RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => Canada Lookup Request => Canada => Canada Lookup Requests Completed => Topic started by: Abby on Sunday 25 May 08 04:43 BST (UK)
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Hi fellow Rootschatters,
I'm in New Zealand and even though I have tried some of your wonderful links to Canadian online resources, I haven't had any luck with the following...
My husband's paternal g.grandparent's marriage certificate has his g.grandmother, Mary Esther MOSSMAN's place of birth as Kingston, Canada. They were married in Waipawa, New Zealand in 1880, with her age as 21, which would have her birth around 1859? Her parents are listed as Thomas MOSSMAN and Eleanor WILWORTH (I think it might actually be meant to be DILWORTH).
I currently have no idea when, or how, they came to New Zealand, but help with Mary's birth would be so much appreciated and would give me something to work on.
Thanks heaps from a hopeful Kiwi,
Abby
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I haven't been able to find her birth, but thought these links might help.
City of Kingston - Vital Statistics
http://www.cityofkingston.ca/cityhall/family.asp
(Index for) The Dilworth Legacy
http://www.texyz.com/textract/examples/dilworth.pdf
Kingston Roots
http://www.angelfire.com/space/kingstonroots/#KF
1851 Census Links
Census Project
http://ontariocensus.rootsweb.ancestry.com/
National Archives
(not transcribed - have to search by community)
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/archivianet/1851/index-e.html
Upper & Lower Canada Marriage Bonds
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/genealogy/012/index-e.html
Federal Census of Ontario 1871
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/archivianet/1871-ontario/index-e.html
Canadian Directories
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/canadiandirectories/index-e.html
Janice
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Should have told you that Kingston is located in Frontenac County, but you should also include Hastings and Prince Edward County as well as Quinte Area.
Also, there is a Henry Mossman living in Bellville, Thurlow Township, Ontario in 1884 - 1899 (Belleville is near Kingston).
There is also a James Dilworth living in Tweed, Huntingdon Township, Ontario. (1884- 1885)
Most Dilworth's seemed to live in Carlton County which is north of Kingston.
Hastings County genealogy
http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~onhastin/
Quinte Genealogy
http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~canqbogs/
Prince Edward County GenWeb
http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~onprince/?cj=1&sid=rootsweb-redirect-us&o_xid=0002921548&o_lid=0002921548
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Thanks so much Janice - I started checking out some of your links then realized this is going to take me some time, so dashed back to say a great big thank you. Not only have you provided me with great sites to explore, but you have also given me hints, information and advice - what more could I have wished for.
This might take me a while but I will certainly let you know when I find anything. Its a shame I have to go to work tomorrow and I guess I should catch some sleep soon too, so I had better get back to it.
Thanks again,
Abby
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Hi Janice,
Using your link to 'The Dilworth Legacy' I found both Thomas Mossman and Eleanor listed which could be promising. If this is a book index as it appears, I can't find a mention of who the author is. An author would help me try to access the book here or perhaps copies of the relevant pages through a Canadian library?
You can probably tell that I'm hopeful................. now back to those links!
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It looks as though the author is Murray Wilton
http://www.texyz.com/textract/biblio.htm
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/topic/story.cfm?c_id=329&objectid=10370946
http://www.times.co.nz/cms/news/2007/11/art100018674.php
http://www.radionz.co.nz/popular/books/soundshistorical/books_featured_on_2_december_2007
It seems to be available at the Dunedin Public Library (the link is below). If that's not close to you, possibly your library will have a copy.
http://www.dunedinlibraries.com/home/
Janice
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Although I couldn't find it on "Google Books", you may find other books that may help.
(I have put the link for "New Zealand Google Books"
http://books.google.co.nz/bkshp?hl=en&tab=wp
Janice
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Hi Abby,
I wonder if your Thomas Mossman was in the military and that's why he was in Kingston at the time of Mary Esther's birth :-\
www.findmypast.com has military bdm, perhaps Mary's birth might be registered there, sorry I don't have a subscription to that site.
