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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Northumberland => Topic started by: cavvytri on Wednesday 28 January 09 10:10 GMT (UK)
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:) Hi, I was hoping that someone with a good knowledge of the Blyth area (Mike? :P) could tell me whereabouts in present day Blyth that Double Row, Cowpen Colliery would be? Was it part of Isabella? Thankyou
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If it was Cowpen Colliery, I think Double Row would have been next to Bolam ave at the side of where Blyth Sports Centre is Now, I can recall my Grandmother mention Badgers Row and that was in Cowpen Colliery at the same site I am on about, Maybe Michael Dixon will know
Regards
Eddie
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I have (or I think I have) somewhere the names of all colliery rows for Blyth area.
But while I dig around for my stuff, to help can you add an ish-date and maybe place/area.
Because.... I can see a map of Blyth that show FOUR Cowpen Collieries
( named after a coal company rather than the place- the Bella the youngest one!)
A fifth colliery/pit at Low Horton got it's name from a different coal company,
The New Delaval Coal Compny- which then gave it's name to that part of Blyth.
Michael Dixon
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There was a Double Row in/at
*Cowpen Colliery- "A" Pit or South Pit ( near todays Baths)
*Cowpen Colliery-Isabella Pit ( also named South Row, probably before it was Double")
*New Delaval Colliery- Forster Pit
*Newsham Colliery
And also at Seaton Delaval Colliery.
Michael Dixon
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Re Double Row
Michael re Isabella Colliery as you came over the bridge from Cowpen the first row at Isabella was South row which backed on to west row a cross the street which is a road through was east row which backed on to New Row, the area which south row and west row stood is now called West Court
Eddie
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Thanks for your help. I have two families marrying into each other and they were neighbours in Double Row, Cowpen colliery.
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It all depends on when this marriage took place. Although the Isabella opened in 1849 the houses were not built until some time later. Double Row appears for the first time in the 1881 census therefore built sometime between 1871 and 1881. Prior to that the workers lived in the rows built for Cowpen A pit (where the baths are) which, I believe, had closed by that time.
There is a William Dalrymple (noted from your surname interests) living at 9 Double Row in the 1881 census.
Christine
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Yes, both families (Coombs and Dalrymple) were there at Double Row on the 1881 census...by the time of the next one they had moved to Pegswood then Ashington where they stayed. So Isabella Colliery?
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Will you believe this ?
All from 1881 Census.
The Coombs ( page ref 5092-67-3) are Double Row at Cowpen Colliery.
This was within census sub-district 7c ( Enumerator Luke Robinson describes this area on 5092-31- in fact he describes 7a-7b-7c together.
The rows following Double Row on the census are Gas Row, Badger Row, Gas Row , Middle Row.
The Double Row of this colliery was parallel to Railway Terrace, but on other side of the railway line. Coming up from Blyth, up Marlow St, at the top, ignore the temptation of the Cowpen Colliery Inn ( now The Top House) cross the railway by the pedestrian bridge ( both line and bridge now gone). On the left would be Double Row, on the right Gas Row, with Badger Row up from the right. Today this area is covered by Bolam Avenue etc.
You can just about see this patch on the old maps on web site
communities.northumberland.gov.uk, in the Ordnance Survey maps in the Blyth section.... on 1920 25" version--- to the extrem left of the map.
Now to the Dalrymple family, as already said, were at 9 Double Row on census page 5092-67-3. Enumerator John Turnbull has made it easy for us by not just describing the sub-district- 8a- on page 5092-85, but by heading the address column on each page with "Isabella Colliery, Double Row"
So........... the two families on C1881, lived in a Double Row, but different ones !
Everyone please free to knock back this unlikely coincidence ??
Michael Dixon
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well done Michael, as ever you are the man on Blyth History ;)
regards
Eddie
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Thanks Eddie,
I'm not really. But I have encountered many puzzles and made many mistakes when doing my research, mainly because of place names been so different then than now. So I have sort of done a fair bit of reading, collecting info and maps, to resolve the "anomolies"
When I was a teenager, my father, a Haltwhistle man was mad keen on Local history. ..........
" Listen Michael I will explain why that railway line was built in that direction rather than... and why the Bedlington Iron Works was also at Bebside"
"Sorry father, it will have to be another time... I am off down Blyth " ( to the Cowpen Colliery Inn - lol )
So I never did listen to him- of course now I wish I had !
Michael Dixon
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Just come online to say the same thing, Michael. The Double Row that has both Coombs and Dalrymple living in it is, in fact, the one at Cowpen. The 1881 census does separate the two by describing the streets at the Isabella as 'Isabella Colliery'.
Christine
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Christine,
I am saying that the two families were in two different Double Rows, at the 1881 census.
