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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Lanarkshire => Topic started by: wildgoose on Saturday 15 March 08 20:27 GMT (UK)
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Can anyone help me track down the couple below on the 1901 Census:
1895 Marriage James MCMONAGLE & Mary TOLAN, HUTCHESONTOWN, GLASGOW, LANARK
Thanks ;D
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Do you know either of their birthplaces? How old were they when they married
Nothing is coming up at the moment but they could be mis-transcribed
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at the moment nothing...but will have a bit more when I get the marriage certificate. The surname, however, may well be a problem... :-\
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Hi Wilgoose and Carol
There are two James McM*n*gl* :P showing on SP with a Mary in the household. This is one of them:
James McMunagle 50, Shipyard Lab, b. Ireland
Mary McMunagle 48, b. Ireland
Joseph McMunagle 8, son, b. Glasgow
John McMunagle 6, son, b. Glasgow
James McMunagle 3, son, b. Glasgow
Bernard McMunagle 8 mo, son, b. Glasgow
Address: 10 Ingram St, Govan
Either mum's age is wrong or she was still having babies at a fair age! Either way, if your couple only married in 1895, these can't be them one would think.
The other James is 32 and in Calderhead. Now to find him...
Monica :)
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Well, there is a Mary in the household, but it's a daughter. Wife is called Sophia:
James McMonagle 32, Furmanman, b. Ireland
Sophia McMonagle 26, b. Ireland
Willie McMonagle 5, b. Glasgow
Annie McMonagle 3, b. Uddingston, Lanark
Mary McMonagle 1, b. Hartwood, Lanark
Address: 25 Jordan Terr, Calderhead
Wildgoose, you will need to look at the MC amongst other things to confirm ages for James and Mary.
Monica
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The details from the mc are:
Marriage cert. No.87
1895, May 11th, St. Francis Chapel, Glasgow
banns.Roman Catholic Church
sign.James McMONAGLE, Tramway cab driver, bach., 40, b.1855
ures.113 Crown St., Glasgow
f.James McMONAGLE, Farmer, decd.
m.Ann McMONAGLE, ms GALLACHER
sign.Mary TOLAN, her X mark, Marine? store worker, spin., 35, b.1860
wit.Edwin WITSKER
Ures. 113 Crown St., Glasgow
f.John TOLAN, Labourer, decd.
m.Mary TOLAN, ms STEEL, decd.
min.Edwin WITSKER, RCC
wits. Manus McMONAGLE & Mary DEVLIN
reg.1895, May 17th, Glasgow
so what now :-X
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Were either showing as married before?
This look a likely entry for Mary's death, age/ birth year also out:
1944 MCMONAGLE MARY WRIGHT TOLAN MCDONALD F 68 GORBALS GLASGOW CITY/LANARK 644/15 0303
What children if any are you certain about?
Monica
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I haven't found anything other than what is on the mc. Do you think she was married before? but if that's her dc then her age should be 84?
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It's just the number of surnames showing on this death entry:
Tolan - her maiden name
Wright - ?
McDonald - ?
Her mother's maiden name looks to be Steel.
???
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This looks like James in 1891 from SP...now to find him on the other index...
1891 MCMUNOGLE JAMES M 35 HUTCHESONTOWN GLASGOW/LANARK 644/11 005/11 013
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that ties in with the mc :-\
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Were either showing as married before?
Marriage entry shows James as bachelor
Mary's fathers name was Tolan so no previous marriage for her
James should be on the 1861 census with parents James & Ann as should Mary with parents John & Mary
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This is the matching entry I think from the 1891 SP entry:
Joseph Lee 36, plumber, b. Greenock
Jessie Lee 48, wife
James McMunogle 35, visitor, seaman unemployed, b. Greenock
Address: 121 Crown St, Glagow Govan (Hutchesontown)
Now where are we :P
Let see if we can find James at home with matching parents from the MC....
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??? However from the 1881 Census index on SP, he looks to be the son of Charles. At home in Greenock with Charles, a fishmonger is a James, 24 and sister Mary all showing as born in Greenock.
From SP, only 3 more entries show (with previous wildcards) and none are him.
If he is from Ireland, he looks to have come over after the 1891 census. Can't see him beforehand. Nor is there a death showing for his mother in Scotland.
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Going round in a full circle ::) back to that first household I posted for 1901
James McMunagle 50, Shipyard Lab, b. Ireland
Mary McMunagle 48, b. Ireland
Joseph McMunagle 8, son, b. Glasgow
John McMunagle 6, son, b. Glasgow*
James McMunagle 3, son, b. Glasgow
Bernard McMunagle 8 mo, son, b. Glasgow
Address: 10 Ingram St, Govan
I think this is his birth entry:
1895 MCMONAGLE JOHN M HUTCHESONTOWN GLASGOW CITY/LANARK 644/11 1052
He was born in April, just before the parents' marriage in May. Father James Van Driver and Mary Tolan, marine store worker. Father James also signed the register.
Wildgoose, what was the address(es) showing on the MC for James and Mary?
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Mary Tolan's death:
1st husband James Wright - Marine Engineer
2nd husband James McMonagle - Horse Cart Driver
3rd husband John McDonald - Iron Dresser
Strangely (never seen this before) the section on the DC for parents' info is taken up with the above info, no details on parents. Death reported by a daughter.
Monica
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The 1944 dc is Mary's daur. also called Mary. Mary snr only married twice er daur. married the McDONALD
Death cert. No.303
Mary McDONALD, wid. John McDONALD, Iron dresser
d.1944, Oct 13th, 8 Ballater St., Glasgow, age 68
f. not recd.
m.Mary TOLAN, Marine store worker, decd.
