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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Fife => Topic started by: valenzed on Tuesday 25 November 08 22:48 GMT (UK)
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Hello
I'm new to this forum (or any for that matter) and would like help with a brick wall I've come up against.
My ggf Andrew Moyes was born in Dunfermline in 1849. I'd fondly imagined that I was descended from a long line of Moyes's, but Andrew's marriage (to Agnes Haxton on 3 Dec 1866) certificate states that his mother was a Mrs Simpson, deceased, and his father unknown.
The 1851 census has him living in Dunfermline with James and Jean Moyes and listed as 'orphan'. By 1861 he is a 'boarder' in the household of James and Elizabeth Moyes. They appear to be the witnesses at his marriage.
If anyone can throw any light on this, I would be most appreciative.
Valenzed
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Hi Valenzed
Welcome to Rootschat ;D
Have you got his death certificate - it may well enlarge of the full name of his mother?
Cheers
AMBLY
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These are Submitted records on the IGI - but, have a great air of truth about them, and can be pretty much 'seen' by a quick checking of Census and Scotlands People:
James MOYES born 28 Dec 1824 Dunfermline, died 7 Nov 1891
Son of David MOYES and Mary ALLAN
Married 1) : on 16 Aug 1845, Dunfermline
to:
Jean HUTTON born abt 1823 Dunfermline, died 17 Jan 1860, Golfdrum, Dunfermline,
dau of John HUTTON and Jane WHITE (WHYTE)
Married 2) on 17 Dec 1860 Dunfermline
to:
Elizabeth RUSSELL born abt 1828 Kirkcaldy, died 22 Apr 1899 Dunfermline
dau of John RUSSELL and Catherine McINTOSH
Further checks show James' first wife Jean HUTTON probably died in or as a result of childbirth with their last child Jemima Hutton MOYES. No doubt partly compelled due to the motherless children and baby, by the years end of 1860 James had remarried and the children, incl Jemima would have had a stepmother in Elizabeth RUSSELL (baby Jemima died in Feb 1861).
The marriage record of Agnes and Andrew in 1866 on the face of it, appears to indicate Andrew was illigitimate (no father listed) and that his mother married a SIMPSON between 1849 and 1851 but then died before the 1851 Census.
What we don't know, is if MOYES was his mother's maiden name or did he adopt the MOYES name from the people who raised him and for whom he named his children in the traditional naming pattern. Since it appears from Census that Andrew's 1st son and 2nd daughter were named for James MOYES and Jean HUTTON.
It is very likely though, Andrew's mother is blood related to either James MOYES or Jean HUTTON.
The 1891 Census has Andrew and Agnes in Markinch with their children.
In 1901, just Agnes and children, in Auchterderran - was she listed as a widow?
The only death I can see to fit anywhere near for Andrew MOYES 1891 to 1901, is in Marckinch 1894 age 52 - but that would make a year of birth 1842-ish.
Altogether 3 x Andrew MOYES died in Fife between 1891 and 1901.
1 was aged between 1 and 20
1 was aged between 50 and 60 (ie: in 1894 age 52)
1 was aged between 70 and 80
The 1891 Census for Fife (not in Markinch) does have an Andrew MOYES b abt 1842 but he is still alive in 1901.
Cheers
AMBLY
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WOW!
Thanks, AMBLY. What a lot of information to digest. I don't have a death certificate for Andrew Moyes. I have the census information from 1851 to 1901, and also assumed that he had died between 1881 and 1901. A foray into Scotland's People might be worthwhile. Agnes is listed as head of the household in 1901, occupation housekeeper - for six miners, which couldn't have been easy.
I can see I'll be spending more time on the computer, as well as sorting out what I already have.
Cheers
Valenzed
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Another possibility is that Andrew was placed with the family by the Church and James and Jean were paid to care for him. I believe the Dunfermline Library holds Kirk Sessions records for that period. There might be a reference to Andrew in it if his care was Church related.
Jacquie
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Thanks for your suggestion, Jacquie. My research is a bit intermittent and haphazard, but I found a reference to the Dunfermline Library Kirk Sessions being put online, so I'll keep an eye on that. Doing research from NZ (as cheaply as possible!) makes it a little more difficult.
Cheers (and Merry Christmas)
Valenzed
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Thanks for your suggestion, Jacquie. My research is a bit intermittent and haphazard, but I found a reference to the Dunfermline Library Kirk Sessions being put online, so I'll keep an eye on that. Doing research from NZ (as cheaply as possible!) makes it a little more difficult.
Cheers (and Merry Christmas)
Valenzed
They might not charge much, if anything, to check out the records. I've requested assistance from the library a couple of times and they've been great.
Jacquie
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I am looking for a lizzie/ elizabeth MOYES - who married a Thomas Galloway and lived in yonge street 1904 & 9 essex avenue 1908.
Thomas Galloway was a Tailor.
they had at least 2 children:
Annie Crombie Galloway - born 31 mar 1904.
William Masterton Galloway - born 29 aug 1908.
any help greatly appreciated
thanks
lisa x
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See Lisa's own topic on her MOYES / GALLOWAY here ;D
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=471162.msg3311148;topicseen
Note:
William Masterton GALLOWAY was born in Ontario, Canada, married in London, England and died in Essex, England.
