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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Kildare => Topic started by: brummie on Thursday 15 January 09 18:41 GMT (UK)
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I wonder if anyone can help - I have just found out that my GtGrandfather was born in Crookstown, Co Kildare around 1862.
His name was Patrick Doran, his father's name was William and they were Roman Catholic. How can I get his birth certificate or details of his birth and is there any way I can find out about his father William and the name of Patrick's mother.
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Civil registration of births in Ireland started in 1864 which means there will be no birth certificate for Patrick Doran so you have to search for church records (if they exist).
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Where would I find these - at the local church or is there a central repository.
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Probably St Laurence RC Church. St Laurence National school is nearby and the telephone no is 050723333. Perhaps they might provide the Priests ph.no.
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In theory you should be able to access the indexes to the Crookstown church registers free at Kildare Genealogy and order an instant transcript online for 5 euro, alas Sod's Law dictates that the Crookstown registers are still unaccessible as they say there are so many mistakes with similar entries being duplicated that they can't decide what to do about it well over a year after all the the other parishes of Kildare became available.
My Cahill/Kelly ancestors lived in this catholic parish which is listed as Narraghmore R.C. A few weeks ago I noted that at long last Narraghmore R.C. baptisms (but not the Marriages) had become available and I spent a number of hours by trial and error working out from the limited information in the indexes, the entries of interest to me. A few days later after paying my credits I attempted to order the transcripts and to my horror discovered that Narraghmore R.C. baptisms were no longer there and when I emailed Kildare Genealogy for an explanation I was told that they had been added in error and later removed. I am now told they have no idea when they are going to be entered.
Having said all of that, you could either go to Kildare Genealogy and send them an email requesting a lookup (as they offered me though that was in respect of the credits I had paid for) provided they don't charge more than the standard 5 euro but that's up to you, failing that you would need to write to the parish priest who may well refer you to Kildare Genealogy in any case.
As it happens I know something about a William Doran who appears in the Primary Valuation (1852) at Inchaquire in the civil parish of Narraghmore (catholic parish of Crookstown) where I have reason to believe my Kelly ancestors originated and a William Doran sponsored a child of of my great-grandparents in 1865 though that was in Durham City after emigration, however I know from experience that many sponsorships are by proxy and I have not been been able to find a corresponding William Doran in Co Durham during that period so you never know, we may have a connection.
Good luck,
J.T.A.
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These are all children of William Doran and Honor Byrne listed in the I.G.I.
Crookstown is in the Registration District of Fontstown so Mary might well be a younger sister of Patrick, the next two are probably the same family and there might well have been a reason why the last child was registered in Wicklow as Crookstown is right next to the Wicklow border. As these births are from the civil registers there are none earlier than 1864.
1. MARY DORAN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Birth: 28 FEB 1866 0459, Fontstown, Kildare, Ireland
2. JOHN DORAN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: 13 DEC 1867 , , Ireland
3. PETER DORAN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: 14 DEC 1869 , , Ireland
4. WILLIAM DORAN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: 06 DEC 1871 , Wicklow, Ireland
J.T.A.
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Thank you so much for all of this information, I shall e-mail Kildare Genealogy and see if they can help.
It looks as though Mary could be Patrick's sister and the William and Honor Byrne you mentioned his parents. The reason I think that this is so is that Patrick's eldest daughter was name Honor.
I am very excited about what you have said as you have opened a door that I thought would never be opened.
I you do come across anything else about the Doran's would you let me know.
Once again thank you very much.
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Best of luck with Kidare Genealogy I have asked why they can't in the meantime make the other volumes available as it is only one early marriage and one early baptismal volume where the problems are, but they say it is a case of all or nothing which sounds stupid to me and all the other researchers who have waited patiently for these records to become available for many years.
You could also apply for Mary's birth certificate from the Irish GRO which will give a location.
Do you know if Patrick was born in the townland of Crookstown or the catholic parish of that name which includes a number of civil parishes. To complicate things the townland is divided into Crookstown Upper, Crookstown Lower and Crookstown East. Crookstown Upper where the church is located and Crookstown East is in the Union of Baltinglass and the Registration District of Baltinglass which is mainly in Wicklow whilst Crookstown Lower is in the Union of Athy and the Registration District of Fontstown, all three adjacent townlands are in the civil parish of Narraghmore.
If you can find an exact location I may be able to help further.
Good luck,
J.T.A.
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On his army attestation (where I found out where he was born) it says Crookstown, Athy, Co Kildare so it should be Crookstown Lower.
As I have only just found out this information the different parts of Crookstown are new to me and from what you have said it sounds like a nightmare trying to find the right one.
Thanks for finding all this out for me it is very kind of you.
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These are all the Doran heads of household listed in the Primary Valuation of 1852 within the Catholic parish of Crookstown which may be too early for the William Doran you are interested in as this survey took place about 10 years before your Patrick Dolan was born but it looks like a relatively easy name to research as it narrows it down to just two townlands in 1852.
DORAN PATRICK INCHAQUIRE KILDARE NARRAGHMORE
DORAN WILLIAM INCHAQUIRE KILDARE NARRAGHMORE
DORAN EDWARD INCHAQUIRE KILDARE NARRAGHMORE
DORAN ANNE INCHAQUIRE KILDARE NARRAGHMORE
DORAN WILLIAM KINGSLAND KILDARE USK
This is where a search of the church registers is needed to see when the eldest sibling can be found and hopefully the marriage.
Not a nightmare at all, fairly simple, in fact it is an advantage to know how these places are subdivided but in any case Inchaquire looks favorite as there were no Dorans in the three Crookstown townlands in 1852 and Inchaquire being adjacent to Crookstown Lower is in the Union of Athy. It also rules out the William Doran at Kingsland as that is in the Union of Naas so that just leaves Inchaquire in 1852 at least. I think you are on a winner!!! I'd get that birth certificate of Mary's if I were you.
J.T.A.
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Hi,
There was no sign of a Thomas Doran in that? My g-grandmother was Winifred Doran (she married Michael Dillon), her parents were Thomas and Catherine Doran, from Gormanstown? (Wicklow) (so it says on the marriage cert in 1881)
Regards,
Maureen.
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....... her parents were Thomas and Catherine Doran, from Gormanstown? (Wicklow) (so it says on the marriage cert in 1881)
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just to clarify... Irish marriage certs dont state the address for parents just the residence of the bride & groom at the time of marriage - which may not be their family homes.
As well as the town of Gormanstown in Co. Meath there are several townlands of that name, including one near Kilcullen in county Kildare and another near to Arklow in county Wicklow.
Shane
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Thanks for the reply, yes, your right, her address was Gormanstown.
I presumed it was Gormanstown near Kilcullen (Love across the main road, so to speak!!) as Michael Dillon was from Ballybarney (just outside Calverstown)
Family rumour states that she was from an upper class Catholic family and she married beneath herself, so her family disowned her after she married :-[ In saying that, I've managed to disprove all the other families rumours, so there's nothing to say there is any truth to this one either!!
Maureen.