oops i think i may have ALice wrong, if she was b. 1869 and not 1871 as i though then shes most likely to be the servant in Corydon in 1891 and i think she appears as a servant in 1901 too?? hang on will go back and get refs
Was Agatha really 28 in 1901 :-\
On the 1881, RG11/1059 Folio 65 Page 3, Lingfield.Thanks Gadget
Alice Steer, aged 16, and parents, William and Annie, and younger sister Agatha, aged 8
Gadget
Spencer Payne born 1874, also Bricklayer and married Amy Jane Nash in 1896, Brighton, Sussex, 1881 Lingfield with parents,
Kerry
Here it is:You beat me to it, I was comparing with other 2s on the page.
John Payne born 1878, Lingfield, married Florence Agnes Nash in 1899, Godstone, Surrey, 1881 Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield with parents
Is this anyone we need?Hi Hepburn
John Payne marriage to Jane Smart Carver in east Grinstead 1881....2b 219..
kerry,Hi Hepburn
can you give me someone to look for,I'm no good at digesting all the info,my brain gets muddled ;D ;D
Hi Sue
Have you got Spencer in 1901 in Brighton Kerry?
Sue
That Jane Payne (b. 1881) seems to have disappeared, Kerry :( I haven't checked for deaths for her fully yet.She's on the 1891 and then seems to disappear after marrying James Chadwick, I had a brief look this afternoon and can't find either of them on the 1901. Couldn't see them on A* deaths either. Did they die, was their name mistranscribed, did they emigrate? Hmmm
Anyone like to check for these :-\
Gadget
Back to STEER for a moment. I fall all over them in the parish register films I have on perm loan at my FHC. Don't recall if Egham, Surrey, Westerham, Kent, or Feltham, Middx, or any combo thereof, but you mentioned Surrey, so....Thanks badger
Don't know when I can get back to FHC, but let me know if you want anything in particular looked up in those places.
Also, St George Hanover Square was not filmed by LDS, but there is a book of marriages that can be accessed on Google Books. Births were not done as a book. All the parish's records are held at the Westminster Archives.
You guys are awesome! Good luck on this hunt, Kerry!
That Jane Payne (b. 1881) seems to have disappeared, Kerry :( I haven't checked for deaths for her fully yet.She's on the 1891 and then seems to disappear after marrying James Chadwick, I had a brief look this afternoon and can't find either of them on the 1901. Couldn't see them on A* deaths either. Did they die, was their name mistranscribed, did they emigrate? Hmmm
Anyone like to check for these :-\
Gadget
Kerry
In 1891 Alice Payne b 1869 Lingfield is in Croyden working as a servant.marriage
RG12, P 593, Folio 40, Page 76
And in 1901 there are 2 Alices b 1869 Lingfield
One is married to an Edward Avery living in St Pancras London
and one with Walter Gardner living in Rickmansworth Hertfordshire
and one with Walter Gardner living in Rickmansworth Hertfordshire
also
SKINNER Jennie Payne East Grinstead.2b 305 2 1917
THORPE Jennie Payne Brighton.2b 576 1 1918
When you get bored of that generation
George Payne born 1838 in Lingfield, appears on 1841, Lingfield, 1851, Lingfield, 1861 Lingfield, 1871, Lingfield, Ag Lab.
Is this of any use? 1825 birth of Caroline STEER in Westham.
My gran’s letters written in the 1930s to grandad (whilst courting) mention some relatives that I would love to fit into the tree. I think because of the names they are her maternal relatives, seem to fit the pattern of names but it would be interesting to see if we can fill in the details for 2 generations of the Payne family with missing census returns and spouses, children etc.
The relatives that are mentioned are Uncle Maurice, = Maurice Payne Auntie Maggie, Auntie Jennie,= possibly Jennie Skinner or Jennie Thorpe ? Cousin Alice, Cousin Winnie and an Olive. - Winnie & Olive possible births given these need following up on the census There is also an Uncle Arthur. The letters are written from Warwick and Uncle Maurice worked at the Morris Car works in Coventry.
Gran’s mother was Emily Payne born 1883 in Lingfield, Surrey and died 1950 in Lingfield.
Her siblings were:
Henry Payne born 1867, Lingfield, married Alice Steer in 1891, East Grinstead and was a bricklayer, 1871 Lingfield, with parents, 1881 Lingfield with parents
Alice Payne born 1869, Lingfield, 1871 Lingfield with parents, 1881 Lingfield with parents Sue found in 1891,1901 and her death also
Martha Payne born 1871, I was told she might have died 1893? 1871 Lingfield with parents, 1881, Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield as housemaid, domestic death confirmedSpencer Payne born 1874, also Bricklayer and married Amy Jane Nash in 1896, Brighton, Sussex, 1881 Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield was bricklayer labourer found in 1901 in brighton
Clara Payne born 1876, Lingfield, 1881 Lingfield with parents found in 1891 & marriage John Payne born 1878, Lingfield, married Florence Agnes Nash in 1899, Godstone, Surrey, 1881 Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield with parents found in 1901
Jane Payne born 1881, Lingfield, 1881 Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield with parents found marriage to .... (can't remember) Chadwick then she dissappearsEmily (great grandmother) for which I have details
Alfred Payne born 1887 Grocer and Baker, 1891 Lingfield with parents, 1901 Lingfield with parents
Maurice Payne born 1890, Lingfield, did he move to Coventry area?, 1891 Lingfield with parents, 1901 Lingfield with parents, i think we are waiting for the 1911 census for various reasonsFrank Payne born 1894, Lingfield, 1901 Lingfield with parents
Parents were John 1844 to 1925 and Jane Payne, 1847 to 1930 both in Lingfield.
So did any of this lot move away to Warwick and can we fill in some of the missing details for them? I have not actually confirmed any of their dates of birth, all come from census returns. Some of the other details might be a bit difficult because we don’t access
to 1911 yet but I am sure that some information can be found.
