RootsChat.Com
General => The Common Room => Topic started by: kerryb on Sunday 20 April 08 09:20 BST (UK)
-
Hi
I have a John Payne who according to his death certificate died in 1890 at Lingfield Workhouse. Last week when I looked at the Lingfield parish registers I had a quick look at burials in 1890 to see if I could find where his grave was. He wasn't in the parish register!
Where would someone be buried if they died in a Workhouse? Would it be somewhere different from the rest of the population and why?
Kerry
-
Hi Kerry
My gg grandfather died in Steyning Union workhouse in 1885 and was buried in St Peter's Upper Beeding. You will know those places. I do not! He was born in Upper Beeding. Does that help?
Thelma
-
Hi Thelma
Sounds like your man was sent back to whence he came! :) That doesn't really help with mine because he was born and bred and died in the same town or at least I presume the workhouse is the same town. I don't actually know whereabout it was. That's given me somethng to think about.
Kerry :)
-
I think he will be in the local cemetery - probably in a pauper's grave shared with several others. That is what happned to my ancestor who died in the workhouse.
Andrea
-
Hi Kerry
Yes, I have found that, generally, persons were returned to the parish which is responsible for them for burial. If the admission registers survive, they will give parish of residence at admittance which can be helpful. Also, as time went on, people were often buried in the nearest main local council cemetery for the area.
Casalguidi :)
-
Would the workhouse have held burial registers and that would explain why he was not in the parish church burial register?
Kerry
-
If the death was close to a census year, have you checked the census to see if he was an inmate of the workhouse?
Just because a person died in the workhouse, does not necessarily mean he was an inmate. The workhouse often provided the only hospital care, so many people died there who were not residents, these people were more likely to be buried in their parish.
Jebber
-
Hi Jebber
Unfortunately not, its a few months before the census of 1891. However I suspect you could be right and he went in for hospital care, it says he died of senile decay (chronic valv dis heart) and he was 83 years old.
Kerry
-
Would the workhouse have held burial registers
Not generally, no, though they may have other surviving records which could list something ie. death registers, minutes etc.. Take at look at http://www.workhouses.org.uk/ to see what might be available - possibly the East Grinstead Union.
Casalguidi
-
If he suffered senile decay, then I would suggest it was definitely a case of hospital care, a couple of mine died in the workhouse for that very reason. It is a hard enough condition to cope with today with our so called NHS, it must have been so much worse in those days.
Jebber
-
Hi Kerry,
I have just found out (Friday) at Surrey FHC, that "my" infant Paris Bradshawe for whom I have the death certificate from the workhouse, was buried the following day at St. James Weybridge 1841.
I have previously spoken to the Vicar there and he has no record of the burial although he has others at his church, so I presume the paupers graves are not marked and only exist on the parish burials, which makes no sense. The burial seemed very soon after death :o
I was lucky because it appeared in the parish burials, including age of 4 months, it states 1 year on his death certificate.
You may be lucky because yours is 1890, Chertsey Union Workhouse records are complete by then with admissions and discharge dates (not before though!) so Lingfield may be the same ;D where was Lingfield Workhouse ???
Good Luck
Crystal :D
-
If he suffered senile decay, then I would suggest it was definitely a case of hospital care, a couple of mine died in the workhouse for that very reason. It is a hard enough condition to cope with today with our so called NHS, it must have been so much worse in those days.
Jebber
When I first received the certificate I wondered why his family had deserted him and put in the workhouse till I stopped and thought. It must have been a terrible illness to have had to deal with in those days. :-\
Kerry
-
Hi Kerry,
I have just found out (Friday) at Surrey FHC, that "my" infant Paris Bradshawe for whom I have the death certificate from the workhouse, was buried the following day at St. James Weybridge 1841.
I have previously spoken to the Vicar there and he has no record of the burial although he has others at his church, so I presume the paupers graves are not marked and only exist on the parish burials, which makes no sense. The burial seemed very soon after death :o
I was lucky because it appeared in the parish burials, including age of 4 months, it states 1 year on his death certificate.
