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Some Special Interests => Occupation Interests => Topic started by: setraynor on Wednesday 08 December 04 23:00 GMT (UK)
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I'm helping to transcribe part of the 1841 Census and I am completely stumped over the following occupations. ??? Anyone out there with some bright ideas on what they are?
duss maker (possibly a dress maker? I've been told it could be"Dressmaker ~ the occupation of 'dressmaker' was commonly given by prostitutes in larger towns and cities.")
duss maid
duss m possible the same as dressmaker above as . m is often used instead of maker?
h s
show m f
grocer sn
grocer li
Any thoughts?
Sharon
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grocer li
could be licensed grocer as in licensed to sell alcohol etc. as well as foodstuffs
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Try
http://rmhh.co.uk/occup/w.html
that will take you onto the W page but you will just need to navigate.
Teddybear
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Thanks for the link. It has given a couple of possibilities for H S (High Sheriff/ Hush Shopkeeper). Licenced Grocer seems logical too.
Still stumped on the 'Duss' ones, the grocer sn & show m f (maybe that's a showman fairground??)
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could the grocer sn be grocer gn
as in greengrocer ?
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Looks like sn to me but it is a squiggle. I'm trying to get a picture of the entry but Adobe isn't playing ball at the moment. I'll try tomorrow evening & copy all the squiggly writing.
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could dudd maid be a dust maid dusting furniture and breakables
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Just looking on the reply dressmaker I hope the ones in my family were really dressmakers because there are an awfull lot of them. :-[
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I'd love to know what a 'Witch Well Hole Maker' is, stumbled across in 1881 census (James Middleton, 56, Islington, Middlesex).
Possible mistranscription of:
Watch Wall Hole Maker ??? In which case, I would love to know what one of them is!
best wishes
Paul
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;) ;) ;)
Could be that grocers sn could be Grocer's Son and grocer li could be Grocer Licenced
;) ;) ;)
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Regarding Pauls Witch well hole maker....there is a watch jewel hole maker also on the 1881 census.....could this have turned into a witch well?
Herbert ASTON Son Male 14 Coventry, Warwick, England Watch Jewel Hole Maker (Apprentice)
Public Records Office Reference RG11
Piece / Folio 3068 / 95
Page Number 25
Actually theres quite a few ..particularly in Coventry with also a few in London.
Was Coventry a big watch making place in 1881??
Otherwise there are quite a few button hole makers..are there any strange buttons called a witch well??
Best Regards,
Emily
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Thank you for clearing that one up Emily!
Wonder if he was responsible for making the hole or making the jewel?
best wishes
Paul
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I tried googling watch jewell hole maker but got too many hits,
so I then tried watch "jewell hole" maker
and got two hits:
1) ... Coventry, Warwickshire, England Note: Timerick||David||married||50||jewell hole
maker||. ... England Note: Timerick||Samuel||married||30||watch finisher||Coventry ...
.... but with a dead link, and
2)
This would seem to be his family on the 1901 Census index living in Leyton....
Joseph Hough: [b.c. 1853, London St Lukes] Jewell Hole Marker
Florence Hough: [b.c. 1860, London Bermondsey]
Henrietta Hough: [b.c. 1878, Essex Leyton] Jewel Hole Maker
at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/HOUGH/2003-11/1070143337
Still doesn't explain what they did !! Probably need a watchmaker's site for that.
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Oooops ---- I tried spelling it right this time ( :-[ )
watch "jewel hole" maker
Got lots of hits including this one: http://www.watches-lexic.ch/pages/eng/tec/exp3.htm with a full explanation of jewel holes and pictures to go with it. --- all to do with shock absorbers and things !!
Fascinating reading ---- if you are interested. :)
And if not, it's nice to know that the information is always there, if you can find it ;D
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WOW that's technical, Bob! Detailed is not the word. Thanks for the link! :)
Paul
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Have found an ancestor with an occupation of Confectioner BUT also has next to it Slue Keeper. What in the dobbledocks is a Slue Keeper?
