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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Somerset Lookup Requests => Somerset => England => Somerset Completed Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Strange Flowers on Thursday 05 February 09 13:58 GMT (UK)
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Hi everyone,
I'm afraid i've hit a brickwall and am hoping for some help on trying to connect two Lawrence families, one in Crewkerne in the 1841 census and the other in Merriot in the 1851 census.
I have traced my GT Grandfather George Lawrence back to the 1851 census: Piece: 1928; Folio: 348; Page: 4
John Lawrence Head married age 52 Labourer born Merriot somerset
Ann Lawrence wife age 40? born Merriot Somerset
George Lawrence Son age 8 born Merriot Somerset
Elizabeth Lawrence Daur age 1 born Marriot Somerset
I know that John is George's father because it says this on his marriage cert to my Gt Grandmother.
The age of George is correct(born 1843) but John and Ann King married in 1847 so Ann can't be his mother.
So this means that John was married before he met Ann.
I am 99% sure i have the correct birth cert of George born in Crewkerne in 1843 and it says John Lawrence is the father and a Sarah Trump is the mother.
The reason i say 99% sure is because there are only 2 born in the right district(Chard) and at the right time. The other entry is an ilegitimate child.
Hope i'm not confusing anybody but i have found John and Sarah Lawrence(nee Trump)in the 1841 census: HO107; Piece 940; Book: 3, District: 3; Folio: 46; Page: 25; Line: 19;
John Lawrence Sawyer age 30
Sarah Lawrence age 30
Charles Lawrence age 2
John and Sarah were married in Hawkchurch Dorset in 1837 according to the IGI.
Looking at parish records, there was an Henry who was born in 1837, then Charles in 1839, then a Jane in 1842, and then George born in 1843.
I have looked for this family in the 1851 census and can't find them - i would guess that Sarah, Henry and Jane have all died.
My problem is that if this is my Gt Grandfather George's parents, then why would John have aged 22 years in 10 years.
Also another thing that makes me wonder is i've managed to find the marriage between John Lawrence and Ann King in 1847 and it just doesn't look right:
17.10.1847; John LAWRENCE; bachelor of Bradford Abbas of full age; labourer; ? LAWRENCE; labourer;
Thomas RING; Henry ARNOLD (witnesses)
17.10.1847; Ann KING; spinster of Bradford Abbas of full age; ?Peter KING; labourer
If this is the same John, then wouldn't it say Widower? Surely Ann must have known about George when she married him.
Sorry for the long explanation, but any help at all would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers,
Craig
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Hi
There is a death showing for a Sarah Lawrence, Dec q, 1843, Chard, vol 10 page 275.
Gadget
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and two possibles for Charles Lawrence in Chard RD:
Sept Q, 1845, vol 10 page 225
June Q, 1849, vol 10 page 264
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and two deaths for Jane Lawrence, again Chard:
June q, 1842 Vol 10 Page
June q, 1842 Vol 10 Page 258
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also a death of Henry Lawrence, in Chard, March q, 1829, vol 10, page 270
I think it might be worth getting the certificate for the marriage to Ann to get the name of John's father. You might then be able to link him to the one previously married to Sarah.
Gadget
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Ref for the marriage is:
Dec Q, 1847, Sherborne, vol 8 page 195
Gadget :)
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Hi Gadget,
Thanks so much for taking a look for me and i'll definately try and investigate the death entries and marriage entry you've found - they certainly look good.
If this is the right John Lawrence, i'm still worried that he's aged 22 years between the 1841 and 1851 census and also he has said he's a batchelor when he married Ann King.
Cheers,
Craig
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I wouldn't worry too much about the bachelor bit - it happens quite frequently.
Re his age - again people often just gave a rough age on censuses. The 1841 ages were grouped into 5 year bands for those over 15 so he would be 30-34 on the 1841. Have you checked the 1841 and 1851 original images. There might be a transcription error as well.
Have you got them on the 1861?
Gadget
PS - Sarah's death cert should give an address which you can compare with George's birth cert.
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No think they are different families
I've just checked the 1841 and John is a Sawyer. On the 1861, Bishops Hill , there is a John Lawrence, aged 51, wife Sarah, aged 54. He is also a sawyer:
RG9/1619 F 14 p 23
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Also a John Lawrence in Merriott on the 1861, aged 63, a labourer (as yours was in 1851) but his wife is a Mary :-\
RG9/1638 F 50 p 8
Worth checking for the death of an Ann
Gadget
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There are 2 possible deaths showing for an Ann Lawrence, Chard:
June Q, 1852, vol 5c page 334
Dec q, 1858, vol 5c page 346
Gadget
added -getting stranger the John/Mary combination are on the 1841 in Merriott (both aged 45) HO107/940 bk 5 Folio 28 Page 19
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Hi Gadget,
Thanks again for your help and sorry for the delay, i've just been to pick the kids up from school.
