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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Cardiganshire => Topic started by: deb usa on Wednesday 17 September 08 23:48 BST (UK)
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Hi everyone :)
I rarely venture onto the Welsh Threads as I have never had a need to , until just recently.
I have discovered that my Granddad (albeit, step Granddad who is the only granadad that I have known) Philip Thomas James b 1919 Liverpool was the s/o Evan Gwilym James and Maud Evelyn Dudley.
This is what I have managed to find so far:
1901
Cardiganshire
11 Marine terrace
John James head married 52 master mariner born Newquay, Cardigan
Ellen wife 40
John Osborne James son 13
David Warren James son 11
Thomas Argo james son 7
Philip Wallace James son 7 (twins??)
EVAN GWILYM JAMES son 4
Mary Evans Mother-in-law widow 70 born Pembrokeshire Fishguard
(All John's family above born in Newquay, Cardiganshire)
1891
11 Marine Terrace
Mary Evans head widow 60 living on her own means born Fishguard
Ellen JAMES dau married 29 seaman's wife
Evan G James grandson 5
John O James " 3
David W James " 2
No sign John snr :-\
so now in 1891 we have another Evan G James ....
Evan GWILYM James born 1887 died march quarter 1896, Aberayon, Cardiganshire
so the first one died and then 'my' Evan Gwilym James was registered a year later... June quarter 1897.
I have found Evan Gwilym James Attestation papers (b 7 March 1896, father John with correct address but dates is off for 1897 reg :-\) and him on a passenger list to New York....
it seems he left from Liverpool at age 16 to go to NY ,,,1913 he was on the ship named the ADRIATIC.
He joined the RCGA (Royal Canadian ?????) in Dec 1916 til Jan 1917 and then the Royal Canadian Expeditionary Forces in May 1917.
By 1919;
Evan G James = Maud Evelyn Dudley West Derby and Philip Thomas James born 26 August 1919.
Philip Thomas James = Venie Violet Penfold
2 Dec 1944 Plymouth
He was 26, Batchelor , Leading Stoker RN DKX 93313 and she 30, spinster, Waitress (Cafe)
I am hoping that I, along with everyone's help, can get much further back and add some info re; His siblings ( great middle names, don't you think? ;D)....but most of all I am hoping that we will find some living rellies along the way....
as always ...I appreciate your help and time
deb :)
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Hi deb,
1881
RG11/5441/881/33
11 Marine Row, Newquay, Cardiganshire
Mary Evans, Wife, Mar, 50, Sailors Wife, Pembroke Fishguard
Ellen Evans, Daur, Unmar, 19, Sailors Daughter, Cardiganshire Newquay
Chris
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1871
RG10/555/21/8
11 Mariner Street
Mary Evans, Wife, Mar, 40, Mariners Wife, Fishguard
William James Evans, Son, 13, Scholar, Newquay, Cardiganshire
Ellen Evans, Dau, 10, Scholar, Newquay
Evan Phillip, Son, 7, Scholar, Newquay
Also in the house
William Bolderson, Head, Mar, 58, Greenwich Pensioner, Winthorpe Lincoln
Mary, Wife, Wife, Mar, 55, Newquay
Chris
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1861
RG9/4191/3/8
11 Mariner Row
Mary Evans, Wife, Mar, 30, Master Mariners Wife, Pembroke Fishguard
William James Evans, Son, 2, Cardigan Newquay
Also in the house
William Caleb Owen, Head, Mar, 31, Joiner employing 3 men, Cardigan Aberayron (Aberaeron)
Mary Owen, Wife Mar, 21, Cardigan Newquay
Evan Owen, Son, 2 mo, Cardigan Newquay
Chris
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Thanks for that Chris
I appreciate your help ...I will return tomorrow (my tomorrow :) ) as I am not feeling well ...hopefully I can give some imput.
I wonder if Ellen's dad was ever home for a census?
deb :)
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Hi deb,
Hope you feel better soon.