Karen
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http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/ has some references to Thomas Mossman, who died aged nearly 100. There are a couple, but the best is at:
Evening Post, Volume LVII, Issue 154, 1 July 1899, Page 4
summary: born on Lord Powiscourt's estate near Dungannan, in Ireland, on the 1st day of 1800. Went to England and spent 25 years there, a lace manufacturer; returned to Ireland when he inherited the family home; after a few years went to Canada and the States; was in the US about 13 years; came to Auckland at the request of his brother-in-law, the late James Dilworth.
On IGI there is a marriage in Ireland for Thomas and Eleanor Dilworth, in 1847.
On the Auckland Libraries database there is listed, arrived Oct 19 1866 on Winterthur, the following Mossmans:
Eleanor
Henry A
Isabella
Mary E
Thomas
Thomas A
William J
Henry Albert, the youngest son of Thomas Mossman, is listed on Papers Past as dying on November 9th.
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Well done Jorose!!
Karen
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Great find Jorose!
Janice
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I am so thrilled - I got home from work, straight onto the computer and there is so much information waiting - I'm blown away. Thank you so much. I will go and digest it all. I can interloan the book from Dunedin through our library here in Hastings.
This genealogy bug is such a buzz - all the more so with such amazing help. Wow!! I would put masses of smilies on here if I knew how (LOL).
Thank you again,
Abby
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Well, I think this can be off to completed? J.J.
This might be Thomas & brother in law in a Sands directory...
http://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/newtownproject/Sands_Directory/sands1896.html
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Thank you so much Janice, Karen, Jorose and J.J.,
I so much appreciate your help and interest. I interloaned a copy of The Dilworth Legacy - it was really interesting and has given me a better understanding. I also managed to pick up a copy of 'A Heritage in Trust' by GL Pearce which included some family tree information - an unexpected bonus.
The links you provided have me sailing off on several 'hot' leads.
Thank you again and good luck to you all in your own searchings,
Abby
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http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/ has some references to Thomas Mossman, who died aged nearly 100. There are a couple, but the best is at:
Evening Post, Volume LVII, Issue 154, 1 July 1899, Page 4
summary: born on Lord Powiscourt's estate near Dungannan, in Ireland, on the 1st day of 1800. Went to England and spent 25 years there, a lace manufacturer; returned to Ireland when he inherited the family home; after a few years went to Canada and the States; was in the US about 13 years; came to Auckland at the request of his brother-in-law, the late James Dilworth.
On IGI there is a marriage in Ireland for Thomas and Eleanor Dilworth, in 1847.
The IGI record is submitted not extracted: Thomas William Mossman married 28 Nov. Co. Tyrone to Eleanor Dilworth.
'Lord Powiscourt's estate near Dungannan' should be Lord Powerscourt's estate near Dungannon but spelling isn't always correct in the newspapers.
Might be connected?:
Londonderry Sentinel, 30 May 1865- marriage- May 25, at Dungannon Church, by the Rev. W.J.M. Young, Incumbent of Brackaville, Mr. John Dilworth, of Killyman, to Miss Ann Jane Dilworth, of Dungannon.
Londonderry Sentinel, 17 Mar.1863- birth- March 8, at Greenvale Cottage, Cookstown, the wife of Mr. F.W. Dilworth, of a son.
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Yeah, it's true...submissions can be a nightmare, but they also can be a
stepping stone to finding more...That submission also has this:
Eleanor Dilworth born circa 1829, Dunseark, Clonfeacle, Tyrone, Ireland
and a death in 1914...no place of death stated...J.J.
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Abby a book has been written by Colleen Bull, from Gisborne, about her side of the Mossman family. She is a daughter of Pynson Wilmot Mossman, who is a son of William John Mossman. It possiby is in the Gisborne Public Library or you may be able to purchase a copy.