When you get bored of that generation the previous generation were:
Elizabeth Payne born 1836 in Lingfield, appears on 1841 census in Lingfield
George Payne born 1838 in Lingfield, appears on 1841, Lingfield, 1851, Lingfield, 1861 Lingfield, 1871, Lingfield, Ag Lab. found in 1881
Sarah Payne born 1841 in Lingfield, appears on 1851, Lingfield
Emma Payne born 1849 in Lingfield, appears on 1851, Lingfield and 1861, Lingfield
John Payne born 1884 as above and I have details for him.
Parents were:
John Payne born 1807, Lingfield, died 1890 and Sarah Kesterton 1810 to 1877, Lingfield.
George in 1881
RG11 1059 4 2
4 Martins Place Lingfield
William Agent head wid 75 labourer (all born Lingfield)
George Payne son in law mar 42 labourer
Harriet wife 33
Elizabeth M dau 2
Emily S dau 11 months
james Wood lodger unm. 19 (or 49 :-\ ) bricklayers lab.
next door but one at number 2 live the Steer family
Kerry working on the names in the letters you have Uncle Maurice and Aunt Mggie so was Maggioe hsi wife?The Coventry one might be a hopeful as that is where they were supposed to be except that maybe she was a generation too old to be a cousin of my grans. Might be worth looking at further though.
also cousin Winnie
now i found these
births
PAYNE Winifred East Grinstead.2b 146 Q3 1883
PAYNE Winifred Coventry.6d 514 Q4 1893
PAYNE Winifred Agnes East Grinstead.2b 143 Q4 1901 - she just missed the 1901 census
PAYNE Winifred E mmn. Cuthbert Coventry.6d 1158 Q3 1917
(CUTHBERT Maud I & Harry Payne married West Ham.4a 69 Q1 1914)
PAYNE Winifred Emily Brighton.2b 234 Q1 1906
PAYNE Winifred Margaret Guildford.2a 93 Q1 1896
what do you think?
In 1891 Alice Payne b 1869 Lingfield is in Croyden working as a servant.Hi Sue
RG12, P 593, Folio 40, Page 76
And in 1901 there are 2 Alices b 1869 Lingfield
One is married to an Edward Avery living in St Pancras London
and one with Walter Gardner living in Rickmansworth Hertfordshire
Dont know what you think of these Kerry
Sue
alsoArrr now the Olive in Coventry 1911 looks really possible, that's the same age as my gran.
PAYNE Olive East Grinstead.2b 154 1 1884
PAYNE Olive Coventry.6d 566 1 1911
PAYNE Olive G mmn. Orr Guildford.2a 113 1 1919
PAYNE Olive M Nicholds ? 1259 2 1914
PAYNE Olive Mary Coventry.6d 547 3 1908
and
SKINNER Jennie Payne East Grinstead.2b 305 2 1917
THORPE Jennie Payne Brighton.2b 576 1 1918
Brilliant!and one with Walter Gardner living in Rickmansworth Hertfordshire
bingo you found her Sue
Dec 1895
Gardner Walter Watford 3a 930
Meacham George Watford 3a 930
Milton Fanny Ellen Watford 3a 930
Payne Alice Watford 3a 930
Alice Gardner age 32 b LingfieldThanks Sue
Walter Gardner age 31 b Chorley Wood Herts occ brickmaker
RG13, Piece 1322, Folio 31 Page 2
Sue
Oh, success!Thanks Badger
the bits i have added are in purpleThank you Toni
My gran’s letters written in the 1930s to grandad (whilst courting) mention some relatives that I would love to fit into the tree. I think because of the names they are her maternal relatives, seem to fit the pattern of names but it would be interesting to see if we can fill in the details for 2 generations of the Payne family with missing census returns and spouses, children etc.
The relatives that are mentioned are Uncle Maurice, = Maurice Payne Auntie Maggie, Auntie Jennie,= possibly Jennie Skinner or Jennie Thorpe ? Cousin Alice, Cousin Winnie and an Olive. - Winnie & Olive possible births given these need following up on the census There is also an Uncle Arthur. The letters are written from Warwick and Uncle Maurice worked at the Morris Car works in Coventry.
Gran’s mother was Emily Payne born 1883 in Lingfield, Surrey and died 1950 in Lingfield.
Her siblings were:
Henry Payne born 1867, Lingfield, married Alice Steer in 1891, East Grinstead and was a bricklayer, 1871 Lingfield, with parents, 1881 Lingfield with parents
Alice Payne born 1869, Lingfield, 1871 Lingfield with parents, 1881 Lingfield with parents Sue found in 1891,1901 and her death also
Martha Payne born 1871, I was told she might have died 1893? 1871 Lingfield with parents, 1881, Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield as housemaid, domestic death confirmedSpencer Payne born 1874, also Bricklayer and married Amy Jane Nash in 1896, Brighton, Sussex, 1881 Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield was bricklayer labourer found in 1901 in brighton
Clara Payne born 1876, Lingfield, 1881 Lingfield with parents found in 1891 & marriage John Payne born 1878, Lingfield, married Florence Agnes Nash in 1899, Godstone, Surrey, 1881 Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield with parents found in 1901
Jane Payne born 1881, Lingfield, 1881 Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield with parents found marriage to .... (can't remember) Chadwick then she dissappearsEmily (great grandmother) for which I have details
Alfred Payne born 1887 Grocer and Baker, 1891 Lingfield with parents, 1901 Lingfield with parents
Maurice Payne born 1890, Lingfield, did he move to Coventry area?, 1891 Lingfield with parents, 1901 Lingfield with parents, i think we are waiting for the 1911 census for various reasonsFrank Payne born 1894, Lingfield, 1901 Lingfield with parents
Parents were John 1844 to 1925 and Jane Payne, 1847 to 1930 both in Lingfield.
So did any of this lot move away to Warwick and can we fill in some of the missing details for them? I have not actually confirmed any of their dates of birth, all come from census returns. Some of the other details might be a bit difficult because we don’t access
to 1911 yet but I am sure that some information can be found.