Doesn't seem to be at home much doe's he :)
Can't find Mary for certain before '61
Will have a look at the James family.
chris
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1861
RG9/4191/15/31
2 High Ter.
John James, Head, Mar, 53, Master Mariner
Ann, Wife, Mar, 53
Jane, Dau, Unm, 24
Eleanor, Dau, Unm, 17
Ann, Dau, 15
John, Son, 12
James, Son, 10
Soloman, Son 8
All born Newquay
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1851
HO107/2484/446/19
2 Chapel Row, Newquay
Ann James, Head, Mar, 42
Jane, Dau, 14,
Thomas, Son, 11, Scholar
Esther, Dau, 8, Scholar
Eleanor, Dau, 6
Ann, Dau, 4
John, Son, 2
James, Son, 10 mo
All born Newquay
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1871
10/5555/33/32
(John jnr. not at home)
2 High Ter. Newquay
John James, Head, Mar, 62, Master Mariner Unemployed,
Anne, Wife, Mar, 62,
Jane, Dau, Unm, 33
Eleanor, Dau, Unm, 25,
James, Son, Unm, 21 Journeyman Watchmaker
Soloman, Son, Unm, 18, Mariner
All born Newquay
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1841
HO107/1375/30/35/1
Parish of Llanllwchaiarn
Hove? House
Ann James, 30
David James, 6
Jane James, 4
Thomas James 2
All born in County
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Good morning Chris
Thank you so much for all your time and effort :D Wow ... Now I can fill in the gaps and find marriages etc. Seems that they were very much seafaring folk ... hopefully I can also find info as to what ships/boats they were on.
again ..thanks
deb :)
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Hi deb,
Hope you are feeling better today.
Soloman's change of career.
1881
RG11/5441/76/10
2 High Ter Newquay
John James, Head, Mar, 72, Mariner
Ann, Wife, Mar, 72
Eleanor, Dau, Unm, 34
Soloman, Son, Unm, 26, Watchmaker
All born Cardigan, LLanllwchaiarn
1891
RG12/4555/143/10
2 High Ter Newquay
David James, Head, S, 55, Coal Merchant
Esther, Sister, S, 48, Charwoman
Eleanor, Sister, S, 46, Housekeeper Domestic
Soloman, Brother, S, 36, Watchmaker
All born Cardigan, Newquay
1901
RG13/5149/22/18
2 High Ter, Newquay
Soloman C James, Head, S, 45, Watchmaker Shop. Own Acc. At Home
Esther, Sister, S, 58
Both born Cardigan Newquay
Chris
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Hi Chris
Strange you should be looking at Soloman ...I was doing the exact same thing this morning ....a watchmaker :o ...tatally different from the master mariner stuff ... ;D
I was trying to see if there was any wills...I wonder if Solman ever got married ? I wonder if we can find anything on his shop.? I'm off to have a bit of a g**gle.
Feeling much better , thanks for asking.
deb :)
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Hi deb,
Nothing on Soloman in the Cambrian newspaper.
Chris
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Thanks for looking, Chris :)
I have been able to locate Marine Terrace and High Terrace ....but nothing else . Nothing on Solomon wither ... :-\
Chris ...If they all lived in New Quay all their lives ... there should be many graves for them .... do you know anything about the churches and cemetaries there?
Thanks again for helping me out!
deb :)
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Hi Deb
Found James James Soloman's brother in 1881.
Lodging in the household of Thomas & Mary Davies, Everton Liverpool.
Can't make out street.
RG11/3662/109/8
James James, Lodger, Unm, 30, Watchmaker, N Wales ??? Cardiganshire
Chris
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Hi Chris
That's great!!! looks like St Domingo Rd ...had to scroll back a few pages ;D
Funnily enough , My grandad Philip Thomas James (1919) was born in Everton, Liverpool.
