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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Worcestershire => Topic started by: louisemccrea on Friday 22 August 08 16:42 BST (UK)
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Hi
I have hit a bit of a brickwall about a few of my ancestors. First is Eliza Brown i have her as born around 1817 she was baptised in 3 aug 1817 in st thomas in Dudley she married a John deVall abt 1833 and he was a master hatter and she owned a china shop she outlived him to abt 1890. I cant find her birth or anything about her family. The other thing i am stuck with is a George deVall born around 1786 in rugeley he married someone called sarah but i cant find anymore than that about her and i know he was also a Hatter in Dudley on the high st. John deVall was there son and they had a daughter called sarah.
Anymore info would be a great help thanks or if anyone knows anything about deValls in Dudley it would be a great help
Thanks Louise :)
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Hi Louise
I found the following in the 1851 Census
They are living at New Dock, Dudley
Eliza is married to John Devall a Hatter & she is the Dau of Samuel a Carter & Hannah Brown
Samuel & Hannah Brown are born in Rugeley, Gloucestershire
the rest of the family are from Dudley Worcestershire.
1851 Census HO / 107 / 2032 Page 43
If you search for the following it will give yoiu access
Eliza Devall Samuel, abt 1818 Dudley, Worcestershire, England Wife Dudley, Worcs
(Brown) Hannah,
John
Hope this is the correct family. Let me know
Wendy47
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Have you looked at 'familysearch.org' as she is there chr 3 Aug 1817. I don't think you will find her birth as they didn't have to be registered then. Parents: Saml Brown and Hanh. They had other children: Elizabeth 1815; Samuel 1819; George 1820; all christenings. The children Samuel and George died within months of being born. These are extracted records.
In the 1841 Census for Dudley there is a Samuel Brown 55yrs, Ag Lab; Hannah Brown, 55yrs, both born in the county. They seem to be living next door to John, the Hatter, and Eliza.
In 1851 there was a George Devall living in Dudley with wife, Sarah. George was born in Rugby, Stafford and Sarah in Cannock, Stafford. He was a Hatter and both were aged 63.
Hope this is of some help. Just let me know if there is anything else I can help with.
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Me again
Do you have George & Sarah in the 1851 census?#
Wendy47
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Hi
Thanks for the information it has all been useful and are definatly the right family this has helped me a great deal in my families history.
Thanks Louise :D
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Hi Louise, Samuel and Hannah Brown were my Gtx4 Grandparents, I have all their tree Samuel 1780 - 1862 Samuel was born Mangotsfield Bristol, I have his family going back John 1758 Married Mary Powell, Thomas 1730 Married Sarah ? Samuel and Hannah nee Tyler born Rudgeway Gloucester 1782 died 1870, moved to Dudley circa 1815. I have an oil painting of Elizabeth 1811 who Married Joseph Darby a Tailor from Cradley Heath. Their son Wm born 1838 Cradley Heath was my Nan's Grandfather. The Devall's were Hatters and the Darbys were all Tailors. I have George Devall born 1786 Rugeley, I did search the Parish Register but couldn't find his Baptism. I did enter all this information on Ancestry, is that where you found it from? Samuel Brown 1819 didn't die he Married a Sarah Kite 1846 Dudley. If you need anymore information just let me know best wishes from linell.
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Hi
Thanks for all that any information is a help to me Samuel and Hannah would be my gr. grandparents x5 i can now start looking into more of my family history
Thanks Louise
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Hi, not done this before but your query came up on a search for Devalls and there are just too many coincidences. I'm looking for info on Samuel Devall, born in 1813 in Rugley. He was a hatter who moved to Leominster where he married Sarah Coleman, a seamstress. Their son Samuel, my GGGrandfather, must have moved back to the Rugely area to appentice with a tailor as he then married there before immigrating to the US before 1871. Does any of that sound like it matches?
Thanks, Alice
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Hi Alice, I have George Devall Hatter born Rugeley 1786. But there the trail ends, the next time George appears is in a Dudley Trade Directory of 1835 where he is a Hatter in High Street Dudley. Your Samuel must be of the same Hatter Devall family, do you know who is parents are do you have Samuel 1813's Baptism? Best Wishes from linell.
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Hi Alice and Linell
I agree it does seem like the same family it would be good to find out the hatter thing surley can't be a coincedence.
While i am on Linell i have found out a few more things about the deValls firstly Alfred deVall b.1848 to John and Eliza i think his wife Louisa's surname may of been Dudley i got this of free bmd i don't know how reliable it is i did find that their son Alfred E deVall b. 1880 Aston died 1886 in Aston.
Secondly the other Alfred E deVall b. 1874 to George and Phoebe married a Jessie Adelaide J Cooke in Kings Norton jul-sept 1899 jessie was born about 1877 in 1901 Alfred was a Head Physician and surgeon. Alfred and Jessie had a son called Ernest Seymour deVall on 28 mar 1901 in Aston Ernest went to Amberley prep school and in sept 1911 went to King Edwards vii school the family lived on Alum rock rd in 1911 and he left King edwards 1918 the family lived 102 Gilliot rd although his father may be dead by 1918 as the schools corrispondence went to his mother instead. I am still waiting for the school to get back to me about my grandfather and his brother but they have been very helpful i will let you know what i find.
I hope you both had a good xmas and ney year
Louise ;D
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Hi Louise, gosh you have been busy! Many thanks for all the info. Not been to the Archives yet, been busy with one thing and another, but plan to go next week. Will be in touch, all best wishes from Linell.
