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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: nicknock on Monday 24 November 08 15:51 GMT (UK)
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I stumbled upon the June 2005 Challenge and couldn't believe my eyes! I'm still reading through it all its immense and I just wish I'd known about RootsChat back then as I have been researching this Robertson family for some time. Charles Macrae Robertson was my ggg grandfather and I have put together quite an extensive tree, as far back as Cornelius Robertson of Rothesay in the C17th.
Is anyone still interested in it?
I have never come across any other descendants I'm wondering if you ever found any but perhaps all will become clear when I get to the end of my reading.
I have copies of portraits of a few of the family, mainly C18th, and I've accumulated quite a lot of background info. Also, some stubborn little mysteries, which I simply cannot get to the bottom of, and which you RootsChatters obviously came up against (not just me being dim then!).
The first Liverpool generation are very interesting. Apart from oldest brother George, it seems all the brothers that I can find any info on at all, and at least one of the sisters, died in their 30s or 40s. Charles Macrae committed suicide. In fact, I'm not convinced this was the first Liverpool generation as I've found evidence of relatives born in Liverpool at an earlier date but cannot work out exactly how they fit into the family tree.
If anyone's interested, I'd love to hear from them. Mind you, I wouldn't be surprised if you're all suffering from Robertson-fatigue.....
Here's the link, if I've done it right...
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,62599.0.html
Nicola
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Hi Nicola and welcome to RootsChat !! :D :D
How exciting ... to start this up again !! :D :D ( though some will groan - I know !! ::) )
I've posted on that thread to alert people to your post here !
Good Luck ... I don't suppose you know anything about "our Claude " do you ?? ::)
Annie :)
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;D Wow, Hello Nicola and welcome....
Annie.... :P :P thanks for the heads up.... ;D
...........I only remember Claude.... ;D ;D
Gonna have to have a scoot through..err.. quick scoot me thinks. :o
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Nicola,
A very warm welcome to you!
It has always been hoped that the challenge's though random, would help a researcher.
All the best,
Pam
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Glad to know that the search continues.
Beth
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Hello everyone, and thanks Annie for alerting everyone.
Three years too late, but here I am, ggg granddaughter of Charles Macrae Robertson...... ;D
Your thread makes fantastic reading for me. I'm gob-smacked at how much you all did, so fast, and it has given me loads of leads (thankyou!). I never heard of Claude until I came across him here, but I do know quite a lot about his wider family they go back to Rothesay on Bute in the C17th. I'm on about p60 of the thread so not sure yet whether you've managed to resolve some of the sticky little problems that I've also come across those three children of Alice Johnson and Charles Macrae Robertson, the multiple people of the same age with the same name (Charles M Robertson jr x 2), etc etc
You solved one thing for me that has nagged at me for ages. I have a basic hand-drawn tree that has come down through the family, which started me off on this whole malarcky, and it refers to a Rev Archibald Robertson, son of John, no dates or anything. One of the last things I read about last night, before I had to peel myself away from the computer, was one Rev Archibald Aeneas R, son of John, along with a potted history. And he was famous (well, a bit!). Thankyou!!!
Please don't groan, but here's where I'm up to:
What I know, because I have the luxury of buying certificates, is that at her marriage to Charles M R, Alice Johnson gave her father's name as Richard Johnson, Ship Master, so I think the illegitimacy of her first three seems quite likely. Although wouldn't a ship master's family be well-to-do........ perhaps less prone to getting into trouble?? Or is that hopelessly naive?? Having said that, I have never found any trace other than that of her father, or of a likely birth for Alice, so I have wondered if she was telling the unadulterated truth because something doesn't feel quite right about it. :-\
Charles Macrae committed suicide in 1877 and Alice died in 1873, so their children were orphaned. He made his will in 1872, leaving everything to oldest brother George, and after his death three of the girls, as you discovered, were sent to Ockham School down south (supported by whom?). I've seen that referred to as an Industrial School, suggesting perhaps they were down on their luck but can't find any records. I was hoping it might give me a guardian. If it wasn't Uncle George, who was so generous to his other widowed sisters-in-laws and nieces, why not? Was it the suicide thing? George didn't leave a will when he died in 1905, or not one that went to probate I was hoping that might shed light but sadly not.
Of Charles' several brothers and sisters that I've found any trace of, all apart from George died in their 30s or 40s. Including Helen who married Mr Ewing. Never found any further trace of the young Archibald, bap. Stepney 1825.
I found a record of the family graves at Toxteth Park Cemetery which has thrown up another conundrum which I'm still working on. Colin Douglas Robertson shares his grave with a married couple, James and Isabella (nee Hamilton) Robertson, that I had never come across, and I cannot place them. They were both born in Scotland (ca 1799 and 1803), poss Greenock, married in Greenock in 1830, he was a merchant and they were living at Toxteth Park in 1851. I have found a James R in Toxteth Park, merchant, with the same address, as early as 1832. Can't find a birth that links him with my lot. Who is he????
There's also an Esther Robertson in one of the family graves, married to an Archibald Douglas Robertson, who's in a separate grave (he died at Rainhill Asylum, aged 45, pawnbroker, so out of the sea 'zone'). They are presumably related but who is he. And he was actually born in Liverpool ca. 1821, according to the 1861 Census.
I've not visited the graves it's possible that the relationships are given wish I lived nearer, but I aim to get there at some point.
I have copies of portraits of quite a few of them. Not the Liverpool generation, apart from my gg grandmother Helen the Greenock/Rothesay lot, Hugh Moodie (father of Janet), a couple of George Robertsons. I'll be glad to show those if anyone's interested....