You may be lucky because yours is 1890, Chertsey Union Workhouse records are complete by then with admissions and discharge dates (not before though!) so Lingfield may be the same ;D where was Lingfield Workhouse ???
Good Luck
Crystal :D
Hi Crystal
I'm not sure where the workhouse was, I am going to have check it out!
Mind you as the sun is coming out I may be called out to the garden today ;D
Kerry
-
I think he will be in the local cemetery - probably in a pauper's grave shared with several others. That is what happned to my ancestor who died in the workhouse.
Andrea
... and as happened with my gr-gr-grandfather in 1870. He died in the Paddington Workhouse and was buried in a mass grave at the Old Paddington (Municipal) Cemetery. The family story is that he was suffering some form of dementia, so perhaps he was in the workhouse's infirmary.
His family lived nearby and were not paupers. I don't really understand why they didn't bury him in his own grave — his wife died six years later and the eldest son arranged for her burial in her own plot with a gravestone etc in the same cemetery.
I learned all this from the cemetery records still held by the local council.
Cheers
Koromo
:)
-
HI Kerry and all
Would the workhouse have held burial registers
I have transcribed some Workhouse records for Northampton and Wellingborough.
Here is what information they gave. May help others here also. :)
No: Day: Mon: Year: Surname: Name: Age: From Parish: Where Buried.
Examples below
14 Jan 1873
Drage Mary Ann 3 months (Mother from Bozeat)-Wellingborough
7 May 1888
Macdonald Lewis Keith 5 months (Mother from Rushden)-Wellingborough
19 17 Mar 1868
Travis George (alias Jn Hy Wilson) 26 Admitted as a Vagrant-Wellingborough Cemetery
33 5 Oct 1868
Johnson Ruth 82 Easton Mauditt-Yardley
5 Mar 1877
Leach Elizabeth 70 Gt Doddington-Wollaston
16 Oct 1913
Roberts Joseph 73 Wellingborough -To Cambridge School of Anatomy
Sandy
-
Thanks Seahall
I'll check out what records they have
Kerry
-
Hi everyone,
Ive just read this thread and was thinking to myself that at this period in time, wasnt it popular thinking among the people that if anyone was senile, or a bit ''loopy'' (for want of a better word), families just had nothing more to do with them??? Kind of like that person dropped that families social status or something??
Wouldnt that answer why families didnt bury certain members in their own graves but did others?? Such as the situation posted by Koromo???
-
Katrina
I think you are right and that is why poor John ended his days in a workhouse when his family could easily have looked after him. They either couldn't cope or didn't want a loopy old man with them. :-\
Kerry
-
Its an awful thought, but then again, i suppose you have to think how the victorians thought... and put your mind back to how people lived then...
Big families, loads of children, social status being all important to well off families..
I never liked the Victorian period much....
-
I think we may be judging them a bit harshly. Very often they simply did not have the money to keep an extra family member who could not contribute.
Andrea
-
I have transcribed some Workhouse records for Northampton and Wellingborough.
Seahall
Are these records easily available? I have some ancestors who were Wellingborough and possibly Kettering Workhouse inmates from around 1837 and would love to see what information they might have about the family. I'm also happy to do some transcribing if needed, provided that is possible from half a world away.
Jojosam
-
Hi Jojosam
A lot of Record Offices ( Northamptonshire in our case) would have the ones that survived.
I could see if any of yours are mentioned if you wish.
Sandy
-
Thank you Sandy for your info and your kind offer. I'm sending you a pm about it.
Jojosam
-
Hi,
My great-great grandfather died in the Sheffield Workhouse - I suspect he went in for hospital care. I looked everywhere for his burial place, but then contacted the Sheffield Indexers (thanks to some advice from a fellow rootschatter) and they immeditely suggested Burngreave Cemetery - which was the nearest large public cemetery to the workhouse. The Friends of Burngreave kindly located his grave and emailed me a photo - it is unmarked, but they lay a wreath on the spot to mark it's place.
So, contacting someone with local knowledge certainly proved helpful - perhaps the local family history society might be able to help, if the local archives cannot.
Anyway, I wish you luck.
Kind regards,
Paulene :)