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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Glamorganshire => Wales => Glamorganshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: marinerclark on Saturday 07 February 09 17:44 GMT (UK)

Title: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Saturday 07 February 09 17:44 GMT (UK)
John Davies married Eleanor Thomas 26th August 1844   

John Davies batchelor or Smith of Penygorse the son of John Davies a carpenter  married Eleanor Thomas spinster of Penygorse dau. of Thomas Thomas a butcher   

John signed his name Eleanor made her mark.   Can anyone locate Penygorse for me   Can't find it on maps(modern) or on Curious Fox or google

This family moved on to Methryr  My great grandmother, Rachel Davies was born  Dec 30, 1861 28 Dyffryn Later they move to Cardiff and live on Alice Street
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: Necromancer on Saturday 07 February 09 18:02 GMT (UK)
it might be Penygroes ? - try googling "genuki penygroes"
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: Non on Saturday 07 February 09 18:36 GMT (UK)
There is a Pengors Road in Llangyfelach which is not too far away from the Church.

Old maps of the area are available online at

www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/GLA/Llangyfelach/#Maps

Non
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Sunday 08 February 09 04:00 GMT (UK)
Thank you both  very much   I'm on the west coast of US steep learning curve I couldn't find the road but the parish was divided into 4  what ever and under Mawr was listed Pen-y-gors  a farm or hamlet????  This was on the genuki site   I'm picking up my Mom's research which couldn't find them being born in the parish or identify them in the 1841 census.  LizR
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: Paul1927 on Sunday 18 September 22 20:00 BST (UK)
Long shot that you still use this site.

John Davies and Eleanor Thomas are my Gx4 grandparents
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Monday 19 September 22 00:54 BST (UK)
Hello Paul  I still get emails on all my posts.  So exciting.  Which kid are you descended from?  I just sent for Eleanord's death cert.  should have in a couple of days.  Liz
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: Paul1927 on Monday 19 September 22 01:22 BST (UK)
Hi, fantastic to have received a reply from you.
I have been trawling through some of your posts as you seem to have a lot of information on the Davies family.

I came across your post by chance as I was attempting to google the residence on the marriage cert of John Davies and Eleanor Thomas. Today I found their marriage cert online as I was about to purchase it along with John Davies' death cert.
I decend from their son Thomas Davies b1845
I started researching the Davies family as my grandfather was adopted and I knew nothing of his real mother. Luckily he retained his birth name.


I am also in contact with a decendant of their other son Richard John Davies 1849-1919

Who is it that you decend from?
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Monday 19 September 22 01:51 BST (UK)
I am a descendent of their daughter Rachel born in 1861.   I have the Greys back pretty far.  Have you seen the wills?   Do you have a syvia(not sure how to spell)  in the family who ran a sweet shop in Barry?  Liz
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Monday 19 September 22 01:54 BST (UK)
Jane was the only one I knew much about.   You know when John Davies Died?  Liz
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: Paul1927 on Monday 19 September 22 01:57 BST (UK)
No I haven’t seen the wills. I could see them being mentioned in posts.

Also I don’t have a Sylvia in my tree but I actually live on Barry Island. Do you know what street the shop was on?

Richard John Davies ended up in Barry and died there in 1919. I liked for his and his sons grave a few weeks back
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Monday 19 September 22 03:07 BST (UK)
No idea which street,  not even sure of Barry.  Only tidbit my Mom remembered besides jane married a Brown and had daughter Edith.  My mother was born in 1918 and emigrated to US in 1953.
      I have been to Llangyfelach.   John Davies and Margaret Grey lived in Caeradog.  Leased 4 parcels on the tithe maps.  It isnt there anymore according to a descendent of William, the oldest son born in 1812.   He lived next door at Penwyn, which was still there. 
      Liz
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: Paul1927 on Monday 19 September 22 21:51 BST (UK)
Where would I find copies of the wills that you mention for the Grays?



Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Tuesday 20 September 22 00:48 BST (UK)
National Library of Wales.    I would to know more about Thomas Davies,  Wife , kids census.

Margaret Grey mother of John Davies was the daughter of Evan Grey  died 1843
                                                               sister of Morgan Grey  died 1844   Liz







Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: Paul1927 on Tuesday 20 September 22 06:53 BST (UK)
Thomas Davies
Wife  Ann Evans
Children
George Adley Davies 1866-1939 ( my Gx2 grandfather)
Sarah Ann 1868
Elizabeth Jane 1872
Margaret E 1874
Rachel 1876
Mary 1878
Thomas 1882
John 1885

Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Wednesday 21 September 22 00:05 BST (UK)
Thank for the info.   Have you seen Coming Home to Wales- the Donny Osmond one?   We are cousins thru Morgan Grey 1730-1818.  There is a glimpse of a book at the Merthyr Library of a family tree.  Would love to know more.   
      I think this relates to why John Davies moved to Methyr.  Morgan Greys daughter Mary married Timothy Martin, Who opened the Penydarren Works.  Their son George Martin was a foreman? at the iron works later.  George  Would have been a 2nd cousin.   My Mom had stories of the family having a carriage and pair.  I think it was the Martins not John and Eleanor.  Donny Osmond is a Martin descendent.    Liz
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: hanes teulu on Wednesday 21 September 22 10:11 BST (UK)
   