When you get bored of that generation the previous generation were:
Elizabeth Payne born 1836 in Lingfield, appears on 1841 census in Lingfield
George Payne born 1838 in Lingfield, appears on 1841, Lingfield, 1851, Lingfield, 1861 Lingfield, 1871, Lingfield, Ag Lab. found in 1881
Sarah Payne born 1841 in Lingfield, appears on 1851, Lingfield
Emma Payne born 1849 in Lingfield, appears on 1851, Lingfield and 1861, Lingfield
John Payne born 1884 as above and I have details for him.
Parents were:
John Payne born 1807, Lingfield, died 1890 and Sarah Kesterton 1810 to 1877, Lingfield.
okay i think thats what we have done so far but please remember this is Kerrys hunt not mine!
OK I've found Elizabeth Payne b 1836 as follows:-Thanks Genie
1851, as Sue says, HO 107/1592/92/23 with the Edwards family.
1858 she got married to William Reynolds - FreeBMD (Jun,1858,E.Grinstead,2b,155).
1861 RG9/579/177/14.
1871 RG10/1058/30/55.
1881 RG11/1057/43/10.
1891 RG12/788/66/11.
1901 RG13/904/114/31.
I hope I'm not repeating what others have found ;D
Genie
Hi
looked on complete marriage index.
seems like Jennie Thorpe married Frederick C Payne
Brighton Sussex
vol 2b p 576
I cannot find Jennie Skinner ... will look using complete index again.
I am not sure what I am looking for , just give me directions as I am a bit lost ...
deb ;D
Arrr now the Olive in Coventry 1911 looks really possible, that's the same age as my gran.
Kerry
Arrr now the Olive in Coventry 1911 looks really possible, that's the same age as my gran.My thoughts entirely Toni
Kerry
Kerry
unless you get the cert will have to wait for the 1911 census ::)
1881 Emma Reynolds 20 niece shoe manufacturers assistant b. lingfield
1881 Emma Reynolds 20 niece shoe manufacturers assistant b. lingfield
hmm wonder who she belongs to, just looking
Well done Toni, don't you love it when they are with relatives! ;D
Kerry
the bits i have added are in purpleJust thought I would bring Toni's summary forward again with some more additions. I may have missed some. ::)
My gran’s letters written in the 1930s to grandad (whilst courting) mention some relatives that I would love to fit into the tree. I think because of the names they are her maternal relatives, seem to fit the pattern of names but it would be interesting to see if we can fill in the details for 2 generations of the Payne family with missing census returns and spouses, children etc.
The relatives that are mentioned are Uncle Maurice, = Maurice Payne Auntie Maggie, Auntie Jennie,= possibly Jennie Skinner or Jennie Thorpe ? Cousin Alice, Cousin Winnie and an Olive. - Winnie & Olive possible births given these need following up on the census There is also an Uncle Arthur. The letters are written from Warwick and Uncle Maurice worked at the Morris Car works in Coventry.
Gran’s mother was Emily Payne born 1883 in Lingfield, Surrey and died 1950 in Lingfield.
Her siblings were:
Henry Payne born 1867, Lingfield, married Alice Steer in 1891, East Grinstead and was a bricklayer, 1871 Lingfield, with parents, 1881 Lingfield with parents1891 Lingfield with inlaws, 1891 in Brighton
Alice Payne born 1869, Lingfield, 1871 Lingfield with parents, 1881 Lingfield with parents Sue found in 1891,1901 and her death also
Martha Payne born 1871, I was told she might have died 1893? 1871 Lingfield with parents, 1881, Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield as housemaid, domestic death confirmedSpencer Payne born 1874, also Bricklayer and married Amy Jane Nash in 1896, Brighton, Sussex, 1881 Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield was bricklayer labourer found in 1901 in brighton
Clara Payne born 1876, Lingfield, 1881 Lingfield with parents found in 1891 & marriage John Payne born 1878, Lingfield, married Florence Agnes Nash in 1899, Godstone, Surrey, 1881 Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield with parents found in 1901
Jane Payne born 1881, Lingfield, 1881 Lingfield with parents, 1891 Lingfield with parents found marriage to .... (can't remember) Chadwick then she dissappearsEmily (great grandmother) for which I have details
Alfred Payne born 1887 Grocer and Baker, 1891 Lingfield with parents, 1901 Lingfield with parents
Maurice Payne born 1890, Lingfield, did he move to Coventry area?, 1891 Lingfield with parents, 1901 Lingfield with parents, i think we are waiting for the 1911 census for various reasonsFrank Payne born 1894, Lingfield, 1901 Lingfield with parents
Parents were John 1844 to 1925 and Jane Payne, 1847 to 1930 both in Lingfield.
So did any of this lot move away to Warwick and can we fill in some of the missing details for them? I have not actually confirmed any of their dates of birth, all come from census returns. Some of the other details might be a bit difficult because we don’t access
to 1911 yet but I am sure that some information can be found.
When you get bored of that generation the previous generation were:
Elizabeth Payne born 1836 in Lingfield, appears on 1841 census in Lingfield married William reynolds found on 1871, 81, 91 and 1901
George Payne born 1838 in Lingfield, appears on 1841, Lingfield, 1851, Lingfield, 1861 Lingfield, 1871, Lingfield, Ag Lab. found in 1881
Sarah Payne born 1841 in Lingfield, appears on 1851, Lingfield
Emma Payne born 1849 in Lingfield, appears on 1851, Lingfield and 1861, Lingfield found on 1871 and married Thomas Potter
John Payne born 1884 as above and I have details for him.
Parents were:
John Payne born 1807, Lingfield, died 1890 and Sarah Kesterton 1810 to 1877, Lingfield.
okay i think thats what we have done so far but please remember this is Kerrys hunt not mine!
Kerry do you already have Elizabeth Payne & William Reynolds on the census ?Hi Toni
i note you don't have her in 1861
deleted having a blonde moment!
