RootsChat.Com

Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => New Zealand Completed Requests => Topic started by: cando on Friday 23 May 08 07:08 BST (UK)

Title: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900 - COMPLETED
Post by: cando on Friday 23 May 08 07:08 BST (UK)
I have a copy of a letter written by George KELLY [b.c1840 Banaghor, Kings County, Ireland] in 1900 with the address Box 39, Auckland, to my OH's gg grandfather in South Australia.  He only speaks in general terms of his family - "I am married with nine children all grown up and with the exception of two, all away from home.  I am engaged in mercantile pursuits..."  Not much help really.  He mentions being 60 years of age and  being in Australia and New Zealand since 1856 and as a result of that snippet of info have found the following-

Unassisted Immigrants arriving at Victoria

KELLY   George    Age 16      Jan   1856   PHOENIX   Port B   Fiche 105  Pge 006

George married Emily DANDO in 1870 but two children were born - Charles William 1867 and  Florence 1869.  George married Emily in 1870 in Sandridge [Melbourne] - not Geelong where they were living.  I have the correct George as his father, John and his occupation Sub Inspector Royal Irish Constabulary, were noted on the marriage certificate.

Two more children were born - Emily Elizabeth 1871 and George Ernest in 1873.

George's occupation on all the certificates is Draper, however George was a tad naughty as he stated on the chns' birth certificates that he and Emily were married in Majorca, Mediterranean in 1866 :o   Wonder why they tied the knot again in Sandridge in 1870!!  A touch of keeping up appearances and let's hope the neighbours don't find out ;)

Then George and family sailed to New Zealand

Index to Outward Passengers to Interstate, UK, NZ and Foreign Ports 1852-1886

                           Ship
KELLY   MR   29 OTAGO    Sep 1874 New Zealand
KELLY   MRS   28 OTAGO Sep 1874 New Zealand
KELLY   Charles 7 OTAGO  Sep 1874 New Zealand
KELLY   Emily   3 OTAGO     Sep 1874 New Zealand
KELLY   Florence 5 OTAGO   Sep 1874 New Zealand
KELLY   Geo 2   OTAGO     Sep 1874 New Zealand

The ages of George and Emily are incorrect the the childrens' names and ages are correct with the exception of George.

Where to from here?  I would appreciate some advice.  I have looked at some of the websites for Auckland - cemetery searches etc. but to date have not been successful in furthering my research.

Cheers
cando

Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: Thamesite2017 on Friday 23 May 08 07:34 BST (UK)
Does George have a middle name?

Theres a Charles William buried Karori Cem 1923 aged 55
http://www.wellington.govt.nz/services/cemeteries/search/search.php

Bye
althea
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Friday 23 May 08 07:38 BST (UK)
Does George have a middle name?

Theres a Charles William buried Karori Cem 1923 aged 55
http://www.wellington.govt.nz/services/cemeteries/search/search.php

Bye
althea

Not to my knowledge. 

Thank you for the link and Charles William - looks like George's son.  Much appreciated. :D

Cheers
Cando

Edit - I think Florence Emily KELLY, spinster, died 28 Jn 1929 aged 60 could be another one.
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: Thamesite2017 on Friday 23 May 08 09:45 BST (UK)
There are so many George Kelly's sadly
Interesting looking at Papers past adverts a George Kelly was Hallensteins manager wellington 1890's

http://www.rootschat.com/links/03gn/

Charles probate, he is a Police sgt

As they arrived at Otago maybe Papers past have some info for that area

If Florence was born 19/1/1876 she went to Caversham School Dunedin
looks like right family as Charles born 19/6/1867 is there to.
Bye
Althea
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Friday 23 May 08 11:34 BST (UK)
Hi Althea

Thank you - I have also been trawling through Paperspast.

George, being a draper, would certainly be a candidate for the manager's job in the advert.  Thank you.