       Morgan Greys daughter Mary married Timothy Martin, Who opened the Penydarren Works.  Their son George Martin was a foreman? at the iron works later.  George  Would have been a 2nd cousin.   My Mom had stories of the family having a carriage and pair.  I think it was the Martins not John and Eleanor.  Donny Osmond is a Martin descendent.    Liz

Had you seen https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3433438/3433749/310/

(col 5 "Presidents of the institute")
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Wednesday 21 September 22 16:28 BST (UK)
Thank you for sharing.   I cant remember my sources for the Martins.  Timothy was there when they did the railway into Cardiff from Merthyr.   I see I got Penydarren wrong.   It is that book you get a brief glimpse of that I would love to find.    Thank you again>  LizR
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: hanes teulu on Wednesday 21 September 22 19:25 BST (UK)
  I see I got Penydarren wrong.   
Sorry, but puzzled by the above Can you clarify?
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Thursday 22 September 22 04:16 BST (UK)
I thought Timothy Martin, the father opened Penydarren.  The newspaper article said it was George Martin the son.   Not sure i printed much of the Martin research I did.  Thank you for the newspaper link.   LizR
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: hanes teulu on Thursday 22 September 22 08:48 BST (UK)
In the newspaper item the phrase "... who sank the first pit ..." applies to Timothy Martin not George Martin.
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: Paul1927 on Thursday 22 September 22 11:44 BST (UK)
Thanks for all this, its fascinating.

I've managed to get the wills regarding Evan Grey. Also I have ordered a Marriage cert for Thomas Davies (John Davies, and Eleanor Thomas' son)
 It was mentioned that you were getting Eleanor's death cert, could you let me know details when you get it.

thanks

Paul
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: hanes teulu on Thursday 22 September 22 13:20 BST (UK)
Welshnewspapers - Evan Grey's death notice (end column)

https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3330360/3330363/11/
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Thursday 22 September 22 21:27 BST (UK)
Thanks for the death notice and getting me straight on Penydarren.  I havent read my Grey file yet.  Obviously need a refresh.   It was notable he even had a death notice  and was called Mister, right?  He didnt leave a will.  His daughter had to apply for an admin.  You would think at 82 and with his wife surviving he would have.   Thanks again.  Liz

Paul   of course.
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: Paul1927 on Thursday 22 September 22 21:35 BST (UK)
Not had any wills for my ancestors. Davies’ very much working class so wouldnt have had anything. 1920’s/30’s  in Merthyr they are all unemployed miners as there was 80% unemployment at the time I believe.

Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Friday 23 September 22 02:47 BST (UK)
I was very surprised to find wills too.   Have you read the Morgan Grey 1818 will.  He is the father of Evan.   Evan is in his 60's by then so dont think is mentioned.  Havent read that will in a long time.
    No death cert yet.    Have you found the farm   Dorgloyd.  It is off the Rhydypandy Rd  near Morriston north of the M4.  Looks like it might still be there.  Tithe Maps on the National Library of Wales site.  Modern map overlay available   Liz
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Saturday 24 September 22 23:52 BST (UK)
It was the right death  certificate For Eleanor Davies.  What are the rules for sharing information from a certificate?   She died March !, 1883.
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: hanes teulu on Sunday 25 September 22 12:25 BST (UK)
1876/77 Map (pub 1884)   https://maps.nls.uk/view/102342445

Tab north west to find "Dorglwyd" - north of Pant-lasau.

Tab south along western edge to find "Pen-y-gors".
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: Paul1927 on Sunday 25 September 22 13:05 BST (UK)
The tithe maps show The farm Maes-eglwys for Morgan Grey which is just west of Dorglwyd. 
Is Maes-Eglwys an additional farm for Morgan Grey as he shows as being occupier for a lot of plots
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: hanes teulu on Sunday 25 September 22 13:57 BST (UK)
Morgan Grey's address on the '41 Census is "Maeseglwys".

Have you checked "View Apportionment" which identifies "House, Garden, Stables, etc".

Note - I,ve been checking that area for Thomas Thomas - Butcher" on the '44 marriage cert. In 1844 he's at "pengorse" - the '41 Census address is "Pontbren" - and more than one householder enjoys that address.

 
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: Paul1927 on Sunday 25 September 22 14:23 BST (UK)
Yeah I have, it was Dorgloyd farm that was throwing me as all I could see was Maes-Eglwys.

I have the same for Thomas Thomas in census 1841
Strange that there is another Pontpren with a Francis family but they do not appear consecutively on the census. I would have presumed if it was the same property the entries would be next to each other.

Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: hanes teulu on Sunday 25 September 22 14:46 BST (UK)
I don't think "Pontpren" is a specific address - it identifies an area/location". There's a "Pontpren- llwyd" on the map, just south of "Maes Eglwys".
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: hanes teulu on Sunday 25 September 22 15:13 BST (UK)
https://maps.nls.uk/view/102342439
This is the map to the west of previous map posted.
On the'41 Census "Pontpren" is preceded by "Pont  Llan" and "Brin willach". These can be seen on the eastern edge of above.
Title: Re: Llangyfellach marriage DAVIES/ THOMAS
Post by: marinerclark on Sunday 25 September 22 16:55 BST (UK)
I believe Thomas and jemima had a son Thomas Thomas born about 1828.  He is Visiting John and Eleanor Davies in Merthyr in 1851.  He is living with another family working as a farm hand in 1841.  Liz