Hi Kerry,Thanks Sue
Did you have Henry in 1891 that i posted earlier?
Sue
Elizabeth Payne & William Reynolds in
1881
RG11 1057 43 10
(children Alice 14 Elizabeth 17 Evelyn 9 William 19)
where is Ada ?
marriage
Q1 1894 East Grinstead.2b 234
PARSONS Emily
REYNOLDS Evelyn Edith
WATERS Charles
WORSELL George
Marriages Q2 1886 E Grinstead 2b 209
COMBER Elizabeth
Reynolds William Transon
2 people missing - looking for them!
Could this be Sarah b 1841 in 1901 census Kerry? She is in Hampstead London
She is working as a servant age 60 but i cant find her in any earlier census.
RG13/121/109/39
Sue
Frank's is dodgy as if he was born 1894 would only be 7 ?
but I am going by area only
Good work Toni, try as i did i couldnt find Sarah before 1901 :) :)
wonder why she never married. Did you find her death?
Sue
George Payne born 1838 in Lingfield, appears on 1841, Lingfield, 1851, Lingfield, 1861 Lingfield, 1871, Lingfield, Ag Lab. found in 1881 - RG11 1059 4 2 - Lingfield with wife Harriet (Agent) married 1878
[
found some marriages
Alfred Payne married 1906 2Q Guildford Surrey
either Mary Ann Peters or Lilllie Theodora Ellis
2a 166
Frank Payne married 1901 2Q East Grimstead Surrey
Minnie Bates or Margaret Fermor
2b 321
Frank's is dodgy as if he was born 1894 would only be 7 ?
but I am going by area only
Hi toni
George Payne born 1838 in Lingfield, appears on 1841, Lingfield, 1851, Lingfield, 1861 Lingfield, 1871, Lingfield, Ag Lab. found in 1881 - RG11 1059 4 2 - Lingfield with wife Harriet (Agent) married 1878
[
looking for Georges death
PAYNE George 75 East Grinstead.2b 84 4 1895
PAYNE George Spencer 42 East Grinstead.2b 83 3 1892
what do you think ?
can anyone get the sussex county football league home page up?
Parents were:
John Payne born 1807, Lingfield, died 1890 and Sarah Kesterton 1810 to 1877, Lingfield.
If you get really desperate, Kerry, I have lots of 17th century Paynes from the middle of Salisbury Plain ::)Hi Gadget
Seriously - it's a very 'common name' I was lucky because they all had seriously rare Old Testament names.
Gadget
Kerry i cant see george in 1901 and looked for a death in the interim those were the only two in east grinstead (reg district)Hi Toni
i think George SPencer belongs to you als as Spencer was a given name in your family a couple fo times in fact i think Spencer had a son Spencer George (confused yet?)
okay ...now I am seriously lost ... so If anything is needed let me know ... I think I will stick to your Traies side Kerry ...LOLHi Deb
deb :-\ :-X
All done on these two thanks Toni, back two more generations with the Paynes to East Grinstead, the Kestertons, though a rare name are a little bit more diffiicult, I am at work this morning so can't remember exactly but I've got Sarah's parents, father died fairly young, mother lived next door. I think we have their parents too but unfortunately they came from Edenbridge, Kent which is more difficult to get records on and I cannot bear the thought of a trip to the record offices in Maidstone, have you ever been to Maidstone?? Don't.
Parents were:
John Payne born 1807, Lingfield, died 1890 and Sarah Kesterton 1810 to 1877, Lingfield.
do you need anything on these two?
okay ..this is my little contribution ... I am posted these just in case there are connections to kerry's family ...rather have more than less, I say ;DHi Deb
national archives; Payne's fron LINGFIELD
Online Document PROB 11/1801
Will of Faithfull Payne Farmer Lingfield, Surrey . Will of Faithfull Payne Farmer Lingfield, Surrey
Date: 1832.
Online Document ADM 188/944
Name Payne William Spencer K38966 Lingfield, Surrey . Name Payne William Spencer K38966 Lingfield, Surrey
Date: 1893
Online Document PROB 11/2119
Will of Richard Payne Laborer Lingfield , Surrey . Will of Richard Payne Laborer Lingfield , Surrey
Date: 1850.
Online Document PROB 11/2021
Will of Sarah Payne Widow Lingfield , Surrey . Will of Sarah Payne Widow Lingfield , Surrey
Date: 1845
is East grinstead in surrey or Sussex?
deb
Online Document ADM 188/944
Name Payne William Spencer K38966 Lingfield, Surrey . Name Payne William Spencer K38966 Lingfield, Surrey
Date: 1893
is East grinstead in surrey or Sussex?
deb
Morning Kerry ;DHi Gadget
Origin of Payne - I haven't checked it out but i was always told it was either derived from peasant or pagan.
Gadget 8)
Hi Kerry i am at work too! ;DHi Toni
who do you want us to concentrate on? the children on the siblings? of who the siblings married
you've made it all much easier to read. :D :D
Barbara
Hi Toni
PHew did you get any work done? ;D
Kerry
you've made it all much easier to read. :D :D
Barbara
do you think ? its still quite confusing over the Reynolds children and also Spencer Paynes children.
