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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Hampshire & Isle of Wight => Topic started by: piddington on Friday 31 October 08 13:13 GMT (UK)
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Thomas Charles or Charles Thomas Champion and family. Thomas was born abt 1806 most likely in Odiham, Hampshire. I think he is the son of James Champion and Sarah Purdue but cant find a record of birth. His wifes 1st name was Ann need last name for her and marriage. 1st child born about 1836 dont know where. The children born after 1845 were born Averstoke, Hampshire. Thomas and Ann are my ggg grandparents so any help to bridge this gap would really help.
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Do you have them on any census ? What were the names of the children ?
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James Champion m Sarah Purdue in Odiham 25 Sep 1807 NB both widowed
This may the first marriage and his wife's death:
James Champion m Elizabeth Taylor in Odiham 25 Jul 1784
Elizabeth Champion buried in Odiham 1 Aug 1802 aged 44
Children of James & Elizabeth, baptism dates in Odiham
John 31 Jul 1785
William 4 Nov 1787
Mary 3 Oct 1790
Jane 5 Jul 1793
Martha 5 May 1799
Children of James & Sarah, baptism dates in Odiham
Thomas 25 Oct 1807
Sarah 27 Jul 1810
The only marriage for a Thomas Champion that I can find and that might fit is this one:
Thomas Champion married Mary Ann Cook 15 Feb 1830, St Mary Portsea
But then I don't see any children in the area, so I'm not convinced at the moment. The names of the early children may help.
Nell
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Hello again
I think I've found them in 1861 and 1851.
1851 is the really useful one:
HO107. P. 1660 Fol. 219 Pg. 22
Frater Lane, Elson, Alverstoke
CHAMPION (indexed Champson)
Thomas Head M. 40 Ag Lab. B. Hants Odioun
Ann Wife M 36 B. Hants. Titchfield
Eliza A Dau 8 B. Hants Bishops Waltham
Martha J Dau 6 B. Hants Boarhunt
Thomas Son 3 B. Hants Alverstoke
Jessy Son 6 mth B. Hants Alverstoke
Henry Varndel son in law 15 Ag Lab B. Hants Exton
William Varndel ~ ~ 11 B. Hants Bishops Waltham
son in law here being used in the sense step son
Marriage:
Charles Thomas Champion Q2. 1842 Droxford Vol. 7 Pg. 101
Ann Verndell on the same page.
Droxford is the area for Bishops Waltham.
Amended : Thomas 40 not 55 :-\
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I'm afraid I can't find Ann or the boys in 1841 :-\
However, this is the family in 1861
RG9. P. 646 Fol. 87 Pg. 4
Elson Road, Alverstoke
CHAMPION
Thomas Head M 55 Ag Lab
Ann Wife M 44
Henry Son 25 Labourer to builder
William Son 21 ~ ~
Eliza A Dau 19
Martha J Dau 17
Thomas Son 13
Jessy Son 11
Charles Son 8
John Son 5
Kate M Dau 3
Everyone says Hampshire - no place names given :-\
Henry and William are down as Champion.
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1871:
RG10. P. 1150 Fol. 133 Pg. 5
Elson, Alverstoke
CHAMPION
Thomas Lodger M 70 Labourer B. Hants, Odiham
Ann Wife M 55 B. Hants, Titchfield
Thomas Son Un 27 Stoker
Jesse Son Un 20 Labourer
John Son 18 Labourer
Kate M dau 13 Scholar
all children born Alverstoke
Thomas snr. is down as lodger, but they appear to be a separate household in the same building.
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Thomas Charles or Charles Thomas Champion and family. Thomas was born abt 1806 most likely in Odiham, Hampshire. I think he is the son of James Champion and Sarah Purdue but cant find a record of birth. His wifes 1st name was Ann need last name for her and marriage. 1st child born about 1836 dont know where. The children born after 1845 were born Averstoke, Hampshire. Thomas and Ann are my ggg grandparents so any help to bridge this gap would really help.
Thomas Charles Champion is my 3x Gt Grandfather...Be nice to hear from you
Best Wishes
Jules ..
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Hello Jules :D
Welcome to Rootschat ;D ;D
Is this the same Thomas Charles / Charles Thomas that I found married to Ann Varndell ?
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Yes it is the same Thomas..Ann's maiden name was Bennett..Her first married name Varndell..
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I hope Piddington gets in touch with you :D
My paternal family came from Titchfield; I have a Varndell family, but later than Ann - one of my line married a Varndell.
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According to my FTM programme Thomas Charles Champion is my half 3rd gt grand uncle!!!!
Happy to exchange info with anyone who might be connected.
