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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Yorkshire (West Riding) => Topic started by: firefox1960 on Thursday 16 October 08 21:47 BST (UK)
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I have hit a real brickwall with this one.
I would love to locate his place of baptism,it would be great to locate this missing data.
He died in 1851 shortly after the 1851 census (in Rastrick)
He did Marry Sarah Whitley on 10/07/1791-in Halifax.
This is the furthest i can get back to on my direct line.
I have looked at the igi,but really haven't a clue as to his baptism and his parents ans siblings.
Any suitable suggestions or guidance would be greatly appreciated.
Kind regards Brian H. :)
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Hi Brian :)
Bit confused - should your heading read died 1851 ?
Do you know when and where he was born - was he in Rastrick on the 1851 census? The one born 1772 Ovenden ?
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Sorry for the error on the posting.
David Hartley was according to the 1851 census-born in Ovenden-west /Yorkshire.
I am Aware he is buried in Rastrick at St Matthews church-but despite a good look at the mi .i was unable to locate the grave.
I have an extensive family tree,but this is a major brickwall.
Kind regards Brian H. ;)
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Sorry for the error on the posting.
David Hartley was according to the 1851 census-born in Ovenden-west /Yorkshire.
I am Aware he is buried in Rastrick at St Matthews church-but despite a good look at the mi .i was unable to locate the grave.
I have an extensive family tree,but this is a major brickwall.
Kind regards Brian H. ;)
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Hi Brian,
Ovenden I think would have been in the chapelry of Illingworth at the time of David's birth. Baptisms for that time are recorded in the records of Halifax St. Johns but David's is not, at least not amongst those on the CFHS CD 1754-1812. Nor is it recorded at Elland St. Mary's where many of the Raistrick BMDs were recorded.
Have you had a look at the Northowram registers ? perhaps your ancestor was a non-conformist ?
Dave
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Dave
Thanks for your very helpful response,it's very frustrating .
I have well and truly hit a brickwall.
I did feel that the std search on the igi latter day saints site would have helped.
Sadly that was not to be.
David Hartleys offspring were all baptised in Ovenden according to the Hugh Wallis igi for Yorkshire.
Kindest regards Brian. :)
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Dave
David Hartley and wife Sarah (Whitleys) children were baptised at the zion new connexion Church in Ovenden.
I am not sure what significance that would have.
I am not really sure what direction to take.
How might i view the Northowram registers.
And another strange thing not one of my direct line (Hartleys) apart from two have the christian name of David -one being David Hartle'y b 1772 as mentioned here.
Kindest regards Brian. ;)
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Hello Brian
I am interested in the Hartleys, as I may have a connection but not through your branch.
There seem to be at least two probable further children of David and Sarah - Barnet Heartley baptised at the Wesleyan chapel Brighouse (Rastrick is now part of Brighouse), born 21 Jan 1803, parents David and Sally, and Grace, with them in 1841 aged 27.
There are three other Hartleys on the 1851 who are recorded as born Rastrick - James 1807, Simeon 1809, Geo 1813. They are all fancy woollen weavers. I don't know if they are related or not, a quick search hasn't found baptisms for any of them (or Grace).
I expect you know about the Yorkshire Coiners and 'King' David Hartley? If not have a look at this:
www.yorkshirecoiners.com
It might explain why David wasn't a popular name among the Hartleys!
Anne
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Anne
I do have extensive detail for my Hartley clan from David Hartley b 1772 Ovenden and family in the Halifax area to the Movement of John Hartley b 1824 Rastrick to Sheffield to start a cutlery business he called John Hartley and sons.
I am aware of the coiners,sadly-no link as yet.
I did wonder if illingworth could provide a likely location for David Hartley's baptism.
I have well andtruly hit a brick wall,and as you state David was quite an uncommon name for a Hartley for certain reasons.
Kindest regards Brian H.
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Hello Brian
Illingworth chapelry baptisms for the period are included in the Halifax records - I have the CD from Calderdale FHS.
There are a few Hartley/Heartleys with an abode recorded as Ovenden having children baptised in your time period, but no Davids, and actually not that many children! Looks as if they may have been non conformist, especially as David's children were baptised at Mount Zion. There were numerous non-conformist churches and chapels in Halifax, most not on the IGI. Calderdale records office looks like your best bet. Of course, David may not have been baptised at all - I have quite a few like that in the area.
