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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: madsy on Sunday 27 July 08 06:53 BST (UK)
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Hi, I'm new to this "sport" and more than a little lost, so I wonder if anyone can help push me in the right direction. With the help of a friend I've found my Dooley ancestors in Wilnecote/Buddesley/Fazeley area but the counties are given variously as Staffordshire, Warwickshire and Derbyshire all in the same census or bmd records! This is confusing. The facts about my family as far as I know them are this: My g. grandfather Joseph Dooley was born around 1862 in Buddesley. His parents were Samuel Dooley and Harriet, nee Hull. Samuel was born in Swadlincote Derbyshire in 1831. Samuel's father was John Dooley, but I don't know when or where he was born. I'm trying to find out if there's an Irish connection.
Does anyone know how I would push back to find if John Dooley's ancestors came from Ireland?
That's the Dooleys. Joseph Dooley married Fanny Titterton. I understand the Titttertons came from Cheshire originally. Again, I can't get back beyone the 1800s. Fanny's father was John Titterton and her mother was also called Harriet (or Harriett). But I can't find any other information. I've looked in Ancestry, but can't find anything.
Madsy
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They seem to have lived along county boundaries - i.e. Wilnecote is in Tamworth parish, which is half in Staffordshire and half in Warwickshire:
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/STS/Tamworth/index.html
1841 census, Swadlincote hamlet in Church Gresley, Derbyshire:
(HO 107/0191 folio 11/16 page 26)
Joseph Dooly, 40, colliery bailiff
Hannah, 40
Mary, 20
Benjamin, 15, coal miner
Edmund, 14, ditto
Samuel, 12
Hannah, 10
John, 4
George, 2
all listed as being born 'in county'.
from the IGI (www.familysearch.org) it appears the older children (including Samuel) were christened in Alfreton, the younger ones in Church Gresley. Benjamin, Edmund and a younger brother, Ebenezer, at least, appear to have moved to Warwickshire in later censuses.
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Thank you for your information. I checked out the links you sent and found the Tamworth history really interesting. However, when I checked the other link, the family search one, I could find nothing on Samuel Dooley. I tried the IGI index and could only find records for Samuel Dooley in the mid 1700s.
Could you tell me how you found the listing you sent me, please? I'm not very adept at knowing how to find elusive entries yet.
How can I check to be sure that the Samuel Dooley in the listing is later the father of "my" Joseph Dooley?
Madsy
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From the details posted it looks as though the Dooleys have been in England since at least 1801 so the Irish connection must be at least a generation or so earlier. If you do find the link to Ireland it will be very difficult to get information on the family there as there will be no civil registration of births, deaths & marriages or census records. To find anything like church records in Ireland you will need to know the family's religion and where they lived (parish of not actual townland not just the county)- the latter bit of information is often impossible to get from existing records.
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Would it be possibe to trace them back to Liverpool (assuming that's where they originally settled)? I'm betting the Irish connection was way back as my g. grandfather, Joseph Dooley died in 1939 and current family history as of then was that the family was English and there was no Irish in us! Since he was born 8n 1862, he would have been within a couple of generations of any Irish influx from the late 1700s.
madsy
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People have been travelling back and forth between Ireland and England, Scotland and Wales for years (there are no passenger lists since all were part of U.K.)
To trace the family in England you would do so like any other search: census records, etc.
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Thank you for your speedy reply. I'll take your advice.
Regards,
Madsy
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I’m new to this group, so I know it’s a few years since your query. If it’s helpful, I have Fanny Dooley nee Titterton in my family tree. She was my first cousin, 3 times removed. Can’t help with the Dooley ancestors, only the Tittertons. As far back as I can see, to her grandfather (my 4th great grandfather) came from Staffordshire.
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It seems as if this is the same family. The paternal name of the Staffordshire Dooleys was Samuel. The Titterton branch that I can trace my family back to was John Titterton.
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Is that John Titterton b1782? Or his son or grandson? So many Johns in that branch! But yes he is my 4th great-grandfather.
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Yes, that's the man. So you and I are related. He would be my grandmother's great grandfather, I think. Do you know anything about the village where he lived and his occupation?
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Madsy - are you aware of Liverpoolhistoryprojects site??
