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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Nottinghamshire => Topic started by: lulis on Sunday 01 February 09 15:25 GMT (UK)

Title: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: lulis on Sunday 01 February 09 15:25 GMT (UK)
Hi

I am looking for anyone who knew the Robinson family of Elkesley
they are:-

William Robinson b. 1842 Elkesley who married on 13.12.1864 Elkesley a
Sarah (Mary) Scott Doncaster b. 06.09.1846 Babworth Ranby

Sarah Robinson had children:-

Mary Ellen bap. 25.04.1869  Elkesley
Sarah Jane bap. 25.04.1869    "
John William bap.26.04.1874   "           Bur.28.01.1876
Fanny Scott bap.26.04.1874    "           Bur. 25.04.1876
William John bap. 13.08.1876  "   Living at Wakefield on 1911 census
Kate             bap. 01.05.1880  "  Had a daughter Edith Clara b. 03.09.1902
Clara Ann    b. March/April 1881  Married William Kirk living near Retford 1911
Fanny          bap. 27.02.1898   "  Bur. 28.12.1961 Elkesley

Fanny Robinson lived in a old parish cottage in Elkesley and had a friend/neighbour called Mrs Allinson in the 1930's.

Sarah and Fanny Robinson appear twice on the 1911 census, at their cottage in Elkesley and visitors at Clara Kirk's house.

Anyone know of this family, and what happened to Kate and her daughter Edith?   I cannot find them on the 1911 census

Lulis

Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: vw on Thursday 24 September 09 14:31 BST (UK)
Hi
I don't know about the descendants of Sarah Scott Doncaster/Robinson but I have some information on her ancestors she was my 3x great aunt.  I am researching the Doncaster family, have you come across any of her ancestors?
Best wishes
Vicki
Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: lulis on Thursday 24 September 09 22:36 BST (UK)
Hi Vicki

Thanks for the reply  I think we have been in contact before maybe 2or 3 years ago.  I have spent some time at the nottingham archives so I might have picked up some info on the Doncaster family since we last had contact

I was hoping for a close descendant of William or Kate Robinson but no luck as yet.

I will try your old e-mail address and see if it is still current

Best Wishes Lulis
Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: Mruczek on Friday 06 March 15 18:33 GMT (UK)
Re William John Robinson

Hi Lulis

I have recently come across your search for my Grandfather, William John Robinson and as it was dated 2009 I assume you have found all the information you require.  If not, I can provide the information regarding his family.  I have some oral history and the family photograph album, the earliest photo of which is of my Great Great Grandma & Grandad Doncaster.  This is my first post as I have just started tracing my family tree.

Regards
Mruczek




Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: Mruczek on Saturday 07 March 15 04:20 GMT (UK)
Hi Lulis

Thanks for replying so quickly.  Yes my Grandfather was William John Robinson formerly of Elkesley who married Ada Dobson in Wakefield.  They had 5 children (birth dates & other dates I can confirm later, for reason see end of this reply)

John married Gladys (nee unknown) had 2 daughters.  John died in 1980's.

Emily, never married, brought up the family when Ada died in 1923.  She still lived at 3 Oak Street Wakefield until her death in 1963

Mildred, married Wilhelm Andrassy (part of the Wakefield Andrassy family) no children. Mildred died 1990's

Ernest, married Hilda Sutherington, 1 daughter! Ernest died 1990's

Harold, born 1920, married Joan Butcher, 1 son.  Harold died in 1990.

Grandfather was a carter with Wakefield Corporation and his horse was called Selby Rose.  He died in 1951, a few months before I was born. 

Questions:
1 Is there much information in his Service Record as his involvement in the 1st World War was the reason for researching the family history?

2 In my very brief trawl one fact that puzzled me was that Great Grandfather Robinson died in the same year that Grandfather was born, 1876, but before his birth, yet in one of the later census, Great Grandma was the head of the household, no other male apart from Grandfather was present and yet 3 more children had been produced - who was the father?

As regards Kate and Edith Clara, because of other commitments, I won't be able to access the family album until early May and therefore check for any photos of them and confirm dates. 

I also have Fanny's will which might be of some help as it lists the beneficiaries.

I also found a John Robinson, widower, farm labourer Elkesley living at the East Retford workhouse in 1881 aged 80.  This was from www.workhouse.org and was from the 1881 census.

