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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Dublin => Topic started by: DudleyWinchurch on Tuesday 04 March 08 13:16 GMT (UK)
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Hi,
Does anyone know of, or have access to, a Dublin Directory for 1916.
I have been reading the history of the siege of Moore Street and wanted to try and find out who was still occupying the block from 10-25 Moore St at the time.
I had family there in 1911 and don't know when they moved on.
Also interested in whether there is any civilian casualty list as the accounts mention that there were a number of civilians killed in the seige.
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I have a vague memory of seeing the names of 1916 civilian casualties on a memorial at Glasnevin Cemetery. Perhaps someone from that side of the city might take a look for you. It was close to the main gate in the area where Kevin Barry's remains were reinterred.
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Hello,
The following list is taken from NORTH DUBLIN EASTER 1916. Produced by the NORTH INNER CITY, FOLKLORE PROJECT in 1993.
The civilians really suffered the most during the rising.
Both sides were responsible. Incidents like the death of a sixteen year old girl in the arms of her mother during the retreat from the G.P.O. were commonplace.
One incident stands out: the murders of civilians by the 2/6th South Staffords in North King Street on Friday evening and Saturday morning. Unlike the case of Bowen-Colthurst, the authorities covered up theses incidents and refused to hold an inquiry. The following names are know to have been murdered at this time.
174 Michael Noonan and George Ennis
172 Michael Hughes and John Walsh
177 (O'Rourke's Public House) Patrick Bealen and James Healy
27 (Louth Dairy) PJ Lawless, Jas Mac Cartney, Jas Finnegan and Patrick Hoey.
Regards
Noel Gorman
Dublin, Ire
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some details for Moore St. from Thom's of 1914 (the closest I have to 1916) :
10 T.F.Coogan, provision dealer
11 James Plunkett, china & glass dealer
12 T.F.Coogan, confectionary
13 Mrs. Rose Anne Hogan
14 Mrs. Norton, china and glassware house
15 Miss M. O'Gorman, clothes dealer
16 Patrick Plunkett, poulterer etc
17 Gore , R. J. chemist and druggist
(res 6. Charlemont-rd. Clontarf)
18 & 19 ruins
20/21 M. and P. Hanlon, fishmongers and ice merchants
22/23 George Price, importer of china , glass, earthenware, fancy baskets and goods
(res. The Villa, Howth-road, Clontarf)
24/25 Patk Kelly, fish merchant,
Shane
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1922 thoms
much the same, except ...
12 Levenston C V , furniture
18 Thwaites A R & co
eadaoin
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Shane and Eadaoin,
sorry I didn't see your messages before. Thanks for your help. It looks like Patrick Kelly, Master Poulterer (and his wife and Mistress ;D Ellen?) has taken over the fish business of my Great-grandmother who lived next door, some time between 1911 and 1914. So my gran would not have been there during the evacuation of the Post Office.
Do your directories, by any chance, have an entry for 3 Little Britain Street, just down the road?
thanks again,
Sheila
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from 1914 :
3 Little Britain Street (N) Mrs Wogan, dairy,
described in the listing as from Capel- street to Green-street.
Shane
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Thoms 1922
no 3 Britain St, Little ... Quirke, Mrs Mary A
eadaoin
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Wow,
thanks again Shane and Eadaoin,
Eadaoin, that's my Great-grandmother, though I never knew her. I know that she was at 3 Little Britain Street by 1917. I visited the house once in the 1950s. That seems to confirm that she took over the shop there and not just lived there. Does it says what her trade was?
Shane, any chance of finding Mary Anne Quirk(e) in that locality in 1914 or I may have another interim address to seek out? She was Fish Dealer at 24 Moore Street in 1911.
Liitle Britain Street, now rebuilt, still runs from roughly opposite what is the end of (the old Great Britain Street?) now Parnell Street, so they didn't move far from Moore Street.
thanks again to both of you, all great info.
Sheila
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I dont see any Quirk(e) listings in the alphabetical trades sections for Fish-dealers or Fishmongers..
sometimes people are included in the street listing section but not the trades section... will have a look in the nearby streets and let you know if I find anything.
