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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Argyllshire => Topic started by: thommoje on Friday 24 August 07 09:19 BST (UK)
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Hello Argyll Roots Chatters,
I have found the marriage record of my GGG Grandparents , David Greig and Elizabeth Walls on 21 Dec 1784.
It reads " booked 5 th Dec and married at Glen ????? the 21 st Dec 1784.
I am unable to decipher the name of the place. If anyone is able to look, I would love to hear what your educated guess is or could anybody who is familiar with the area around Inverary suggest what this Glen - - - place might be.
It is a bit difficult to get that kind of detail from here in Australia so any help would be most welcome .
I note with interest that all other marriages on that page just state that the marriage was booked but don`t give a venue for the event. Could this have been a country house , a village , ???
Look forward to hearing from anyone who can shed some light, Regards, Thommoje
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Are you able to post the portion of the entry containing the place name? Names in Scotland that begin Glen..... are unfortunately all too common, so without some clue to go by, it could take ages. The parish covers quite a wide area, mostly rural. Glen Aray or Glen Shira are two obvious names, possibly Glen Fyne, depending upon where they lived in relation to the parish boundary.
Nell
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Hi Little Nell ,
I had thought when I first saw the image that it looked like Glen shiva / shira but did not know whether such a place name existed.
Is this a village? Can you tell me more?
Regards, Thommoje
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Glen Shira is a valley which stretches north-east(ish) from the shore of the small bay of Loch Fyne called Loch Shira, just north west of Inverary. The valley is about 10 miles long with the hills of Stuc Carden and Beinn Ghlas on the north-west shore and Barr Mor on the south, to name just three. About 5 miles up the glen is Rob Roy's House, just downstream of the dam at Lochan Shira.
Have a look at this site:
http://www.streetmap.co.uk/
Type Glen Shira into the search box and look at the resulting map (ordinary 1:50000 OS map), zoom out for a smaller scale and larger area.
This site has some pictures of Glen Shira:
http://www.k5kj.net/scotland/shira.htm
Nell
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Thank you once again , Little Nell . I will check out those sites .I had also found a site called Geograph British Isles , which has modern day photos from places all over the UK.
Many thanks, Thommoje
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Me Again, Little Nell, Thanks for your interest. Those sites are great!
William Greig , son of David Greig and Elizabeth Walls , was burried in what looks like Kilmbin Cemetery. Do you recognize the name?
Regards, Jean (Thommoje)
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Hi Jean,
That name doesn't ring any bells and I can't find it anywhere. There are lots of places in Scotland which begin Kil..... I wonder about Kilmun perhaps?
Look at the Genuki page for Argyll:
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/sct/ARL/
It may help you pinpoint the place.
Nell
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Hello Again, Little Nell.
I don`t see a parish which could match but maybe it is a more localized place, this Kilumbin / kilmlien ?? Churchyard ( not Cemetery).
All the records that I have found of William Greig - unmarried - Overseer ( as was his father David) - 1785 - 1858 indicate that he was born , lived and died in Inverary and from the 1841 Census till his death, he lived in Newtown , Inverary.
I would guess that his burial place is nearby.
It is not of major importance but his home in Newtown became home for his unmarried sisters ( Grace / Grizel and Margaret )and a few who were widowed ( ChristinaFogo, Janet Purdie and Elizabeth Thom). So, it is of interest in family terms.
Regards, Jean
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Might it be Kilmalieu cemetery? This is near Inveraray, but I cannot pinpoint a map reference for it. :(
Nell
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Hi Little Nell , I think you might be right. It certainly would be Kilmalieu if the "a " had been included in the spelling of the recorder.
I would expect that many of my forbears would have been buried in this churchyard - certainly the Greig family and possibly some Purdie family members. I would love to be able to locate it on a map.
Are there parish burial records?
Thank you so much for your persistance, Regards, Jean
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Sadly, there are very few records of burials in the Old Parish Records. I've looked through the list here:
http://www.gro-scotland.gov.uk/files/list-of-oprs-492to551.pdf
and there doesn't seem to be anything.
I understand that the Scottish Genealogy Society holds an unpublished list for Kilmalieu Cemetery -E-mail enquiries to info[at]scotsgenealogy.com
(replace the [at] with @ ) - they may be able to help you. I still cannot find its exact location. :(
Nell
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Hi Nell, I have been away for a few days , but I see you are still trying to help and I thank you so much for that.
I will persue your suggested avenue. I have also contacted a photographer from the area who submits local snapshots to Geograph British Isles to see if he can take a photo of the graveyard for me . I will let you know what transpires, Regards, Jean
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Hi Jean,
I am also trying to track down information on burials at Kilmalieu Cemetery, Inverary. Phoned someone in the Council today, said he would have a look but didn't think they would have records as far back as 1860 - the date I am interested in. If he is not able to help, he suggested trying Register House (sure he said that though it may have been National Archives of Scotland).
Have not been very lucky tracing my Argyll roots back past their migration to Glasgow pre-1860 as there are no parish records for that part of Argyll. Maybe there are Session records recording shroud fees or maybe sasines recording purchase of burial plot?
If I hear anything back, will drop you a line. If you get anything, would be good to hear what you found out.
:) :) :)
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Found Kilmalieu Cemetery. Find Inverary on a map, then travel in a north-easterly direction along the A83: the cemetery is about half-way from Inverary and the curve at the top of Loch Fyne.
Try this link
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Inverary&ie=UTF8&oe=UTF-8&client=firefox-a&t=h&om=1&ll=56.235647,-5.071478&spn=0.033917,0.070038&z=14
Burial records and monumental inscriptions do survive: I believe they are currently being digitised.
