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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Yorkshire (North Riding) => England => Yorkshire (North Riding) Lookup Requests => Topic started by: j.m.firth on Tuesday 04 March 08 19:53 GMT (UK)
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I'm trying to identify the parents of Thomas Dobby, who married Sarah Ann (possibly Moss) in1882. The pair were living in Gargrave in 1891. I wonder if it would be best to order a marriage certificate or whether a birth certificate would be better. I'm struggling to find the correct record to order the latter. I would be really grateful for some advice. Thanks.
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Probably a marriage certificate would be better to begin with -that will give you ages of bride and groom (not always accurate) occupation -names of fathers and their occupations -also witnesses are sometimes family members and so give further clues.
First thing you need to do is make sure you have the correct marriage reg.
If you would like to post any details you have then maybe we can have a look around for you
Suz
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Have you looked at 1881 census 71 Richmond St leeds
RG11 4511 91 5
There is a Thomas Dobby 19 Bootfinisher b Horsforth Yorks entered as stepdson - his mother's name is Hannah
Maybe????
Will look further back
Suz
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Yes I'd found Thomas Dobby in 1881 and 1871 in Horsforth, Leeds (this also being his birthplace). The 1891 census gives his birthplace as Ripon, could this be an error? In my eagerness and inexperience I've jumped ahead of myself. I assumed Thomas's parents to be James Dobby and Hannah Foster and ordered their marriage certificate. This shows both to be living in Horsforth at the time of their marriage in 1859. It gives James Dobby's profession as being a 'cordwainer' which appears to be a shoemaker, so this would fit. I'm concerned however, since there is a discrepancy with Thomas's birthplace that I have wrongly matched him to James and Hannah and am jumping to conclusions. Hope this makes sense. Thanks for your help. Jane
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Hi Jane,
Well I can't find another Thomas Dobby of correct age - he is consistent with age - and also with Ripon as p.o.b. after marriage .
The Thomas found has a Ripon connection -and possibly spent his early years there
pre Thomas Birth
1861
Ripon Yorks
James Dolby Head M 23 Shoemaker Kirkby Malzeard Yorks
Hannah wife 28 Horsforth
Ellen daughter 1 Horsforth
RG9 3196 109 11
Daughter hannah was b Ripon (age 5 in 1871)
maybe Hannah (mother) went home (she was b Horsforth)
to have the children -and didn't get there in time for hannah??
You can always confirm later with Thomas'marriage cert
Maye it's worth looking for wife Sarah in 1881 to see f they lived close by
Well done
Suz
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Hi Suz, I took your advice and ordered a marriage certificate for Thomas Dobby. This confirms that his father was James Dobby (boot finisher) living in Leeds. I am fairly sure now that the first marriage certificate I bought i.e. for James Dobby and Hannah Foster, is correct. This would have been good news if it hadn't thrown up the next major hurdle - James' dad was another Thomas, a farmer, I presume from around Kirby Malzeard and recorded as deceased on his son James marriage certificate (1859). Complicated this ancestry business isn't it !- but also annoyingly compulsive. Thanks for your help so far.
Jane
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Hi Jane,
I'm so pleased the cert was the correct one - it is always good to have documentation where possible
There is this family -which looks promising
1851
Willow House
Kirby Malzeard
Yorks
Thomas Dobby Head M 46 Farmer of 51 acres Ripon Parish Yorks
Ellen wife 41 Ripon Parish Yorks
Homer son 19
Thomas son 10
Richard son 8
William son 6
Mary Ann daughter 1
James son 13
all children b. Kirby Malzeard
HO107 2281 480 10
1841
Kirby Malzeard Yorks
Thomas Dobby 33 Farmer
Ellen 30
Homer 9
Enoch 5
James 3
Thomas 11 mths
Joseph ingleby M.S.
all born in county
and next door -may be related?
Aron Dobby 73 Ind
Elizabeth 40
Richard 40 ag lab
all b in county
HO107 1258 32 15
Hope this helps
Suz
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The only prolem with this family is I think Thomas was still living in 1861 -and beyond?
I'll have another look around
Suz
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This Thomas Dobby is still at the same farm in 1861/71
All the signs are that he is james father
James called his first 2 children Thomas and Ellen -after his parents????
on James marriage cert in 1859 does it state father Thomas deceased in full? -or could it read as something else??
Who were witnesses at the marriage?
Could they e relations of James???
Suz
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Thanks for your continued help, I'm really stuck! It makes sense that Thomas and Ellen Milward are James' parents. The trouble is, it says quite clearly 'deceased' underneath Thomas's name. Residence at the time of marriage for both Hannah and James is given as Woodside, Horsforth. The witnesses were James Pickard and Maria Pickard, their neighbours. Could a family fall out account for the word 'deceased'? Is this bound to be accurate? They married at the Register Office of .........difficult to read. Is this unusual for the time? or significant? Jane
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The word deceased could have been entered in error - sometimes the word is omitted when the father is actually deceased.
I asked if the word was clear -as it could have said Thomas "senior" or suchlike.
The other possibility is -was hannah's father deceased and the word was put under the "wrong" father.
As I looked through the censs I wondered if james had fallen out with his family -purely because of his occupation. The Boddys seemed to help on the farm - haven't checked all of the children- but in later census some of the children have married and are still "at home" with parents . Maybe james'father disowned him when he took up another profession.
As hannah was a few years older than James -was there something about hannah that the family disapproved of?
Also, as they married in a register office, could a disaggreement have occurred because hannah was of a different faith to the Dobbys?
When I was young it was still frowned upon amongst the older folks if a "chapel" person was walking out with a "church" person. (my grandparents married in a register office for similar reason - in the 1890's -then had their children baptised Cof E but raised them as methodists -and they all married in CofE!!!)
Another factor could be if james wasn't quite 21 -putting deceased would be a way out of gaining parental consent.
maybe james just fell in love and ran away with hannah and didnt want to tell the family
Of course this is all supposition.
But there are no other likely candidates to be James father -no other James born that time and area either.
maybe james was rebellious- he does seem to be an afterthought on the 1851 census-but he could have just been missed out and then entered at the end.
The 1861 census is so precise -in occupation column relationships are given in detail.
Of course it could be nothing more than an error was made in the marriage register
Suz