I don't know whether or not they landed at Otago - the name of the ship was Otaga 

Oh good - some school records.  That's great. Thank you.
Florence was born in 1869 [the only child for whom I don't have a birth cert]  Charles William was born 12 Jun 1867 - written in full on his birth certificate.   

I wonder if I will ever find the names of the five children born in New Zealand....I live in hope....but it is early days :)

I am if wondering George and Emily died in Auckland - I have searched/trawled the online cemetery indexes - they may be buried at Waitakere Cemetery. I have found the office staff to be extremely helpful...may give them a call.

Would have been so much easier if George had been given a 2nd name!

Cheers
Cando
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: Thamesite2017 on Friday 23 May 08 19:42 BST (UK)
Yes middle names are great....

Yes the ship was the Otago and landed Otago area
http://members.iinet.net.au/~perthdps/shipping/mig-nz2.htm#nz2 you can see some voyages

The ship left Melbourne 9 sep 1874
Bye
Althea
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: DotBrennan on Saturday 24 May 08 01:46 BST (UK)
Hi Cando

Following on from the info already provided by Althea…..
These may, or may not, be yours….

Charles William b1867
No marriage for a “Charles William” but there is this which might be him:
1894 Folio Ref: 2470
Charles KELLY
Florence Emily SILBERY

Working backwards:
1893 Electoral Roll:
Charles William KELLY
Constable
O’Rorke St, Auckland

(Fits in with the probate stating he was a Police Sgt).

Karori Cemetery MI
ILMO Charles William KELLY d 28 Feb 1923 a 55yrs.  Deeply mourned,  Florence Emily KELLY d 27 Jun 1929 a 60yrs.

When I first saw this I thought it was brother and sister, but given the above marriage it is probably husband & wife.

If you contact the cemetery, they should be able to tell you who purchased the plot, so hopefully you will find out if it was “Miss” or “Mrs” Kelly.
I have always found them extremely helpful.

Karori Cemetery Office
76 Old Karori Road
Karori
(04) 476 6109
(04) 476 8242
cemeteries@wcc.govt.nz



Florence b1869
1893 Electoral Roll:
Florence KELLY
Domestic Duties
Chapel St, St Alban’s, Ch’ch


Emily Elizabeth b1871
NZ Marriage 1891 Folio Ref: 2473
Emily Elizabeth KELLY
Samuel MacKey McGEE

1893 Electoral Roll:
Emily Elizabeth McGEE
Domestic Duties
143 Cashel St, Linwood, Ch’ch

Samuel MacKay McGEE
Commercial Traveller
143 Cashel St, Linwood, Ch’ch


George Ernest b1873.
No marriages or Electoral Roll entries specifically for “George Ernest”


George & Emily (parents)

1881 Electoral Roll:
These are the only entries for George:
Labourer, Hamilton East
Civil Servant, Bay of Islands
Cook, Dunedin

He may not have qualified to vote.

1893 Electoral Roll:

(Mother & Daughter?? or daughter in law?)
Emily
Fruiterer
Grey St, Auck.

Emily
House Duties
Grey St, Auck.

George:
Draper, St Albans, Ch’ch

There were no entries for a George in Auckland at the same address….
So did Mum & the kids move to Auckland while George stayed in Christchurch with daughter Florence…?


I hope I haven’t confused the issue!


Bren.
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Saturday 24 May 08 11:00 BST (UK)
Thank you so  much for all that information Bren.  I will follow up your suggestions.  You haven't confused the issue.  It is surprising how often information that on first reading you may think is not your family and later proves to be most valuable :)

Florence Emily who died aged 60 in 1829 is listed as a spinster....so it may be Florence b. 1869.  I will contact the cemetery to see if they can help me further.

KELLY    Florence Emily  Aged 60  Occupation Spinster
Buried on 28-06-1929
Cemetery    Karori
Section CH ENG2 Plot# 227 G  Record# 84095.

and Charles William is in
Section   CH ENG2  Plot# 227 G Record# 84094

Searching in NZ is a big learning experience for me...and I am trawling through all the resources listed.

