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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Staffordshire => England => Staffordshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: lancs.fox on Wednesday 31 October 07 16:23 GMT (UK)
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I wonder whether anybody can help solve a problem which I have encountered as to what happened to Edward Simonds (also known as Symonds) as he just seemed to disappear.
What I do know is that he was born in 1858 in Atherstone, Warwickshire, and lived there, working as a hatter, until 1891 at least.
Then, for a period (but I don't know how long), he ran the Goats Head Inn in Abbots Bromley with a friend. So far I've not been able to find any Directory listing him as licensee, though.
The 1901 Census reveals his wife, Mary Olivia Symonds, with her five children at their home, Bentilee Cottages in Abbots Bromley, but no Edward was present. She described herself as 'married'. A thorough search for Edward in that census has not turned up anything.
The next information that I have found is that Mary and the children emigrated to the States in about 1903, but Edward never did emigrate, and in the 1910 US Census Mary described herself as a widow.
One rumour in the family is that Edward died in a farm accident, but I have not been able to find any appropriate entry on St. Catherine's Register for the death.
Does anyone have any access to Abbots Bromley records which may shed any light on this man's fate?
Thank you for reading this.
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Hi,
Have been looking at your query with interest as I live fairly close to Abbots Bromley.Haven't been able to yet find out what happened to Edward.
In 1891 as you probably know the family lived in Atherstone and with them was Edward senior shown as an uncle -also a Hatter from Atherstone.
Between 1891 and 1901 Mary Olive had two more children (presumably by Edward) Francis 1893 and William 1895.
In 1901 Edward Simonds (the uncle) is in the Uttoxeter workhouse aged 67
and he died there in 1903 aged 70.
That is the only Edward Simonds/symonds death in that area between 1891/1910.
I can only surmise that Edward left his wife and family but will keep on looking
Kind regards
Sandra
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Hi Sandra,
Thanks for your reply and for having a look at this problem for me.
The fate of Edward Simonds (Symonds) has mystified me - he just seemed to disappear.
In the 1901 Census, Mary Olivia describes herself as 'married', just as she does on the passenger list when sailing to New York in 1904. However, by the time of the 1910 US Census she states that she is a 'widow'.
A direct descendant of Edward and Mary Olivia, whose mother remembers having Sunday lunch at home with Mary Olivia in attendance in the early 1940s, is strongly of the opinion that Edward never made it out to the States. She has also told me that the mention of Edward's name was frowned upon in the family. This belief is supported by the fact that I haven't been able to find Edward on any passenger list.
It is believed that he stayed in England and died there in suspicious circumstances - but, even so, his death should show up somewhere. Had he perhaps formed a new relationship and decided to 'opt out' of having his whereabouts recorded in the 1901 Census?
It is beginning to look as though we'll never know.
Richard
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I just happened to come across this post last week, and I joined RootsChat so I could reply. I don't know whether anyone is still interested, but Edward and Mary Olivia (Fox) Simonds were my great-grandparents. I know much more about Mary Olivia than Edward, but I'd be happy to share what I know.
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Hello, etonjim - welcome to 'RootsChat'.
Thanks for your reply.
I haven't really got any further with my research on this matter since posting just over two years ago, though I was contacted by the grand-daughter of Mary Olivia Simonds who resides in the States. She sent me a photo of Mary Olivia (with one of her sons who was in the US army at the time) and I was able to send her a photo of Georgiana Fox, one of the sisters of Mary Olivia taken in Ashby-de-la-Zouche in 1938.
It is interesting that Mary Olivia was your great-grandmother. There will therefore be a connection between us through Mary Olivia's father George James Fox of Atherstone who was my great-great-grandfather.
Are you in touch with any of Mary Olivia's descendants in the US?
I won't mention any specific names of current descendants in this post as this would be best done through a private communication.
I would be pleased to hear from you further so I'm sending you a personal message with my e-mail address.
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Well there is certainly no death that matches with your Edward but befor you
discount it as a possibility I would contact Lichfield RO and ask them to do a search for you
between 1895 1903 for the parishes of Abbots Bromley, Newborough and Hoar Cross.
Unfortunately there is no MI's for Edward in these churches but you may get lucky in the burial registers.
Other than that it does look as though Edward may have used an alias, especially if he ran off with
someone! Have checked 'Smith' and 'Jones' for b.1858 Warwickshire-No luck!
Regards
Alyson
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Thank you, Alyson. Hoar Cross is probably my best bet, since that's the church my great-uncle mentioned attending when the family lived in Abbots Bromley.
Jim
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Jim, ......they did'nt actually live in Abbots Bromley.
I come from AB and know the area very well and looking at the census 1901
details they are in actual fact some distance away, but for the purpose of census
it came under AB, though why Newborough enumerators did'nt do it I don't
know....to me that seems more logical, hence my suggestion to check Newborough
parish records aswell. I did have a look at Newborough census to see if Edward was
maybe working on a farm?.....but alas no!
reagrds
Alyson
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Alyson,
Thank you so much, that's actually very helpful. I had difficultly locating them at all in the 1901 census until, on a hunch, I tried Symonds and not Simonds. Apparently, they had changed the spelling BEFORE leaving England. I was always told that they did it upon arrival in America, since Mary Olivia preferred the "old English" spelling. It's also interesting to note that the youngest child, William, was born in (presumably) Newborough around 1895, which puts the family in the Abbots Bromley area at least by that time. I think they changed the spelling to distance themselves from Edward, one of the "bad lot" Simondses, I've been told. I rarely heard his name mentioned, and my father (his grandson) called him "Eddie" the one time he spoke of him.
