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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Hertfordshire Lookup Requests => Hertfordshire => England => Herts Completed Lookup Requests => Topic started by: delta on Wednesday 22 August 07 11:25 BST (UK)
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My great great grandfather Daniel Odell was baptised 20.7.1811 Wadesmill, son of Daniel Odle and Rebecca. Daniel died 1814 age 45, and Rebecca died 1815 age 32. I have looked through parish records (and also the IGI) but can find no marriage for Daniel & Rebecca, or any other children. I think that Daniel was probably the son of Daniel and Mary Webb, baptised 10.7.1768 Thundridge (all part of the same area). I could find no Rebecca born around 1782.
Any ideas please?
???
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Hi, There is a marriage of Daniel ODLE to a Reb Plaier in 1803, Littlebury, Essex from Boyds Marriage index, hope this helps
Bev
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Hello Bev
Love the picture of the penguins.
Certainly sounds a possibility. The familysearch website doesn't seem to carry much on Essex - hence no marriage or earlier offspring. They must have moved to Hertfordshire before my gggrandfather was born. I think I'll try posting a message on the Essex board to see if someone can help me from there.
Thanks again for your help.
Delta
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Hello Delta
Did you now that the Odells originated in Odle Bedfordshire! There is an Odell family website.
All my Odells are from Pirton Herts and there are many more in Hitchin Herts. The Odells seem to have two things in common 1. they were mostly non-conformists and 2. by trade they seem to be Blacksmiths. Because they are non conformist they have wonderful biblical names. I have a Uriah, a Hezikiah, a Jeptha and a Daniel, unfortunately not yours I think. My great x4 grandparents Richard Odell and Mary Wheeler were married 11.1.1743/44 in Baldock Herts not a million miles from Wadesmill. They had a son Daniel born 1753. Both Richard and Mary died in Pirton but I don't know where they were born
Any of this link in with your Odells?
Benzol
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Hello Benzol
Thank you for contacting me about the Odell/Odle families. I will have a look for the Odell website but I don't think my lot came from Beds unless it was before the 1750s. Also they appear to have been Ag. Labs although I did find one other who was a Farmer. The only blacksmith I found was a William Odell aged 16, a patient at Hertford County Hospital in 1891, but I have no idea whose son he was.
I think that Daniel's family came from Thundridge. My great great grandfather Daniel was born in 1811 to Daniel and Rebecca and the only marriage I have been able to find is the one in Essex, which is why I am trying to find out more about it. Given the burial date and age of the Daniel who married Rebecca he would have been born about 1768 and his parents were probably Daniel and Mary Webb who had a son Daniel bp. 10.7.1768 at Thundridge (just up the road from Wadesmill). They were married in 1763 at Standon.
I am guessing my only option will be to try and arrange a visit to the Essex Archive Offices to check the marriage and any possible children born to them in Essex. Their only baptised child from Hertfordshire was Daniel.
Thanks again for your reply.
Delta
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Hi Delta
The Odells were from Odle many years earlier than the 1750s. Like many surnames I suspect that the first Odle was a foundling and given the name of the village where he was discovered.
I think William Odell blacksmith 1891 Hertford census was one of yours. His father was Alfred born Standon c.1842 his mother Elizabeth nee Turner born Great Hadham c.1847. There were also three younger daughters Agnes b. 1876; Alice b. 1878; Annie E b. 1880. The family lived High Cross Standon 1881 census. Interestingly Alfred's father Samuel was living with the family he was born c. 1793 in Thundridge. Alfred and Elizabeth were married Oct-Dec 1872 (Ware RD Vol 3a Page 289). Alfred died Apl-June 1911 (Ware RD Vol 3a Page 329).
William Odell "blacksmith" seems to be getting warmer. Have you found him in 1901? If he was working with/for an Odell relative that would be encouraging. Also are you sure that none of your Odells have biblical names?
Did you know that HALS @ Hertford has a very good computerised marriage index "The Allen Index". Might be worth looking there for more details of the Odells before venturing into the wilds of Essex!
Cheers
Benzol
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Hello Benzol
Not my family I am sorry to say. Alfred was the son of Samuel and Susan Chappell (1801-1876), and Samuel was the son of George (1753-1818) and Susannah (1763-1829). I did find a William Odell in 1901 who could have been the one who was a patient in 1891, except that he was an Attendant at the Herts Lunatic Asylum, St. Albans.