I was hoping when George emigrated he may have stayed put!!!   I was also hoping he died in Auckland seeing that was his address in 1900/1901 and he was aged 60.  He didn't mention his wife in the letters only his nine children.

Thank you once again.

Cheers
Cando
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: Thamesite2017 on Saturday 24 May 08 18:08 BST (UK)
Hi Cando
following a child may lead you back to the father??
I have the Auckland Directory 1894-95 (A Street directory) at present here as by chance and the problem arises more with the name...there are lots of George Kelly's thorughout NZ and 4 in Auckland
George Kelly, Papkura
George Kelly, Parua
George Kelly, Horsebreaker, Opotiki
George F Kelly, May St, Mt Eden

I am swayed to if they are in Auckland the papakura one is them because there is a School entry for a George family of papakura going to a catholic school 1886 ??that could be youngest Geo going ti High school???????

there is a Richard Kelly b 25/10/1881 father George going to Papakura public school

The school records are just making things confusing there are Kelly children who have been at Paeroa, then to Cambridge and then to Auckland..so nothing could be concluded...apart from finding a fellow researcher, marriage certs of the children you know may be only hope to following there whereabouts

Bye
Althea
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Sunday 25 May 08 02:08 BST (UK)
Hi Althea

You are kind spending time researching for me.  I am trying to familiarise myself with the NZ resources........

Wonderful resource Directories :)  I am probably going to make things a tad more difficult.....the KELLY family in Australia are and were Church of England and in Ireland were Church of Ireland in other words they were Protestant Irish.  I should have mentioned this before.  Sorry. 

I am starting to think that our George may have moved around a bit...perhaps because of his employment possibly as a draper.

I agree my only hope is a marriage cert of one of the chn and George Ernest would seem the most likely candidate at this stage.  Oh if only Charles Wm had married.  Just my luck.

Once again thank you.

Cheers
cando

Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Sunday 25 May 08 04:56 BST (UK)
Have just trawled through the passengers on the OTAGO and found a Mrs DANDO aged 50 - I think this may be Emily KELLY's mother.  Now that is a more unusual name than KELLY ;) 

Also found a small snippet in the Otago Witness  detailing the arrival of the Otago at Port Chalmers.  The KELLYs or Mrs DANDO aren't listed as I would assume they are amongst the 33 passengers in steerage.  It did mention however that there were 46 passengers on board for other ports.

Cheers
Cando
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: Thamesite2017 on Sunday 25 May 08 05:05 BST (UK)
Good work Cando  8)
Whats her first name, do you know, then we can see whats available
BYe
Althea
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Sunday 25 May 08 05:22 BST (UK)
According to George KELLY and Emily DANDO's marriage cert in 1870, Emily's parents were James DANDO and Jane REES.

There is a shipping record of Emily and Jane arriving together in Victoria in 1864.  Couldn't see a James DANDO in the records...unless he came out earlier.

Cheers
Cando
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: Thamesite2017 on Sunday 25 May 08 06:10 BST (UK)
A James Dando, gumdigger dies 1920, Whangarei
agency series accession box / item record part alternative no.
AAOM  6029    29209
Archives Wellington

This family is buried at Whangarei
http://www.wdc.govt.nz/customerservice/?lc=cemetery ??Kate as Wife

So sadly nothing Jane that jumps out
Bye
Althea
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Sunday 25 May 08 07:28 BST (UK)
Thank you Althea.  My understanding is there were/are numerous DANDO families in New Zealand and naturally I don't know if there is any connection.  Will keep searching ;D  Perhaps I shall keep to the KELLY lot for the moment.

Cheers
Cando
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: DotBrennan on Monday 26 May 08 09:09 BST (UK)
Hi Cando

I've been thinking would the address on the letter be his employers address, rather than his personal address?

