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General => Technical Help => Topic started by: Sooziecats on Sunday 21 December 08 17:55 GMT (UK)
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Hi can anyone help me please?
My Uncle paid cash for a Toshiba L300-154 from a small independant shop in our town a few days ago.
When he got it home he had to put the battery into the back of the laptop and turn the machine on.
The system loaded up Windows Vista and then a sceen appeared stating something like - System initialising, this may take a few minutes. Three hours later it was still the same!
I took it back to the shop and explained the problem. The owner was extremley rude to me..... to cut a very long story short the owner told me that computer software was not covered by the sale of goods act. I asked for a replacement lap-top or a full refund but both were refused. The lap top is in the shop waiting for the owner to check it out and is probably going to cost another £50 to get it back.
Can you tell me what rights my Uncle has please and if the battery should have already been in the laptop?
Thanks
Sooziecats
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Hi Soozie,
Was the laptop NEW?
Gary
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Yep - brand spanking new and cost £379.99!
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Tell him you are off to Trading Standards for advice.
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I tried that one, but he shouted at me that because a computer consists of many parts computers are not covered by the Sale of Goods act - I put him right on that one, so he changed his mind and said that the Software was not covered. He then went on to patronise me by telling me the difference between hardware and software (I teach computing so I do know!). I have emailed Toshiba and am waiting a reply from them.
Sooziecats
Just looked on the Toshiba website and the battery should have already been inside the computer - mmmm more ammo for me to use!
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I'd be spitting feathers by now. !!
I am no authority but I would have thought that any software that is specifically included in the product description would be at least partly under warranty, even if it is a 'refer to manufaturer' type.
However, if he is installing software illegally without paying for it I would expect him to act like this. You could threaten reporting him to FAST (Federation Against Software Theft), that might have the desired effect.
The fault looks more like a hardware problem to me anyway but I am a programmer and they tell me we are therefore biased that way. ;D
Paul
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Soozie - you have got a receipt, I hope?
At the moment you have no computer and no proof that you bought it, otherwise. :o
The shopkeepers contract is with your uncle, so he would have to pursue the matter himself - speak to the Council, as they have responsibility for trading standards.
http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/glos/Consumer.htm
We bought the same computer a couple of months ago from a larger store and can confirm that the battery was already in it. From that particular supplier the software was also installed but that's not always the case.
Let us know how you get on & good luck!
Kind regards, Arranroots ;)
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Hi Sooziecat
The Sale of Goods Act
You may have rights under the Sale of Goods Act if you have bought
commercial goods
personal, household goods to use in your business and the seller contracted out of the Consumer Guarantees Act
Sales of Goods Act applies to computer software
I think it applies to this country
ricky
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Yep we have the receipt. I know the transaction is with my Uncle but he is very shy and does not want to make a fuss!
BUT that bloke from the shop is going to wish he had never met me by the time I have finished with him! I work for a local college and quite a few students have bought computers from him and when they dont work "he has been so helpful and only charged £50 to sort the problem out".
I just wish my Uncle had asked me to get him a laptop
Bring on Tuesday - I can't wait!!!!! By the way I do have a level 3 qualification in Customer Service and I know how to hold my temper - I dont really want to be arrested just before Christmas!!!!!!!
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I thought the retailer was responsible for goods for the first year.
Did you buy on a Credit Card because I think you would be covered.
Besides that,.... it was not fit for purpose.....when you bought it, if you are unable to load vista.
I would contact Trading Standards.
Ambers
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Possibly a quick phone call to Trading Standards would clarify any doubts you may have before returning to the store.
Although I too would echo the "not fit for purpose" stance.
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I will be on the phone first thing in the morning to Trading Standards - and straight down the shop for my Uncles money back if I can (he paid cash)
We are off to the pub quiz in an hour and one of the teams there has a member who works for Trading Standards so I might get an answer tonight.
Bring it on - I am so fired up. My Uncle is so kind and gentle and the bloke in the shop was so rude about him.
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I don't know why he should be complaining, if you rang Toshiba tech support they would tell you to go back to your retailer for a replacement within 28 days of purchase. The retailer would not lose out as he just passes it back as a "dead on arrival" unit. It does mean paperwork for him but not alot.
Software is certainly covered under the warranty, what use is a pc/laptop without an operating system! If an operating system came with it then its covered, if it fails before that, then its a hardware fault.
It should also NOT cost you another penny!, DEMAND your money back or a new replacement, not a refurbished one.