i dont know if i missed any and i didnt put census references for all i wasnt going to put any but then i did!Hi Toni
PHew did you get any work done? ;D
Kerry
not much! 2 letters 2 quotes, better crack on i s'pos
Henry Payne born 1867, Lingfield, ( Q1 1866 2b 129 or Q3 1866 2b 113 East GRinstead)
1871 Lingfield with parents
1881 Lingfield with parents (1881 Alice Steer Lingfield with parents)
married Alice Steer in 1891, East Grinstead and was a bricklayer,
1891 Lingfield with the Steer family
1901 65 Buckingham Place Brighton (with wife Alice, children Elise 9 Violet 3 and sister in-law Agatha)
Henry Payne born 1867, Lingfield, ( Q1 1866 2b 129 or Q3 1866 2b 113 East GRinstead)
1871 Lingfield with parents
1881 Lingfield with parents (1881 Alice Steer Lingfield with parents)
married Alice Steer in 1891, East Grinstead and was a bricklayer,
1891 Lingfield with the Steer family
1901 65 Buckingham Place Brighton (with wife Alice, children Elise 9 Violet 3 and sister in-law Agatha)
birth
PAYNE Elsie Adelaide East Grinstead.2b 149 Q3 1891
PAYNE Violet Brighton.2b 230 Q1 1898
or
PAYNE Violet May Godstone.2a 206 Q1 1898
in 1901 Violet is listed as being born godstone so i think it will be the latter
Clara Payne born 1876, Lingfield, (birth PAYNE Clara East Grinstead.2b 127 Q4 1875 )
1881 Lingfield with parents
1891 living in Litchfield, servant (isn’t Litchfield Staffs?) is this def. ‘our’ Clara?
1898 married George Wood , Godstone 2b 411
1901 living in Godstone son Kenneth age 1
1
John Payne born 1878, Lingfield,
1881 Lingfield with parents,
1891 Lingfield with parents
married Florence Agnes Nash in 1899, Godstone, Surrey,
1901 6 Lavinia Road Croydon as Head but with wifes sister and Thomas Nash visitor widower pensioned constable (who was Thomas Nash?)
Hi ToniRight here we go!
PHew did you get any work done? ;D
I will have a closer look tonight and add the older stuff when I am home.
Kerry
Part 2Hi Toni
John b. 1844 siblings were
Elizabeth Payne born 1836 in Lingfield
1841 census in Lingfield
1851, as Sue says, HO 107/1592/92/23 with the Edwards family.(servant)
1858 she got married to William Reynolds - FreeBMD (Jun,1858,E.Grinstead,2b,155).
1861 RG9/579/177/14.
1871 RG10/1058/30/55. Glen Vue Road East Grinstead (children William S or J 9 scholar Emma 11 Elizabeth 7 .Alice 4 .Ada 1 )
Death REYNOLDS Ada age 4 East Grinstead.2b 87 Q1 1874
1881 RG11/1057/43/10. (children Alice 14 Elizabeth 17 Evelyn 9 William 19)
1891 RG12/788/66/11. (children Elizabeth 27 Eveline 19 )
1901 RG13/904/114/31. no children with them)
Death REYNOLDS William age 67 East Grinstead.2b 98 Q1 1903
Childrens births :
Q21861 Reynolds William Franson 2b 109
Q41866 REYNOLDS Alice 2b 126 (Alice in 1891 servant for the William family RG12 469 30 51)
Q21869 Reynolds Ada 2b 130
Q41863 REYNOLDS Elizabeth 2b 115
Q3 1871 Reynolds Evelyn Edith 2b 127
Q21859 REYNOLDS Emma 2b 105
MARRIAGE Q1 1894 East Grinstead.2b 234
REYNOLDS Evelyn Edith
WATERS Charles
1901RG13 904 67 29.
18 St James Road East Grinstead (Children Evelyn E Waters 5 May E Waters 3)
Does she belong to this family? Birth REYNOLDS Maud East Grinstead.2b 141 Q3 1876
Deaths Q3 1876 REYNOLDS Maude 0 East Grinstead 2b 65
George Payne born 1838 in Lingfield,
1841, Lingfield,
1851, Lingfield,
1861 Lingfield,
1871, Lingfield, Ag Lab.
1878 Q3 Married Harriett Agent ,E.Grinstead,2b,189
1881 4 Martins Place Lingfield with father in law, wife children Elizabeth M 2, Emily S 11
1891 RG12/789/52/24.
Sarah Payne born 1841 in Lingfield, (didn’t marry, ‘dressmaker’) Birth for Sarah Payne Mar 1841 Reigate Surrey
1851, Lingfield HO107 1641 194 9
1881 dressmaker head - all alone RG11 168 74 34 St John Hampstead London 60 Gayton rd
1891 RG12 107 160 30;(dressmaker still - head) St Stephens Hampstead
1901 RG13 121 109 39. london hampstead St Stephen as a Housekeeper Servant
Death for Sarah Payne 1842-1910 Oct/Nov/Dec
Wandsworth London Surrey aged 68 1d 359
Could this be Sarahs death?
Sarah Payne Oct-Nov-Dec 1908 age 67 Paddington Greater London
Vol 1a Page 6
Emma Payne born 1849 in Lingfield,
1851, Lingfield
1861, Lingfield
1871 servant in Kingston
1877 Q2 1d 1058 Camberwell married Thomas Potter
1881 97 Rye Lane Camberwell son Edwin 3 born Peckham
John Payne born 1844 as above and I (Kerry) have details for him.
their Parents were:
John Payne born 1807, Lingfield, died 1890 and Sarah Kesterton 1810 to 1877, Lingfield
1881 School House East GRinstead
Kerry can go back two more generations with the Paynes and has a bit of info. For the Kestertons who seem to originate in Edenbridge Kent (Sarahs mother is Ann and brother William)
Kerry perhaps you can give us this info so we can work on that also ???
are Florence Nash and Amy Nash related ?
who is Thomas Nash?
John Payne marriage to Jane Smart Carver in east Grinstead 1881....2b 219..which John Payne is this?
Kerry is he one of yours? :~
birth
PAYNE Joseph Spencer East Grinstead.2b 156 Q2 1882
1891 56 HIgh street East Grinstead with father George J aged 41 (can't make out occ.)both born East Grinstead RG12 788 7 9
1901 barrackes near Chichester RG13 971 55 7
married
PAYNE Joseph S East Grinstead.2b 307 Q4 1911
LIMMER Lucy M
children
PAYNE Edith M Limmer East Grinstead.2b 237 q2 1912
PAYNE George S Limmer East Grinstead.2b 182 q4 1917
PAYNE Margery C Limmer East Grinstead.2b 219 q2 1914
Yes I agree its probably the Godstone one, I think Lingfield came under Godstone. Henry stayed in Lingfield didn't he. He's not one that went to Brighton.