76 Roman Catholic marriages for Dooley
http://www.liverpoolhistoryprojects.co.uk/liverpoolrcmarriages/marriages.php
there are also Baptisms and Burials on that site
http://www.liverpoolhistoryprojects.co.uk/liverpoolrcbaptisms/
http://www.liverpoolhistoryprojects.co.uk/liverpoolrcburials/
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Titterton in Staffordshire - 1700-1800
515 results
https://en.geneanet.org/fonds/individus/?size=10&ignore_each_patronyme=&ignore_each_prenom=&type_periode=between&exact_month=&exact_day=&exact_year=&nom=titterton&ignore_each_patronyme=&prenom=&prenom_operateur=or&ignore_each_prenom=&place__0__=&zonegeo__0__=Staffordshire%2C+England%2C+United+Kingdom&country__0__=GBR®ion__0__=ENG&subregion__0__=STS&place__1__=&zonegeo__1__=&country__1__=®ion__1__=&subregion__1__=&place__2__=&zonegeo__2__=&country__2__=®ion__2__=&subregion__2__=&place__3__=&zonegeo__3__=&country__3__=®ion__3__=&subregion__3__=&place__4__=&zonegeo__4__=&country__4__=®ion__4__=&subregion__4__=&type_periode=between&from=1700&to=1800&exact_month=&exact_day=&exact_year=&go=1
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is Onecote close to Wilnecote ?
https://gw.geneanet.org/nickyf?n=titterton&oc=1&p=john
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I am descended from Charles Titterton. He was my grandmother’s grandfather. Fanny was his niece, the daughter of his eldest brother John. John and Charles had 11 other brothers and sisters. Charles may have been the black sheep of the family, he certainly featured in the local courts a few times. Their father was John b1811, married to Elizabeth. John’s father was also called John b1782 married to Mary. That’s about as far back as I’ve gone.
Fanny’s brother Ernest married Maria McGowan who had a sad upbringing; she and her 9 siblings were orphaned and ended up in the workhouse as paupers.
Another point of interest is that Fanny’s first cousin William was the father of Sir Ernest Titterton, the nuclear physicist (associated with the atom bomb, Manhattan Project etc.).
As for the Dooleys, someone else on Ancestry has traced them back many generations. No Irish connection yet and it goes back to 1610 - still in Derbyshire. I’ve quickly added them to my tree but haven’t done my usual checks. You will need to check any available records to make sure the line is correct. However, that suggests that Samuel Dooley was born in Swadlincote but in 1829 not 1831 and married to Catherine. The Dooley line then goes back: Joseph, b.1797, William 1773, Edward 1742, Henry 1699, Henry 1658, William 1630, John b. 1 Jan 1610.
There’s a lot of conflicting information across the Titterton tree, I need to tidy up my version but I’m focused on my paternal line atm. Hope that’s helpful, regards Claire
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Madsy, have you considered DNA testing? If you or a male relative with the Dooley surname test their Y-DNA then it could help you discover where your early Dooley ancestors hailed from; whether ireland or Scotland, and what region.
Some might say Y-DNA is limited in its use compared to the more popular atDNA test because Y-DNA is only passed down from father to son. For that same reason though it can be very useful for tracing and finding matches on the surname line.
FamilyTreeDNA Y-DNA tests start around around 80 pounds when on sale.
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This is all wonderful information. Where are you searching? Are you using one source or multiple sources? With all the libraries closed now, I find it hard to access the materials I need. I don't buy subscriptions to all the genealogy sites as the Ottawa library has licenses for all of them so they are free to use. The genealogy librarian is there to help, as well. This lockdown is a bit frustrating, but of course, I understand and support it. The information you have given here is invaluable and will help me a lot.
I understand that the Dooley connection to Ireland may go back centuries for some. The farther back it goes though, the more I wonder how Dooleys got to England. It wasn't easy in those days pre-1600s.
It's the same with Scottish connections pre-railway days. How on earth did peasants manage to travel so far? It's a bit of a conundrum.
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That last reply from me was to Claire R. but somehow another response from TunjiLees got in the middle. Here is a reply to TunjiLees:
Hi,
The only male relative I have on the Dooley line, who is also descended from a Dooley father, is not very interested in getting his DNA tested. I will see if I can prod him into it! The name "Dooley" after all stems from O Dubhhaoloich, or something like that, which is obviously Gaelic. Is this Irish Gaelic or Scottish Gaelic, I wonder? I know many Scots Gaels moved into Ireland back in history sometime.
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Hi again. I have a subscription to Ancestry so I just did a very quick search on there. The last 5 generations of Dooleys I listed were all from the village of Great Longstone in Derbyshire. I think Henry may have been the schoolmaster. As you don’t have Ancestry, I suggest you google “Dooleys of Great Longstone, Derbyshire”. That picked up an old history book which mentioned the Dooleys, some church records, and other people interested in tracing those Dooley roots (including someone interested in the Irish connection). There was also a link to WikiTree (you can join this for free) and I suggest you could message the owner of that Dooley profile and ask for information. I have the Titterton tree fairly complete but I’m not so sure of the Dooley tree as he was an in-law and a distant relation.
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There was also a link to WikiTree (you can join this for free)
Same caveats apply to WikiTree as with trees on other sites. There are plenty of errors.
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Thank you. This is very helpful.
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Oh yes, I wasn’t suggesting that the OP simply copies information from WikiTree (or Ancestry for that matter!). But there is a page set up for one of the Dooley ancestors from Great Longstone. I’m suggesting that the OP contacts the individual listed as the owner of that page and asks for the information he has and his sources to see if there might be a connection. In fact the church records are listed as a source for that page.