And if so, why use that on a family letter....?


Bren
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Monday 26 May 08 12:01 BST (UK)
You could be right Bren but I have a feeling from the tone of his letter, that he was in business himself. 

After the initial jubilition of within the space of a few hours, finding his shipping record to Australia, his marriage and birth of children, his shipping record to NZ and the death of two of his children, and an electoral roll record, I feel that the 'roll' of discovery may have hit a brick wall and come to what I hope is a temporary halt :(

I will keep searching the resources.  You must find it a tad difficult with no online bdm's.  I was hoping to find the birth of his other five children.

Cheers
Cando
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Tuesday 27 May 08 02:55 BST (UK)
Is is possible for sks to do a lookup for further possible details on the following marriage registration or the intention to marry data.

Emily Elizabeth b1871
NZ Marriage 1891 Folio Ref: 2473
Emily Elizabeth KELLY
Samuel MacKey McGEE

Cheers
Cando
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: Mk2_Zephyr on Tuesday 27 May 08 04:05 BST (UK)
The marriage is after 1880,

You would need the exact date and place for a ITM.   :(
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Wednesday 28 May 08 01:23 BST (UK)
The marriage is after 1880,

You would need the exact date and place for a ITM.   :(

I am new to NZ research and I thank you for taking the time to look at my request and respond.....however I always find it is helpful to expand a little  or post a link for further information. 

I thank Althea and Bren for their wonderful help but have decided to defer any further research for the time being. 

Cheers
cando
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: Thamesite2017 on Wednesday 28 May 08 01:37 BST (UK)
Hi Cando
Sorry you couldn't get too far
For future ref here's the bit on ITM's
http://www.archives.govt.nz/docs/pdfs/Ref_Guide_Pers_Identity.pdf

Its a pity in Nz we can't just browse the certs, but you do often see people place lookups for the ITM's that they are happy to do especially if they are searching for something else
Archives charge $8 to do it, but the wait is horrific

Goodluck, keep asking
Bye
Althea  ;D
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Wednesday 28 May 08 01:53 BST (UK)
Hi Althea

Thank you for the link - have save the .pdf file for future research. 

Cheers for now
Cando

Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: Mk2_Zephyr on Wednesday 28 May 08 02:36 BST (UK)
 :o
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: berar on Sunday 15 June 08 01:04 BST (UK)
If this is any help at all, I can tell you Florence Emily SILBERY is one of mine. She was born in Petone (Near Wellington), NZ on 25 October 1876, and died on 8 May 1914. She eloped at the age of 17 and married Charles KELLY (born 17 Aug 1866). The children that I have recorded are Lillian Maude Kelly (1899), Albert (1903) and Lilly (no date). It is all a bit of a mystery, but my family legend has it that Cardinal Thomas Williams is a descendant, but somehow there is an adoption in there somewhere. I think it may have been a shock when she eloped with a Catholic (her parents being Protestants).
Florence Emily SILBERY was the daughter of Joseph SILBERY and Emily Harriett (JAGGS) who migrated to NZ from London in the 1860s. SILBERY is a very rare name in Britain now (including variants Silberg and Silberry), but thanks to Joseph and his Uncle Jim Silbery, New Zealand is probably the World centre for SILBERYs these days! (Joseph was my g-g-grandfather).
If anyone can shed any light on the above confused story, I would be delighted to hear about it. Meanwhile, I hope this helps someone.

Berar
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: newbe_nz on Saturday 01 November 08 22:45 GMT (UK)
Just wondering if you need anymore help with this family Cando.

Newbe
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Sunday 02 November 08 10:15 GMT (UK)
Thank you Newbe....I have actually put th is branch of my OH's KELLY family on the backburner as I felt I had progressed as far as possible.  I would be marvellous if I could find George's c.1840 death...perhaps one day.  Newbe I do thank you for the extra work you have done for me...searching for deaths and photos of the MAGEE graves.  You help is appreciated. :)

My apologies to berar...I did not see your post.  I think we have eliminated the SILBERY's from the KELLY family that I am researching.  Thank you however, for your input and good luck with your research.