I sympathise with your brick wall. Halifax isn't the easiest area to research - too many people with the same names, and a lot of non conformists.
Anne
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Anne
Thank's so much for your considered and helpful response.
Kindest regards Brian.
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Hi Brian
I too have hit the same brickwall as you. Mine stops with William Hartley born circa 1792 also in Ovenden. There has to be a lot of records missing for Illingworth St Mary's parish church. I have been also trying to find the baptism circa 1786 of Bernard Hartley who lived in Hebden Bridge and also born Ovenden, but the same brick wall again. A bit of background will help.... My William marries at Haworth Church in 1818 to Rebecca Seed (Leed on the IGI). He stays in Haworth as do his descendants right down to me. His wife dies, Rebecca dies in 1846. In 1861 census a "new" daughter appears, a Grace Hartley aged 46, no sign of her before and she is born before his marriage to Rebecca. Also her place of birth is shown as Wadsworth (Hebden Bridge area) Could this be the Grace living with your David in 1841? William was a tinner, ie a worker with non ferrous metal, the Bernard in Hebden Bridge is an ironmonger and brass and iron founder. Bernard also has a daughter Grace. Additionally there are a few Bernard Hartley's in the Haworth Parish, more than the average for what seems to be not a common name. Hope you can see all the connections coming together within a relatively small area, but it all stops at Ovenden or Illingworth. There is a possible baptism for my William at Illingworth in 1792, father Jo, this could be John or Joseph. My thoughts are that it is Joseph as the Calderdale FHS CD shows it as Jos not Jo. I have visited the CFHS library and looked at the Illingworth St Mary's fiche and it is horrendous to read, the original register must be badly damaged. I have even tried to start earlier and come forward, starting with the Rev David Hartley, vicar at St Mary's Illingworth in the early 18th century but that also was a non starter. There is a mention of this Rev David on the hartley name website, it includes some of his descendants including the Dr David Hartley and Winchcombe Henry, a name that crops up in my family much much later. Anyway enough babbling for now, hope it gives you something if only that I too have hit that wall. Regards Andrew
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Brian
I have found recently that there may have been some 'lumping' together of BMDs associated with the methodist circuits. At this time I am not sure of the details except that Ovenden and Southowram may have been involved.
There are some postings about Illingworth on RootsWeb Transcriptions that may be of interest
http://newsarch.rootsweb.com/th/read/TRANSCRIPTIONS-UK/2001-05/0989678594
Andrew I have a Susey Bland married John Hartley both of Haworth in 1854 at Keighley also Humphrey Wood of Haworth married Elizabeth Hartley 1850 Bradford and John Wood of Haworth married Martha Hartley of Cowling 1863 at Bradford.
Dave
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Dave
We've been in touch before on GC. John Hartley is William's son. Susey Bland was his first wife. She died having had no children. Unfortunately the other names do not have any meaning to me.
Regards Andrew
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Andrew and Dave,how nice to obtain a fresh response from you both regarding my illusive quest regarding the Hartley Clan.
I do know that David Hartley was born c 1772,I believe in Ovenden.
He married Sarah Whitley on 10/07/1791 in Halifax.
They had the following Children,
John Hartley 1792 -1869
Edward 1795
Henry 1797 - 1856
Adam 1798
Aaron 1801 -1851
Mary 1800
I am unsure of what happened to Henry ,Adam and Sarah,and a Grace Hartley appears on the 1841 census,and i am not sure what the link is to David Hartley.
David Hartley is buried in St Matthews church grounds Rastrick along with his wife Mary ,son Aaron and Grandson Joseph Hartley 1830 -1843.
I managed to find David Hartley's sons grave Henry Hartley 1797-1856 ,he is buried with wife Martha(Goodyear)1791 -09/01/1875.
But strangely I couldn't locate other family members graves.
I have been advised that David Hartley was a non conformist,and that this could be a bit of an issue .
So many questions,The nbi lists a number of other Hartley's at St Matthews Rastrick,just not sure if there is a link.
I thank you both for your interesting posts.
Kindest regards as always Brian. :)
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The Grace Hartley that shows up on the 1841 Census was born c 1814,David Hartley died in 1851 after the 1851 census date aged 79,his wife had died in 1848.
Kindest regards Brian H.
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My apologies
I do know what happened to Henry Hartley-son of David Hartley and Sarah Whitley.
