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Census Lookups General Lookups => Census and Resource Discussion => Census Lookup and Resource Requests => Topic started by: ex1066er on Monday 18 August 08 01:25 BST (UK)
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Hello,
In 2005 a kind person on RootsChat found a relative of mine in the 1851 Census. Since then I've had access to the Ancestry version of this census through my local library, but have never been able to locate the entry myself.
Could someone please check to see if they can find the image for the following household:
Eastbourne, Sussex:
HO 107 1637 F130 (is reference I was given)
John Betteridge Hd widower 71 b Gls Stoke
Ellen dau laundress 30 b Eastbourne
I have still not been able to trace the baptism of John Betteridge. He died before 1861, so the 1851 census reference is my only clue to his place of birth.
If you find the image, could you please give me the full reference (including page no), and also check the image to see if the transcription "Gls Stoke" is correct. Could it be something else?
I've assumed Gls Stoke means Gloucestershire, and "Stoke" is possibly Stow-in-the-Wold (I've been told that locals just refer to the village as "Stow"), and a Cotswold accent in Sussex in 1851 could easily transcribe "Stow" to "Stoke".
Fun stuff this detective work! Anyone got other suggestions?
John
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HI John
This is how that family are transcribed on Ancestry
John B McCage 71 bn Glesholonra Steve
Ellen "" 50 bn
With a lodger as well
Here the full Ref
HO107; Piece: 1637; Folio: 162; Page: 34
The 130 you were given refers to the Household Schedule number so does not help at all in finding the people you were after.
Wendy
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The IGI has this baptism in Stow on the Wold
JOHN
Christening: 18 DEC 1781 Stow On The Wold, Gloucester
so presumably either a not legible surname and parents' names, damage to the register at that point or the register was just not completed. You could have the register checked to see whether there is more information that can be extracted or enquire whether the Bishops Transcripts have survived for Stow and see what information they contain about this baptism.
If you are relying on the IGI for your information on whether John's baptism is in the register it is always worth having the register (or another index) checked because the IGI has mistakes like any index.
Regards
Valda
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Isn't there a Stone in Gloucestershire? That is what it looks like to me. Awful writing though.
Andrea
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Hiya John
It looks like Stone to me as well and there is a Stone in Gloucestershire
Willow x
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Both Stone and Stow-in-the–Wold baptismal registers are covered by the IGI for the period of interest circa 1780.
Stow 1610-1812
Stone 1578-1812
There are Betteridge baptisms showing on the IGI in Stow beginning in 1785 for John and Elizabeth Betteridge and 1788 for Robert and Elizabeth Betteridge. I can’t find marriages on the IGI for either of these couples, but then Stow marriages are not covered by the IGI. Neither have a son called John on the IGI baptised in Stow. Though a Mormon church member submission 'guesses' at a birth in Stow for a John Betteridge.
John Betteridge
Birth: 1785 Of, Stow On The Wold, Gloucester
Father: Robert Betteridge
Mother: Elizabeth
Spouse: Mary Cary
Marriage: 18 APR 1809 (according to an extracted entry in Wotton Under Edge)
There are no Betteridge baptisms in Stone.
On the 1851 census there are Betteridges living in Stow who were born there about the same time as John in Eastbourne. William Bettridge aged 60 and Thomas Betridge aged 63. There are other Betteridges born Stow.
There are no Betteridges born Stone from any period.
I have access to a burial index recording burials in Stone and Stow from 1813 onwards. No Betteridges in Stone but quite a few in Stow. For instance
1823 John aged 63 birth year circa 1760
1829 Elizabeth aged 69 birth year circa 1760
1833 Elizabeth aged 80 birth year circa 1753
1851 Robert aged 83 birth year circa 1768
If John’s age on the 1851 census in Eastbourne is correct, 71 (and his age at burial or on his death registration would help confirm it) then with a birth year of circa 1780 John of Stow or either of the two Elizabeths would be old enough to be his parents.
Gloucestershire Record Office online database shows no instances of Betteridges in Stone but it does show some interesting records for Stow.
http://www.gloucestershire.gov.uk/index.cfm?ArticleID=1335
Year Surname Forename Gender Parish Reference Occupation Catalog
1823 bettridge john U stow-on-the-wold 1823/ 19 shopkeeper Wills 1801 - 1858
and an earlier will
1808 bettridge robert U stow-on-the-wold 1808/ 80 carpenter Wills 1801 - 1858
There is also a Prerogative Court of Canterbury will held by The National Archives for Bettridge in Stow but again nothing in Stone.
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/
Will of Elizabeth Bettridge, Widow of Stow on the Wold , Gloucestershire 24 October 1829 PROB 11/1761
and the Death Duty entry for Robert’s will
Description Administration letter of Robert Betteridge of Stow, Gloucestershire. Proved in the Court of Gloucester.
Date June 04 1808
Catalogue reference IR 26/346
Dept Records of the Boards of Stamps, Taxes, Excise, Stamps and Taxes, and Inland Revenue
Series Board of Inland Revenue and predecessors: Estate Duty Office and predecessors: Registers of Legacy Duty, Succession Duty and Estate Duty
The National Archives research guide gives details on the sort of information that might be found in Death Duty registers.
Death Duty Records, From 1796
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/RdLeaflet.asp?sLeafletID=107
‘They can give the name of the deceased, with address and last occupation, the date of the will, the place and date of probate, the names, addresses and occupations of the executors, and details of estates, legacies, trustees, legatees, annuities and the duty paid. They can also give the date of death, and information about the people who received bequests (beneficiaries), or who were the next-of-kin, such as exact relationship to the deceased. Tax was not payable on bequests to people within a closely defined family circle, and as a result the family relationship was often noted in the registers.’
There are no wills at TNA at Stone for Betteridges.
None of this is conclusive for a birth for John Betteridge of Eastbourne in Stow (as Andrea says the census enumerator's handwriting on the 1851 census isn't easy to decipher), but of the two places, Stow or Stone, it certainly seems to prioritise the search to the possible Stow records first.
Regards
Valda
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Wow, what great detectives ! Thank you so much Valda (x2), winston, Willow & sillgen.
It will take me a while to absorb and check all the clues and links provided, so I'll report back with my findings and let you know the progress.
Ancestry's transcribing of the 1851 Census blows my mind away - no wonder I couldn't find John Betteridge - I can't wait to have a look at the image at my local library tomorrow.
Again, thanks for ALL the information. Rootschatters are the tops!
John
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HI John
I know as of this message its John early years and parentage your probably after but do you have a wife for your John Betteridge?
Wendy
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http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/AKEHURST/2006-06/1150500442
but I can't see a burial for her, to give a more exact age and therefore year of birth.
Regards
Valda
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HI Valda
Thanks for that. I have seen that entry while Googling I suppose I just wanted confirmation that this John was that John - if you know what I mean.
There is this site that I found while using the abov site looking for George Akehurst Betterindge their son which does mention her parentage but nothing more on the Betteridge line sadly.
http://members.cox.net/akehursters.net/Files/Akehurster-3.PDF
Wendy
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There is a researcher registered with the Guild of One Name Studies researching the surname Akehurst, so for Elizabeth I would also contact him to see what information he holds.
http://www.one-name.org/
or
http://www.akehurst.org/
Regards
Valda
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Yes Winston, "this John is that John".
My John Betteridge married Elizabeth Akehurst at St. Mary's Church in Eastbourne 20 June 1804. I have the SFHG and akehurst.org to thank for links to that side of the family.
John