Cheers for now
Cando
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: newbe_nz on Sunday 02 November 08 19:33 GMT (UK)
Your welcome,  If there is anything else we can do let us know.  We are only too glad to help.

Newbe
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: knebworth on Friday 23 April 10 16:46 BST (UK)
Hi Cando,   A friend has asked me to help her with her family research her grandparents were Emily Elizabeth Kelly and Samuel Mackey McGee.   Are you still researching this family ?    Regards Knebworth.
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: cando on Tuesday 27 April 10 23:37 BST (UK)
Hi Knebworth :)

Welcome to rootschat.

Yes I am still researching this family.   Emily is my OH's 2nd cousin, twice removed.  Her father George, emigrated to Australia from Ireland in 1856, married in Victoria and arrived in New Zealand in 1874.  Emily was born in Geelong Vic - one of ten children born to George KELLY and Emily DANDO.  I have progressed quite well with my research in NZ.  Any information I have on the family thereon is available in the public records in NZ ie bdm's etc. 

You need to make two more posts and then you will be able to send me a pm [personal message] and if you wish we can communicate by email.

Cheers ;D
Cando
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900
Post by: knebworth on Wednesday 28 April 10 20:34 BST (UK)
Hi Cando,    Its wonderful to hear from you.My friend would like to make contact with you at some stage.Have you done much research into the Dando family as well ? Regards knebworth.
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900 - COMPLETED
Post by: cando on Thursday 29 April 10 01:12 BST (UK)
I have researched the DANDO family in Wales. 

I will pm my email address so your friend can contact me directly.

Cheers and thank you.
Cando
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900 - COMPLETED
Post by: kellydando on Wednesday 21 March 12 07:37 GMT (UK)
I am GDaughter of George Kelly's youngest daughter.
Does anyone still want info on George Kelly and his family?
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900 - COMPLETED
Post by: cando on Wednesday 21 March 12 23:11 GMT (UK)
Hi kellydando :)

Welcome to rootschat

George KELLY born 1840 Banaghor, Kings County, Ireland 1920 died St John's Hill, NZ  is my OH's 1st cousin three times removed.

George's father John KELLY b. 1804 Sussex, England and my OH's gggrandfather, Henry George KELLY b. 1808 Hampshire, England died 1896 Kilkerran, South Australia were brothers.  Their father John KELLY b. 1780 possibly Galway, Ireland died Dublin 1824.  According to records at Kew, John was in the Galway Militia, Rifle Corps and 77th Regiment.  I have a photo of John's wife, Harriet's headstone at Mt Jerome Cemetery, Dublin.

If my research is correct you must be the grand daughter of Mabel Jane KELLY 1884-1944 who married Keith Robert McISAAC in 1918  ;D.

I have progressed considerably with my research in NZ thanks to the number of records that have come online since I started researching the KELLY/DANDO family in New Zealand.

If you make two more posts we can use the Personal Message system to exchange emails, ie of you wish.

Cheers
Cando

Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900 - COMPLETED
Post by: kellydando on Wednesday 21 March 12 23:27 GMT (UK)
Yes. That would be great. I am in contact with Sidney Kelly's Granddaughter.
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900 - COMPLETED
Post by: cando on Thursday 22 March 12 00:51 GMT (UK)
If you look at the top of the pate you will see....

Welcome back, kellydando, you have 1 messages, 1 are new.
Show unread posts since last visit.
Show new replies to your posts.

If you click on [at the top of the page] 1 new message a new window will open with my message with my email address.

Cheers
Cando
Title: Re: George KELLY in Auckland in 1900 - COMPLETED
Post by: cando on Thursday 22 March 12 00:52 GMT (UK)
Oops meant page not pate. :-[

Cheers
Cando