He married Martha Goodyear on 19th November 1818 in Elland,I have found no children to the marriage.
It is Edward,Adam and Mary Hartley I have no detail on regarding what became of them,and also( Grace Hartley) who crops up on the 1841 Census with David Hartley and wife Sarah plus their son Henry Hartley and wife Martha.
The search continues.
Kindest regards Brian. ;)
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David Hartley bapt 11th Nov 1754 father David at Halifax Northgate Presbyterian chapel
David Hartley Bapt 21st March 1773 Halifax Independent Chapel Northowram
father David
Maybe some connections
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Hartley_(philosopher)
Brown horse Inn, Lane ends. Northowram may be interesting investigating as well
Could tell you more but would spoil your Fun
A trip to YAS Claremount House Leeds ask Janet
Ask Ian at WYAS Halifax Library
Bit of Sherlock Holmes thinking needed its all there if you work at it. :o
Enjoy ;)
D/F 8) .......................................... ;D
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David Hartley bapt 11th Nov 1754 father David at Halifax Northgate Presbyterian chapel
David Hartley Bapt 21st March 1773 Halifax Independent Chapel Northowram
father David
Dobbie, can I ask where you managed to get hold of this information ?
Dave
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David Hartley bapt 11th Nov 1754 father David at Halifax Northgate Presbyterian chapel
David Hartley Bapt 21st March 1773 Halifax Independent Chapel Northowram
father David
Dobbie, can I ask where you managed to get hold of this information ?
Dave
Hi
Repository Kew London
http://www.bmdregisters.co.uk/
You'll need to register free
free info -Click on RG4-3167 gives Chapel and Click on Full detail gves extact dates limted 1754
Free info -Click on RG4-2077 gives Chapel and Click on Full detail gves extact dates limted 1773
Cost about £3 each for more info
or contact Ian at Halifax WYAS for copies of Fiche/film about £3 each with SAE
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Repository Kew London
Did you have to visit or are they available on film anywhere ?
OK I've now seen the added link, thanks
Dave
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Repository Kew London
Did you have to visit or are they available on film anywhere ?
OK I've now seen the added link, thanks
Dave
updated my post above with exact details
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A few MI's St Martins Church Brighouse -I hold copyright on these. Held at Whitley Beaumont Collection. (My Family private records)
Also a copy has been deposited with Huddersfield Library along with alot of Halifax info held in Tolson/Beaumont/Ramsden estate Records.
''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
My Beaumont/Ramsden family forebares deposited most family records in YAS Claremont Archives Leeds again Halifax and Huddersfield stuff also they hold all the Halifax Lidsters no doubt some Hatley's will be in these.
They have person name and place index at Halifax WYAS and YAS Leeds- Halifax and Huddersfield library hold indexes and Illingworth church has Church info on genuki website
Its a case of going, seeing and searching.
Well best I can help with.
Good hunting.
D/F
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http://www.calmview.eu/WY/dserve.exe?dsqApp=Archive&dsqDb=Catalog&search=advanced&dsqCmd=Search.tcl
Enter Hatley in Search in the link!
Something maybe be of interest
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D/f
All good stuff and very interesting,although I have yet to locate anything on Brown Horse Inn- Lane Ends Northowram relating to my elusive Hartley clan.
Do you think that the Hartley's are linked to the Northowram area ?.
I thank you for your time and effort,I am a small fish in a very big lake at the moment.
I have an extensive family tree,but have failed to make much progress on my direct - Hartley line.
I have solid detail from 1772 to the present day with numerous family links, in to my Hartley line.
I did explore the potential link to the cragg vale coiners and also David Hartley the philosopher,and as yet found nothing to suggest any connection.
I keep taking time out to firm up the other aspects of the family tree ,then returning to - (my brickwall)
Grateful thanks and kindest regards Brian H. ;)
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Hi
Northowram and Ovenden villages are a few miles apart but the area boundaries of Ovenden and Northowram meet somewhere near Bradshaw. Cuting across Holmfield and Buttershaw top from Iliingworth is a flat hill moorland at the top of the valley head above Halifax and Ovenden village but run across to Shibden and Northoram village. You need to understand the topography also that these remote farm smallholding weavers used the turnpike roads to sell cloth at markets at Brighouse , Halifax and Bradford. St Mary Illingworth/Mount zion/other Chapels and Northowram Church's and nonconformist chapels had entries with abodes Northowram in Illingworth Church's and visa versa at Northowram BMD's parish entries as abodes ie;- Illingworth, Holmfield, Ovenden, Bradshaw & Buttershaw villages meaning the lived in different areas to where they worshiped.
