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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Cumberland => Topic started by: KateB_2007 on Friday 04 January 08 19:23 GMT (UK)
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Hello, Happy New Year :)
I don't suppose anyone has any McGills in their tree? I am about to declare this a dead end other wise!
Both were born in Ireland and ended up in Whitehaven. Censuses say they were both in the building trade.
Abraham McGill born C1836 (wives Mary Nixon/Catherine Dixon, children - Mary, Eliza, Sarah, Malcolm, James, Abraham, Ada, Hugh, Joseph, Robert and George)
Joseph McGill born C1847 (wife Eleanor Kneen, children - Margaret, Sarah, Eleanor, Eliza, Mary, Joseph, Florence and Wilhemina)
I have them all on 1881, 1891 and 1901 censuses with their children etc, but nothing previously. I really would like to know where in Ireland they were from, the censuses just say Ireland.
Worth a try - you never know!
Thanks
Kate :)
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Nothing to be gained in 1861 or 1871 as it also says Ireland!
Tazzie
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Same for Joseph in 1861 Ireland.
Tazzie
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Lol, well thanks for looking Tazzie.
Just my luck that it isn't a bit more specific!
Does it mention any parents on either census?
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hate to say this but a lot of Irish records were lost in a fire in Dublin (similar to ww1 records being lost at Kew when it was bombed in ww2) so you may never get any further back. Sorry. :'(
bob
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Hi Kate
You may be in for a few brick walls in Ireland. All but one of my branches end in Ireland. If they had only put down the town as well as "Ireland" on the census, things could be so different.
Good luck with your searching, but don't get any hopes up looking in Ireland
Rosemary
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Hi both,
I was starting to think it could be a bit tricky! Anyway thanks for your replies. I will just have to start on another branch of my tree!
Kate :)
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Hi Kate ......
His marriage cert to Mary Dixon may have some clues...
Whitehaven 1859 Abraham Mcgill
Mary Dixon 10b 638
or 1851 HO107/2436 F 291 P 12
Andrew Mcgill hd m 39 plumber & glazier empl 2 WHITEHAVEN
Esther Mcgill WI M 38
ABRAHAM MCGILL son s 14 plumbers apprentice
John SON S 11scholar
Esther dau s 9 scholar
Andrew son s 7 scholar
Mary dau s 5
Isabella dau 2 months
all say b Whitehaven!
Tazzie
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Hi Tazzie,
Thanks for that, the plot thickens!
Kate :D
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Hi Kate
I found on IGI (submitted though, so will need checking)
Abraham McGill b1837 bap St James church, Whitehaven
Father - Andrew McGill
Mother - Esther Montieth (Esther's father is James Montieth)
Andrew and Esther married in 1835 at St James church, Whitehaven
It also says that Abraham married Maria Hilton in 1859 at Everton, Lancs
But this Abraham died in 1874.
It seems there were two of them living in Whitehaven, born a year or two apart, but one born in Whitehaven and one born in Ireland.
Not much help, but now you have two of them :)
Rosemary
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Hi Rosemary.....
I think Kate had best go for a cert and take it from there.
It does seem to rule out my find above.
Tazzie
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Hi both,
Thanks for that. Seems that there was 2 Abraham McGills born a year apart, unusual!
Thanks for all your help.
Kate :)
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Hi,
I am actually related to the McGill family of Whitehaven and they were married into my Walker family of Whitehaven. Some of the story is on my webpage http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ckfamilyhistory/joseph.htm.
Ester Montieth was the sister of Mary Montieth who married my Joseph Walker and Ester married Andrew McGill son of Abraham. ;D
Also see my webpage http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ckfamilyhistory/gileswalker.htm.
ChristineK
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Hi CK,
I have pm'd you.