:)
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My line of Champions is Martha Jane daughter of Charles Thomas and Ann Bennett. Martha was born abt 1845 Boarhunt , Hampshire. She married Walter Peake 13 Jan 1862 Alverstoke, Hampshire. Haven't an exact date of birth for Martha and nothing on her mothers line of Bennetts. Going back in time I have Charles parents as James mother Sarah Varndell. Grandparents Francis and Mary Morris. I do have alot on Walter Peake line. But would love to fill in the others as Walter Peake and Ann Bennett are my Great grandparents that I didn't know about until a few years ago. My grandmother never new her father George B Peake or her mother Eliza Jane Coleman as the mother but her in the Barnardo Home and she was shipped here to Canada. Any help would be welcomed and am more then willing to share what I can.
Carolyn
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hello, my name is sasha madgwick
thomas champion was my x3 great grandfather i thiiink
my nan has a lot of the family tree, for the madgwicks and champions who lived in whittington house, elson, hampshire
if you would like me too send them too you my email adress is (*)
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to avoid spamming and other abuses.
Please use the Personal Message (PM) system for exchanging personal data.
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Sasha,
You are aware that the whole world can now see your e-mail address and telephone number. I suggest you modify your message.
Tom
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I am descended from Charles Thomas or Thomas Champion baptised 1807 Odiham. His son Charles was my Gt Grandfather. Does anyone know for certain that Thomas's father, James was the son of Francis Champion & Mary Morris? This is the popular opinion, but there were 2 James Champions baptised in Odiham in 1759. Has anyone seen a parish register entry of James's marriage to Elizabeth Taylor, his first wife, that gives the name of his father? The fact that many folks attribute his parentage to Francis & Mary may be a case of copying and assumption, but I have serious doubts that we all have the wrong parents for James.
I have traced Ann (Varndell) Bennett's parents and siblings if anyone is interested. Will post details in a separate message.
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Below are strong possibilities for sisters of Ann Bennett, from Familysearch.org indexed records:
Jane Bennett bpt 20 Apr 1817 Titchfield,
parents John & Ann Bennett
Eliza Bennett bpt 19 Feb 1820 Titchfield
parents John & Ann Bennett
Mary Bennett bpt 7 Oct 1821 Titchfield
parents John & Ann Bennett
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Hi Piddington;
I am interested in your family as I also live in Canada and have done a lot of research, as a hobby, for other people on Home Children shipped to Canada. I must admit I have done no research beyond Bergoin George Peake & Emily or Eliza Jane Coleman so had none of their offspring listed in my tree. Now you have motivated me to search. Bergoin's mother Martha was a sister of my Gt Grandfather, Charles so I hadn't explored her line yet. Do you have everything you need since your Grandmother was sent to Canada? I have access to several web sites so if you need anything please let me know and we can communicate by PM. I do have quite a lot on the Champion family, but some of it is very confusing.
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Hi Sasha;
I am interested in your Whittington House Champions. I assume you are descended from Charles Thomas's son Thomas b 23 Apr 1848. Does your grandmother know where abouts Whittington House was. It has come up several times in my tree and a friend in Gosport has tried to trace its previous location to no avail. If you have posted your 3 messages maybe we can communicate by PM?
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Hi Retrisher..
Thomas Champion 1848 is my 2x Gt Grandfather..I have alot of info on the Champions, birth/ marriage/ death certs plus some photos and a photo of what was once Whittington House...
Jules...
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James Champion and Elizabeth Taylor are my 4th gt grandparents, so I will be very interested in any responses to Retrisher's inquiry as to James' parentage.
Also, does anyone know who Elizabeth's parents were?
:)
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Hi All Champion researchers
Retrisher thankyou for your kind offer with my homechild but I was lucky I found what I needed on my grandmother through the Barnardo home. I ordered her records which gave me amazing backround information. To answer your question I don't know where I first got the idea that James Champion was the son of Francis. Thomas Charles is my 4th grandfather. Proving anything back that far is really hard to do.After your post I did look back in my records and did see that I had made a note on the 2nd James just incase.
Sasha I too would love to hear from you through a PM as anything I can add to this family would be great.
PS looks like I have a bunch of new rellies in here
Piddington
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To add to retrisher's possible siblings for Ann Latter Day Saints also had
Ann 1 Oct 1815 Titchfield
Sarah 5 Mar 1826 Titchfield
Joseph 20 Jul 1823 Titchfield
Would love to hear who John Bennett the father married Ann ?
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Hi All;
I am not sure on parentage of Elizabeth Taylor. Many people have her birth as 1763 in Kingsclere, but again I do not know whether this is accurate. There were several Elizabeth Taylors baptised in Kingsclere around that time, but Elizabeth's burial record of 1802 shows her as being 44 which puts her DOB around 1758, so next I question the Kingsclere location. How do we know this? I am at brick wall stage in my tree so am going back checking my sources and trying to sort facts backed by actual records from assumptions.