I live in Hertford so have visited County Hall quite a few times over the last six years and, unfortunately, there is no marriage between a Daniel Odell and Rebecca in the Allen Index. My hope is that the Essex one might be correct because there was a William Odell in Bengeo who was born in Littlebury, Essex, in about 1807. His wife and my Daniel's wife were sisters. Unfortunately, William died in 1859.
Regards
Delta
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Hi, Just back from Essex Archives Record, Here the marriage details of Daniel Odle & Rebecca Player but didnt have the time to look for your William's christening but will try next time.
D/P 9/1/3 Littlebury
Daniel Odle of this parish bac and Rebecca Player of this parish spin, married this church by banns 4th July 1803 by C.R.Landon (curate)
Daniel Odle X his mark
Rebecca Player X her mark
In the presence of William Salmon
Regards Bev
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Hello Bev
Thank you so much for the information. I am very grateful. If you could look for William at some later date that would be wonderful - it would be nice to know whether my Daniel and William were actually brothers.
They each had 9 children and William's eldest son was also called Daniel, born in 1834. Daniel's firstborn was James who was born in 1836. He married William's daughter Jane in 1863.
I really do appreciate your help.
Regards
Delta
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Hello Delta
Forgive me for any errors I make in this but I am new to the site so just trying to work out what is what! Earlier this year you were in touch with Benzol re the above and he sent you details of the Odell family at Standen headed by Alfred and Elizabeth. I suspect that it was not the connection you wanted but, if that family is of interest to you, please let me know as I am their great grandson and am in touch with other members of the family. I am going to try and find other descendants as time permits! Sorry to trouble you if not helpful but all the best in any case!
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Hello
There were quite a lot of Odell families in and around Bengeo and Hertford but I am pretty sure that Alfred and Elizabeth are not connected to my lot at all.
The connection I would like to be able to find is that Daniel 1811-1890 and William 1806/7-1854 were brothers. I think Daniel's father 1768-1814 was probably the son of James 1765-1827. As Daniel 1768 was married in Essex there may well have been other siblings that I know nothing about.
Thanks for your kind offer anyway.
Delta :)
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Hello westsaxon
I have just had a thought about your ancestors. I do have some info on other Odells from Bengeo and surrounding areas which I have taken from Parish registers so please feel free to ask about them if you don't have this info. For example I have burial dates for Alfred's grandparents George & Susannah. If you wish you can PM me.
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Good morning Delta!
Sorry about the late response but we have been away on hols and I had not realised that I had your message tucked away with all the weird and wonderful bits that turned up in my inbox. I am interested in anything relating to the family especially as I am sharing the info with two other greatgrandchildren of Alfred and Elizabeth and they are always keen to here any new snippets!
I hope I am not imposing upon your helpful nature but I was wondering if you could give me a little advice as a new boy to the site. My grandmother left my grandfather when my mother was a girl so I never met her. There have been a few clues as to her whereabuts but nothing too solid and I guess that they did not divorce. Knowing that people just married again I suspect that there may be a whole separate family line but I have no idea how to go about searching. I had understood that she had been living in East Sussex in her latter years but an ad in the local papere personal columns has not been fruitful. Do you know if there is a "right" way of going about this kind of thing? Any ideas gratefully accepted!!
All the best
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Hello again
Hope you had a good holiday.
You don't say who your grandparents were but, as a rule, anything relating to births, marriages and deaths after the beginning of the 20th century is not always easy to find on the web.
My first option would be to try the freebmd site which does sometimes give dates up to about 1920ish. If it's after that I am afraid it means trawling through the bmd records at your local archive office (I think some records are kept at local libraries but I have never tried that route myself).
The way I would do it would be try to see if your grandmother remarried, starting soon after your grandparents separated. I believe there may be a way of finding out about divorces but, again, I have never tried to find out anything like that. If you do find a marriage that seems likely you would probably need to send for the certificate.
Another alternative would be to buy a subscription to either findmypast or ancestry (both around £80 a year I think). The basic package on findmypast gives access to all censuses except 1851 and 1901, but you would be able to scroll through the births, marriage and deaths quarter by quarter and year by year up to 2005/6. I think Ancestry would probably give you the same options and they do have most of the 1851 and 1901 censuses.