Well, it looks like i've got the wrong birth cert for George.
Do you think i'm right about him not being Ann's son in the 1851 census?
Here's the 1861 census: RG9; Piece: 1637; Folio: 45; Page: 18
Ann Lawrence Widow age 44 char woman born Dorset Bradford
George Lawrence age 17 ag labourer born Dorset Bradford
Samuel Lawrence age 9 ag labourer born Crewkerne
Henry Lawrence age 4 born Crewkerne
I can't find them on the 1871 census.
Cheers,
Craig
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If Ann and John didn't marry until 1847, I can't see that he could have been the son of their marriage :-\
However, George was b. Bradford, Dorset on the 1861 but Crewkerne on the 1851. Could he havebeen Ann's illegitimate son?
It's tricky - I've been looking for other John Lawrences on the 1841 who would be an alternative but can't see any so far.
Have you got George on any later censuses at all?
Gadget
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Interesting that there are 2 birth registrations for a George King and a George Lawrence King in Sherborne (covering Bradford):
GK - March q, 1842, vol 8 page 10
GLK - June q, 1844, vol 8 page 86
Gadget
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Hi Gadget,
It's a very complicated story of George. I have had to trace him using a "cousin" that i heard about from a relative.
Just to complicate things further the cousin was also called George Lawrence and was the grandson of a Samuel Lawrence- Samuel is the brother(half brother?) of my Gt Grandfather George.
Here is the 1881 census of Samuel Lawrence with his family living in Leicestershire:
RG11; Piece: 3124; Folio: 117; Page: 47
Samuel Lawrence mar age 27 general labourer born Somerset Cruckhorn(crewkerne)
Fanny Lawrence mar age ? born Stafford
George Lawrence son age 2 born Stafford
Susannah Lawrence age 6 months born Leicester
(there are alo some lodgers living with them)
Interestingly, next door is his brother, my Gt Grandfather George:
George Lawrence age 36 mar born somerset cruckhorn(crewkerne)
Mary Lawrence mar age 29 born Devon
Just seen your new post, the two George Kings are very interesting. There is a website with the parish registers of Sherborne including Bradford Abbas so i will definately take a look.
Thanks again Gadget for your help, it really is appreciated.
Cheers,
Craig
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Hi Gadget,
It's a very complicated story of George. I have had to trace him using a "cousin" that i heard about from a relative.
Just to complicate things further the cousin was also called George Lawrence and was the grandson of a Samuel Lawrence- Samuel is the brother(half brother?) of my Gt Grandfather George.
Here is the 1881 census of Samuel Lawrence with his family living in Leicestershire:
RG11; Piece: 3124; Folio: 117; Page: 47
Samuel Lawrence mar age 27 general labourer born Somerset Cruckhorn(crewkerne)
Fanny Lawrence mar age ? born Stafford
George Lawrence son age 2 born Stafford
Susannah Lawrence age 6 months born Leicester
(there are alo some lodgers living with them)
Interestingly, next door is his brother, my Gt Grandfather George:
George Lawrence age 36 mar born somerset cruckhorn(crewkerne)
Mary Lawrence mar age 29 born Devon
Just seen your new post, the two George Kings are very interesting. There is a website with the parish registers of Sherborne including Bradford Abbas so i will definately take a look.
Thanks again Gadget for your help, it really is appreciated.
Cheers,
Craig
Hi,
How did you get on with all of this?
I am looking into a Jane Laurence birth reg 1842 Crewkerne, Somerset, England. Father John, (now the mothers name given by a long deceased family member was Annie Trump, but no sources or proof. ) Absolutely no records so far match, this is the closest. Jane went to Australia very young and married, her first daughter being named Sarah. I was always told Jane was born in Pudding Lane, Taunton, but have never been able to confirm this either.
I wonder if you discovered anything else about the Crewkerne, Laurence's?
Cheers
Del
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Also a John Lawrence in Merriott on the 1861, aged 63, a labourer (as yours was in 1851) but his wife is a Mary :-\
RG9/1638 F 50 p 8
Worth checking for the death of an Ann
Gadget
This may explain that marriage perhaps. http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/8403ca53-040a-4968-bbd3-9b540a909114