Henry Payne born 1867, Lingfield, ( Q1 1866 2b 129 or Q3 1866 2b 113 East GRinstead)
1871 Lingfield with parents
1881 Lingfield with parents (1881 Alice Steer Lingfield with parents)
married Alice Steer in 1891, East Grinstead and was a bricklayer,
1891 Lingfield with the Steer family
1901 65 Buckingham Place Brighton (with wife Alice, children Elise 9 Violet 3 and sister in-law Agatha)
birth
PAYNE Elsie Adelaide East Grinstead.2b 149 Q3 1891
PAYNE Violet Brighton.2b 230 Q1 1898
or
PAYNE Violet May Godstone.2a 206 Q1 1898
in 1901 Violet is listed as being born godstone so i think it will be the latter
hi everyoneAgain not one I've come across before in my direct line but we are looking for an Esther Payne born 1817, Lingfield. I am presuming that Esther Wood must have been Payne or am I totally confusing and tangled up with me nieces?? I'm going to . one.
Just been checking census and found this one is it anyone you looking for Kerryb ?
1851 HO/107 -1641-132-p11
East Grimstead Withyham Surrey
Henry Wood 34 b 1817 Lingfield Ag Labour
Ester Wood 34 b 1817 Lingfield
Ellen Wood 13 b 1838 Lingfield Seamtress
Sarah Payne 7 b 1844 Lingfield Scholar ( niece)
Wouldn't that be more likely to be the Brighton Violet - possibility though :D
Henry Payne born 1867, Lingfield, ( Q1 1866 2b 129 or Q3 1866 2b 113 East GRinstead)
1871 Lingfield with parents
1881 Lingfield with parents (1881 Alice Steer Lingfield with parents)
married Alice Steer in 1891, East Grinstead and was a bricklayer,
1891 Lingfield with the Steer family
1901 65 Buckingham Place Brighton (with wife Alice, children Elise 9 Violet 3 and sister in-law Agatha)
birth
PAYNE Elsie Adelaide East Grinstead.2b 149 Q3 1891
PAYNE Violet Brighton.2b 230 Q1 1898
or
PAYNE Violet May Godstone.2a 206 Q1 1898
in 1901 Violet is listed as being born godstone so i think it will be the latter
could this be Violets marriage?
PAYNE Violet M (spouse) Trattles Steyning.2b 585 Q1 1919
Kerry are these births yours?Well too young to be children of Henry and Alice Steer, so presumably another Payne married a Steer. I'll check FindMyPast around that time.
all Payne mmn. Steer
Albert H D Reigate.2a 397 Q3 1913
Lily E Reigate.2a 327 Q2 1918
Winifred A Reigate.2a 386 Q3 1913 (ooh Winifred / Winnie)
Morning allOooh thanks Deb, that's fantastic. No actually its quite sad. And another publican. ;D
Well done Toni ...fabulous work!!!! ;D :o
look what I found ... Spencer Payne married Amy Jane Nash ...
This MUST be her death ....
NA:
PAYNE COR/3/2/1920/25
Amy Jane, wife of Spencer Payne, licensee of The Jolly Fisherman Inn, 35 Market Street, Brighton; 47; at the Royal Sussex County Hospital; fracture of the skull and laceration of the brain caused by a fall at [home] on 9 Feb; accidental death
Date: 1920
deb :)
Benjamin Payne born 1798
Here is another payne lolI've never seen that one before, she must fit in somewhere as well. Shall have to check for an Emily born 1881 in Lingfield.
1901 RG13/632-27-p6 Godstone St Peter & St Paul
Emily Sarah payne 20 b 1881 Lingfield Servant
Morning allOooh thanks Deb, that's fantastic. No actually its quite sad. And another publican. ;D
Well done Toni ...fabulous work!!!! ;D :o
look what I found ... Spencer Payne married Amy Jane Nash ...
This MUST be her death ....
NA:
PAYNE COR/3/2/1920/25
Amy Jane, wife of Spencer Payne, licensee of The Jolly Fisherman Inn, 35 Market Street, Brighton; 47; at the Royal Sussex County Hospital; fracture of the skull and laceration of the brain caused by a fall at [home] on 9 Feb; accidental death
Date: 1920
deb :)
Kerry
Excellent thank you Toni ;D1
John Payne born 1878, Lingfield,
1881 Lingfield with parents,
1891 Lingfield with parents
married Florence Agnes Nash in 1899, Godstone, Surrey,
1901 6 Lavinia Road Croydon as Head but with wifes sister and Thomas Nash visitor widower pensioned constable (who was Thomas Nash?)
working on Thomas NAsh
1901 aged 58 b. Lingfield RG13 641 25 41 (details as before)
1891 RG12 235 108 38
6 litle george st, st boldph aldgate
added so Thomas Nash is Florences father now to findthe conenction with Amy Jane if there is one.
Thomas Nash head 48 city police constable b. lingfield
Jemima E wife 46 b. worcester
KateE dau. 21 b. London Aldgate
Florence A dau. 14 b. do.
Margaret dau. 2 b. do.
1871 RG10 414 66 28
148 ......... Aldgate
Thomas Nash head 28 city policeman b. Lingfield
Jemima E wife 26 b, WorcesterElizabeth do. d b. aldgate(this is crossed thorugh ont he census)
Kate Ellen dau. 1 b. Lingfield
Edwin brother son 22 Billard Marker b. Worcester
John Hy Evans coachman 15 coachman b, do.
William do. errand boy 11 errand boy b. do.
next door is another city policeman also
1851 HO107 1641 192 4
John Nash 42 head shoemaker b. lingfield (as are all the family)
Elizth 39 shoemakers wife
John son 14 errand boy
Fredk son 12 scholar
George son 10 "
Thomas son 8 "
Edgar son 6 (no occ. given not even scholar :-\ )
Elizabeth dau. 4 scholar
Edward 1
Brilliant Toni, I'll check the Surrey Marriage Index to see if marriage prior to 1837.