Here's the piece on Edward that I can add to the puzzle. He worked with an uncle or cousin at the Goat's Head at some point until the time that he abandoned the family to fight in the Boer War. That would put him out of the picture from 1899 to 1901, which makes sense since he doesn't appear in the census. He made it back to England from South Africa, but just barely, as he died accidently some time before 1903 when my grandfather John R (transcription error on the census, not John K) left for the States. I was always told that my grandfather had to identify his body, so he had to have died by 1903. Odd that there's absolutely no record of his military service or of his death. That part's still a mystery. But we're getting closer.
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Oh! well done you.....
Glad you have the missing piece to the jigsaw, I'm sure you will find him somewhere
on record regarding the Boer War.
As to his death, I'd bet he is there somewhere with a gross mis-transcription error....
.... presumably he returned to the area? Firstly I would look on 1901 census to see
if he is in the area, don't rule out reg. districts of Burton on Trent and Lichfield as these
districts run very close to where the family were in 1901, I'm presuming he was not
welcome in the family home so may have been residing quite close.
Also, keep these reg. dist. in mind when searching for his death, my ancesters died up
the road from Hoar Cross and their deaths came under Burton on Trent. Similarly another
of mine died Kings Bromley (also not far away) and that death came under Lichfield.
I do get up to Staffs RO every few months, I will look out for him there next time I visit.
I f you find him in the mean time ......... do let me know.
Regards
Alyson
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Alyson,
Thanks. I'll keep looking. There must be some record. It's amazing that so much is so readily available.
Best wishes,
Jim
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Hi I live in A.B. and have just read your posting. Births and deaths at that time were
registered in Uttoxeter, there is a Edward Simonds death registered in 1903 you will
find his death certificate at Burton on Trent, it maybe worth your while to get a copy
just to eliminate him. The address is 57-60 High Street, BOT DE14 1JS 01283 233301.
Also The Goats Head was run by Stephen Arnold in 1891 and in 1900 it was Thomas
Dawson.
Hope this info is of some use
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Hello!
Thanks for your information. I have begun to wonder if the Edward Simonds who died in the Uttoxeter workhouse in 1903 is my great-grandfather after all, although the age given is off by about 30 years. It would certainly explain why my family were so reluctant to speak of him. To complicate things, the Edward who died at Uttoxeter, if it's the same Edward that we're looking for, is listed in the 1891 census in Atherstone as Edmund, aged 61. So he would have to have been 74 in 1903.
The Goat's Head does figure in the family history, so searching that out might be helpful, as well, but there are likely no records of Edward ever working there.
Here's another possibility. I understand that my great-grandmother, Mary Olivia, either taught music or was chapel organist at St Mary's School in A.B. She went with the choir to Lichfield Cathedral when they sang Evensong (which from the A.B. Girls School web site, they still do) and was able to play the organ (a feat unheard of for a woman at the time). If this is true, the school may have a record.
So, there are a few more leads.
Much appreciated,
Jim
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Hi etonjim,
My own view (without seeing a death certificate) is that the Edward Simonds who died in Uttoxeter is the same Edward (I read the 1891 Census entry as 'Edward', not 'Edmund') who was recorded as an 'uncle' on that Census whilst residing with the Mary Olivia Simonds family at Railway Terrace, Atherstone.
Although that Edward Simonds was recorded as being 70 at death, this age must not be taken as 'gospel'. It is my experience that many incorrect ages are given at death, particularly so where such deaths occur in a workhouse. Three or four years discrepancy is not unusual.
The mystery remains - when and where did the person we are seeking, namely, Mary Olivia's husband Edward Simonds, die?
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Hi, re Mary Olivia at St Marys A.B. Marcia Rice who was Head for some years at the
school wrote a book about the school I have seen the book some years ago I'm
sure it listed past teachers, pupils etc I'm trying to get hold of the people who owned
it will let you know of my findings.
You may be able to get hold of a copy not sure how many printed
El.
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Hi, the Edward Simmonds in Heath Union workhouse in 1901 was 67years old born in
Atherstone job descript Hatter, his marital status says S for single but has been
written over w or m. I think this is the guy you are looking for
el.
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Hi,
If you access 'staffordshirebmd' you will see that Edward Simonds died at
Uttoxeter in 1903. If you require a certificate you can download an
application form and the cert. will cost you £7.
pc99
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Hi,
Thank you. That's very helpful. Even if it's not Edward the nephew (my great-grandfather), the certificate may some information on the deceased's next of kin.
Jim
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Thank you, Matron54.
I would be very much interested to know if Mary Olivia Simonds's name appears in the history of St Mary's School. I'm not sure about the Edward Simonds who died in the Uttoxeter workhouse, though, since the age is so different. My great-grandfather Edward would only have been in his mid-40s in 1903. Nothing definitive so far, and I'm quite sure he didn't follow the family to the US.
Jim
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Don't ask me why, on a whim, I decided to poke around a genealogy website- wait, yes I do, but more on that later....hi there- Jim- this has to be my cousin- I started reading and realized it was you. I am so happy you are doing this!
Love from Nancy in New York City.
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Hi, Nancy, yes indeed. I'm glad YOU'RE doing it, too! We have another cousin poking around the internet, too. We're all looking for Edward Simonds!
Love,
Jim