The watchmaker occupation seems to be creeping in more .
deb
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I have been on IGI
DAVID JAMES 14 MAY 1837 Llanfihangel-Geneu'R-Glynn, Cardigan
s/o John James and Ann
JOHN JAMES s/o John James and Ann
25 MAR 1835 Llanfihangel-Geneu'R-Glynn, Cardigan
THOMAS JAMES s/o John James and Ann
27 SEP 1839 Llanllwchaiarn, Cardigan
JANE JAMES d/o John James and ANN
08 MAY 1837 Llanllwchaiarn, Cardigan
Looking at the 1891 you posted ... all siblings living together ...I wonder why they weren't married :-\
now to find Ann's maiden name :-\
deb
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Hi deb,
Here is a list of Chapels and Churches I found for Newquay
Chapels:
Bethel Welsh Baptist, Margaret Street
Wesleyan Methodist
Tabernacle Welsh CM, Glanmor Terrace
Church:
St. Llanllwchaearn
There may be more.
Chris
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oh my ...
could this be it LOL
John James = Ann EVANS
18 APR 1834 Llanfihangel-Geneu'R-Glynn, Cardigan
extracted.
:-\ :-\
I am so not knowing where these places are ...
Saint David, Llandyssul
Llanbadarnfawr
Llechryd
Verwick
Llanfihangel-Geneu'R-Glynn
are they all close .... are these their proper Welsh names ? arrghhhh i think I need a lesson in Welsh ;D
deb
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thanks for the churches and chapels
:)
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Parish Church LLanfihangel Geneu'r Glyn near Llandre
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Hi deb,
To give you some idea of the area.
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Chris
Thanks you again ... the photo is lovely ...just hope some of my people are buried there ... the map is also great, although I am not at all familiar with the language and spelling ;D
I shall do some more investigating ...I just hope that the James peeps did not always marry the Evans peeps ;D
deb
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Hi deb,
Can't find a marriage for Soloman but found James' marriage.
Sept. Q 1887 W Derby 8b 880
James James & Frances Catherine Smith.
Confirmed on 1891
RG12/2957/103/9
19 Robson St. Everton
James James, Head, Mar, 37, Watchmaker, South Wales New Quay Glam
Frances Catherine, Wife, Mar, 25, Worcester Leamington
Ada Dixon, Lodger, Single, 21, Dressmaker, Lancashire Liverpool
Claude Lewis James,Son, 1, Lancashire Liverpool
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Hi Chris
Great stuff ..I see them in 1901...no Claude Lewis though :-\
Can't see a death either :-\
James James is still a watchmaker .
deb
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don't know if you've come across this site, Deb, it's very helpful
http://www.welshmariners.org.uk/search.php
If you search for John James with place of birth New Quay, you'll get some details. I thought Argo sounded like the name of a ship....
;D
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OSPREY ....WOW
Thanks so much ...I could just hug you ....
Brilliant!!!
deb :) :)
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Oh my! Just read the entry for David W - evidently a very brave man!
;)
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Oh Myyyyyyyyyy indeed !!
wow wee ...can't wait to show my uncle all this ....
deb :)
I should be grocery shopping ...but can't leave the computer ;D
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Chris and Osprey
also found Evan Evans ...Ellen James nee evans dad ...on that site ...
;D ;D
deb
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Hi deb,
Things have certainly moved on thanks to the site that Osprey posted.
Done your shopping yet?
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Hi Chris and Osprey
Got the shopping done in a mad rush ;D
found an account of David Warren James' last minutes at sea ....
here's the link in case you're interested ..
http://www.bbc.co.uk/ww2peopleswar/stories/45/a2702945.shtml
deb :)
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Hi Deb,
that's amazing to find such a detailed account and uplifting to find that a relative was held in such high esteem. Looks like he might have got everyone off safely except himself.
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Hi deb,
As Osprey said an amazing account. You must be so pleased to have found that.
Chris
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Hello Deb.
Just seen your message.