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D/f
Thanks again for the informative detail,any ideas regarding the Brown Horse Inn at Lane ends Northowram,that you mentioned earlier,I have been unable to establish any detail or Hartley family link.
Kindest regards Brian H. ;)
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Hi Firefox,
Sorry Dave don't want to step on your toes with this one, but there is a David Hartley , in fact two David Harleys who lived at Threapcroft, Illingworth. One married Wilkinsons and related to my Amblers and Cockroft distantly.
There is a good site. ie google David Hartley threapcroft. 'the Hartley Family of Chorlton'. Don't know if this is what you are looking for Firefox,but certainly a lot of history on there. You may have already seen it.
Sandra
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Sandra
Thanks for your response,I am unsure what the Brown Horse inn - Lane Ends Northowram has to do with the Hartleys - as suggested by Dobfarm ?,I have not managed to locate anything regarding this.
I am unaware of any link to David Hartley the philosopher,or the Craggvale coiners.
Dobfarms post seemed rather cryptic ?.
I would dearly love to progress much further.
I think I can safely say following the kind help I have had on roots chat ,that David Hartleys b 1772 Ovenden was David Hartley b 1754 in Wheatley,as mentioned many times- the non conformist element has proved a tad difficult.
Kind regards Brian H. ;)
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Hello Brian
I think the Brown Horse Inn is in Clifton, not Northowram. It was a meeting place for Luddites, including a William Hartley and a Samuel Hartley. I expect that is the Hartley connection Dave was referring to.
See Malcolm Bull's Calderdale Companion:
http://freepages.history.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~calderdalecompanion/qq_94.html
Anne
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Anne
Many thanks for the follow up on my enquiry,the Hartley clan will be the death of me.
Kindest regards Brian H. ;)
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Hi all,
The Brown Horse i think you are refering to is at Lane Ends, Northowram/Coley, on the Brighouse and Denholme gate road between Hipperholm and Shelf, opposite Westcroft lane leading into Northowram.
The postcode is HX3 7SD
the pub is still there.
See Malcolm Bull's website
http://freepages.history.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~calderdalecompanion/p200_b.html
Regards,
Andy
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Does this one have any Hartley connections though? It seems there may be some confusion between the two - maybe Dobbie can enlighten us?
Anne
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Anne
Some time ago I looked for a link to the Luddites and cragvale coiners and also the philosopher David Hartley.
Sadly I did not locate a Link.
Kindest regards Brian.
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For those researchers interested in Hartleys of Halifax, in particular descendants of Rev David Hartley, I submitted earlier this year most of what I know to the Malcolm Bull website
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David Hartley Bapt 1773 father David -in Halifax Independent Chapel in the parish of Northowram
http://www.bmdregisters.co.uk/
http://www.bmdregisters.co.uk/help/recordset_info.php?rs=RG4&piece=2077&sub_piece=
Ovenden village location now also in 1772/3 and Greater Ovenden parish area are two different meanings, the boundary border between Northowram Parish and Ovenden parish was just West of Boothtown, West of Oueensbury road and Boothtown road (One main road with two names) Thus David the father could have lived in Ovenden parish and worshiped in Northowram parish area.
https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?output=classic&dg=brw
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Dobfarm, I agree. My line backward from William Hartley born Ovenden in 1792 and died 1868 in Haworth. Before moving to Haworth circa 1816-1818 my William was in Wadsworth (using Birchcliff Baptist) but when he married the first time in 1814 to Betty Asten at Halifax he was in Northowram. He & Betty Asten already had a daughter Mary pre-marriage in 1812 and a Grace soon after marriage. William's brother Barnerd was already in wadsworth and had the same occupation as a tinner. William was born in Ovenden and baptised at Warley Independent Chapel in Warley Town. His parents were Barnard & Betty (nee Brigg married 1770). The family start out at Upper Oldfield in Warley using Mixenden Independent Chapel. Barnard & Betty die at Haley Hill, Northowram and were buried at Salem Methodist in Halifax in 1828 & 1837 respectively. There is a newspaper article that mistakenly suggests the 1828 death is Barnard Hartley the bridge builder of Pontefract. You can't even believe the papers in 1828! I don't know what happened to the graves at Salem Chapel when the road was altered in the 1960's(?) but fortunately a record of the inscriptions exists in Halifax Archives. I say all of this to demonstrate how the family moved about the district and also their use of various non conformist chapels. I must point out that the Northowram Independent Chapel is listed on the LDS IGI under New Malton, York! Having looked at the register entries on BMD registers it looks like the register may have been taken to Malton from Northowram by someone, possibly a Heywood connection here. Apart from the register entries, the links between members of this family have been substantiated by various newspaper family notices in the Leeds Mercury and Halifax Guardian. The fact that John & Joseph, 2 of the siblings of my William, were involved in book binding, printing and newspaper publishing must have contributed to the newspaper entries. This follows later with an indirect link from the aforementioned John to a John Hartley who starts the Brighouse Echo. Enough said, it is mostly on Malcolm Bull's site.