Some local records are posted on http://www.skwebpages.com/inveraray/ (not burial or MIs yet) but if you ask the webmaster for information, he might be able to help.
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I've literally just got back from a week doing research up there in Inveraray, and have several phots from the cemetaries around the area on Sinclair graves if this is of use to anyone.
I've also got some general phots of the area of Iveraray, Kilmorich, Strachur & Stralachlan, including Maam in Glen Shira
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Hi Stralachlan, I am now several shades of green - one because the English beat us in the World Cup a few hours ago but mostly , I`m green with envy over your week in Inverary doing research.
I would love to see any of your photos of the Inverary , Newtown , Glen Shira area as I live in Australia and it is probably unlikely that I will see these places in person.
Don`t suppose your research took you to Kilmalieu Churchyard burial ground ? ?
Regards, Thommoje
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Hi Grey Seagull,
You are so clever! Thank you so much for letting me know where Kilmalieu Cemetery is and for that web site about Inverary.
I had located some of my family on the 1851 Census before , but being able to see it all is great. I will get more from that site.
The photographs are amazing as many of them are of Inverary around the time my family would have lived there.
The photos of Inverary pier, in its early form ,were particularly poignant as my G G Grandfather was the Harbour Master and would have walked the pier almost daily.
Thanks again, Jean
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Might it be Kilmalieu cemetery? This is near Inveraray, but I cannot pinpoint a map reference for it. :(
Nell
A good place for looking up places like that is CANMORE, the database of the Royal Commission of Ancient and Historic Monuments of Scotland. You can search the database by the name but it can be difficult because of variations in spellings. You can also search an area by type or category, these have changed so you will need check which is used for burial grounds. You can also use CANMAP to zoom into an area of the map and then mark part of it and see a list of sites in that area. I took photographs of war graves and churches for a time and often used it to find burial grounds because some of the ones in the Highlands & Islands can be difficult to find - often these older ones are on the original site of the church and there will be thr ruin there.
http://www.rcahms.gov.uk
The Scottish Genealogical Society (http://www.scotsgenealogy.com/acatalog/Argyllshire_MI.html) do have MI for some Argyllshire burial grounds but only a handful and not including this one.
Martin Briscoe
PS I might have a picture inside the burial ground if any use to you
PPS There are three images in the burial ground on CANMORE but all of one grave
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This is one burial ground and old chapel reported in Glen Shira by the RCAHMS
Maam
Type of Site: Burial Ground, Chapel
NMRS Number: NN11SW 3
Map reference: NN 1232 1271
Parish: Inveraray
Council: Argyll And Bute
Former District: Argyll And Bute
Former Region: Strathclyde
Archaeology Notes
NN11SW 3 1232 1271.
(NN 1232 1271) Burial Ground (NR) (Site of)
OS 6" map, Argyll, 2nd ed., (1900)
Nothing now remains of this burial ground. The New Statistical Account [NSA] (1845) states that children and infants were interred in the burial ground of Kilblaan in the 18th century Kilblaan is listed by Argyll County Council (1914), Scott (1915-61), and Campbell and Sandeman (1964) as a chapel site, dedicated to St Blaan. Campbell and Sandeman suggest that the chapel site is now occupied by Kilblaan farm at NN 128 133, but they make no mention of this site, and seem to have missed it. The Ordnance Survey Name Book [ONB] also quotes an old man, over 90, stating he was present at the burial of a child at this site about 1800.
NSA 1845; Name Book 1871; Argyll County Council 1914; H Scott et al 1915-61; M Campbell and M Sandeman 1964.
There are no traces of a burial ground at the published site.
Visited by OS (D W R) 8 March 1973.
References
Campbell and Sandeman, M and M (1964 )
'Mid Argyll: an archaeological survey',
Proc Soc Antiq Scot, 95, 1961-2, 68, No. 441,
County Council of Argyll (1914 )
List of ancient monuments and historic buildings in the county of Argyll,
[s.l.], 16,
NSA (1845 )
The new statistical account of Scotland by the ministers of the respective parishes under the superintendence of a committee of the society for the benefit of the sons and daughters of the clergy,
15v, Edinburgh, Vol. 7, Argyll, 26,
Name Book (County) ( )
Original Name Books of the Ordnance Survey
Book No. 54, 169,
Scott, H et al (eds.) (1915-61 )
Fasti ecclesiae Scoticanae: the succession of ministers in the Church of Scotland from the Reformation,
Revision, Edinburgh, Vol. 4, 8,
Martin Briscoe
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Hi Jean,
I am also trying to track down information on burials at Kilmalieu Cemetery, Inverary. Phoned someone in the Council today, said he would have a look but didn't think they would have records as far back as 1860 - the date I am interested in. If he is not able to help, he suggested trying Register House (sure he said that though it may have been National Archives of Scotland).
.....
This is the burial ground at Kilmalieu
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Hi Jean,
I've uploaded some photos onto Photobucket, so if you follow this link you should be able to have a look.
http://s195.photobucket.com/albums/z286/stralachlan/Argyle/
I have been to the following church yards: Crarae, Kilmalieu, Clachan Farm (behind Loch Fyne Oyster bar), the new Inveraray cemetary at the foot of Glen Shira, Cairndow, Clachan Strachur, Strathhlachlan, and Dalmally. I've taken photos of any headstones relating to Sinclairs in these.
I can see why the Grampians in Victoria are called that, they really do remind me of Scotland. I dont know where in Oz you are.
PS. I've just checked my records, and there were no Greigs or Purdies in my headstone pictures, but that doesnt mean they're not there of course. There was a 1779 roll call of the Argyll estate which you might find interesting. The Lochgilphead council archives has a copy.