If you check the following website you will find information on the James mariners.
welshmariners.org
You will also find David Warren James's name on the C.W.G.C. site and on a bronze plaque in New Quay Memorial Hall.
alism
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Hi alism
Thanks for that ... osprey had given me the welsh Mariners site ...which is just fabulous ... I had not thought to look on CWGC though .
I was also wondering if there would be anything on the James or Evans families in a museum ... I have no idea where though.
is there a site for the memorial Hall in New Quay? My uncle is hoping to visit, so hopefully I can give him as much info as possible.
thanks again
deb :)
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hi again
help ...I cannot for the life of me , find david warren James on CWGC :-[ :-\
deb
added ..just found it ... :) ::)
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can't remember a museum in New Quay - it's not very big, but there is a Tourist Info place - not sure if it's open all year
http://www.touruk.co.uk/tics/Ceredigion_1.htm
There is one in Aberystwyth though - might be worth contacting?
http://www.ceredigion.gov.uk/index.cfm?articleid=197
and the county archives are also there
http://archifdy-ceredigion.org.uk/
Picture of High Terrace among others
http://www.newquay-westwales.co.uk/photos.htm
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Hi Debs
pleased to see that you found a lot of information about your New Quay people. I actually lived at High Terrace for a while about 15 years ago!
I still live fairly close to New Quay (in llandysul) and currently both my sister and Mother in law live there. My husbands family have roots in New Qauy and I will ask my mother-in-law if she can remeber the names at all.
The memorial hall is an old community hall and has been used as the local cinema in the past.
I will see if it is possible for my sister to get a photo of the plaque for you. (My memory is terrible =- so email if you haven't heard anything for a while!)
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Hi spj
Thank you so much ... a photo of the plaque or any other info would be wonderful.
deb :)
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I will see what I can find out over next few weeks and let you know. New Quay is a beautiful place!
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debs
Plaque already on my computer. Hopefully I've sent it correctly.
Hope the weather is better with you.
alism
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alism
How FABULOUS!!!!! Thank you so much ;D :D
weather cooling off a bit ... very pleasant here now.
deb :)
ps ...why did they not put David Warren , i wonder?
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Hello
This is all very interesting to me as my Grandad is Thomas Argo James !! So I guess I am in some way related.
The next time I see my Dad I will ask him if he has any memories of Evan Gwilym James.
In the meantime thanks for all this information its, very helpful. I'm still trying to put it all together and work out who relates to who at what time, but hope you don't mind if I follow up with further posts if and when.
regards
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Francis
Welcome to Rootschat ... :)
Evan Gwilym James is my gr grandfather albeit through adoption! I am happy to meet you even though it's on the internet LOL
deb
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Deb.
As I live in Aberaeron I will get out this week and do some digging for you.
The church in New Quay is quite new but the grave yard is not disturbed too much. I will go and have a look for you. Any chance of emailing me a pdf of this bit of your family tree?
Llnawllchaiarn is the Parish that includes New Quay. Aberaeron is about 7 miles away.
jan
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Hello
I have fairly recently started looking at our family history. Whilst doing so I came across your message and chats about Evan G. Although I already knew most I did learn a bit more.
In a distant way, I think it does meant we're related and hope you can follow this. Evan G's father was John James - one of John's brothers was Thomas. Thomas married an Elizabeth Evans and had 3 children, 2 girls and a son David. David had 6 children - Lizzle Eleanora, John Evan Lisbon, Thomas Arthur, David Ewart, Hydwen & Violette. David Ewart is my Grandfather making Thomas my Great, Great Grandfather.
My mother can remember Argo (one of Evan's brother) and lives very close to New Quay.
If you managed to follow that, I hope it is of some interest to you !!!!!
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Hi F J
I'm so glad you found this post!
This would be your Thomas and my John together on the 1851 census, sons of John James and Ann Evans Davies:
2 Chapel Row, Newquay
Ann James, Head, Mar, 42
Jane, Dau, 14,
Thomas, Son, 11, Scholar
Esther, Dau, 8, Scholar
Eleanor, Dau, 6
Ann, Dau, 4
John, Son, 2
James, Son, 10 mo
Have you managed to trace their parents back further?