There were 4 different Cowpen Collieries at the same time, ( North Pit, South Pit, Crofton Mill Pit and the Isabella, all entitled Cowpen Colliery) ) all within the "Township" of Cowpen ( which included the north and west of today's Blyth town).
Two of these colleries had Double Rows- The Isabella and the South Pit.
These two separate areas are now West Court/South End Avenue (Isabella) and Blyth Sports Centre/Railway Terrace(South Pit).
Michael
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Yes, I know that, Michael. In my own, possibly clumsy way, I was agreeing with you!
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Sorry Christine, My apologies - I misunderstood your " the one at Cowpen"
Michael
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:) Thankyou all very much for your help. Now I know they were in different Double Rows, and approximately whereabouts in present day Blyth they would have been. Very confusing mind you! ;D
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But only confusing to us, who are " contaminated" by our modern context and knowledge.
There would have been no confusion with your folk of that time !
Michael Dixon
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Hi All, I have three documents in which a double row is mentioned. The first is my mothers birth certificate from 1923, she was born at "17 Double row Cowpen Colliery, UD". This is the double row described by Michael as being just to the left of the bridge at the top of Marlow street. I have a map which shows a "Sixth row" between Gas row and and Badger row and also a West row beyond Double row; in the middle of all these is shown a "Club" sadly that's the edge of my map so I don't know if there was a first to fifth row as well.
I have two death certificates for my great grandparents who died in1922 and 1925. These certificates show the places of death as "7 (&30) Double row, South Newsham UD". This Double row formed part of the road that now runs to the coast past the new housing estate, A1061 I think? Double row was on the right as you headed to the coast just past what would have been the rail crossing, behind double row was single row both rows being close to Newsham South farm and the old reservoirs.
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( Miners rows at Cowpen Colliery - "A" or "South" Pit
In a triangular area which enclosed the shaft and pit yard.
From the south >Double Row.West Row.Sixth Row. Gas Row.Badger Row, and the row of houses on what is now called Cowpen Road . These houses were the nearest to the pit shaft and pre-dated the others. So although there were no 1- 5th rows, Sixth Row was the 6th row built. Or so I think !
Try it out, with use of the Durham online mapping site. Using it like a time machine will reveal the development of Cowpen Colliery pit yard - and maybe pan down to Newsham colliery ( google durham gis to get to site ! )
Michael Dixon
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Sorry for jumping in at the end of this query, but I remember a 'New Row' opposite Gas Row. I don't recall a 'Sixth Row'.
To explain, I lived at 7 Double row between 1949 and 1951, then at 1 New Row for a year before moving to Cowpen Estate.
I knew people in all the other rows mentioned, Gas, West, and Badger. The 'Club' in the middle had a fine clay pit used for quoits.
I wish I had a photo of Cowpen Colliery but all I've got are a few shots of our yard.
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Welcome to rootschat.
I'm afraid I don't have any photographs but someone on here might - it's amazing what you can find on this site.
Alternatively, Northumberland Archives at Woodhorn have a lot of local pics - maybe they have one.
Christine
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Thanks Christine, I'm visiting the area next week (I live in Coventry now) so I may make time to look at Woodhorn.
Regards, George
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It might be worth a phone call to see what they have before you go. Just in case you don't have the web address details of contacts and opening times can be found at
http://www.experiencewoodhorn.com/welcome.htm
Christine
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I did get to Woodhorn, and what an impressive place it is. Had a good look around and registered to look at the maps.
The map I found only included a tiny snippet of Cowpen Colliery, and they did,t have the next sheet.
So the search goes on.
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George,
You said you don't recall a Sixth Row.
In fron of me I have the 25" version of the 1897 Ordnance Survey map showing the "top" of Blyth.
It clearly shows rows of houses roughly in a triangular shape. Two long sides formed by West Row to the west, Double Row and Gas Row forming the east side and topped off by Badger Row.
Sixth Row is shown towards the angle formed by Badger Row and Gas Row.
West Row was in two separate parts. I wonder if Sixth Row got it's name from been 6th. , after West Row ( northern part), West Row ( southern part), Double Row, Gas Row and Badger Row. then Sixth Row.
Is Sixth Row what you knew as New Row ?
The map referred to by fremund is on-line at site communities.northumberland.gov.uk enter the Blyth section, click on Ordnance Maps- choose 1897 25 "... see extreme left of map to see Cowpen Colliery rows.
Here are snippets of what a roving reporter of the Newcastle Wqeekly Chronicle wrote in edition of 4th Oct 1873 ( he covered a different colliery every week for over two years.)
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" ...... Cowpen had gas works of it's own, and a row of cottages close by is known as the "Gas Raw", each house within which contains two rooms. It was the first row built by the present owners, and until a few months ago had neither privies nor ash pits; but now these requirements have been added.