Hope this will be of some use to you.  The oral history information is how Grandfather joined up for the 1st World War and the cousins who ran the Robin Hood pub at Elkesley and why Grandfather didn't speak to any of his relatives.















Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: larkspur on Saturday 07 March 15 09:53 GMT (UK)
Mruczek
You may need to edit your post and remove the people who are still alive, as we cannot post living people here. Dorothy, Ernest and Harold's families for instance. ;)
Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: chempat on Saturday 07 March 15 13:17 GMT (UK)
Quote:
'2 In my very brief trawl one fact that puzzled me was that Great Grandfather Robinson died in the same year that Grandfather was born, 1876, but before his birth, yet in one of the later census, Great Grandma was the head of the household, no other male apart from Grandfather was present and yet 3 more children had been produced - who was the father?'

Think you will need their birth certificates to see who is claimed as their father or how big a lie their Mother told.

If you also get their marriage certificates that might lead somewhere, but for one of my ancestors the siblings gave a variety of names for their Father.
Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: larkspur on Saturday 07 March 15 14:15 GMT (UK)
There are 7 baptisms for children at Elkesley, as given in a previous post,with the mother as Sarah Scott (first names)There is however some additional info regarding Kate and Fanny.
25-4-1869 Sarah Jane Robinson father William mother Sarah Scott father a labourer.
25-4-1869 Mary Ellen  ditto
26-4-1874 Fanny Scott  ditto----buried 25-4-1876 aged 2 years
26-4-1874 John William  ditto--- buried 28-1-1876 aged 4 years
 13-8-1876 William John ditto

1-5-1881 Kate mother Sarah Scott Robinson , no father entered
27-2-1898 Fanny mother Sarah Scott Robinson  ditto

Burial Elkesley
18-2-1876 William Robinson aged 34.
Sarah Scott Robinson would have been around 4 months pregnant with William John.

Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: lulis on Saturday 07 March 15 21:08 GMT (UK)
Hi

We have a interesting family of Robinsons.  The information everyone posted looks correct.

There is one big gap in this family and it is my Grandmother.  She was Clara Ann Robinson born I believe in April 1881 at Elkesley.  I have a copy of her birth certificate and it is dated Second April 1883
Mother is Sarah Robinson General Work.  No father is listed When registered Twelfth May 1883.

The only problem with this is on the 1881 Census Clara Robinson is shown to be 2 months old!
Her sister Kate Robinson is not on the 1881 Census

On the 1891 Census Sarah Robinson is head of household and with her are William son age 14 yrs,
Kate aged 10 yrs, Clara aged 8 yrs and Fanny aged 5 yrs.

When Clara died in 1935 her obituary in the newspaper gave her age for her to have been born in 1881.  My thinking is the man came round to do the 1881 Census and she had not registered the birth of either Kate or Clara so she registered Kate being born in 1881 and Clara being born in
1883?

I have copies of the birth certificates of Kate, Clara and Fanny and there is no father listed on any of them.  So the question I have persued over many years is who is my Great Grandfather?

I cannot find a baptism for Clara Robinson anywhere

There was a illness going round Sheffield in 1875 and a year later it arrived in Elkesley (they had relatives in Sheffield)
John William Robinson born 1872 died 28.01.1876
William Robinson born 1842  died 18.02.1876
Fanny Scott Robinson born 1874  died 25.04.1876

And William John Robinson was bap on 13.08.1876

No wonder Sarah Scott Robinson went on to have three more children, it would be so heartbreaking for her to loose three of her family in one year.

I have more information on the Robinson/Doncaster families. And I have a theory who is my Great Grandfather, but as yet I cannot find the truth.

Lulis
Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: larkspur on Sunday 08 March 15 11:01 GMT (UK)
"There is one big gap in this family and it is my Grandmother.  She was Clara Ann Robinson born I believe in April 1881 at Elkesley.  I have a copy of her birth certificate and it is dated Second April 1883
Mother is Sarah Robinson General Work.  No father is listed When registered Twelfth May 1883."