Kate :)
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Hi,
This headstone is in Preston Quarter(Whitehaven) Cemetery -
"In memory of / Andrew McGill who died / Octr. 20th 1858 aged 46 years / and of Esther his wife who died Octr. 24th 1881 aged 68 years / and of John their son / who died January 6th 1872 / aged 33 years / Abraham their son died / May 8th 1874 aged 37 years / and was interred in Irton Church Yard".
also
"In affectionate remembrance of / Hugh M GILL / who died December 24th 1875 / aged 75 years / Eliza the beloved wife of / Hugh M Gill who died November 17th 1865 aged 63 years / James their son who died / at /Australia December 31st 1866 / aged 34 years / Eliza their daughter who died at Australia March 17th 1870 / aged 33 years / In affectionate remembrance of / Abraham M Gill who died November / 27th 1906 aged 71 years / Mary the beloved wife of / Abraham M Gill who died Feb. 12th 1882 aged 45 years / also Eliza daughter of / Abraham and Mary M Gill who died April 2nd 1863 aged 15 months / also Eliza their second daughter / who died November 26th 1866 / aged 10 months. Also Ann daughter of the above who died / February 4th 1871 aged 11 months / also three of their children died in their infancy / Sarah Carr daughter of the above who died / June 16th 1895 aged 31 years".
A bit late tonight, but if these are of any use I can check for details of burials.
Regards
Jo3
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also
"In affectionate remembrance of / Hugh M GILL / who died December 24th 1875 / aged 75 years / Eliza the beloved wife of / Hugh M Gill who died November 17th 1865 aged 63 years / James their son who died / at /Australia December 31st 1866 / aged 34 years / Eliza their daughter who died at Australia March 17th 1870 / aged 33 years / In affectionate remembrance of / Abraham M Gill who died November / 27th 1906 aged 71 years / Mary the beloved wife of / Abraham M Gill who died Feb. 12th 1882 aged 45 years / also Eliza daughter of / Abraham and Mary M Gill who died April 2nd 1863 aged 15 months / also Eliza their second daughter / who died November 26th 1866 / aged 10 months. Also Ann daughter of the above who died / February 4th 1871 aged 11 months / also three of their children died in their infancy / Sarah Carr daughter of the above who died / June 16th 1895 aged 31 years".
A bit late tonight, but if these are of any use I can check for details of burials.
Regards
Jo3
Hi Jo,
Many thanks for this, these are my relations. Hugh and Eliza were my ggg grandparents. Particularly interesting as I didn't know they had a son James (who had obviously gone to Australia with his sister Eliza who I have been searching for for ages!) :)
Where did you unearth this information? But certainly if you don't mind I would be interested in any burial details.
Kate
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Hi again Kate
Sorry about the delay - again it's late but I'll 'pm' some details tomorrow and I have just got another headstone transcription, though sadly it is rather worn at the lower part. Some details are the same as the other one but maybe you can help me with some uncertain words and dates.
"In / affectionate remembrance of / Abraham McGill / who died November 27th
1906 / aged 71 years / Catherine the beloved wife / of / Abraham McGill who
died Jan. 13th 1898 / aged 37 years / John son of Abraham and Catherine
McGill / who died Feby. 21st 1888 / aged 4 years / Thomas William their son /
who died June 7th 1888 / aged 2 years / Abraham Dixon, son of Abraham & Mary McGill / who died Feb. 17th 1898 / aged 24 years / also _____ rahm McGill 2nd Batt. Canadians / son of the above, killed in action on / the Cambrai______ August 28th 1__8 / aged 20? years / ___________ / ___ ham _____ / __________ ."
Regards
Jo3
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Interestingly, if you go to cwgc.org and search mcgill in 1918 there is a robert died 28-8-1918 but aged 29 but I don't think he's in a cambrai cemetary. Having said that I think some bodies were moved from the 3 cemetaries in Cambrai
bob
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Freebmd has a robert mcgill born whitehaven,10b page 640 in Q3 1889
bob
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Thanks Bob,
That's very helpful - I hate not knowing the full story on these inscriptions although I have to stick to what I can see on the stone.