Benjamin Payne born 1798
hi Kerry - thsi seems tobe going relatively easy for once!
Benjamin in
1851 HO107 1641 386 49 South lane Worth (maybe Worth lane)
1861 RG9 580 20 1 (Worth Lane Worth .... lace cottage)
1871 RG10 1059 25 10 (Yew Tree Worth)
Ann died in bewteen census
1881 (with son Thomas family) St Johns .... Worth RG11 1060 45 37
Benjamin married Ann unknown (b. circa 1798 godstone )prior to 1851
he worked as an ag lab 1851, carter 1861, labourer 1871
they had children all born worth
Thomas 20 in 1851 (scholar coachman)
Joseph 14 do. (scholar carter)
Mary Ann 10 do.
Thomas son of Benjamin Payne family as 1881
(some the p.o.b are hard to read so i have only put down the ones i can read!)
Thomas Payne 50 garden lab
Ellen wife 49
Charles son 16 b. brighton
Arthur son 13
Annie dau. 10
Henry Payne born 1804
Henry Payne born 1804
1851 HO107 1641 244 12
wow lots of children will fill that in in a min
1861 possibly RG9 579 6 7 age out a bit
Henry Payne born 18041851 HO107 1641 244 12
wow lots of children will fill that in in a min
1861 possibly RG9 579 6 7 age out a bit
do we have a Henry Payne b. 1814 i found him in 1851 - 1881 inc. with wife Susannah, will post details separately so not to confuse!
Ok found a Alice C A Steer and Fred Payne married in Reigate September 1911.Kerry are these births yours?Well too young to be children of Henry and Alice Steer, so presumably another Payne married a Steer. I'll check FindMyPast around that time.
all Payne mmn. Steer
Albert H D Reigate.2a 397 Q3 1913
Lily E Reigate.2a 327 Q2 1918
Winifred A Reigate.2a 386 Q3 1913 (ooh Winifred / Winnie)
Did they all call their children Winnie, my gran had a sister called Winnie but she was a Terry of course.
Kerry
Hi everyoneNow that I am up early and noone else is around I've finally got time to go through some more pages.
I found John Payne in 1881 Census born 1807 lingfield Surrey
School House East Grimstead
John Payne aged 74 b 1807 Widow ag Labour
lodgers John Ager aged 20
Sarah Ager aged 25 Wife
sorry if repaeating someone else but wasn;t sure if you had that one
Could this be Sarah b 1841 in 1901 census Kerry? She is in Hampstead LondonBrilliant Sue
She is working as a servant age 60 but i cant find her in any earlier census.
RG13/121/109/39
Sue
i did a quick look on the CWGC site for your Paynes also but nothing jumping up and down in front of meYep I think I tried this one before and couldn't see anything useful. I guess they must have all survived.
and also soliders who died in the great war just with pob lingfield and east grinstead but no Paynes there
Brilliant ToniCould this be Sarah b 1841 in 1901 census Kerry? She is in Hampstead London
She is working as a servant age 60 but i cant find her in any earlier census.
RG13/121/109/39
Sue
Hi Sue
shes not married is she
i found these
1901
RG13 121 109 39.
1891
RG12 107 160 30;
(dressmaker still - head)
1881 dressmaker (nudge nudge wink wink ??? ) head - all alone
RG11 168 74 34
1851
HO107 1641 194 9
Just to confuse things this Henry was born in Lingfield at a time mine were being born in East Grinstead. ::) ::) I wonder who he was!
do we have a Henry Payne b. 1814 i found him in 1851 - 1881 inc. with wife Susannah, will post details separately so not to confuse!
Henry & Susannah 1851-1881
1851 HO107 1641 133 12
Henry Payne head 37 Sawyer (all b. Lingfield)
Susan wife 36
Lucy dau. 11 scholar
James son 9 do.
Mary Ann 3 do.
next door
Charles 27 sawyer
Rebecca 27 wife
Hester dau 3
Saxby
James 51 shoe maker master employer kent edenbridge
mary 49 wife b. lingfield
william 25 so shoemaker b. do.
1861 RG9 446 115 26
Henry Payne 47 (some sort of employer) b. lingfield
Susannah 46 wife b.do.
James son 19 b. do.
Susan dau. 17 b. do.
next door
South Green Oxted
Moses 37 Sawyer b. lingfield
rebecca wife 37 b. do.
Elizabeth Esther 12 dau scholar b. do.
Emma dau 7 do b. do.
Sarah ann dau 4 do. b. do.
Lucy dau. 1
1871 RG10 830 60 14
Reigate
Henry head 57 farm baliff b. lingfield
Susannah wife 58 b. do.
Susan dau. 27 dressmaker b. do.
1881 RG11 799 91 15
park lane reigate
Henry Payne 67 farm baliff b. lingfield
Susannah 66 wife b. do.
Lucy dau. unmarried 41 b. do.
The same Henry and Tamar in 1871Henry Payne born 1804
1851 HO107 1641 244 12
wow lots of children will fill that in in a min
1861 possibly RG9 579 6 7 age out a bit
details from 1851
Henry Payne head 46 Ag Lab (all b. East Grinstead)
Tamar wife 36
Benjamin son 16 ag lab
Tamar dau. 11
Henry son 9
Jane dau 7
Elizabeth dau 5
Edward son 3
Sarah dau 2
James son 11 months
Brilliant ToniCould this be Sarah b 1841 in 1901 census Kerry? She is in Hampstead London
She is working as a servant age 60 but i cant find her in any earlier census.
RG13/121/109/39
Sue
Hi Sue
shes not married is she
i found these
1901
RG13 121 109 39.
1891
RG12 107 160 30;
(dressmaker still - head)
1881 dressmaker (nudge nudge wink wink ??? ) head - all alone
RG11 168 74 34
1851
HO107 1641 194 9
So I just need the 1861 and 1871 now!
