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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Kent => Topic started by: Nennefer on Tuesday 28 October 08 22:50 GMT (UK)
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Is there anyone who knows anything on Old Terrys Lodge in west Kingsdown, Kent. I think it is in Terrys lodge lane just along the rd from Terrys Lodge farm.
I am trying to find out the age of this property and any details of previous occupants.
I think it used to be owned by the local manor house St. Claires estate or something like that.
I know it was used as the gamekeepers lodge in the 1950's
Thanks in advance for any help ;D
Jenny
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I pass this house most days but the only clues i can give you are a post box set into the house with G R on it (now unused) and the back windows have been bricked up.
Not much to go on.
Jakki
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Would it be the property listed as Terry's Lodge Farmhouse on the Images of England site (you may need to register to view photo and details) or is that a different building?
http://www.imagesofengland.org.uk/
Casalguidi :)
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I pass this house most days but the only clues i can give you are a post box set into the house with G R on it (now unused) and the back windows have been bricked up.
Not much to go on.
Jakki
Thanks for that. I didn't remember the post box. It is a curious place for a post box.
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Would it be the property listed as Terry's Lodge Farmhouse on the Images of England site (you may need to register to view photo and details) or is that a different building?
http://www.imagesofengland.org.uk/
Casalguidi :)
I believe Terrys Lodge Farm is a differant building just along from Old Terrys Lodge. Thanks all the same. Looks like there isn't much to be found on this building. I wonder if a search of the Census would unearth anything is there a way of searching for an address can anyone tell me.
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The 1881 census is searchable by address http://www.ancestry.co.uk
Did it actually come under Ash next Ridley ie.
1861
Terry's Lodge, Ash next Ridley - uninhabited
RG9/469 folio 130 page 3
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1851 - Ash (next Ridley)
Terry's Lodge Gate House
Terry's Lodge House (farmer)
Terry's Lodge Cottage
HO107/1607 folio 849 page 20 and the preceding page
Just shout if you want the full entries.
Have you tried ...........
http://www.historicaldirectories.org
http://www.kentarchaeology.org.uk/Research/Maps/ANR/01.htm
http://www.hereshistorykent.org.uk/
Casalguidi :)
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I can't supply you you with any details about the property but I can tell you my Great Grandfather and his family lived in one of the cottages (I think there were three which in more recent times were knocked into one large house) He was called Edwin Mills and was the Game Keeper on the estate during the twenties up until his death in the seventies. I vaguely remember visiting them when I was a child and remember the small dark scullery in the back of the house and the front parlour (only for best). Is there anything specific you need to know as my Mother and her sisters lived with their Grandparents for a while during the forties and may be able to tell me more about the ownership of the place and the estate at that time if that is what you are interested in. One of my Aunts has a superb photograph of Edwin with a full brace of pheasants and his guns outside the cottage.
Tracy Wise
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Thanks for that any information would be of great interest. The reason for my interest is that I was born in old Terry's lodge in the late 50s my father was also Game Keeper there for a short while. I am very interested in any information I can get on its history. It is the little detached cottage that has its back directly onto the road and looks out from the top of the Downs. It had no running water there and my mother had to draw water from the well in the garden. Ahhh what happy days.
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Spoke to one of my Aunts today and she thought the estate belonged to a Sir Mark Ediman Collet son of Sir Mark Wilk Collet (1864-1944) First Baronet of St Clere's born 1816, died 1905, a Governor of the Bank of England.
I was also a bit confused with the dates that my Great Grandfather lived in Old Terry's Lodge. He worked there during the twenties and thirties which is where my Grandmother and her siblings grew up but they had moved on to Fairseat by the forties til the seventies to another estate owned by the Stonehams I think which is the cottage I remember visiting.
I do remember my Gran saying how she used to be allowed a ride on the masters carriage up to the main house (St Clere's?) sometimes , when she was a small girl and having to walk three miles each way to school in Wrotham.
Anyhow I am speaking with my Gran's sister in law soon who would certainly remember more so hopefully will report back soon.
Regards and have enjoyed opening up more of my families history in that area, thank you.
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This thread brings back some memories! I used to go past Old Terry's Lodge every day on my way to school and go tobogganing from the top of the hill (during the 70's/80's) During this time I remember that the cottage was empty and only has been renovated and lived in relatively recently (guessing around 10 years ago). By co-incidence I also knew the Stonehams through primary school.
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I to am interested in Old Terry's Lodge and any thing else related to Terry's in the area.
I think one of my ancestors was a Jeremiah Terry married to an Anne Heaver both born at Kingsdown near Sevenoaks, which I think is now West Kingsdown. The wedding was in April 1815. Jeremiah Terry is listed as from Romper's Hall which I cannot find any reference to and it is a very unusual name for a residence. They had a son called James christened in June 1824 at Ightham.
Any contributions gratefully received.
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I'm not sure if this link will work but if you can pull up this site of kent in 1789 you can clearly see old terrys lodge and terrys lodge around even then.
www.archivemaps.com/mapco/kent1789/kent11_02.htm
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Hi Advance
When/where was your Jeremiah TERRY described as of "Romper's Hall"?