A brick wall runs along the Back and Ends; the ash-pits are built high, with doors just as we have them in town, and each home has it's own back-yard.
"Fiddler's Row" face the Blyth & Tyne Railway, which it overlooks, and is the same in structure as the Gas Row.
Parallel with the Fiddlers Row is the Double Row, each house in which contains three rooms, but another row, called the Middle Row, is built so near it that there is no room for such improved privies and ash-pits as have been added to the other rows.
Quality Row is a gentleman of the ancient regime and swells in portly pride at the bottom of the west leg of the triangle. Each of it's houses contains no less than four rooms, the upper rooms being reached by a noble staircase.
The West Row forms the remainder of the triangle. Its houses are comfortable two-roomed houses, with projecting pantries behind. But it is too close to the Middle Row to leaqve room for conveniences.
In the centre of the triagle are the village schools, large and well ventilated with separate departments for boys, girls and infants. There are no chapels in the village. Blyth is close at hand and Blyth is a religious town, so there is no necessity for places of worship in the village itself, although zealous Methodists hold services and conduct Sunday classes in the colliery school. "
...........
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Michael Dixon
( from Bebside Colliery village where reporter gave it's privies scored a higher rating than Cowpen Colliery. lol)
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Thanks for that Michael, really interesting.
What, I wonder is an ash pit?
I've looked at the map and where I lived after Double Row was in one of the two houses in line with 6th Row but separated from it. I wonder if those two houses constituted New Row, and I've just forgotten about the name 6th Row?
The privies were still in use until the end, though of course we called them netties. They were separated from the back yard by a lane which seemed to be made of coal dust and crossed by walking on lengths of worn out conveyor belt to avoid the worst of the grime, especially in the wet.
Little wonder that Cowpen Estate seemed so superior when we moved there.
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Regards, George
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George,
Ash pit pre-dates the nettie. A sort of midden, into which folk dumped their
"overnight waste" etc.
I was born in Bebside colliery rows in 1941. Our house had no water, electricity or lavatory. We had to carry water from a stand pipe tap about fifty yards away. In the back lane we had an "Earth Closet".
When the whole colliery village was demolished circa 1951/2, we were rehoused to Weardale Ave, Cowpen Estate. My two younger brothers and I, were fascinated by two indoor flushing Water Closets and electricity and running water. Slumdog Millionaires !
Henry Young, an enumerator for parts of Newcastle in the 1861, inserted a comment on atrocious social conditions... here a little snippet..
".... A cart calls at the end of every street..... those who neglect or may not hear the bell are compelled to keep "slop pails" for another 24 hours on the premises or in the absence of the ploice get rid of it as best they can....."
Michael
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Point to note having lived the first 18 years of my life at the Bella( Isabella Colliery). These 5 rows West East New double and the one you missed MIDDLE double Row changed to south Row while I was at School so sometime in 1960s double Row came across the top of the Bella and it usually housed the Pit foremen every Row had a least one turnbull family and they were connected through marriege to Waugh Davisons Henderson Rhodes Stevenson Palmer Taylor Coleman Weatherby Heamsley to name but a few of the mining families
By the way a correction for you the first Row from the the Bridge was West Row
Bella
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Bella,
Who are addressing your comments to ?
My comments were about Cowpen Colliery near the top of Waterloo Road, not the Isabella Colliery .
Michael
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Just been looking at this item due to Double Row catching my eye on the index. Thought 'I wonder if that's about the Bella.' I then saw the reference to there were no churches there, and that there were plenty in Blyth. Months back I was delving into New Deleval history, and came across a 1935-7 ordnance survey of New Deleval. There are 3 Methodist churches shown- one either side of the infants school, and one at the top of the lane continuing on from Plessey Road. (The old waggon way). Growing up in the 1940's the rows of miners' cottages were no longer there. New Deleval finished at the top end of Plessey Road and the area of the schools. As a youngster I could not understand why there was 1-2 gas lamps on the lane towards the church, and why the church had been built there, when there were no houses in its vicinity. The top church stood alongside the colliery rail line, and was still used until about 1950-2. Where the colliery rows stood was the timber yard in the late 40's/early 50's, encircled by a rail line. We used to play amongst the timber stacks, and although seen by the workers, we were never chased off- we did not do damage ! In a previous post I spelled it as Delaval, then noticed a spelling on this forum as Deleval. So I changed my spelling. But looking at the 1935 map it is spelled "New Delaval" Now I am confused ???
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pityacka,
I suppose that because the pit's name was derived from the Norman family, the Delavals, it is fair to call it New Delaval. ( New Delaval as opposed to "old" or original Delaval)
My great grandad married in Blyth St Wilfred's in 1862. His address on marriage cert. was just Forster Pit, an earlier name of the community around the pit.
Before the pit was sunk ( circa 1860) that area was called Low Horton.