There are a lot of kind people on this site who might be willing to help but you would need to give quite detailed information because of the time factor involved in looking up information when it is not in a census.
Any local archive office should have the bmd info for the whole of England and Wales up to at least 2006. Some are willing to look things up for you if you are unable to visit but they do charge, usually by the hour so it can get quite expensive. However, local archive offices only have parish records for the county they are in and they do not receive the records until the parish books have been completed so not all records are available as some books are still in use by the particular churches, especially if it is a small parish.
Sorry not to be more helpful.
Delta
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Hello Delta,
I have just found this website and notice that you are probably related to me. My grgrgrandfather William Odell was born Littlebury, Essex. I can't find a lot out about his birth or parents. My grgrandfather was David, born in Bengeo Herts. He moved to Nottingham before 1881.
I also have Daniel Odell married to Mary Webb as William's parents but wonder why, if they did, move to Liitlebury. It is only William who was born in Essex as the others were from Thunderidge and Wadesmill, as was Mary Webb.
It is all very confusing and I would be very grateful if you have come up with anything else since you posted your last message.
It would be nice to hear from you anyway.
Best wishes, Adas
Hello again
Hope you had a good holiday.
You don't say who your grandparents were but, as a rule, anything relating to births, marriages and deaths after the beginning of the 20th century is not always easy to find on the web.
My first option would be to try the freebmd site which does sometimes give dates up to about 1920ish. If it's after that I am afraid it means trawling through the bmd records at your local archive office (I think some records are kept at local libraries but I have never tried that route myself).
The way I would do it would be try to see if your grandmother remarried, starting soon after your grandparents separated. I believe there may be a way of finding out about divorces but, again, I have never tried to find out anything like that. If you do find a marriage that seems likely you would probably need to send for the certificate.
Another alternative would be to buy a subscription to either findmypast or ancestry (both around £80 a year I think). The basic package on findmypast gives access to all censuses except 1851 and 1901, but you would be able to scroll through the births, marriage and deaths quarter by quarter and year by year up to 2005/6. I think Ancestry would probably give you the same options and they do have most of the 1851 and 1901 censuses.
There are a lot of kind people on this site who might be willing to help but you would need to give quite detailed information because of the time factor involved in looking up information when it is not in a census.
Any local archive office should have the bmd info for the whole of England and Wales up to at least 2006. Some are willing to look things up for you if you are unable to visit but they do charge, usually by the hour so it can get quite expensive. However, local archive offices only have parish records for the county they are in and they do not receive the records until the parish books have been completed so not all records are available as some books are still in use by the particular churches, especially if it is a small parish.
Sorry not to be more helpful.
Delta
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Hello Adas
Unfortunately, I have not been able to find out anything more about William. All I do know is that William (1806/7-1854) and my Daniel (1811-1890) married sisters and Daniel was a witness to William's marriage to Martha Harwood.
My Daniel's parents were Daniel (1768-1814) and Rebecca Player (1783-1815) and they were married in Littlebury in 1803. A Rebecca Player was baptised at Romford, Essex so I am presuming this is the one, and my Daniel was baptised in Thundridge (next to Wadesmill), Herts. He was the son of Daniel and Mary Webb of Thundridge.
As William called his eldest son Daniel that could mean that he was named after William's father.
If you have a death certificate for William it may give his date and place of birth.
I have also tried to research the parents of Martha and Susannah but have so far have been quite unsuccessful. All I do know is that they had 10 children and their mother Elizabeth was buried in 1859.
Best wishes
Delta
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Hello delta
I have written information to you about the Harwoods but seem to have lost it. I will have to do it again -but not today. I am still trying to find my way around this site. :(
Adas
Hello Adas
Unfortunately, I have not been able to find out anything more about William. All I do know is that William (1806/7-1854) and my Daniel (1811-1890) married sisters and Daniel was a witness to William's marriage to Martha Harwood.
My Daniel's parents were Daniel (1768-1814) and Rebecca Player (1783-1815) and they were married in Littlebury in 1803. A Rebecca Player was baptised at Romford, Essex so I am presuming this is the one, and my Daniel was baptised in Thundridge (next to Wadesmill), Herts. He was the son of Daniel and Mary Webb of Thundridge.
