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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Lancashire => England => Lancashire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: old boy on Tuesday 11 September 07 17:00 BST (UK)
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Robert whittle and wife Margaret ?
6 children born all died within 15 yrs how sad
john born 1850 11mnths died
ellen ann born 1866 6mnth died
robert born 1867 10 weeks died
ellen born 1867 10 month died
margaret 1864 5yr died
joseph who had a good innings born 1860 died 15yrs
how must it of affected the parents
What was roberts wifes maiden name ? he was born c1830 died 1870 age 40
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whereabouts were these children born - and in fact the parents :P
Theres 3 Roberts marrying Margarets in the Preston Regn District 1847 - 1851
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Thanks Newf born preston i think, on a grave stone in preston cemetry so i think preston is most likely
i'm hoping there one of mine in a sad sort of way
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If the 1850 kiddie was the first, then the 1849 marriage might be right .... best way would be to get a childs BCert and verify her maiden name from it ....
Marriages Dec 1849
Barton Eliza Preston
Barton Richard Preston
Beetham John Preston
Page Alice Preston
PORTER Robert Preston
Swindlehurst Ellen Preston
Whittle Robert Preston Vol 21 Page 586
Wilding Margaret Preston do
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Cheers Newf off to Preston again soon so might pop into reg office and see
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also on same grave it says
Robert (husband of Elizabeth ashcroft) died 1923 40 yrs do you think he could be a whittle or an ashcroft ?
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The IGI has the christeneings of the children (or some of them) and it also has some others:
All at St John, Preston
All have parents Robert and Margaret:
Joseph chr 10 May 1859
Joseph chr 6 JAn 1861
Richard chr 27 Oct 1861
Ralph chr 17 Dec 1861
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Just to confirm the marriage above - this is from Lancs BMD
Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1849
WHITTLE Robert WILDING Margaret Preston Register Office or Registrar Attended Preston PRESTON/13/95
also on same grave it says
Robert (husband of Elizabeth ashcroft) died 1923 40 yrs do you think he could be a whittle or an ashcroft ?
Presume you mean did a Whittle female marry an Ashcroft hence Roberts surname
Firstly - this may be a possible marriage for Robert & Elizabeth
Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1908
ASHCROFT Robert CHAMBERS Elizabeth Preston, St Mary Preston 233/5/287
This is another possibility for Roberts parents
Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1877
ASHCROFT Daniel WHITTLE Mary Elizabeth Preston, St John Preston 229/37/14
Per IGI
DANIEL ASHCROFT / MARY ELIZABETH WHITTLE
Marriage: 23 DEC 1877 Saint John Preston
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This is the 1891 census for Robert Ashcroft
13 Samuel St Preston. All surname Ashcroft and all b Preston
Daniel 33 occ carter
Mary 35
Annie 12
Robert 8
Charley 6
Margaret 4
Elizabeth 2
plus boarder Martha Phillipson aged 24
If you do a parent search on the IGI you will find baptisms for several of the children
PARENT SEARCH ON IGI
www.familysearch.org - On home page - click on “Advanced Search” to the right of the blue SEARCH button
Select “International Genealogical Index” from the left hand menu
Input fathers name and surname BUT only put mothers christian name as not all entries have the maiden name
REGION – select British Isles from the menu
COUNTRY – select one or “All countries”
COUNTY (will appear when you select COUNTRY) – select whichever matches what you know about the family
Click SEARCH
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At least one child of Robert & Margaret lived to produce children of her own - Mary Elizabeth Whittle was the daughter of Robert & Margaret
1861 census - all b Preston unless shown otherwise
1 Back St Pauls Square
Robert Whittle 30 can't decipher occupation
Margaret 34 b Longton
David 9
John 7
Mary Elizabeth 5
Joseph 18 Months
Edward Gillibrand 14 lodger b Lancs but can't decipher area
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Carole as i have said before you totally amaze me with how quick u can do this
Cheers Steve
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Hi Steve
Just in case they do belong to you - might as well go the whole hog:
1871 for 1 Leeming St (Lodging House)
Margaret Whittle 44 widow - lodging house keeper b Longton
David 19
Mary E 16
Joseph 11
Richard 9
Ann 2
In 1881 just Margaret and daughter Ann are at 51 Leeming St - shown as a lodging house and shop keeper
1881 for Cut Thorn Dilworth
John WHITTLE 27 b Preston Flagger Slater
Margaret 31 b Longridge
William 7 b Longridge
Mary Elizabeth 5 b Longridge
No David at the moment
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The Margaret Whittle that lived at Cut Thorn in 1881 was born Margaret Kenyon. She was the sister of Alice Elizabeth Kenyon Norcross - my GGGM.
