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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Down => Topic started by: minimac on Monday 17 December 07 17:29 GMT (UK)

Title: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: minimac on Monday 17 December 07 17:29 GMT (UK)
I am trying to trace Audley W. Bestall b.1848/50 in Castlederg, Co Tyrone.  He married on 25 May 1883 Mary P. Campbell  at Magherahamlet Presbetyrian Church, Downpatrick.  This was a second marriage.  He had four children with first wife Mary Jane Caldwell who died in 1882, the youngest Charlotte Elizabeth is my grandmother.

Where did they live after their marriage and did they have other children.  Any help would be really great as I have reached a full stop.

Thanks.

Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: BallyaltikilliganG on Monday 17 December 07 19:56 GMT (UK)
I think that generation works out like this, the source being familysearch.com
Audley William Bestall    Marriage: Mary Jane Caldwell     22 FEB 1872 Killeter, Castlederg, Tyrone .  Mary Jane parents are Father: Henry Caldwell  and Mother:   Sarah McFarland   
Children
Margaret Catherine Bestall Birth:  04 JUN 1873   or 04 JUL 1873   
Frederick George Bestall  Birth:  03 DEC 1876
Sarah Georgina Bestall  Birth:  About 1878   
Charlotte Elizabeth Leah Bestall Birth:  16 AUG 1880   

I would chart up George Bestall’s family using the same sources below, he could be a father, uncle, brother etc and proable cosuin

Earlier in time from www.failteromhat.com/post1845.php
Bestall Mrs. ??? Town of Castlederg, Strabane Lower Road, Urney Tyrone. Griffiths valuation has other follow-ups notes, sometimes maps etc. The date is 1860 I think see /freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~tyrone/parishes/householders/urney3.html

Google maps has a good map at  Lower Strabane Road, Castlederg, Strabane, United Kingdom  The road runs between Castlederg and Erganagh/
The location of the civil parish of Urney is shown on www.proni.gov.uk/geogindx/parishes/par267.htm

Killeter is decribed in en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killeter and is not in Urney it is in the civil Parish of Termonamongan see www.proni.gov.uk/geogindx/parishes/par255.htm

Creeduff is also in the civil Parish of Termonamongan see the townland map at see www.proni.gov.uk/geogindx/parishes/par255.htm

AS these townlands are on the border of a county keep an open mind on the townalnds just over the border

My search was
From www.emeraldancestors.com  a  pay to view website
Births
1873 Margaret Catherine BESTALL F    Tyrone so this could be your great aunt?
Marriages
1881 hugh Alexander XXXX marries    charlotte eliza  BESTALL  Antrim         
1883 audley w j  BESTALL  marries   mary p    XXXXXX Down  Yours known.       
1902 henry caldwell  BESTALL marries   rebecca  XXXXX   Down       
1905 henry  XXXXX marries   sarah g  BESTALL  Antrim / Down       
1906 joseph charles XXXXXX marries   charlotte  BESTALL  Antrim / Down         
1908 howard  XXXXX marries    jeannie  BESTALL  Antrim       
1909 frederick george  BESTALL marries   mary charlotte    Down       
1910 thomas john   XXXXXXX marries    margaret c  BESTALL  Antrim / Down

Ros Davies Co Down website has no Bestall listed to my surprise.

From www.familysearch.com from a simple search for Bestall in Ireland and the’over 25…’ expanded
18. Sarah Georgina Bestall - International Genealogical Index / BI
Gender: Female Birth: About 1878 Creeduff, Castlederg, Tyrone, Ireland
 19. Audley W. J. Bestall - International Genealogical Index / BI
Gender: Male Birth: About 1850 Creeduff, Castlederg, Tyrone, Ireland
 20. Frederick George Bestall - International Genealogical Index / BI
Gender: Male Birth: 03 DEC 1876 , Tyrone, Ireland
 I am reducing this list for Rootsweb sake, it stops at
 30. George Bestall - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Marriage: 25 FEB 1847 , Tyrone, Ireland

Recap
Audley William Bestall    Marriage: 22 FEB 1872 Mary Jane Caldwell     Killeter, Castlederg, Tyrone
Children
Margaret Catherine Bestall Birth:  04 JUN 1873   or 04 JUL 1873   
Frederick George Bestall  Birth:  03 DEC 1876
Sarah Georgina Bestall  Birth:  About 1878   
Charlotte Elizabeth Leah Bestall Birth:  16 AUG 1880     

Sarah Georgina Bestall
 Birth:  About 1878   Creeduff, Castlederg, Tyrone, Ireland
Parents:
  Father:  Audley W. J. Bestall  Family
  Mother:  Mary Jane Caldwell     