The use of non conformist chapels was a bit of a surprise to me given that they descended from a curate of the Church of England, namely Rev David Hartley, but David was school master at Oliver Heywood's Northowram chapel and must have been sympathetic towards non conformism.
Going back a generation from Barnard, he was born circa 1751 the son of Barnard Hartley & Betty nee Hyde that marry at Halifax St John in 1735. They have children locally; John 1736, Hannah 1738, Thomas 1745, Mary 1747, Sarah 1749, Barnard 1751 and possibly Joshua 1754. Latterly they are in Warley Township and using Luddenden. In the gap between 1738 and 1745 it seems that Barnard & Betty were possibly in Leicester & Loughborough where they had Elizabeth 1741 (died an infant and buried there) and David 1742. I have not yet been able to bring forward with all certainty the lines of John, David & Thomas. Not forgetting the female lines which may give rise to illegitimate male Hartleys.
There is information online but, also from my own research, about Barnard's (B1716) older siblings and half siblings that show how they moved away from Halifax. Elizabeth marrying Francis Booth and going to Birstall, David the philosopher to Cambridge (at university), Newark, Bury St Edmunds, London and Bath and John who was an Excise Officer being firstly in Halifax where he marries Mary Holker/Howker and has a son David in 1732 baptised Illingworth, then he is in York and finally Dorking Surrey. Family reasons may well explain Barnard being in Leicester in 1741/42 but it may have also been connected to his work. Barnard was also in Stockport at one time around 1740 as this is referred to in a letter (Halifax Archives) from his half brother Dr David (the philosopher) to his friend John Lister and mentions sending 5 guineas when Barnard's wife leaves Halifax to join her husband in Stockport. The line forward from David (B1732 of John) is not completed either but if he survived that line may be in the south.
There seems to be so many Davids around in the mid 18th century I have not been able to separate them and see where they link in. Of course there is the coiner "King David" as well. One of the incompleted lines will I am sure connect Brian's (firefox1960) David Hartley of Binns Hole, Ovenden that marries Sarah Whitley of Moor End, Ovenden in 1791. Can anyone clarify where Binns Hole (or Binns Owl) is? I have found suggestion that it is near the present Nursery lane in Ovenden which is very close to Bleakbrough (Blackburn?) where the first mentioned above Barnard & Betty (nee Brigg) are living circa 1785 to 1788. It is possible that Sarah Whitley was not David's first wife and he is the one born in Leicester. I have forgotten if there is an age at death of this David.
to be continued
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continuation...
Back to Rev David Hartley. There is suggestion on a very good Hartley website (hartleyfamily.org) that Rev David has another son James by his wife Everald. Rev David Hartley first married Evereld Wadsworth at Halifax St John on 12 May 1702. Their first child died unnamed as an infant and was buried at Luddenden on 30 Jan 1702/3. Their next born was Elizabeth who was baptised at Luddenden on 22 Feb 1703/4. Their last child was David born April 1705 and baptised at Halifax St John on 21 June 1705. David's wife Everald died and was buried at Luddenden on 14 July 1705. There is simply no time for another child but it may just be possible to squeeze another child into those from David's marriage to Sarah Wilkinson. Having said that, there is no James on the tree submitted by someone to the College of Arms. The story of James comes from an American line of Hartleys that originated in Cockermouth, Cumbria from a Robert (B1736) son of James. It seems they have a story of descent from a Hartley the curate of Armley. I have suggested to them it may be from a Robert Hartley curate at Armley 1773 to 1775 but I may well be proved wrong. I disagree with some of the dates on hartleyfamily.org website for the births of Rev David's children. I have taken mine from the registers.