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Welcome to rootschat 3 lucky sevens! Enjoy! J.J.
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Thanks 777 - I'll do a search for it and see if I can get hold of a copy. Really special to be your first call to Rootschat, although I've a hunch it will be just the beginning for you - such a wonderful site to be a part of - a team with such helpful, thoughtful and generous members.
Thanks too Aghadowey - so many apologies for taking sooo long to reply to you - I've been somewhat snowed under with lots of other things for a while, so its exciting to be back 'in the seat'. It looks as though this Dilworth family were out of Donaghmore, County Tyrone and some of them apparently moved to Portadown, County Armagh around the time of the potato famine. I'm afraid I have lots to learn about Irish genealogy, so I will store your information with care - I can't as yet see how it fits directly but I know how these gems can prove to be invaluable, so thanks heaps.
Special thanks J.J. - I have yet to get Eleanor's birth certificate, so your information on her birth details will be invaluable - it looks very likely!
What at team!
Thanks again to all,
Abby
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Hi Abby,
www.GenesReunited.co.uk also has genealogists tracing the Mossman family.
All these sites are great for contacts. I grew up in Gisborne so know most if not all the Mossmans there, and there were many of them.
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Hi my surname is Mossman and I live in Northern Ireland. I came across your post. I am not sure what you are trying to find out but the Thomas Mossman that went to New Zealand is a relation of mine and I was brougt up near where he lived. The remains of his house stood up until a few years ago. I have been to New Zealand to meet his relatives and then have been over here. He also served in the police and we have his police baton. I have a copy of his obituary somewhere which gives his history. If you want to contact me my e mail is ** email address has been removed to prevent spam and other possible abuse. Please use the secure PM system to exchange personal information.as I do not be on this site!
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Hi my surname is Mossman and I live in Northern Ireland. I came across your post. I am not sure what you are trying to find out but the Thomas Mossman that went to New Zealand is a relation of mine and I was brougt up near where he lived. The remains of his house stood up until a few years ago. I have been to New Zealand to meet his relatives and then have been over here. He also served in the police and we have his police baton. I have a copy of his obituary somewhere which gives his history. If you want to contact me my e mail is ** email address has been removed to prevent spam and other possible abuse. Please use the secure PM system to exchange personal information.
as I do not be on this site!
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welcome to rootschat shazmos....you belong on the site now that you've joined in ;D J.J.
http://boards.rootsweb.com/surnames.dilworth/49.2/mb.ashx
perhaps another publication on parents of James
http://muse.aucklandmuseum.com/databases/Muscat/37439.detail
Item # 7 - Copy of a notice of sale regarding the sale of Thomas Hall's farm 'Mount Prospect', located in the Parish of Aghalee, County Antrim, and containing 67 acres of land held by lease under the Marquis of Hertford, dated 25 November 1843. (holograph; 2 leaves)
Item # 8 -- Application from John Hall, Auckland, to the Colonial Secretary, dated 6 December 1847, for an (Intermediate) or Second Cabin Passage from Great Britain to Auckland, New Zealand, for his family, currently residing at Lake View, near Antrim, Ireland. (holograph; 1 leaf)
Item # 9 -- Testimonial from the parish priest of Aghalee in the diocese of Dromore, County Antrim, Ireland, dated 16 August 1841, regarding John Hall. (holograph; 1 leaf, folded; 2 written sides)
Item # 12 - Farewell letter from Isabella Hall to her sons [John and Richard Hall]. (holograph; 1 leaf, folded; 4 written sides)
Item # 13 - Indenture of apprenticeship by which John Hall, son of Thomas Hall, consents to be apprenticed to the woollen, linen, silk and haberdashery business for a period of four years,
Folder 2:
Item # 1 -- Softcover volume (22 cm) containing the family trees of the Young, Runciman, Martyn, Buttle, McNicol and Hall families compiled by A.M. [Arthur Meredith] Leslie Armstrong in October, 1958, from the 'Baby Book' and other records kept by Aunt Margaret [Runciman]. (12 leaves)
death notice for Isabella (Hall) Dilworth & perhaps siblings:
Items #8-13 -Hall, Baird and Dilworth family death notices and obituaries: (1) Obituary for Sarah Baird, 1911, (2) Obituary and death notice for Robert Hall, 1920, (3) Obituary and death notice for Thomas Henry Hall, 1911, (4) Obituary and death notice for John Hall, 1909, and (5) Obituary and death notice for Isabella Dilworth, wife of James Dilworth, 1910.