Jo3
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Jo3, I started looking for another abraham following your partial inscription - then thought he may be X abraham or abraham X but was surprised just to find robert. I know the problem with inscriptions as I tried to find folk at Brampton last year and they are in soft sandstone.
bob
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Hello
Many thanks for that Jo, that's really interesting. I now have 15 children for Abraham the elder.....blimey!
Thanks again :)
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Hi Kate,
I will try again. regarding Robert McGill he emigrated to The States in 1910. he travelled with his brother in law Joseph Stockdale I think. He was the husband of Ada Annie. Ada Annie followed some moths later with the children.
Robert ended up in Windsor Canada, returning to England in 1915 with the 20th battalion Canadian Expeditionary Force. He was killed on 28th August 1918, and is buried in a war cemetery between Arras and Cambrai.
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Hello Keith,
Many thanks for that. I have Ada Annie in my tree, so it all fits
Happy Easter
Kate :)
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Hi Jo3
Sorry everyone for posting a message on this subject when I am actually trying to get in touch with Jo3 regarding a post regarding John Pitblade. I have replied to that post but, since it was dated in 2004, am not too certain how successful I will be in making contact. Thanks for your understanding.
Thanks and regards
Laufi
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Hi All, :)
This will not get anyone further back, but I just thought I would add the following.
My grandfather's much older brother, Joseph Stockdale HANVEY , b Whitehaven 1874 married Ada Annie McGILL in May 1897.
Her father was Abraham McGill, builder, and at the time Ada's address was Deansgate Hotel, Manchester. They married in Whitehaven, both aged 22.
Joseph emigrated to USA in July1910 followed by Ada & 6 children in Sept 1910. I understand that they had one more child. According to census returens they settled in St Louis, Missouri. Joseph & Ada returned to UK in 1939 and after 2 months returned to the USA. I don't have the complete passenger list so didn't know about Robert travelling out with them.
This is the basic info I have about them, as it is not my direct line I haven't pursued them further.
Deetot
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FIND A GRAVE
Just incase this of interest :-
Abraham McGill Hanvey (1903 - 1959) and wife Mildred B (1907 - 1989 )
Burial: Saints Peter and Paul Catholic Cemetery (old) Saint Louis St. Louis City Missouri.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0r4o/
1940 Census - https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/K7HW-9Z3
Daughter Ada Hanvey:-
Ada Hanvey
SSNBorn 29 September 1905 and died December 1986
Last Residence: 63105 Saint Louis, Saint Louis, Missouri,
SSN was issued: Missouri (Before 1951)
Joseph and Ada in 1940 - https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/K741-DP9
Sandra
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New York Passenger List for Robert McGill - Robert Mcgill - born 1889 Whitehaven. England and aged 21 years. Single. Bricklayer. Bro:- Malcolm McGill. New Street. Whitehaven. Also travelling with Robert was John J Mann. 34 years old. Book binder. Wife:- Mrs Mann 37 Irish Street. Whitehaven.
Port of Departure: Liverpool, England to New York on the Campania, arriving 23 July 1910
Robert was going to a sister :- Mrs Mary Kitchen. 222 Dalton Street. St Louis. Missouri.
John J Mann was also going to the same address - Mary Kitchen was a friend.
This was the address and family they were going to in 1910 :- 222 Dalton Street. St Louis Ward 24, St Louis (Independent City), Missouri
Isaac Kitchen 50 and Mary J Kitchen 49
John C Kitchen 21 - Mac Kitchen Jr 18 (believe this to be Isaac) - Mary D Kitchen 20 and William Kitchen 22
The middle initial "C" in John's name was Colebank.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/M21Z-2D3
Isaac Kitchen (Mac on the above census) -
FIND A GRAVE
Burial March 1926 - Calvary Cemetery and Mausoleum Saint Louis St. Louis City Missouri.
John Kitchen
Born 1 st July 1890 and died November 1969
Last Residence: 63147 Saint Louis, Saint Louis City, Missouri,
SSN was issued: Missouri (Before 1951)
Isaac had married Mary Jane McGill in Whitehaven December 1886 - 10b 894
Sandra