You say you believe she was born April 1881 but have her birth cert saying 1883.
Kate Robinson was registered Jun 1881 at E Retford 7b/13, there is also a Arthur Butt Robinson with the same registration details.
The 1881 census was on the  3rd April, so if one of the girls birthdays was on 2nd April she should be only be a day old on the census. The census image looks like 2 weeks. I could not find a death for this Clara , so a bit of a tangle there with names, Could Sarah have called her Clara initially and then decide she liked Kate better? She certainly baptised her as Kate in the May 1881.
I think it unlikely she left 2 years to register a birth as there was a consequence to doing that.

Fanny's baptism date does not tie with her census age either -according to that she was born 1886 and baptised 1898, so she would have been around 12 at her baptism.
Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: Annie65115 on Sunday 08 March 15 22:28 GMT (UK)
I doubt that Sarah had 3 more children due to sorrow at losing 3 earlier born ones. She was a widow with small children in the days before there was any such thing as social security and many women in that situation did what they had to do to survive and get food into the children's mouths..
Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: lulis on Sunday 08 March 15 23:48 GMT (UK)
Hi

I have copies of the birth certificates of the three daughters of Sarah Scott Robinson

All are in Registration District East Retford
21.03.1881 Elkesley  Kate Robinson  When registered 07.05.1881
02.04.1883 Elkesley Clara Ann Robinson  When registered 12.05.1883
25.09.1885 Elkesley  Fanny Robinson  When registered 07.11.1885

Kate had a daughter
03.09.1902 Elkesley Edith Clara Robinson  When registered 15.10.1902  No father named

Clara Ann Robinson married my Grandfather and went on to have 8 children, which I will not go into

I searched the baptisms records first many years ago and I have Kate's baptism written down at Elkesley Number 742 and dated 01.05.1880? 

Regards Lulis
Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: Mruczek on Monday 09 March 15 00:10 GMT (UK)
Hi Lulis

You mentioned in a previous post that you had William John Robinson's KOYLI service record, is there much detail in it?  If there is, I will apply for it.  The one I have just received back from the MOD re my father was very sparse on detail, to the extent that his active service contained 2 lines - dates of departure and arrival in North Africa and yet he qualified for 6 campaign medals!

Regards Mruczek

Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: larkspur on Monday 09 March 15 10:34 GMT (UK)
 "searched the baptisms records first many years ago and I have Kate's baptism written down at Elkesley Number 742 and dated 01.05.1880? "

Both Freereg and NFHS give 1881 for Kate's baptism. If you have her birth as 21st 3rd 1881, her baptism could hardly be 1-5-1880.
 Free Reg
Elkesley
St Giles
Number   742   
Baptism Date   01 May 1881
Forename   Kate
Mother Forename   Sarah Scott
Mother Surname    ROBINSON
Abode   Elkesley
   
Title: Re: Robinson family-Elkesley 1861-1961
Post by: lulis on Monday 09 March 15 22:21 GMT (UK)
Hi Larkspur

Thank you Larkspur for looking up the baptism date for Kate.  I have also seen this on Free Reg, but when I started my tree (i am not sure) but I think I got the information of the baptisms from parish records on microfiche's?  Could have been at the library at Retford.  A year makes a big difference to the way I see things, so when I have time I will track down the Parish records and look again.

Hi Mruczek

There is not much information on the service record for William John Robinson.
If this is what I have?
He must have been in the Territorial Army, his Reg No was 4897.  Then he changes Reg No to 202118  He was a private in the KOYLI.   Unit 1/4 Bn  First joined for duty 15.06.15   Place Wakefield

Some of the sheets are burnt and some you cannot read very well (faded or done in pencil)

On the Military History Sheet it reads

(First Heading is burnt           From                             To                   Years           Days
Embodied Home             14.6.15                   4.3. 16                                            264?
Abroad                           5. 3 .16                 11? 2. 19                          2
Home                            14.2.19                   18.3.19
?                                   19.3.19


Campaigns   First line cannot read?      --      4.3.16
                  Expeditionary Force France   5.3.16 to  ? ? 19

British War Medal
The Victory Medal


Medical Inspection Report
Date cannot read
Apparent age 38 yrs 11 months
Height 5 ft 5 3/4ins
Chest measurement   35 ins    Range of expansion 3 ins

I got this record because my mother told me her mother was upset that her brother had been killed in WW1.  But now it is too late to ask her again.

Regards Lulis