RootsChat.Com
Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Antrim => Topic started by: Templar Knight on Friday 14 September 07 22:31 BST (UK)
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Hi everyone. Things have gone quiet on the Co Antrim board, Why?
Templar/Anthony
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Hello
You want some activity?
Here's a query I have. On my gtx2 grandfather's wedding certificate in 1855 his place of birth is Northern Ireland. What would that constitute in those times please?
Is Ireland playing in the Rugby World Cup? See other posts tonight!
Good night.
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That is unusual on both counts as place of birth is not usually given on Marriage Certificates (was he married outwith the Scotland, England, Wales or Ireland?), and Northern Ireland did not exist until a much later timescale.
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Good morning
Thanks for the reply. Yes, you were correct John Williamson married in Gatehouse of Fleet in 1855 and that is why birth details were mentioned on his marriage certificate. Northern Ireland is clearly stated but no town, unfortunately.
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Could it perhaps be that the word before Ireland on the certificate was a townland name? Are you certain it does say Northern? There was no 'partition' in the country of Ireland until the 1920's, when Northen Ireland came into being.
You were fortunate in even having an indication of his birthplace, as 1855 was the only year this was included on the marriage certificates in Scotland (would that it had continued this way, as it could have helped so many people with their research - at least for researchers of the future, it was re-instated in the 1970's).
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Hello again
Thanks for your further response. I was very interested to read your comments. When the Register Office at Kirkcudbright first found the marriage certificate the young lady just said Ireland. However, when I found the original on Scotspeople I am fairly sure it read Northern Ireland. I will certainly have another look at the original, if I can find my password/log in code!
Just for interest, I have a Mary Blair nee Scot(t) born in England who disappeared after the 1881 Scottish Census but I haven't been able to find her anywhere. I have had other rootschatters on the trail too but no luck so far.
I will look on Scotspeople when I have a minute - it's such a lovely day outside today, absolutely gorgeous.
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Hello Scotmum
I have checked the marriage certificate once again. John Williamson's place of birth was definitely "North of Ireland, Locality not known", date of birth "not known", ag lab (which fits the picture).
I think he was once referred to as "vagrant" on an ealier census.
I will keep looking.
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'North of Ireland' (probably Ulster) is slightly different from 'Northern Ireland' (a more modern term for 6 of the 9 counties of Ulster). Unfortunately with a common surname like Williamson it will be hard to find information in Ireland without more details to start with.
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Thanks for the reply Aghadowey.
I have been offered help so many times recently on this site. Indeed I think I had some advice from someone on the "Down" section re this family. It's all so very vague. I don't want to put someone to double trouble!
This John Williamson mentioned as 25 in 1855 on his marriage certificate and born in North of Ireland, was the son of a John Williamson and a Helen Williamson (nee McColville). He was married according to the rituals of the Catholic Church.
I suspect he came from Antrim as that is the nearest point of Ireland to Scotland (isn't it?).
Hubby and I have holidayed in the SW of Scotland several times recently doing family history research. All I need now is a good excuse to visit the North of Ireland, after watching recent programmes on its beautiful coastline!
Kind regards
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Travel between Ulster and Scotland was very common so don't narrow down your search too much to Co. Antrim without more proof. Many people went to Scotland to work and their relatives would even have visited back and forth. A connection of my husband's and his daughter from County Londonderry died in Jan.1867 off Cantyre, Scotland on wreck of the 'Falcon.' He and daughter had gone over to son in Glasgow to celebrate the New Year and died on the voyage back home.
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That's really interesting and, of course, very sad.
My mother (the Scottish side) was always telling me that the stretch of water between Stranraer and Larne was notorious for storms. There was the Princess Victoria which sank (I can't remember when).
Regards,
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Just looking for something else a few minutes ago and came across 1850 deaths for family who died on voyage between Scotland and Ulster.
'Princess Victoria' sank 1953. One of the survivors that we knew died a few weeks ago.
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Before the days of Larne-Stranraer there was a packet service from Donaghadee (Co Down) to Portpatrick (Wigtownshire). (My great-great-great-grandfather probably used that service when he married in Portpatrick in 1794.)
So you probably need to search more widely than Co Antrim.
Adrian
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Hello Kintree
Thanks for that useful information. I am actually interested in a marriage I found on Family Search between a John Williamson and a Margaret Halliday, which took place in Moira, Down on 3rd December 1842.
This latter event hasn't yet been proven to be my ancestor but somehow it feels right. However, there's no saying though that it is!
Kind regards,
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Hello ankerdine,
You'll have to rely on Church records as civil registration in Ireland was not introduced until 1864. Non Catholic marriages were registered from 1845 onwards but when the registration for BDMS started in 1864 some people didn't bother with the registration for a few years after that date.
Christopher
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Hello Christopher
My gtx2 grandfather appeared in KKD around 1851 so would this indicate they were fleeing from the Irish Potato Famine at that time? I wonder if records were again rather haphazard due to the terrible deaths and movement of people.
Can you recommend a good book about this particular period? Back to the library again?
Judy
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Hello Christopher
My gtx2 grandfather appeared in KKD around 1851 so would this indicate they were fleeing from the Irish Potato Famine at that time? I wonder if records were again rather haphazard due to the terrible deaths and movement of people.
Can you recommend a good book about this particular period? Back to the library again?
Judy
Hello Judy,
"Black ‘47 and Beyond: the Great Irish Famine in History, Economy and Memory" (http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=sH-J4WxqknkC&printsec=frontcover&vq=Irish+Potato+Famine+Books) by Cormac Ó Gráda. Published in 1999 Princeton, NJ: Princeton University Press. It's also online as a Google book.
Christopher
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Thanks, Christopher, that was quick. I will follow up the title you suggested.
Judy