The detail on  21 above is
Charlotte Elizabeth Leah
 Birth:  16 AUG 1880   Castlederg, Tyrone, Ireland
Parents:
  Father:  Audley William Bestall  Family
  Mother:  Mary Jane Caldwell 

The detail on  24 above is
Frederick George Bestall
 Birth:  03 DEC 1876   Castlederg, Tyrone, Ireland
Parents:
  Father:  Audley William Bestall  Family
  Mother:  Mary Jane Caldwell 

The detail on 28 above is
Audley W. J. Bestall
 Birth:  About 1850   Creeduff, Castlederg, Tyrone, Ireland
Marriages:
  Spouse:  Mary Jane Caldwell  Family
  Marriage:  About 1877   Creeduff, Castlederg, Tyrone, Ireland

The detail on 29 is
Husband
 Audley William Bestall
Marriage:  22 FEB 1872  Killeter, Castlederg, Tyrone, Ireland
Wife Mary Jane Caldwell Pedigree 
Christening:  14 APR 1850   
Marriage:  22 FEB 1872  Killeter, Castlederg, Tyrone, Ireland
Father:   Henry Caldwell Family
Mother:   Sarah McFarland   

Good luck, Jim
Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: minimac on Monday 17 December 07 22:08 GMT (UK)
Thanks for all of this and all the time you have taken.  Some of it I know already from www.familysearch.org. and from other roots chatterers.  The web links are tremendously helpful though so thanks again.

What I do wonder is whether Audley Bestall had any other children with his second wife Mary Campbell and when he died?  I have heard someone in the family mention Lisburn??  I wonder?!!



Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: BallyaltikilliganG on Tuesday 18 December 07 00:53 GMT (UK)
Hi minmac , could  the family be connected to another, a liverpool family see below.
From google search engine
The New York Times of  June 29th,1871 lists a Audley Bestall in a passenger list from New York in the steamship Donau bound for Glasgow Liverpool and Derry, leaving the 28th June 1871.

From www.irelandoldnews.com/obits/obidxb.htm [ i think this will mean AA Bestall b1905?]
Bestall, Audley Augustus; 96; Belfast IRL>Rock Hill SC; Rock Hill H; 2001-9-20; wrabb
Bestall, Audley Augustus; 96; Belfast IRL>Rock Hill SC; The State; 2001-9-21; betsten
Bestall, Sally (HAMILTON); 96; Belfast NIR>Rock Hill SC; Rock Hill H; 2000-1-14; wrabb

From FreeBMDS
Births Sep 1877     
Bestall  Audley Caldwoll    Liverpool  8b 149

now that set me off looking at all Liverpool Bestall births, these are really strange
Births Mar 1875   
Bestall  Charlotte Caldwell E     Liverpool  8b 177   
Births Jun 1876   
Bestall  Sarah Georgiana     Liverpool  8b 136
Births Mar 1879
Bestall  Rebecca Margaret     Liverpool  8b 136
Births Mar 1883   
Bestall  Frederick     Liverpool  8b 134
I leave you to find out whatever and of course I didnt look further on FreeBMDs for M and d's
Interesting, Jim
Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: minimac on Tuesday 18 December 07 15:18 GMT (UK)
This is amazing information you have dug up!!

Yes the Liverpool family is our family. They are the siblings of my grandmother Charlotte Elizabeth.  I did not however know of Audley Caldwell Bestall or Rebecca Margaret and some of the d.o.b's seem a little different. I did not know they were all in Liverpool although my grandmother I know married my grandfather Joseph Macfarlane and they lived there and it is where we all hail from.  Rebecca Margaret must have been the child of the second marriage of Audley William B to Mary Campbell in 1883 I think.

Audley Bestall passenger on the steamship from NYC to Glasgow/Liverpool/Derry will be my grandmother's father the one Audley William I think.

Audley Augustus b. 1905 is intriguing as one of my father's brothers was called Cyril Augustus and that could be where the name came from maybe.

It's all such a glorious jigsaw!  I will delve deeper into the web sites you have listed.  Thanks greatly.
Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: GaryOB on Tuesday 18 December 07 16:05 GMT (UK)
Hi Minimac

Don't forget the great Alfred Edmeades Bestall (1892-1986) who wrote and illustrated the Rupert the Bear stories from 1935 onwards.  He was originally born in Mandalay, Burma and had connections to NW Wales. 
Once established as an author he lived at Woking then Surbiton until his death.  He is now buried at Brookwood Cemetary, Woking.

Gary
Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: minimac on Wednesday 19 December 07 07:07 GMT (UK)
Well, you never know we might be related.  What a lovely idea.  I will bear this in mind and check him out.