I used to work in the support dept of a very large IT company and they would be horrified at the treatment you are getting!
I would certainly go to Trading Standards with the rubbish you have been given.
jc
I once bought some software, admittedly cheap from the large pc chain. After installing it, I found it was ONLY in GERMAN :D I took it straight back to the shop and they tried it on until I produced the emails I received from the the company with registration and passwords all in German... this was needed to work the flippin thing and useless without. But "just this once" they gave me my money back but told me it wasn't their policy to change/refund software and they hadn't had complaints before... oh yeah! right, so all customers in the local Berkshire area are fluent German speakers. ;D ;D ;D
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Amber's hit the nail on the head. What you bought - the computer - is not fit for purpose as it doesn't compute. There's no legal argument around it unless it had been advertised as an "as is" sale (for which you might reasonably have expected to pay a lot less than usual). The dealer is obliged to provide you with a working computer matching ALL of the specifications of the one you bought, or he must return your money. Bluster doesn't count.
Don't let him sit on his laurels. Pester him. Write to him. Phone him. Threaten him with Trading Standards and Small Claims court. And, when you finally get satisfaction, report him to Trading Standards anyway, because that's all a rude git who tries to con his customers deserves.
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Thanks for all of your replies. I have just been back to the shop and aaaaaaaargghhhh they are closed on Mondays!
i have contacted Trading Standards and both the hardware and software are covered by the Sale of Goods Act 1979. I have now, on their advice, written a letter asking for my money back. As soon as I get a result I will be onto the local press and reporting him to trading standards.
Watch this space ha ha ha!
Sooziecats
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Hi
I would get in touch with Toshiba also, tell them what has happened and ask them whether the shop is an Authorised Toshiba Dealer. I don't think they would be too impressed.
Andy
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The legal term is "not of merchantable quality" If it does not work it is unfit for use and you are entitled to your money back.
Trading Standards have the authority to make him abide within the rules.
Do not accept a refurbishment of any description. you are entitled to a new machine.
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Looked like the letter worked! I have just put a cheque in the bank for the full amount.
The bloke told be that because the battery case was not closed correctly it had caused a software error!!!!!!!
I have spoken to my Uncle and he has told me that he did not have to put the battery in the back of the lap top and that the shop owner would not open the box in the shop to show him how to use the laptop. ALSO when my Uncle got the machine home the security seal and inner packaging had been opened and the model number did not match the instruction booklet!!
Well we will not be going there again.
Merry Christmas
sooziecats
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don't they come out with a load of b***
I'm so pleased you got your money back, though why a cheque? hope it clears! The whole episode leaves a bad taste doesn't it.
I buy my computer equipment from Novatech (Reading or Portsmouth branch) or online with Ebuyer. Direct from the manufacturers like Dell are also more trustworthy than these smaller outlets or even the well known high street chain.
Merry Christmas
Jenny
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I bought my beloved a Toshiba for christmas, found to be dead on arrival.
Phone call to supplier, result new laptop within the hour. (I live locally)
Now thats what I call service. 8) 8)
Brian
(For UK users CCL is the name)
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I have also have a Toshiba, and it works faultlessly - just so that others don't think that Toshibas are a load of .... Tosh ;D ;D ;D
Bought from Morgan, one of the distributors rather than a retailer
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I had 4 faulty TV's from Currys and kept taking them back for exchange, finally on a hot summer day wearing T shirt and shorts I demanded to see the manager then told him that I would sit in his shop until he found me a TV that would not break after 5 minutes, and every hour he kept me waiting I would remove an article of clothing.
I got an upgrade to the latest model and the explanation why the others did not work - a design fault!
Not that this helps much but hoped it would cheer you up before Christmas.
Good luck and demand you rights.
Mike
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Hi,
This is unrelated to the laptop topic but have just joined RootsChat and am looking for a way to contact sooziecats as I think we may be related on the Wanklyn side of the family. Cant find a way of sending her an email direct. Can anyone help?
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Hi Frowna
If you post again, you will be able to use the personal message system to contact her - I'm not sure that she has been online recently but she should get an email to say that you've sent a PM.
Replying to this counts as an extra post.
Kind regards, Arranroots ;)
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P.s. - alternatively you could leave a message on the Guest Book of her website:
http://www.tribalpages.com/tribes/sooziecats
There's a message page there too: http://www.tribalpages.com/tribe/contact?userid=sooziecats
:)