:-\
Shanko
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Hi Shanko
Could it be sluice keeper? Did they live near a canal/waterway/lock? If so, they may have been responsible for opening and closing the sluice gates when required.
Casalguidi
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First stop, Google; found a reference: " ...as fish in pond or slue get loose ... "
which made me think of drains, or a canal or sluice ...
and while I was thinking about it, Casalguidi posted her entry !
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Casalguidi + Berlin Bob
No they didnt live near any docks and the occupation is exactly as this: Confectioner Slue Keeper. So it has me stuck. I have other ancestors who were Confectioners but only that
I have looked on many many websites with old occupations but nothing with Confectioner Slue Keeper, not even Confectioner some of them
Shanko
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Wonder if it has anything to do with sloes and gin?
Paul
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Also found a Google reference to slue / slough, and the following (US) definitions for slough:[
n] any outer covering that can be shed or cast off (such as the cast-off skin of a snake)
[n] a stagnant swamp (especially as part of a bayou)
[n] a hollow filled with mud
[n] necrotic tissue; a mortified or gangrenous part or mass
[v] cast off hair, skin, horn, or feathers; of animals
Not sure if that gets you anywhere!
Paul
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This may be ridiculous, but could it be really bad handwriting for "shop keeper"?
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Got me curious ...
Is the Slue part quite clear on your document? Sure it's not shop keeper?
Is the document online on a census so we can have a look perhaps?
In any case good luck
Jonathan
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Now gin sounds more like my ancestors
Seriously thanks Paul but none of those would fit with a Confectioner
:(
Shanko
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Store keeper?
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Suttontrust - nope definatly not shop keeper
Johnathan - yes it is clear as and it does say Slue Keep after Confectioner
Hackstaple - Nope not store thats too many letters anyways :(
Id put the occupation bit up but god knows how you put an image up in here
Shanko
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Now gin sounds more like my ancestors
They laughed, and slued themselves round. --Dickens.
[1913 Webster]
Yes, now that Sutton Trust and Hackstaple have mentioned it ... shop sounds more feasible!
Paul
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Can you give us the name, age and county and the census it's in and we can look for it?
Paul
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Just got it out and looked again and above all the Confectioner Slue Keeper it has Sweet (something) Bread
Sweet Bread ..... EWW! now that is gross!
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Well, it sure looks like Slue - but I'm sure the well-trained eyes of Rootschatters will work this one out! ;D
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For all our sakes, post the image and put us out of our misery.
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Paul
Thank you for putting it up for me. Comical though I can do html with tables etc but putting an image on here I havent a clue!
See told everyone it is Slue so now back to the original question what is a Confectioner Slue Keeper?
;D
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am i the only one who doesnt think it looks like confectioner?
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I think blinky's got it! :)
The 't' in confectioner looks like an 'l', so the 'l' in slue must be a 't' and Hackstaple wins the money because it can really only be store keeper.
Paul
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blinky,
What do you reckon it is then? ???
I have transcribed many census pages and have come across Confectioner many times and I have the cd's here as well and those images are alot clearer and I also zoomed right in and checked each letter
Shanko
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I agree
I think it says confectioners store keeper. There seems to be an "s" on the end of confectioner and note that the "t" in confectioner isn't crossed as isn't the "t" in store. Hence the only problem would be that the "o" in store isn't an o but an "e".
Casalguidi
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And, if I'm not mistaken...
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I finally make it to 200 posts! ;D
Paul
Moderator Comment: Well done Paul
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it would be interesting to see the rest of the page to compare letters.
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Shanko,
I'd settle for Confectioner(s) Store Keeper.
I must say I'm rather envious that you have choices!! I'm perfectly happy when my lot can be found at all on a census return which is legible and doesn't appear to have been through the washing machine and then half burned ;D (e.g. half of St Luke parish 1851 where my lot seemed to have dwelled!)