Ann Bennett's parents; only records of a John Bennett I could find were a baptism 2 Apr 1797 in Andover and 1841 & 1851 census records for John Bennett in Andover area. There is a marriage to an Ann Reynolds in Brockenhust in 1813 but this would make John only 17 if it is same John as above. Also Titchfield would have been quite a distance from Andover so not 100% convinced this is our John.
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A couple of submitted LDS entries state that Elizabeth was born in 1763 and was "of Odiham".
:-\
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Has anyone seen a parish register entry of James's marriage to Elizabeth Taylor, his first wife, that gives the name of his father?
Parish register entries of marriages do not record parents' names at this date.
Where was John Bennett apparently born according to the 1851 census, and his age?
(Sorry - I've lost track of what you know and what you would like to find out :-[ )
Nell
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Thanks Nell for reminder about parish records, I had forgotten. Now I guess we are stuck without proof of James Champion's parentage unless someone finds a Family Bible.
We know Ann's father was John Bennett from Ann's marriage record and we know Ann's mother was Ann from the IGI Christening records of Ann & siblings. Possible census entries for John:
1851: John b. 1796 Grateley. I don't think this is John we are looking for as children are listed as born in Quarley, not Titchfield.
1841: I think are different John b 1786, & wife Ann b 1791 both Hampshire may be a possibility, but still not sure. Also do not think the marriage from 1813 I found applies to either of these Johns because of the underage and parental consent need for Ann. The 1841 Ann wouldn't need it and wouldn't the 1851 John have needed it himself or did it only apply to females?
"This information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk"
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Now I really am confused.
Can I summarise what I think is trying to establish here:
Ann Bennett, daughter of John, married Thomas Champion in 1842. This was her second marriage.
Her first husband was named Varndell. Ann Bennett married John Varndall/Varnhall/Verndell in Alverstoke in 1833. They returned to Bishops Waltham area where their children were born. Ann would have been 18 when she first married.
Ann who married Thomas, was born in 1815, in Titchfield.
A John Bennett married Ann Budden in Titchfield 9 July 1809. But at the moment I don't see any children born to this couple before Ann in 1815 :-\ So maybe not the right marriage.
(Have we now strayed away from Champion to Bennett - would it be better to split with a link?)
Nell
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Hi Nell...
I have another child for John and Ann Bennett......Charles Bennett born in 1813 Titchfield!!
So total children that I know of are
Charles 1813
Ann 1815
Jane 1817
Eliza 1820
Mary 1821
Joseph 1823
Sarah 1826.....
I shall be heading to Winchester records office sometime in the New Year to check parish records....
Jules x
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Sorry to butt in with no info but I just had to tell you all that James Champion and Elizabeth Taylor are my gggg grandparents through Martha and the Clark family. All I have is copied info so at the moment I am of no help, sorry.
Cheers,
Dave
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Hi Dave,
Welcome to the discussion.
Which of Martha's children do you descend from?
:)
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Hi,
I descend from Martha's son William and then Charles Searle (1870). I picked up this conversation when searching Google for clues!
Dave
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Welcome to the family Dave.
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Hi Dave..
I have quite a bit of info on Martha and William Clark and their children....
Jules...
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Happy New Year to you all.
Jules, I'd certainly like some help!
Dave
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I would also be interested in any information that might be available.
:)
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i have a detailed family tree and lived in elson up to a year ago, i have sinced moved but can easily go back to the church and get records and copies of the family tree which my grandmother keeps, Thomas champion was my 3x grandfather (i think) *
please email me for more info
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Thanks
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Hi Sasha; I would love to hear from you re Champions & Elson, but I guess we have to use personal message. My internet is operating very slowly this week so will have to wait until things move faster. Have you posted your 3 messages to enable using personal messages?
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im struggling to understand this site, i did try putting my email adress maybe if i write it in a different format..
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Thomas Champion born 1848 is my 2x gt grandfather...His daughter Bessie is my gt grandmother....
Jules...
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Hello it's been a while since I've been on here! Thomas champion was my x3 grandfather, he lived in Whittington house Elson, I would love to see any photos if anyone has any! It feels amazing to connect with relatives x
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Hi Sasha Elizabeth;
Same guy; he was my 2x Gt. Grandfather through his son Charles (1852) I have tried to send you a PM with my email, but not sure it was sent. if it doesn't come through let me know on this forum & I will try again. Somewhere I have a photo of Whittington House, several of Charles and some other bits and pieces.
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Wittington house is in Elson lane Gosport. My gran was a Champion and lived there with her family.