The address' for Thomas in 1904 and 1908 are Canadian address' where the two mentioned children were born.
Cheers
AMBLY
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I am a great-grandson of Andrew, living in New Zealand.
I have seen his death certificate, and I can confirm that he died in a mining accident in Markinch in 1894.
The eldest son, James lived in the Morpeth area of Northumberland. Two grandchildren emigrated to NZ (perhaps 1960s).
Son John emigrated to NZ early 1900's with his family.
Son George (My grandfather) immigrated to NZ in 1926 with his family.
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A little more on Andrew Moyes (1848 - 1894)
- died 28 Nov 1894 at Isabella Coal Pit, Markinch. On DC his mother is listed as "MS Wyse".
James Moyes his "father" had several sisters. I will get details but one had an illegitimate daughter about 2 years younger than Andrew.
Family:
Margaret 1867-1897 m Thomas Cunningham
James 1869-1940 m Williamson Dixon
Thomas 1871-1871
Andrew 1872-1881
John 1875 - 1951 m Nellie Donaldson
David 1878 - ?? believed to have gone to Sth Africa (possibly Boer War)
William 1881 - m Granty Robertson. My aunt remembered him.
George 1883 - 1972 m Agnes Reid
Jessie Hutton 1885 -
Alexander 1887 - 1887
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Here are the details of the siblings of James Moyes "father" of Andrew Moyes
ie children of David Moyes and Mary Allen. Note that in the 1851 census Mary is a "midwife practising". Perhaps Mary delivered Andrew Moyes??
1. Ann Moyes b.9 Mar 1823 m 1852 to Robert Tod. They disappear from Scotland Census.
2. James Moyes b.28 Dec 1824; m.1845 to Jane/Jean Hutton; m2 1860 to Elizabeth Russell
3. Mary Moyes b.17 May 1830 - presumably died before 1832
4. Mary Moyes b.17 Dec 1832 - more on Mary below
4a. In census George Moyes & Agnes Moyes (twins) born 30 Apr 1833 - must be "adopted"
5. David Moyes b.28 Jan 1836; m. Christina Dick
6. Christina Moyes b. 20 Apr 1838 m Robert Houston
7. Henry Moyes b.22 July 1840 m. Euphemia Vivian McKinley
Mary Moyes b17 Dec 1832 (timeline)
- 1850 daughter Jeanie Moyes b.10 Jan 1850 - Dunfermline, Fife. Vital records online show her father as David Smith, perhaps a late baptism, but she doesn't appear as "Smith" in Census.
- 1851 Census Jeanie is in household of David Moyes/Mary Allan. Relationship to head of household shown as niece. David Moyes was youngest of his generation, can only be great-niece see 1871 Census.
- 1871[?] Census Jean is in household of James Moyes/Elizabeth Russell. Relationship to head of household shown as niece. (This matches exactly her being daughter of Mary Moyes).
Timeline of Mary Moyes (continued)
- 1852 marriage to David Smith
- 1854 son Thomas Smith b.1854
- 1857 son David Smith b.5 Apr 1857 - Dunfermline, Fife
- 1859 daughter Mary Allan b.6 Apr 1859 - Dunfermline, Fife
- 1863 daughter Agnes Walls Moyes b.21 Sep 1863 - Dunfermline, Fife
My thoughts (circumstantial evidence only) is that Andrew Moyes (1848) is a good fit to be the natural brother of Jeanie Moyes (1850).
Another possible scenario is that Mary Moyes (nee Allan) delivered Andrew, but the mother died. In that situation what would the midwife do?
Family surnames on certificates
The name "Simpson" on cert of Andrew Moyes/Agnes Haxton, presumably is what Andrew had been told. The only source of the name "Wyse" that makes sense is that Andrew tried to find out about his own origins. Is there any reason to think it is accurate? I haven't found any Wyse/Simpson marriage.
A red herring
I did research an Andrew Simpson born close to the same date as Andrew and within about 10 miles. The father was "Simpson", the mother was "Petrie". That Andrew Simpson is also in the 1851 Census with his family, all alive and well.
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Family surnames on certificates
The name "Simpson" on cert of Andrew Moyes/Agnes Haxton, presumably is what Andrew had been told. The only source of the name "Wyse" that makes sense is that Andrew tried to find out about his own origins. Is there any reason to think it is accurate? I haven't found any Wyse/Simpson marriage.
Maybe a bit far-fetched but I wonder if Wyse could possibly have been a misinterpretation of Moyes?
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Hi.
Looking for any info re the following & any help would be fantastic.
Regards,
Gary
Australia.
First name(s) #John Inglis
Mother's first name(s) #Bessy Moyes
Last name Inglis
Mother's last name #Moyes
Birth year 1702
Archive reference OPR 410/1
Birth date 17 Aug 1702
Register year range 1645-1810
Baptism year -
Item 2
Place Beath
Page 45
County Fife
Record set Scotland, Parish Births & Baptisms 1564-1929
Country Scotland
Category Life Events (BDMs)
Father's first name(s) #James Inglis
Subcategory Parish Baptisms
Father's last name Inglis
Collections from Great Britain, Scotland