All the Best
Jonathan
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As requested - not the whole page, but something with an e and a t for you
P
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appear to have been through the washing machine and then half burned
Anyone found any census washers or census burners in the 1901? ;D
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well i think shanko could be right,who ever wrote it doesnt cross their ts .
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If the first word is Sweet then the person does appear to cross their "t's" .... however I would agree that the latter section does appear to be Store Keeper.
It also looks as if different pieces of information have been given and crossed out and then the store keeper bit added as a catch all description.
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i reckon it must have been a friday afternoon job.
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I believe that the three words on the top line have been added afterwards - probably by another person(s) and possibly at different times to categorise what trade/profession the occupation would come under as per census guidelines.
The middle word looks like shop. Then somebody realised that they didn't have a shop ie. a store keeper working for a confectioner so deleted that. Then bread is added ie. the person worked in the breadmaking industry but then that mistake is realised thus deleted. Finally, sweet - the person worked in the sweet industry.
That seems to make sense to me.
Casalguidi
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Can someone tell me what did a zinc worker ,a lime worker and a billard marker do :-[
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I think a zinc worker is self-explanatory. A lime worker would be involved in making cement or perhaps whitewash. A billiard marker would work in a billiard hall or gentlemans club, keeping score and usually holding the stakes where there were bets on the game. 8)
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That was very quick thankyou. I hadn't heard of a billiard marker before.
And the zinc one I think I must definitely be a bit dopey but what kind of self explanatory is it, would they have made pipes or would it have been used for coins
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Lime Burning
Lime (calcium oxide) was used for the manufacture of mortar and also as a fertiliser. It was discovered in medieval times that lime improved soil structure and neutralised excessive soil acidity, leading to increased crop yields. For lime-burning, only broken limestone and a source of fuel was required. The limestone was usually quarried right next to the lime-kiln site. Also used in tanneries to remove hair from hides
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I thinkk the Billiard-Marker was a bit of a general man servant. here's is a reference.
http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache:Nq1W7b4cslMJ:www.eaba.co.uk/mags/bn/1875/1225/markersChristmasBox.html+what+was+a+billiard+marker&hl=en
You will also find him mentioned in various works of fiction. I think he was the guy who not only kept score a billiards but was Held the money when a wagerer was on a game.
If anbody has any other info on this profession, please let us know.
deadants
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Thankyou again for the replies
And the link I shall have a look at that asap
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laineychr
A zinc worker would then like now I suppose, work in the metal finishing business. Metal components are dipped in a zinc bath for the purpose of corrosion prevention.
Leofric
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Hi deadants.
billiard marker was the job my gggrandfather George Webb was doing 1871
census.
I've had a look at the web link. I don't think I would have lasted 2 minutes. maybe he enjoyed it?
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Hi laineychr,
their were probably good fringe benefits that made it worth while. Big tips spring to mind. Also, Some of these guys were bookmakers, and thats were the real action was. ;)
deadants
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Hi Laineychr - take a look at this site if you want to know a bit more about your Limeworker..
www.amberleymuseum.co.uk. click on Browse Amberley - then exhibits - then Kilns
It also has info on other rural trades and crafts and is on the site of the old Peppers Lime Quarrey at Amberley West Sussex.
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Whilst scrolling through Christenings for the chappelry of Turton I came across the following 15 April 1804 Mary d. Henry & Anne Horrocks, whitster
Further down there was a chapman. Any ideas on either of these occupations?
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Sue,
according to: http://www.gendocs.demon.co.uk/trades.html
CHAPMAN
[1] A dealer or pedlar of goods usually itinerant going from village to village.
[2] A keeper of a booth or stall in a market
sounds like an older name for some of my lot (and me) Market Traders
WHITESTER or WHITSTER
A person who bleached cloth.
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Thanks B Bob
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Does any kind soul or knowledgeable bod out there no what your occupation was if you were a Wire Drawer??
Was it wealthy or status giving?
Thanks a lot.
Aga
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From: http://www.gendocs.demon.co.uk/trades.html
WIRE DRAWER
A person who made wire from metal by drawing the metal through various size holes in a template.