Other possible lines of research are from Rev David Hartley's siblings and half siblings. David was the son of Barnard Hartley (see Oxford Alumni and Halifax Baptism 1773). His siblings were Mary 1658, John 1662 (born at Ovenden) Thomas 1668 (born Halifax) Samuel 1669, Sarah 1671 and possible Barnard 1679 and Martha 1685. Barnard first married Margaret Wood at Hartshead on 28 March 1658 and secondly Maria (or Mary) Collison at Halifax on 16 Nov 1667. I need to correct the details supplied to Malcolm Bull as I now think the Barnard Hartley to Elizabeth Brigg says of Haworth. I think the last mentioned Mary B1658 (or Maria) marries Andrew Hartley in 1683 and amongst others they have a son Andrew. There is a record at Halifax Archives of a memorial inscription at Halifax St John of Barnard Hartley buried 4 Aug 1696, his wife Mary buried 17 Nov 1711 and his grandson Andrew, gardener, buried 10 Jan 1752 aged 59. The burial for Andrew gives him of Southowram. Andrew has amongst others a son David in 1724. Another potential line! The stone and burial do not give an age for Barnard in 1696 but Oliver Heywood records it in his register and says he is aged 62. There is no stone where it shows on the plan and therefore if anyone knows the whereabouts of the Halifax St John gravestones please let me know. I would like to see this stone as the inscription also includes B. (Heart) H. I guess this means there is a heart shape between the letters B and H. This is intriguing as it is a very similar format to that used on the coiner's grave of King David at Heptonstall.
Still lots of lines to bring forward and also the question of Barnard's birth circa 1634. It may be local to Halifax but also there is the civil war in between his birth and marriage and therefore due to the upheaval and movements that occurred it could well be in Haworth, Colne, Barnoldswick, Marton in Craven, Carleton near Skipton, Manchester, Gisburn or virtually anywhere, even Derbyshire or London!
I have used Barnard throughout but in some cases Bernard is recorded but I do not believe they can be separated.
All of the above, along with the information supplied to Malcolm Bull, just about completes all I know of the Hartleys of Halifax that I have so far researched. Sorry to go on so much but if anyone can add to or correct all of this please post or get in touch. I hope some of it may be of use to other Hartley researchers.
Andrew
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CORRECTIONS!
Sorry, I am always get a century out.
1. Robert Hartley curate at Armley 1673 to 1675 not 1773 to 1775
2. David was the son of Barnard Hartley (see Oxford Alumni and Halifax Baptism 1673) not 1773
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Brian (firefox1960), did you follow up Dobfarm's suggestion of researching YAS at Claremont House in connection with the Brown Horse Inn at Northowram? I wondered if you had managed to find out anything further?
Andrew
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Hi Andrew
I have extensive details of my Hartley line, and will be in touch tomorrow, thanks so much for making the effort to respond to my thread.
I have just take a recent extended break from my research
Kindest regards Brian.
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There is an interesting clandestine marriage at Fleet Prison, London of David Hartley to Elizabeth Aaron on 8 Oct 1738. David is described as a Chinaman which may be connected with imports by the East India Company. See Malcolm Bull on James Hartley of East India Company. Also could the surname Aaron be the source of the Christian name Aaron of David & Sarah Hartley in 1801. If connected obviously a later generation.
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Hi Andrew
David Hartley b 1772 Ovenden died 1851 Rastrick is my 4x great grandfather he married Sarah Whitley on 10/07/1791 at St Johns Halifax.
offspring
John Hartley 1792 - 1869
Edward Hartley 1795 -1797
Henry Hartley 1797 - 1856
Adam Hartley 1798 ?
Mary Hartley 1800 ?
Aaron Hartley 1801 -1851
Bernard Hartley 08/05/1803 - 1849
Grace Hartley 1813 - 1889
All offspring born in Ovenden apart from Grace who was born in Rastrick.
I have David 's occupation as a weaver.
I believe David was bapt 23/03/1773 at Northowram independent chapel.
I believe David's father to also have been a David Hartley b 1754 in Wheatley.
Sadly I have not been able to progress further, although I have extensive detail on the family .