I would love to hear any stories about the family.
Thanks
deb :)
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Hello Deb
First I appologise as after posting my reply I realised I hadn't signed off properly!
I haven't got any further back than John and Ann yet but hope to in time. Most of my information has come from my great Aunts, Hydwen & Vio, it is of these siblings I know the most about as they would regularly tell stories of the family whenever we visited. My grandfather David Ewart (in typical welsh fashion is known as Ewart) was the only on to have children. Lizzie Eleanora (known as Nora) trainned as a teacher then married a headteacher (David Evan Davies), John Evan Lisbon (known as Lisbon) died at the age of 15 in Saigon in 1910(he was on his first trip as a ships apprentice), Thomas Arthur (known as Tom) died at 20 in 1917 in the first world war in France, my grandfather married Beatrice Davies and they had 2 daughters (my mother Ann Arabella, called Bella and her sister Mary Honoria Eileen, called Eileen). Hydwen and Vio never married and lived together in Lewis Terrace in New Quay (all have now died).
For some reason Mum mainly remembers Argo of John's family (I do have some picturs of Argo and I think his sons somewhere). As she remembers bits she does tell me but my stepfather is very ill so I don't like to push to hard at the moment as she has alot the contend with.
When I get some time I will look out the photos and scan them to attach to another message.
If you haven't found it yet ,look on the 1861 and 1871 census you will find Esther living with her grandmother Esther Davies who is 80 and 91 years old and a beer seller/inn keeper. After this it is Thomas's family I have followed.
Hoping you have managed to follow this as I have tried to condense it as much as possible and that some of it is of interest.
Frances :)
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Hi Frances
Great to hear from you again! :) Thanks for the info on your Thomas' family.
I have done a lot more research today and am finding it quite fascinating! Seems that a lot of the family died at sea, one of them at age 15.
I would love to take them further back! John James was b 1808 New Quay ...I wonder if we can find that on IGI? I did spot this today...John James (1808) married Anne Davies in the St.Llwchaiarn Parish Church on 25 November 1834.
Also from an MI:
"In loving memory of Anne beloved spouse of John James, 2 High Terrace, New Quay who died January 4 1886 aged 78. Also John James named above who died February 26, 1890 aged 82. And David his son who died July 19, 1891 aged 56. Also Esther his daughter who died March 19, 1828 aged 81. Also Eleanor his daughter who died January 16, 1933 aged 88. Also their son Solomon Christmas who died March 25, 1940 aged 87."
I think Esther's death year should be 1928 and not 1828!
I would love to see some photos when it's possible. i will also look for the censuses with Esther and her grandmother. :)
Deb
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Well done, you've got further than me!! ;)
You are obviously more practiced at this research, I only started a few weeks ago and am finding it a bit mind blowing how to get hold of the info.
The one that died at sea at 15 was John Evan Lisbon, he fell down the cargo opening on deck (not sure what it's proper name is).
Won't forget about photos.
Frances xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
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I have a lot of photos of Newquay ...would you like to see them?
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Hello Deb
Sorry about the wait but just been busy. At last over the week end I managed to dig out the photo of Thomas Argo, I just hope I manage to attach it OK. We have always thought that Argos name is something to do with a ship as his brother Thomas's house was called Argo House and have now found out it was a ship that was owned by their father John James D.O.B 1808.
Happy hunting for any other info ;D
Frances xxxxxxxxxx
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Sorry have had trouble attaching Argo's picture, have had another go at attaching it. Not sure what I'm doing wrong just hope it works this time.
Frances xxxxxxxxxxx
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Frances ...
That is unbelievably wonderful!!!!!!!! Thank you so much!
deb xxx :D :D
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http://www.welshmariners.org.uk/
you have this site I am sure...but just in case...
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Thank you but I have already exhausted this site!!
Frances xxxxxxxxxxxx