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Hello again Louise, did you notice on the 1901 Census for Alfred E. Devall the Surgeon that a 54 year old Annie Brown is in the household? She is a Monthly Nurse?? Born Chard Somerset, probably there to look after Jessie and or baby Ernest. Wonder if she is connected to Samuel Brown, I did a search for her on the Census, looks like her husband was Henry Brown born about 1840 Uplyme Devon, his parents were George Brown and Elizabeth born Devon. I gave up then, as trying to trace a George Brown back to Bristol is nigh impossible! Just a thought from linell.
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Hi Linell
I forgot to say about the Annie Brown i also wondered if she was related but your right George Brown rather a common name i imagine lol. I would be nice to know though.
Louise :D
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Hi Louise, yes shame about Annie Brown, is she a relative or just a co-incidence, seems a long way from Devon to Birmingham to be a Nurse Maid? Unless she had moved up there? I checked on Gilliott Road, it is in Edgbaston, so Alfred also moved to the posh side of Brum, catch up with you soon from linell.
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Hi Alice
Since you contacted me i have been looking for any connections. You said your Samuel was born about 1813 i found this also on the 1881 census but is it possible he was born in 1812 as i think i may have found his christening as 11 Oct 1812 if it is him then i have the name of his parents as William deVall and Mary i also may have Williams family but i am not sure i am going to have to sort out all my info and get back to you on that. Also if this is the right Samuel i have a few siblings Elizabeth Christened 2 apr 1809, Martha christened 2 dec 1810 and Thomas Chubbook christened 21 dec 1814 all born in Rugeley. I have came across a lot of deValls in Rugeley i think they are all related i will let you know what i find.
Take care
Louise
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Hi Louise, That sounds about right. I also think they are all connected. Certainly share some family names. I have a strange letter written by one of his daughters that gives his father's name as William, and sister and brothers' names as Martha and Thomas. It also says, though, that William's father was a French duke who fled the French revolution and sought refuge with Sir Charles Wolsey near Rugeley. I've checked with them and they highly doubt it as Sir Charles was such a staunch supporter of the revolution he helped to storm the Bastille! I think there might have been a little Victorian bigging up of the family history. It did say that William died in a fire Jan 2 1815 and I have found a newsarticle about a Wm Devall who died on that date in an acid factory - doesn't really sound like the kind of place a duke's son would work even if he was a refugee! Anyway, nice to know they had an imagination. Any chance that Wm's wife's last name was Hawley?
Alice
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Hi Alice
I have Marys surname as Hawley and i have their marriage as 25 Dec 1806 and i believe Williams parents were a Samuel deVall and Martha Brindley. I got in contact with another woman who has a Mary deVall in her family i think this is Williams sister and so does she she is in the process of transcribing the Rugeley parish reg so i will see if anything comes up. She was saying that quite a few deValls are registered in the Blithfield church which is on the Blithfield Estate just outside Rugeley the Estate and Church belonged to the Bagot family and she thinks the family worked for them this is in the first part of the 1700's she sent me bits and pieces and one bit was about a family called the Smallmans who were related to her Mary deVall in 1861 they had a William e deVall staying with them age 24 and a Carpenter born in Leominster this may be another son of Samuel and Sarah.
My mother was a deVall and told me that her dad or grandad had looked into the family history and said that the family had come from either Catalan France or Spain and that there was some scandal of them coming from the illicit relationship of some poor woman and a priest it definatly sounds like they had good imaginations lol.
If you send your email address to my personel messages i will email you the info i got from the other lady and anything else i have.
Louise
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Hi Louise,
This is great! Very interesting. So some bit are based on the truth! One of Samuel's other sons had another howler about his having been a body guard to Queen Victoria.
Anyway, I'm not very good at this site yet, how do I send a personal reply vs a posted item? Or have I just done so?
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if you look under my picture at the side at the bottom ther is a wee green scroll click on that and you send a pm through that. I read somewhere else about a queens body guard i will have a wee look just now
Louise
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Hi Louise and Alice, this is all great stuff, I too think they are all connected and one big Hatter family, some of the sons or grandsons could have been apprenticed as Tailors. I am fascinated by your stories of the French Revolution and the Blithfield connection. I found some Baps and Marriages from Colton which is near Blithfield. Once the weather is better I will go to Blithfield Churchyard and look at the Tombstones. It is up an unkempt road, really muddy at the best of times! Will be in touch best wishes linell.
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Hi all, My information indcated that our Devalls were in the Rugely graveyard...Interesting to see what you turn up tho!
Alice
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Hi Alice, will have a look around Rugeley Churchyard too, mind you a lot of the old Tombs are difficult to read, apparently it's the acid rain which erodes them, so I have been told, maybe easier to look at the Parish Register. The name of Martha seems to run through the generations, it does in the George 1786 line, one of his Granddaughters was Martha Maldiva Devall, wonder if that was someone's surname? Best Wishes from linell.
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Hello
I am interested in your message. Especially;belonged to the Bagot family and she thinks the family worked for them this is in the first part of the 1700's she sent me bits and pieces and one bit was about a family.
Do you have anymore information regarding this?
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Best wishes
TalbotMartin
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http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/family-tree/bcconnections/193564/51379/William-Devall-Family
The family are on here, just click the names and you can view the ancestors and descendants. HTH Linell.