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http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~shamere/MARRIAGES4.html
[NZ'er 16th July 1853] - On Tuesday 12th July, at the residence of the bride's brother, Otahuhu, by the Rev. Thomas Buddle, Mr JAMES DILWORTH, of Remuera, to ISABELLA, second daughter of the late Thomas Hall Esq., of Mount Prospect, County Down Ireland.
The IGI has a submission...for siblings being:
Thomas Henry Hall c 1821 Aghalee, Antrim, Ireland
John Hall , c 1823
William Hall c 1825
Edward Hall c 1827
Isabel or Isabella Hall c 1829
has parents as:
Thomas Richard Hall & Isabella Stephenson
There are actual extracted files for birth & christening of Robert & christening of Edward Anna, & John....
to a Thos HALL & Isabella ...but no extracted file for Isabelle
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hi thanks for the information esp the aukland museum and the mossmans. what is your connection to the mossmans and dolworths?!
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No connection...just am on the immigration to Canada site.... ;D J.J.
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I'm Pynsons grandson. Thomas was one of his two other brothers. Yes to Gisborne and breeding like rabbits, there are tons of us! Try this link: http://www.militarian.com/threads/mossman-brothers-new-zealand.8230/
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Welcome to the site, Mike. The poster Abby has not been active for years, however, I have also sent her a message that there is a reply should her notification have been turned off...but her email may no longer be active. In the meantime you can peruse the site, read the beginners info and post something should you have a query of your own.
all the best, J.J.
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Hi Mike
Are you the son of Rodney Mossman? I am the great grandson of Willie Mossmans sister Isabella Stubbs and have been tracing the Mossman/Dilworth history. I have met some of the extended family to date.
JJ
Can you drop Abbie an email line, I have the obituary for Mary Watt which has her birth details if she is still after this.
Cheers
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Rowan26 welcome to Rootschat! I am so sorry I cannot email them, only private message them which you can also do with other rellies on this thread once a few posts are made ( they say three but I seem to reach people after two, so just try it ...hit the scroll to the left)...Abby has not responded, so may have changed her email address & not kept up with the site.
The private message part of the site is for discussing living relatives...You can exchange a few ancestral details on here in the meantime...
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Hi Rowan,
Yes I am Rodneys son. Sorry I dont know that many answers, but know the NZ family of course and sometime its on my bucket list to visit Ireland. Recently Tim died, but Tim, Henry and Rodney at just short of 93 were believed to be the oldest living set of Triplets in the world for quite some time. Half that generation is gone now, but they bred like rabbits so there are a ton of cousins..... ;D
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I imagine it is o.k. to mention these living lads as they've made the news a lot...a great writeup on the three lads...with images over the years...Seems Abbey won't complain that we've hijacked her thread...altho you never know if she'll show up again one day & join back in....
http://www.nzwomansweekly.co.nz/your-stories/weekly-people/threes-a-charm-brotherly-bond/
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JJ
The personal messages doesn't appear to be working for me, I tried and got a "you are not able to send personal messages" reply, How do I go about doing this?
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That was the second post needed...Note that you now have the "posts:2" listed under your name. If still doesn't work, post once again.
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Cheers JJ
I had worked it out, all done now successfully
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A site that may interest those with interest in the Mossman NZ descendants.
http://www.sinnottnz.com/getperson.php?personID=I6175&tree=tree5