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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Warwickshire => England => Warwickshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Brian Sc on Friday 07 March 08 02:17 GMT (UK)
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I am trying to tie together the Scofield family Joseph and Elizabeth originally married 1828 leek wootton .1841 they lived in Walsell and finally moved to Coventry .St Michaels appears to be there church .Could anybody help with any records on This family .Joseph b1806 Elizabeth B1811
Joseph died 1864? Elizabeth nee Smith died 1891
Their appears to be a tie with a Joseph 1782
Catherine 1784
Hannah1786
thomas1788
john1790
All of these were children of Joseph and Hannah
My conclusion is Joseph born 1806 was born to one of these but I would like too see any records from st Michaels or leek Wootton re this family .
Can anyone help
Ann from Australia is from our same family but is there any more help
Thank you
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Hello Brian
You can order the St.Michael's/Leek Wootton fiches from your local LDS family centre:
http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/FHC/frameset_fhc.asp
Jim
PS.
In 1841 they were in Exhall between Coventry & Bedworth not Walsall which is in Staffs.
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Brian,
You say that they "moved to Coventry". But the 1851 shows that Joseph was born in Coventry. Here are the rest of the details:
Living in Much Park St, Coventry in 1851:
Joseph Scofield, Head, 45, Carpenter, born Coventry, Warks
Elizabeth, wife, 41, born Warwick, Warks
Sarah, daughter, 21, Silk Winder, born Leek Wooton, Warks
Benjamin, son, 16 Carpenter at home, born Warwick, Warks
Mary, daughter, 14, Silk Winder, born Birmingham
Thomas, 10 son, Carpenter at home, born Coventry
Elizabeth, daughter, 8 scholar, born Coventry
Charlotte, 5, scholar, born Coventry
Hannah, daughter, 3, born Coventry
Joseph, son, age illegible, born Coventry
If you want the 1861 just ask...
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There doesn't appear to be many Scofields in Coventry or Leek Wootton so I can see why you think they are connected.It's just possible Joseph is an illigitimate child of one of the 2 daughters & wasn't christened.Suggest you get the marriage details from the PR's & see who the witnesses were.
Jim
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Brian,
There is only one Scofield family still living in Leek Wooton in the 1841:
No address other than Leek Wooton:
Thomas Scofield, 52, Carpenter, born Warwickshire
Mary Scofield, 57, born Warwickshire
Susannah Scofield, 15, born Warwickshire
and I found another in the 1861:
Living at Campsey Ash, Suffolk
Joseph Scofield, Head, Widower, 78, Carpenter, born Leek Wooton, Warks.
Katherine(difficult to make out) daughter, 25, born Campsey Ash.
So that's 3 of them carpenters! Wonder if the father will be also when you find him?
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Hi everyone .Thank you for your prompt replies .
I am a New Zealander and direct descendant of Joseph ,1806 through Thomas who emigrated to NewZealand
I'm sorry Jim it was Exhall not Walsall in the 1841 census. You are correct
In reply to Leofric ,the family living in Much Park St in 1851 are my descendants. Thomas was the one who came out to live in NewZealand in 1875. In the 1841 census Joseph is stated as being born outside the census area ,therefore I was looking at the Joseph as the father living in Suffolk who was born in Leek Wootton .I did not know that fact , thank you for the info ,but he might be the right Joseph stated in my enquiry.
I will have to get a certificate but there now appears to be two options .
First Joseph was the illegitimate child of Thomas and Mary who were married in 1813.
Second Joseph was the son of Joseph .The names were handed down .I am unsure whether Joseph was an illegitimate son of the daughters Catherine or Hannah as these two went on too marry in 1811 and 1817.
I think Joseph born 1806 died in 1864 at Birmingham but I will investigate further
Is there any further info on the 1861 census that would help
Regards from NZ
Brian Scofield ;)
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Hello Brian
1861 cen:
RG9/2205/74/8
77 Little Park St. St.Michael's Coventry
Joseph Scofield/55/carpenter/Cov.
Elizabeth/52/Warwick
Charlotte/15/silk winder/Cov.
Hannah/13/do/do
Rosa/7/Cov.
Why have you discounted the daughters as parent of Joseph?
The 1841 census has Joseph as born in County but you have to look close as it does look like an "n" but is definitely a "y".
Jim
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Just re-read your note.
I will have to get a certificate
What cert. were you thinking of getting ?
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Hi Jim .The cert I was looking at getting is on free bmd page 6d vol 125 where it states a Joseph Scofield died in 1864 at Birmingham. This is the Joseph who married Elizabeth 1828. I am presuming that as he is not found in the 1871 census I am thinking this must be him.
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Jim ,As for your first answer The daughters I was referring too were the ones from Leek Wootton born 1784 1786 .Would the girls not allow Joseph to be adopted by their husbands
Brian
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Hello Brian
I see these as possibilities:
Joseph is the son of one of the daughters but retained his mothers name
after marriage.(unlikely)
or
son of one of the sons wives and changed his name to Scofield on marriage.
You could order the Leek Wootton fiches from LDS and look at Josephs
marriage details as this seems to be the only positive info. there is on him.
Were there any family members as witnesses,did they marry by Banns or Licence.
A licence would give additional info.
You could also email the War.CRO. and ask them to look for you if you give them
the date & place details.
http://www.warwickshire.gov.uk/countyrecordoffice
Jim
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From the info. supplied by Leofric I've traced Joseph back to Campsea Ash to his marriage there to Elizabeth Last in 1806,which means he must have been there before the birth of Joseph so I think you can rule him out as a father.
jim
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These are the children of Joseph Scofield & Elizabeth Last
EDWARD SCOFIELD - Christening: 07 MAR 1808 Campsea Ash, Suffolk
HANNAH SCOFIELD - Christening: 20 OCT 1811 Campsea Ash, Suffolk
KATHERINE SCOFIELD - Christening: 28 OCT 1813 Campsea Ash, Suffolk
JOSEPH EDWARD SCOFIELD - Christening: 23 FEB 1807 Campsea Ash, Suffolk
ELIZABETH SCOFIELD - Christening: 01 JUL 1809 Campsea Ash, Suffolk
THOMAS SCOFIELD - Christening: 31 OCT 1810 Campsea Ash, Suffolk
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Hi Jim
Thank you for the information .