Michael
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Delaval deleval The name coming from The Delavals of Seaton Delaval hall and of course due to local accent pronounced deleval.
Of course there were methodistchurches at (Newsham ) New Delaval there was a methodist on Newcastle Road which was also a cinema and I attended the methodist at New Delaval up until about 1960,behind the school beside the golf course My aunt was married there 1906
The church was still standing last year when I was taking photos of the old school.
My father spent his entire life at Isabella colliery living in West Row andNew Row and later the bungalows which are now West Court. he said the methodists had a place in one of the houses at the end of West Row when he was growing up 1920s.
Bella
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I used to live at 22 Double Row, before it was demolished and we moved to Cowpen Estate. As a small child I can remember walking down to the footbridge to cross the railway line then on to the town center.
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734641,
In the 1950s I used to walk though the pityard to cross over the railway line via the footbridge. But I did not go much further on the Blyth side. I took half a dozen steps to the left- into the Cowpen Colliery Inn.
Michael
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Do you know what year double row was demolished? I can remember that we were one of the last families to leave but being so small not sure of the year. My guess would be either 56/57???
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I have an old photo taken on Double Row. It's a group kids on and around my Uncles new Matchless motorbike. Not sure of the names but would any one be interested if I posted it?
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734641,
I suggest you post it. Some folk may be interested in the buildings, some in the motorbike, some in the people, in the photo !
Michael
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I had forgotten all about this subject, and when having a look at it I found I had also added to it sometime back. I will have to have a studied read of it all again, later on today. And as regards posting photographs - where did cavvytri (the originator of this thread) get the photograph of the Bella Pit Heap covered in snow for his avatar ? ;D The heap could look like that in winter. I recall one winter there were German students over on an exchange visit. One was staying with a Margaret ??? (forgot surname) who lived at Bedlington/Ashington area, and who came to Blyth Grammar School. Snow had fallen before her arrival and when she got to the house where she was staying, she saw the local pit heap which was covered with snow, and remarked, with a German accent of course, " Ah, you also hav ze mountains here." I think when things were explained she vas a leetle disappointed. :)
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Ok will did them out and post it although there is little of the buildings
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I thought that it might be useful to post a map from the 1920's showing the streets that have been discussed in this post.
Then I have come across an aerial photograph from about 1948 which actually shows Double Row. I have tried to duplicate this using Google Earth to show where the street would have stood today. And then finished it off with a Street . on the ground. Double Row would have stood roughly aligned with the footpath with stretches back from the small building in the foreground.
I hope that you find it useful!
copyright image removed
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The rest of the images...
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The map image has been removed. Please follow this link to see the map.
https://www.old-maps.co.uk/#/Map/430755/581466/12/101116
Tip! You will have to zoom out a couple of times using the - marker on the side of the map before you will be able to see the Un-subscriber view.
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I have an interest in the Patterson family which lived at 11 Double Row, Cowpen during the first 15-20 years of the 1900s. By 1914 there were at least 9 children, the two parents and a lodger living there. Earlier in this thread Michael described the houses as having three rooms, but I'd be grateful for advice as to the layout - ie was there (a) one large room downstairs and two upstairs, (b) two downstairs and one upstairs or (c) were they all on the same level.
When the father, Tom John Patterson serving with the Northumberland Fusiliers was killed on on the first day of the Somme, 1 July 1916, would his wife and children been forced to live elsewhere?
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Hi Southernman, Welcome to rootschat :)
Sorry for the delay in responding - I thought I had some hand-drawn plans of the usual layout of colliery houses but can't find them anywhere :-\
Three roomed houses had one large room downstairs and two up. Others I have been in had two rooms downstairs - a smaller front parlour (used only for special occasions) and a larger living room at the back.
As for 'security of tenure' - the houses went with the job so if there was no miner living in the house then the family would have to find alternative accommodation. I don't know whether there was some kind of 'amnesty' during the war - if the head of household was away fighting then it is to be hoped that the house was retained for his return but I haven't been able to find out as yet.
Christine
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Thank you, Christine. I suspect, given the number of people living in the house, it would have been the one down, two up version.
My main interest is in the youngest child, Hannah. I know she was educated at Blyth Secondary (later Grammar) School circa 1926-1932, but after that she disappears from the radar until receiving an immediate commission on joining the WAAF in September 1941. When she died of meningitis the following April her estate amounted to over £400 (equivalent to £15000-18000 today), not bad for a lass with her beginnings. I'd love to know what she did after leaving school.
Brian
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Hi Brian
I think your best bet with Hannah would be to start a new topic on this (Northumberland) board giving all the information you have. This is an old and quite long thread and your posts could easily be missed. More people will notice if you start a new one.
Christine
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Wise advice Christine - my thanks for your help.
Brian