK)
CaroleW,

Any thoughts on the strange mix up on names: Ann/Mary and  John/Joseph?

Lindoo.
Title: Re: BURTON in Normanton-on-Trent
Post by: CaroleW on Friday 27 February 09 21:40 GMT (UK)
Hi

1871 shows son Joseph 16 plus son John 14.  Have you checked freebmd to see if Ann was registered as Mary Ann

1861 shows a 7yr old Joseph Burton (indexed as Barton) b Normanton as a visitor with the Hibberd family in Sheffield