I think we can rule the Suffolk line out .
The date of Joseph born at Leek Wootton 1782 doesn't seem too match up and uncertain if this is the same Joseph of Suffolk .If not Where did he go ?
Joseph of 1806 was married at leek wootton by banns and a George Smith and Charlot Sharpe were witnesses. As he was married in 1828 a license would not be given.
I will obtain the death record and see if this is our Joseph .
Thomas and Mary still stick in my gullet as a good possibility however .
Thank you Jim
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Just a couple of points.
I believe the Joseph in Suffolk is the same person.He was born at the same time has the same family occupation & came from Leek Wootton & there aren't any other Joseph Scofields born at that time.
Licences were granted in 1828 it was means of marrying without Banns being read or if they wanted to marry elsewhere.If you come across any that are by licence it's worth getting the info.
I'll have a look at Thomas.
Jim
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Hello Brian
I don't think Joseph is the son of Thomas,it doesn't stack up.
Joseph would have had his mothers surname unless the marriage Banns had been read by the time of the christening (if there was one) whereby the Rector may have allowed him to be christened Scofield.
If Thomas & Mary had been living together I would expect to see other children prior to the 1813 marriage.
The only expanations now as I see it is that Joseph was the illegitimate son of Mary Bull ( but not Thomas) & was given the Scofield name on marriage.
or
was an illegitimate child of one of the daughters but lived with g/parents after marriage as he may have been rejected by the husband.
I suppose there are lots of scenarios you could come up with from being left on the doorstep by gypsies ;D to being washed up in a reed bed.
I'll still put my money on the daughters.
Jim
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Thanks Jim I have emailed for further details on Josephs Marriage and I will order the cert of the death in Birmingham .Hopefully it is the right person .I would be pleased if I could find the results of Thomas and Marys exploit's.
Brian
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Thomas & Mary were very boring.Lived in Leek Wootton all their lives.Daughter Susanna had an illegitimate child Philip in 1862 but never married & that's about it.
Now Joseph's family were adifferent kettle of fish,very dysfunctional.
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Forgot to mention they had 3 other children:
Thomas/1817
John/1821/d.1822
Joseph/1822
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Jim .
It is quite a mystery but I have recently looked up the site on Coventry and specifically Much Park st and Little Park st .It was a pretty rough area with the Irish etc .All I can say is with time and now I know why Thomas came to New Zealand .It was hell living like that .It appears that with all the children [girls ]as silk winders and the squaller that was around I know doubt believe you when you say about Joseph .
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I think it was more likely that the work dried up.Silk weaving was a big industry in that area but foreign imports began killing it off.The Irish had been going there for a very long time so I wouldn't have thought that was a problem.It was more likely because the area was depressed & he thought assisted passage (if that's what he had) to New Zealand would give him & his family a better life.Then as now NZ & Aus.
were desperate for skilled labour & recruitment in the UK was quite common even then.
Jim
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I will see what happens when I get this report and cert .In the meantime I will continue to look up sights on Coventry and conditions in the 1800s . As per Google earth sight It is all taken over by council and police buildings and TV .The st Michael's Church appears played a big part in the Scofields lives .It could have been Elizabeth that was the dominate force in the family but we will never know .Interesting times when one dives into history
Brian
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Jim 1
Too follow on with your thoughts that Joseph may have come from one of the two girls Catharine or Hannah ,Im trying to trace Catharines Movements. Under family search she was born 1784 and married George French 18.2.1811. From there on I have trace of any movement with children or any activity in any county .
Can you help in any way on your records
Brian
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I can't find anything either.I've searched all the Warwickshire Parishes & NBI but no recorded deaths or births for this couple,and they aren't anywhere in 1841.Maybe they emigrated as well.They may have have died childless.
Jim
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Jim
Thank you . I thought you may have more resources but not too worry . They have been lost in cyberspace .I will keep looking and with new technology they may come too light later
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To Jim 1 I finally received the Death certificate of Joseph Scofield born 1805.As I thought he died in Birmingham of a stroke in 1864 aged 59 .He was a carpenter journeyman .He died at Theordore street birmingham.There is a hospital there and I am presuming he may have died there. However your death certificates in the UK at that time did not give the information like birth dates ,parents names etc. We were more fortunate in New Zealand with more info given.
I am pleased however but I would be wondering about the occupation
It seems as though his son Benjamin was his apprentice and later Thomas his other son .
I am thinking maybe our Joseph was originally the apprentice of Thomas Scofield of Leek Wootton who married Mary
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I have found the following apprentice record
Apprentice: Thomas Scofield
Normally Resident of : Coventry
Parent's Occupation: Carpenter & Joiner
Parent: Joseph
Master: Joseph Scofield (father)
Masters Trade: Carpenter & Joiner
Enrolment: 22 November 1854
I also search to see if Joseph had any other apprentice but looks like he just had his son, no ther Scofields found
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Hi from NZ cov2811
Thank you for that record.I new that Thomas was the apprentice .He was the one who came out to NZ in 1870s. However Benjamin Smith, his other son ,was a Carpenter and I would have thought he would have been an apprentice to his father .Benjamin was the older son .He may have been out of his time by the time Thomas took over as his apprentice.He was 6 years his brothers senior.