Folk have suggested a Luddite connection and also one to the Philosopher David Hartley.
What are your thoughts Andrew ?.
Kindest regards Brian.
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Hi Andrew
I have always felt the none conformist aspect to be a bit of a difficulty.
Although David is buried in the church grounds at St Matthew at Rastrick with other related Hartley's, I have only
been able to locate David's son Henry Hartley's MI and his wife Martha Goodyear.
Henry Hartley 1797 -04/09/1856 and wife Martha Hartley (Goodyear) 1791 -09/01/1875.
The 1851 census lists David Hartley as an annuitant.
Kindest regards Brian.
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Hi Andrew
I might well be wrong but the David Hartley b 1754 in Wheatley looked a likely candidate for David Hartley B 1772 - Father.
David Hartley b 1754 died in Elland in 1800
offspring - David Hartley b Ovenden 1772
Sally Hartley b Ovenden 1779
Bernard Hartley b 1784 Ovenden died 02 January 1875 Ovenden.
And as you say there are a number of David Hartley's around at that time.
Kindest regards Brian.
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Hi Brian
I have posted extensively my thoughts on here and to Malcolm Bull's site and you will see how much my Hartley family is moving around the country, and outside UK too, so I wouldn't rule anything out. There are quite a few possibilities given in my posts from which your line may spring.
I would look for information in the various archives, including but also beyond the registers, and don't forget newspapers. Halifax archives have a brilliant online index to the Halifax Guardian. The non conformism events may be a surprise but it is fact. Also another way forward would be to try sort out the various Davids in the 18th century.
If it was easy it would be boring!
Andrew
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Hi Andrew
Food for thought for sure, I have nearly 10,000 entries in my extended tree and the quest to go further back on my direct (Hartley) line is strong.
The easy bits are not at all interesting it's the struggle and effort that can pay off that's the bonus.
Kindest regards Brian.
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There's also Betty B1770 in Clayton of David and baptised at Northowram Independent Chapel and Jane B1789 Ovenden of David & Elizabeth at South Parage Wesleyan which is the same place David & Sarah use. It really is about sorting out all the Davids. I know it is an obvious thing to say but they can only be born once and die once but can marry many times. Don't rule anything out.
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Hi Andrew
Thanks for the contact and advise it will prove to be very useful, as I do need to take a fresh look at things.
Kindest regards Brian.
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Don't forget the David Hartley that marries Martha Crowther at Elland Church in 1727 and starts having children there.
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There are a few Hartley named bodies lying in the parish churchyard at Calverley!
[Full information available if required, I might even have photos of the graves] :D
Brian
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Hi
I have found no Link to Calverley at all - but thank you for the reply.
Kindest regards Brian.
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are you still looking for info or have you found your answers? 🙂 I think I'm a distant relative of yours. I may be able to help
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Hi Harry
I am still wishing to find more about my direct Line (Hartleys)
I have my most distant confirmed direct line relative as David Hartley born in 1772 Ovenden and the link right from there to me.
The none conformist issue and numerous Hartley's with similar names and lack of evidence is an issue.I have always felt illingworth and are to be of great interest.
I do know that David Hartley born 1772 in Ovenden-father was called David too- and do think his father was born in 1754 in Wheatley and died about 1800 ?.I feel as though I have been in the wilderness on this for years.I do hope we can share some details on this.Kindest regards Brian Craig Hartley.
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I have just found this posting on Rootschat and I would like too add my bit too see if anyone can move me forward on my Hartley branch.
Here goes my great great grandmother was Betty Hartley (according to census born in Sowerby 1795) The only one I found was father David Hartley. Betty (Elisabeth) married William Naylor in 1819. On the parish register for her marriage she is recorded as from Erringden?
Their youngest Mary married William Kendall and their daughter Ann Kendall married George A Slingsby
Betty Naylor nee Hartley was buried at Luddenden having died in Midgley.
I also looked at the coiners as both names Hartley and Varley were mentioned in sentencing the latter being pardoned.
I have now found a David Hartley baptised at Sowerby 1769 father John. He married Betty Varley at Heptonstall 1789. He was recorded as living in Stansfield and Betty was from Heptonstall (reasonably confidant that these are mine)
I think Betty Varley was born in Illingworth (not sure) father William.
Not found the demise of David or Betty Hartley nee Varley neither have I managed too find any information on John his father or his mother. Can anyone help me
Eileen