BTW way why nudge nudge wink wink, am I missing something??
Kerry
Really :o :o :o
I didn't know that! ::) ::) ::)
gosh someone interesting in the family.
Kerry
Henry Payne in 1841
H0107 1115 1/33 6
Again in East Grinstead
No success with a marriage on either the Surrey or Sussex Indexes. I think I need another look. they must be there.
Kerry
I'm back
sorry have not done anything to help ... Toni you're on a roll babe ;D :D
errr what can I do .... maybe I will be the cheering section ....woohooooo everyone ...well done ..... great job .... yeeeee haaaaaaaa!!
deb ;D
Right here we go!
this is the generation of John born 1807 father to Elizabeth etc.
Benjamin Payne born 1798
Elizabeth Payne born 1801
Henry Payne born 1804
John Payne 1807 to 1890 - mine
Sarah Payne born 1809
Jane Payne 1811 - 1813
These are all children of Edward Payne born 1780 East Grinstead and Jane unknown, they were all baptised in East Grinstead and little Jane died and was buried in East Grinstead.
The Kestertons -
John Kesterton born 1771 Edenbridge, Kent died 1835 Lingfield, Surrey
married Ann Salis 1803 Lingfield she was born 1784 Edenbridge and died 1852 Lingfield
children:
Ann born 1802 Edenbridge
Thomas 1805 Edenbridge
Sarah 1810 Lingfield
Esther 1817 Lingfield and baptised in Lingfield
Eliza 1821 Lingfield and baptised in Lingfield
Rebecca 1824 Lingfield and baptised in Lingfield
William born 1826 Lingfield
Kerry
What about the Kesterton boys Deb
I bet you can crack them by lunch time :-* :-*
Kerry
was there two William Kestertons b. 1826 Lingfield ???
1841 HO107 1077 7 56 5 (with mother Ann) Lingfield
1861 RG9 356 168 26 Lambeth (kennington lane)
William Kesterton head 34 or 36 cab proprieter b. Lingfield
Ellen wife 30 b Kent ? east ? London Bridge
Ellen dau. 7 b. Lambeth
william son 6 b. do.
rosemary dau 4 b. do.
plus 2 lodgers
see here:~
www.francisfrith.com/search/england/surrey/lingfield/photos/lingfield_57086.htm - 42k -
was there two William Kestertons b. 1826 Lingfield ???
1841 HO107 1077 7 56 5 (with mother Ann) Lingfield
1861 RG9 356 168 26 Lambeth (kennington lane)
William Kesterton head 34 or 36 cab proprieter b. Lingfield
Ellen wife 30 b Kent ? east ? London Bridge
Ellen dau. 7 b. Lambeth
william son 6 b. do.
rosemary dau 4 b. do.
plus 2 lodgers
I reckon that should read Edenbridge, which is quite local.
Kerry
I'm back
sorry have not done anything to help ... Toni you're on a roll babe ;D :D
errr what can I do .... maybe I will be the cheering section ....woohooooo everyone ...well done ..... great job .... yeeeee haaaaaaaa!!
deb ;D
HI Deb :)
i've not done the female Paynes born circa 1799-1800Right here we go!
this is the generation of John born 1807 father to Elizabeth etc.
Benjamin Payne born 1798
Elizabeth Payne born 1801
Henry Payne born 1804
John Payne 1807 to 1890 - mine
Sarah Payne born 1809
Jane Payne 1811 - 1813
These are all children of Edward Payne born 1780 East Grinstead and Jane unknown, they were all baptised in East Grinstead and little Jane died and was buried in East Grinstead.
The Kestertons -
John Kesterton born 1771 Edenbridge, Kent died 1835 Lingfield, Surrey
married Ann Salis 1803 Lingfield she was born 1784 Edenbridge and died 1852 Lingfield
children:
Ann born 1802 Edenbridge
Thomas 1805 Edenbridge
Sarah 1810 Lingfield
Esther 1817 Lingfield and baptised in Lingfield
Eliza 1821 Lingfield and baptised in Lingfield
Rebecca 1824 Lingfield and baptised in Lingfield
William born 1826 Lingfield
Kerry
i.e. these ones
and not done anything with the Kestertons
Hi Sue
Kerry,
Check this out on FreeBMD a marriage Dec 1838
Henry Wood and Hester Kesterton
Could this be your Esther?
Sue
Toni
If so heres 1851 Lingfield for them
HO107/1641/132/11
Guess what? Theres a niece called Sarah Payne age 7 b Lingfield on there :D :D
Sue
Hi guys
Kerry take a look at this, have we already got it? The dates right for Sarah b 1810 :-\ :-\
Im amazed at the age difference between John and Sarah, over 20 years.
HO107/1641/194/9
Sue
do you have Edward & Jane Payne in the census or had they died by then?Ooh no Toni I haven't got that one! Lets go and have a look
added how about this one?
1851 HO107 1641 242 9
East GRinstead
Jane Payne 81 head widow pauper b. East GRinstead
Edward Payne son 61 brickmaker b. do.
Mary dau in law 62 glover b. do
Benjamin grandson 29 ag lab b. do.
and in 1841Sadly not the right one Edward's mother was Sarah Durrant and father William Payne. Sarah Durrant came from Ringmer.
HO107 1115 1 35 9
Grinstead Common
jane Payne 70 Y
Edward 51 brickmaker Y
Benjamin 20 brickmaker Y
how about this
Edward Payne m. Jenney Chapman 14 Oct 1789 East GRinstead
Jenney & Jane were interchangeable
lots more Payne marriages in the same batch :) M070561
Scrap that, I've just had a look at it, its an Edward and Betsey, obviously wrong ones. Back to the drawing board.
Kerry
There's always the possibility they were dead before 1841 :-\ :-\
Re: KerryB's Second Chance Scavenger Hunt. Everyone Welcome To Join In.