I've wondered about a slave trade link that was mentioned once or twice in the thread....
Anyway, I've droned on a bit, hope you're still awake, and hope you might be interested!
Bye for now
Nicola
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Hello Nicola,
Good Luck with your research.
Liverpool Annie, thanks for alerting us to the new message.
Since my last message I have learnt more about the Tatham family of Poplar and now know that I was not completely correct about which children were Christopher's and which belonged to his brother Marmaduke. If future readers on this site want more information please contact me through Rootschat. Still no luck with Duncan Dunbar Tatham except that I discovered he was working as a gaoler in Geelong during the years he was living there with his wife and children.
Regards,
Denise
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Hi Nicola, and welcome!
And ... hi Denise, too LOL ... should we add at this point that Duncan Dunbar Tatham's son Duncan John has proven just as elusive?
However, just before I got kicked out of the local library at closing time, the other week, I did discover a D J Tatham, right age, birthplace listed as "Austria" (!), parents born UK ... working as a bartender in Laredo Laramie City, Albany, Wyoming, in 1880. Just found, also ... a Mr D J Tatham who sailed first class and alone, from Kingston, Jamaica to Bristol, aboard the "Port Henderson", arriving 15th December, 1910. Whether that's him or not, .... ?? And what happened to him after that, is anyone's guess - either I just haven't found the clues ... or he vanished again!
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Hi everyone, thanks for the welcome. :D
I've just reached the end of June's 2005 thread which seems to have run on into September! A staggering body of work. Shame Claude continued to be so elusive. I shall keep my eyes peeled...
btw, Archibald Robertson, b.ca.1796, m.1822 to Agnes Hamilton, Greenock, emigrated to Australia, I believe. He was a doctor (referred to in his mother Janet Moodie's will as 'Physician of Greenock', and later (1841), physician, Toxteth Park. I found an obituary to Agnes in the Greenock Telegraph. She died 4 March 1877 at St Kilda, Melbourne, Australia, widow of Dr Archibald Robertson.
Well, onwards and upwards to those brick walls!
Nicola
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Hi Nicola and welcome to Rootschat. Glad you found some of the research done useful but it seems you have found out a lot more to add to it also, like you said, also having the benefit of certificates.
I look forward to hearing about any other finds you have
MaryA
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I found a record of the family graves at Toxteth Park Cemetery which has thrown up another conundrum which I'm still working on. Colin Douglas Robertson shares his grave with a married couple, James and Isabella (nee Hamilton) Robertson, that I had never come across, and I cannot place them. They were both born in Scotland (ca 1799 and 1803), poss Greenock, married in Greenock in 1830, he was a merchant and they were living at Toxteth Park in 1851. I have found a James R in Toxteth Park, merchant, with the same address, as early as 1832. Can't find a birth that links him with my lot. Who is he????
Nicola,
This Isabella Hamilton who married James Robertson, is she the Isabella Hamilton christened on 16 March 1803, in Greenock (dau. of John Hamilton and Isabella Gellie) and therefore the sister of Agnes Hamilton who married Dr. Archibald Robertson?
This could therefore mean James Robertson is either not related to the other Robertsons or he is yet another son of Archibald Robertson and Janet Moody. Especially as there is a Greenock link.
If indeed she is this Isabella, then this would provide a link to your own family.
I hope this helps.
Regards,
James R. Yeowell.
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Hi James
Thanks for your help. Since posting my original post, another researcher has suggested that James was indeed another son of Archibald Robertson and Janet Moody but neither of us have found his baptism record so it can only be a supposition. The fact that he shares a grave with Colin Douglas Robertson (grandson of Archibald and Janet) in Liverpool suggests to me that they are related, and this scenario would make Colin James' nephew .
I hadn't pursued Isabella's roots actually, but I do think its likely that she is the daughter of John Hamilton and Isabella Gellie as you suggest. I've just done a trawl on Scotland's People, and she's the only one that comes up in 1803. It would mean that brothers Archibald and James married sisters.
Can I ask if it's the Robertson link you're interested in, or the Hamilton side? If it's the Robertsons, you may be able to help with another little issue...!
Thanks again,
Nicola
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Nicola.
Alas, I am not related to any of these individuals. I just happened to recently come across the 2005 Challenge and decided to see if anything had been missed. I have actually managed to link the gentry branches (the Orr-Ewing and Wolseley families) into my own tree (thanks to several very distant branches in my own tree that eventually leads to gentry), so the data has not been completely irrelevant.
Yes, it does seem that Isabella Hamilton married another brother. However, as you say, there is no proof that James Robertson is another son. Have any census extracts for James Robertson in Scotland been found? As he was married in 1830, he hopefully would still be alive by the time of the 1851 census. This could determine his age and where he was born.
I am happy to have been of assistance though. Often it takes a neutral look at a tree to spot something missed before.
Best regards,
James R. Yeowell.
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Hi James
I have him in Liverpool with Isabella in both the 1841 and 1851 Censuses, and both say simply that he was born ca. 1799 in Scotland. The date is corroborated by his gravestone, which he shares with one of my Robertson ancestors, which is the most solid link to a relationship.
Oh well, I shall persist! Many thanks for your help, and best of luck with your own research.
Nicola
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Nicknock,
very interested in furthering Charles MacRae Robertson et el.
My email (*)
Have sorted a lot of stuff in this area in last 3-4 months after a 7 year hiatus.
Joffy
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