Shane
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Thanks Shane,
they never moved far. Once they got to Little Britain Street they stayed at the same house until it was knocked down in the 1960s.
I've one possible address in Lower Denmark Street in about 1906 but that was between two addressses in Moore Street itself so it's just about finding out where they were between Moore Street in 1911 and Little Britain Street in 1917. I can't imagine it would have been further away than one of the side streets.
Sheila
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the closest Quirke to Moore Street listing I can see in 1914 is
57 Mountjoy street, Denis Quirke (no occupation listed)
not that far from Moore st about 1 km
Shane
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Thanks Shane,
haven't found any connection to a Denis, as yet.
Mary Anne was widowed before she left Moore St, so would have been head of the household at any subsequent address (unless they moved in temporarily with relatives but, with six children, that would be a big thing). I'd rather thought that she went straight from there to Little Britain Street but this does not now seem to be the case.
but thanks again as I am now beginning to build up the details of her life and it all helps.
Sheila
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Glad you found great-grandma!
Mary A Quirke is in the list of "nobility, gentry, merchants and traders" in 1922 at her address in Little Britain St.
It doesn't say what she's trading, and there's nothing for her under FISH.
eadaoin
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Thanks Eadaoin,
Unfortunately I don't think that she was nobility but until I know more, I can just hope ;)
At this period she could be going through changes of fortune as she was very recently widowed. I've yet to see the 1901 (although a cousin has just got me a copy from Dublin) so don't yet know if she worked before being widowed but she was a fish dealer in 1911 and, given that by 1914 someone else was trading as a fish merchant from the same Moore Street address, I'm guessing it was a shop rather than a barrow.
The next positive fix that I have is that my grandmother married from the Little Britain Street address in 1917 so I'm just trying to fill in the gap.
[added: and of course, there was a lot going on in that part of town at that period]
Sheila
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could not see any other promising Quirke listings -
I suppose it's possible that Mary and family were living with another family or in some kind or rental or tenement. If this is the case the owner of the building may be listed but not the tennents. It does not seem as though Mary was operating her own business as that would usually be listed (she could have been employed by someone else - in which case she would not be included).
I would say that from lack of occupation included in the listing Eadaoin located that Mary and family were of independent means .. maybe a pension or a sale of some property ?
Shane
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Hi Shane,
thanks for all the searching. I've just found out the cost the site of 24/25 Moore Street was valued at last year but I doubt we're talking ownership here.
The house at Little Britain Street consisted of a shop and perhaps several stories (can't picture the outside but remember stairs and seem to recollect that there was no internal plumbing), and the remaining family only had partial occupation by the fifties. It had become one of the notorious tenements by the time they were relocated, so no money then.
Mary's husband had been a pattern-maker so a skilled craftsman but not a professional, so to speak. I think pensions came in for the over-70s in Ireland fairly early so by 1922, she may have been on a state pension (but can't imagine that was much).
I'm just guessing that as Mary was listed at the Little Britain Street property that she had the shop unit but that there may have been others already in (some of?) the other rooms. There are certainly several different family names at that premises on the electoral roll for 1939.
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Just checked the 1911 and the house at Little Britain Street had 8 rooms and 11 windows
(I'm picturing a front door with a window each side and 3 stories above, each with three windows - is that likely? I think that I remember that it backed onto a yard with a stand-pipe for water).
It is described as a private house but Mrs Wogan is a shopkeeper and has 3 rooms. Two other (extended?) families share the rest of the building.
It could be that they moved into a part of this house but were not listed [in 1914] as they were not trading until Mrs Wogan left the premises later.
[added: or even still at Moore Street but that the neighbour was now running the shop]
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Hi hope this is of use to you in some way, it has a list of civilian casualties. I found my grt grt grandmothers name here. The casualties are listed on page 6.
http://www.nli.ie/1916/1916_main.html
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Just saw your inquiry about those killed in the 1916 Rebellion.
The Irish Times handbook for the Rebellion was reprinted some 10 years ago and contains lists of Military and civilian casualties and those who were deported with the bonus of addresses.
If you want me to look up something just revert
Regards
Quaxer
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Hi,
no info to add with this post,hope you have found the Quirke/e connection by now,just a late 50s/early 60s [?] photo of Kelly's at no.25.