Many thanks.
Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: minimac on Sunday 14 July 19 21:23 BST (UK)
I have been trying to find Audley William John Bestall’s father George Augustus Bestall for many years but with no success.
However there was a posting before my post was split up regarding him.  Could you please send me that information and advise me how I might further look into his whereabouts and that of his ancestors?
Thank you.
Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: hallmark on Sunday 14 July 19 21:49 BST (UK)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=815623.msg6770012#new

??
Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: hallmark on Sunday 14 July 19 22:03 BST (UK)


Marriage of MARGARET CALDWELL in 1847
Group Registration ID   N/R
SR District/Reg Area   Strabane
Returns Year   1847
Returns Quarter   1
Returns Volume No   10
Returns Page No   247

 Marriage of GEORGE BESTALL in 1847
Group Registration ID   N/R
SR District/Reg Area   Strabane
Returns Year   1847
Returns Quarter   1
Returns Volume No   10
Returns Page No   247
Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: hallmark on Sunday 14 July 19 22:12 BST (UK)


No Marriage Agreement Registered

Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: hallmark on Sunday 14 July 19 22:20 BST (UK)
Grrrrrrrrrrr... It is a Marriage Agreement!! 

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSN4-2YMW?i=67&cat=185720

Sorry!
Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: hallmark on Sunday 14 July 19 22:50 BST (UK)
n
Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: rayhayes on Friday 20 December 19 03:34 GMT (UK)
George August BESTALL ended up in Victoria, Australia with a second wife and three sons.
Let me know if you still need the details.
Ray Hayes
Tasmania, Australia


I have been trying to find Audley William John Bestall’s father George Augustus Bestall for many years but with no success.
However there was a posting before my post was split up regarding him.  Could you please send me that information and advise me how I might further look into his whereabouts and that of his ancestors?
Thank you.
Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: minimac on Friday 20 December 19 12:07 GMT (UK)
Hello Ray,
How fascinating.  I would love to know more please?  Perhaps we’re related?
Tasmania!  He was last traced to the USA?! 
Jill.

Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: rayhayes on Friday 20 December 19 12:25 GMT (UK)
Hi Jill,
George Augustus Bestall appears to have married a second time to Catherine Hearn or Ahearn after the death of Margaret nee Caldwell in 1861.
I haven't found the marriage.
In 1865 they had a son George in Prahran, a Melbourne suburb.  George died in 1918 in Oakleigh, another Melbourne suburb.
Another son William was born c 1870 (record not found).  He married and had children, and died in 1944 in Oakleigh.
Another son Augustus was born c 1874 (record not found). He died in 1904 in Fitzroy South, a Melbourne suburb, apparently unmarried.
George Augustus Bestall died in 1892 in Collingwood, a Melbourne suburb.  He had been a hotel licensee for some years.
Catherine Bestall died in Fitzroy South.
One of my relatives married a brother of George Augustus, Abraham, who died at Camolin, County Wexford.  He had been the medical officer and registrar at Camolin.
Regards
Ray
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Hello Ray,
How fascinating.  I would love to know more please?  Perhaps we’re related?
Tasmania!  He was last traced to the USA?! 
Jill.
Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: minimac on Saturday 21 December 19 15:25 GMT (UK)
Hi Ray,

I have read your post with great interest and all the details you have unearthed on the family history.

Agadowey on an earlier post (which somehow got high jacked by another member’s posting) on the subject 14 April 2019 suggested that George Augustus Bestall c1822-1902 died in Chicago? 

Do you have any evidence that your Australian George Augustus Bestall remarried and had three further sons was the same as my George Augustus Bestall?  I have never seen him placed in Australia.  Is there more than one George maybe?  If he arrived in Australia did he travel alone or with his motherless children?
Do you have a death certificate and does it match the date and place of birth with mine?

You think he died in a Melbourne suburb in 1892 but Agadowey thinks he died in Chicago in 1902.  I am confused?!

What do you think?

Jill



Title: Re: Audley William Bestall b.1848/50
Post by: rayhayes on Saturday 21 December 19 22:51 GMT (UK)
Hi Jill,

The one who died in the US was a George J Bestall, different man.

The death notice for George Augustus Bestall in Victoria refers to his father and two of his brothers.

Ray

Hi Ray,

I have read your post with great interest and all the details you have unearthed on the family history.

Agadowey on an earlier post (which somehow got high jacked by another member’s posting) on the subject 14 April 2019 suggested that George Augustus Bestall c1822-1902 died in Chicago? 

Do you have any evidence that your Australian George Augustus Bestall remarried and had three further sons was the same as my George Augustus Bestall?  I have never seen him placed in Australia.  Is there more than one George maybe?  If he arrived in Australia did he travel alone or with his motherless children?
Do you have a death certificate and does it match the date and place of birth with mine?

You think he died in a Melbourne suburb in 1892 but Agadowey thinks he died in Chicago in 1902.  I am confused?!

What do you think?

Jill