As William called his eldest son Daniel that could mean that he was named after William's father.
If you have a death certificate for William it may give his date and place of birth.
I have also tried to research the parents of Martha and Susannah but have so far have been quite unsuccessful. All I do know is that they had 10 children and their mother Elizabeth was buried in 1859.
Best wishes
Delta
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Hello Delta,
I will try again to send you the information I have on Martha and Susannah Harwood's parents. Father was Benjamin, christened 26th March 1780 in Little Munden, Hertford. He married Elizabeth Howard in 1805 in the parish of St. Luke Old Street, that is all it says in the Pallot's Marriage Index.
I only have the two children listed. If you have the others I would appreciate it if you could send me the names.
The parents of Benjamin Harwood were William Harwood and Sarah Smith, who were married 24th November 1779 in Therefield, Hertfordshire. I have the family going back further but am not one hundred percent sure if they are the right family.
Have you a full list of any siblings that William and Daniel had?
Best wishes
Adas
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Hello Adas
I was aware of this marriage between Benjamin Harwood and Elizabeth Howard but as it took place over a year after their first child was baptised in Watton at Stone on 12.8.1804 I had dismissed it.
If you look on the IGI (I use the familysearch website) you will find the baptisms for the children of William and Martha, Daniel and Susannah, and also of Benjamin and Elizabeth Harwood (Horwood).
Best wishes
Delta
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Hello Delta
Did you now that the Odells originated in Odle Bedfordshire! There is an Odell family website.
Hi, I also descend from Richard Odell and Mary Wheeler of Pirton, via their son Thomas 1760 - 1822. I was wondering how long the Odells had been living in Pirton. Do you know how far back there are records of Odells living there>
All my Odells are from Pirton Herts and there are many more in Hitchin Herts. The Odells seem to have two things in common 1. they were mostly non-conformists and 2. by trade they seem to be Blacksmiths. Because they are non conformist they have wonderful biblical names. I have a Uriah, a Hezikiah, a Jeptha and a Daniel, unfortunately not yours I think. My great x4 grandparents Richard Odell and Mary Wheeler were married 11.1.1743/44 in Baldock Herts not a million miles from Wadesmill. They had a son Daniel born 1753. Both Richard and Mary died in Pirton but I don't know where they were born
Any of this link in with your Odells?
Benzol
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My Winch family came from Pirton and the surrounding area and I have a number marriages to Odells within various family branches (see below for surnames). For example:
Samuel Winch, born Q4 1847 St Ippollitts, married Martha Odell Q4 1868 (born c 1840 Graveley daughter of James and Mary Odell). Samuel was a blacksmith living in Little Wymondley in 1881 and 1901.
David
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Hello all. I apologise for butting in on your thread, Delta! ;D
I'm new here, because a Google search of 'Odell Blacksmiths Pirton' pointed me at the post from Benzol earlier in the thread, quoted below:
All my Odells are from Pirton Herts.
I have a Uriah, a Hezikiah, a Jeptha and a Daniel.
My great x4 grandparents Richard Odell and Mary Wheeler were married 11.1.1743/44 in Baldock, Herts.
Any of this link in with your Odells?
Benzol
All of the above link to my Odells. We share the same very great grandparents, Richard and Mary. I too have the unusual biblical names, and my ancestors were Blacksmiths in Pirton' some 250-ish(?) years ago.
I'm wondering how far back our branches of the Odell tree diverged?
cheers,
Ajokay
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Hi Ajokay,
I am also descended from Richard Odell and Mary Wheeler, from their son Thomas Odell b. May 1760 d. 1 Dec 1822.
Best, Ray
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Hi Ajokay,
I am also descended from Richard Odell and Mary Wheeler, from their son Thomas Odell b. May 1760 d. 1 Dec 1822.
Best, Ray
And I from Thomas's older brother Robert, 1749-1805
Don't know why I'm surprised that somebody else replied, there will be many of us!
Ajokay
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Hello ajokay,
Welcome to RootsChat.
We have just heard back today from Delta's husband to say that sadly she has died.
Regards
Sarah