Rest of the children from that family (obviously at least a few died in childhood)
DOB
1873 WHITTLE William
1875 WHITTLE Mary Elizabeth
1877 WHITTLE John
1878 WHITTLE George
1879 WHITTLE George
1880 WHITTLE Margaret Matilda
1881 WHITTLE Martha Ann
1883 WHITTLE Emily Alice
1884 WHITTLE Richard
1885 WHITTLE Agnes
1890 WHITTLE John
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The IGI has the christeneings of the children (or some of them) and it also has some others:
All at St John, Preston
All have parents Robert and Margaret:
Joseph chr 10 May 1859
Joseph chr 6 JAn 1861
Richard chr 27 Oct 1861
Ralph chr 17 Dec 1861
I don`t want to throw the cat amongst the pigeons ,but
Ralph Whittle b sep qtr 1861 is on www.lancashirebmd.org.uk and luckily enough Preston gives MMN ...and in this case it`s TINSLEY,may be a different Ralph Whittle....allan ???
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I think you have to proceed very carefully...it looks like there are TWO Whittle /Wilding marriages...all on www.lancashirebmd.org.uk births
1850 John Whittle MMN Wilding
1850 William Whittle MMN Wilding
1850 William Whittle MMN Wilding
3 different registrations
1852 David Whittle MMN Wilding
1852 Ellen Whittle MMN Wilding ...not twins
1854 John Whittle MMN Wilding
1856 Mary ElizabethWhittle MMN Wilding
1859 Joseph Whittle MMN Wilding
1861 Richard mmn Wilding
1864 Margaret mmn Wilding
1866 Ellen Ann mmn Wilding
1867 Ellen MMN Wilding
Robert MMN Wilding .....THEY ARE twins
1869 Ann MMN Wilding
No Ralph ??
allan
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I think I can add a bit more to this. I'm a keen researcher of my own surname and I believe that the Margaret Wilding mentioned in this thread is a first cousin, four times removed.
Garstonite is right about another marriage complicating things. Richard Whittle married Ellen Wilding on 6 Feb 1837 at Preston St John. Being early in 1837 this marriage doesn't appear on LancsBMD. Ellen is not a relation of mine AFAIAA, but using LancsBMD and census returns I believe the marriage produced at least the following children :-
Jane b 1840
William b 1843
William b 1845
Richard b 1847
William b 1850
Ellen b 1852
The first two Williams died early, but the others survived infancy.
I think that Robert and Margaret had a total of 11 children, so the original poster's concern about the parents might be alleviated somewhat. The ones who survived childhood and who are therefore not mentioned on the MI are
David b 1852
John b 1854
Mary Elizabeth b 1856
Richard b 1861
Ann b 1869
But there are still some loose ends that I can't explain :-
1) The baptism record on IGI (which is extracted, not submitted) states that Mary Elizabeth Whittle died in 1858. Census returns suggest that this wasn't the case, and there are no matching death records on LancsBMD or FreeBMD.
2) There are two William Whittles with a mother's maiden name of Wilding in 1850. I can only explain one of them. Registered twice ?
3) IGI shows a Joseph Whittle baptised in 1861, son of Robert Whittle and Margaret. Was this a re-baptism of the 1859 child, who survived until the age of 15?
AND FINALLY, I'd love to see the full detail of the MI mentioned by the original poster. If he/she or anyone else has this could they please let me know.
Tim Wilding