(afterwards married to 1st James WRIGHT, Marine Engineer,
2nd James McMONAGLE, Horse cart driver)
cod.Hypostatic congestion of lungs
inf.Annie BERWICK, daur.
Reg.1944, Oct 14th, Glasgow
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address was 113 Crown St., Glasgow
Going round in a full circle ::) back to that first household I posted for 1901
James McMunagle 50, Shipyard Lab, b. Ireland
Mary McMunagle 48, b. Ireland
Joseph McMunagle 8, son, b. Glasgow
John McMunagle 6, son, b. Glasgow*
James McMunagle 3, son, b. Glasgow
Bernard McMunagle 8 mo, son, b. Glasgow
Address: 10 Ingram St, Govan
I think this is his birth entry:
1895 MCMONAGLE JOHN M HUTCHESONTOWN GLASGOW CITY/LANARK 644/11 1052
He was born in April, just before the parents' marriage in May. Father James Van Driver and Mary Tolan, marine store worker. Father James also signed the register.
Wildgoose, what was the address(es) showing on the MC for James and Mary?
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Ahh...I'm with you, I think ::) Confusing cert.
So daughter Mary b. 1876c. Who was the father, is this from the James Wright/Mary Tolan marriage? So certainly Mary Tolan had to be much older than 35 at the time of her marriage to James McMonagle in 1895.
Do we have the right entry for them in 1901 therefore?
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Sorry wildgoose, your post crossed over.
We certainly seem to have the right entry. The address showing for the birth of John in 1895 is also 113 Crown Street. Snap ;D
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The dc is very confusing as it doesn't name Mary's father, however, the 1901 entry would seem to be correct. May be worth trying to find a TOLAN WRIGHT marriage :-\ or a bc for Mary jnr. Could be that neither men were her dad... :o
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Nothing showing unfortunately. Marriage could have been in Ireland.
Can't see a marriage for daughter Mary to John McDonald under a maiden name of T*l*n or Wright either.
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Looks like daughter's marriage may also have taken place in Ireland:
John McDonald 39, iron dresser, b. Ireland
Mary McDonald 29, b. Ireland
James McDonald 5, b. Govan
Margaret McDonald 3, b. Govan
Joseph Clarke 23, lodger
John Cowell 20, lodger
Address: 5 Hamilton St, Govan
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Hi.....I have a bit of a interest in the McMonagle's and the various spellings....One of my relatives Alexander McKellar married Susan McMonagle in 1863 Greenock, Susan was born abt 1843 Greenock her parents were Manus(Manur) McManigal and Susan Brown both born Ireland.... Susans siblings were Charles, James, Manus(Manur) Mary, Peter as of the 1841 census....
Any links?
Cheers
Carol
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I haven't found him on a Census but take a look at the details on James marriage cert. ;D
Marriage cert. No.87
1895, May 11th, St. Francis Chapel, Glasgow
banns.Roman Catholic Church
sign.James McMONAGLE, Tramway cab driver, bach., 40, b.1855
ures.113 Crown St., Glasgow
f.James McMONAGLE, Farmer, decd.
m.Ann McMONAGLE, ms GALLACHER
sign.Mary TOLAN, her X mark, Marine? store worker, spin., 35, b.1860
wit.Edwin WITSKER
Ures. 113 Crown St., Glasgow
f.John TOLAN, Labourer, decd.
m.Mary TOLAN, ms STEEL, decd.
min.Edwin WITSKER, RCC
wits. Manus McMONAGLE & Mary DEVLIN
reg.1895, May 17th, Glasgow
There's got to be a connection don't you think...Do you know whereabouts in Ireland ???
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HI... I think its more than possible that there is a connection.....On the Inverclyde.gov.uk site there are a few death notices one is Elizabeth Stewart wife of Charles McMonagle died Sept 3 1852 Knock County Mayo...... plus a few others with some different spellings... Your James could be the son of James b about 1834 Greenock there is a death notice for James McMunigale fishmonger 29 Shaw St Greenock on Aug 25 1868.....just a little bit more searching to do.. ..... Susan McMonagle died 1904 in Lanarkshire.....
Cheers
Carol
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many thanks ???
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This is my James below
1901 Census: 10 Ingram St, Govan
James McMunagle 50, Shipyard Lab, b. Ireland
Mary McMunagle 48, b. Ireland
Joseph McMunagle 8, son, b. Glasgow
John McMunagle 6, son, b. Glasgow*
James McMunagle 3, son, b. Glasgow
Bernard McMunagle 8 mo, son, b. Glasgow
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HI.....In the 1851 census Susan is living with her sister Mary and her husband David McLean at 1 Broad Close Greenock...1861 I still have some searching to do I think I found her but not sure....1871 Susan and her husband Alexander McKellar were at 106 West St Backland Greenock..1881 they were at 97 Houston St Kinning Park, Glasgow.... 1891 114 Macher St Plantation, Glasgow... 1901 114 MacLean St Plantation, Glasgow....
Susan and Alexander had only one child Julia who sadly died as a infant.....I have a few more bits but not sure of it....
Cheers
Carol
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HI
I have found Susan in the 1861 census....
Kings Land Longwill Close Greenock
Charles Muingale Head occ fish merchant b 1833 Greeonck
Elizabeth b 1825 Paisley
Elizabeth -step daughter? b 1847 Greenock
Ellen - step daughter? b 1850 Greenock
James son b 1856 Greenock
Manne son b 1853 Greenock
Mary daug b 1859 Greenock
Susan daug b 1855 Greenock
Susan -step-daughter? b 1845 Greenock
Do you have James McMonagle and Ann Gallacher marriage reg?
cheers
Carol
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No I haven't I only have the mc of James snr. & mary tolan :-[