Casalguidi :)
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Thanks for the replies, the old map link is very interesting, if you look further down the segment there is a building called Roper's which the reference in the link below may have misprinted as "Romper's"
The link below is to page 477 of a journal called "Monthly Magazine or British Register" vol 39 page 477 of 1815. The marriage of Jeremiah Terry Esq and Anne Heaver is noted.
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=3wYZAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA477&dq=Jeremiah+Terry+of+Kent#v=onepage&q=Jeremiah%20Terry%20of%20Kent&f=false
Best regards,
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This is interesting to read. My great granddad was born at Old Terry's Lodge in 1876 (I assume cottages, as his father was only an agricultural labourer). For years I've been trying to find Old Ferrys Lodge as that's what it looks like on the birth certificate!
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Hi
Zena Bamping in her book History of West Kingsdown devotes a 5 page chapter on the Lodge. ...."The Terry's ..are called thus after a very large and old family that have lived and straddled the border from here and into Wrotham Parish since before records began."
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Drove past this cottage today only to see it razed to the ground. Strange that I can't find any information online about it. Only this thread.
Was anybody ever successful in finding any info. Even googling Old Terry's Lodge brings up very little.
It had the best views. I just wanted to see the front. The view of the back from the road looked interesting. Can't find any photos either.
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Hi I have a photos of the front of the house that was taken a few years ago now and some interior photos too. I also have a part photo taken in 1958/59 but don’t have it to hand at the moment. I will try to find to older one for you to see.
It is was my birthday yesterday and having been born in the house thought I would go visit it. As stated it has been demolished to make way for a modern monstrosity. No proper investigation was made as discover how old the property was before giving the go ahead to demolish it.
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The main living room.
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It is a tragedy that the house has been demolished to make way for a modern eyesore/s. :'(
Looking at the two photos I think the house would have had some age to it.
Wild guess with no evidence, but I think that the upper floor and the windows may have been a later addition. The celing in main room shown in the photo looks quite low and the beams don’t look that old. As I say, that’s just a guess, and closer examination would have been needed to judge more accurately.
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I suspect as you do that there was an older building at the heart of this one. Either that or it is a replacement for a much older building that was on the site. Still a shame to see a usable building like this destroyed for the sake of someones whim.
This image shows one of the bedrooms above there were originally 4 like this I believe but one was converter to a bathroom.
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If you look carefully at this photo of one of the smaller bedrooms you can see the method used to divide the upper floors in Old Terrys Lodge. I would have loved to have got a closer look at this old house to try to get an idea of period. Maybe have done a few test pits in the area of the garden.
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It looks to have been in excellent condition. I’m sure the house would have had some stories to tell. So sad that it has been destroyed.
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I would love to know more about the people who have lived in Old Terrys Lodge over the years. Sadly I’ve not been able to find any Census details on the property. Or any property in the road, which points to my sad lack of ability with searching census returns.
I’m considering compiling all the info I have and the memories told on here about the house into a small booklet. A small way to honour the house I was born in.
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1885 electoral register:
Cheesman seems to have been there for several years after that
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1901:
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Oh wow thank you I can add those people to my information. That’s excellent!
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Wrotham burial, 1787:
Jeremiah & Hannah Banister, son & daughter of Henry Banister, Old Terry's Lodge
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In the 1841 census the property is occupied by two families of Ag Labs: Thomas Broad & John Driver
In 1851 it's the families of John Corner and John Driver
1871, John Cadd, gamekeeper
1901, Sidney Butcher, gamekeeper
1921 Edward Packman, gamekeeper
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For posterity's sake...
The house was sold by the St Clere Estate some time in the past. The story/timelines aren't clear but possibly the late 80's to late 90's, when something of a selling spree was said to occur. So the story goes, the gent who bought it from St Clere was an architect, and ostensibly made extensions/additions/modifications to the property that made it "unviable to refurbish".
The house was subsequently purchased back by the St Clere Estate and it is the current trustee that is named on the planning application for the demolishment of the property.
There were few objections to the planning application, which may be why it didn't get much attention from planning. Interestingly, an application to demolish the Old Terry's Lodge was refused in August 1972. To the 2022 application, a conservation officer gave a (weak) objection, but no site visit was carried out so it's obvious why the powers that be wouldn't give this much weight.
If you are inclined to notice or care about these things, a walk of the St Clere estate would evidence that it might not be unfair to suggest they do not put much weight behind the importance of the detail of the historic properties under their custodianship. Planning applications back to the 90's specify material requirements for extensions and alterations that were not satisfied. PVC replacements for historic timber windows and loss of locally defining features such as arched flush casement windows have been completely lost and replaced with ill fitting and poorly installed uPVC units over the past two decades. You can see some of the progressive loss on google street view "see more dates".
The decision to demolish then would not be a surprise - a quick look at planning portal tells they fought multiple objections to be granted permission to demolish another, listed, building on the Estate - ultimately succeeding. Interestingly again, one of the primary arguments for needing permission to demolish the building did not come to fruition. Retrospective enforcement is, as is proved time and time again, largely toothless...
Ultimately, there is the argument that it is their land, their buildings, and who should have the right to tell someone what they can or can't do with something their Great-Great-Great forefather built? And in the interest of fairness, they are certainly not the only organisation to be pursuing the same path in that part of the world.
Sad, nonetheless.